IvyMorgan
Posts: 729
Joined: 7/5/2007
From: Midlands, UK
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ORIGINAL: Darcyandthedark
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ORIGINAL: IvyMorgan
To the munch/demo comment, I think we demo S&M a lot because it's *easy* to do. I spent about half a year wondering how on earth I would do a hypno demo... turns out, it doesn't work in a demo, it's not showy, jazzy, exciting to watch... it does work in a workshop (come to LAM to see it, date pending!) So, whilst it *is* possible to do a demo about something non-S&M (for example, Leather Family incarceration demo last CMunch) it's harder than doing a "look, here's a single tail and here's how you use it" and oftentimes, unless there is a backstory it's hard to retain interest.
But is it a cycle that demos have got into, rather than the show? If I am wanting to learn something, I could personally do without all the show and jazz. If I want that, I watch a scene or whats happening on the stage presentation. If I attend a demo or a workshop, I don't need clever lighting and sparkles to keep me focused. Is that a reason why certain people aren't attending and why you see the same old faces - because no one is catering to the non showy, monogamous, long term relationship, non performing couples - who just want to learn for themselves? Which should come first - chicken or egg? Are people more concerned on the amount of people - is it quantity ?
I guess it depends on what it is that the people attending the demo want to learn. What is going to draw the crowds. Sadly, yes, it is sometimes about bums on seats (and entrance fee in the coffer) as, if people don't show, there is no money and the event dies. Or, if people don't show, the organisers wonder "why bother" and the event dies.
I agree, when learning, we don't all need lights and sparkles, but, they do make it interesting for people who wouldn't necessarily have been interested, and they do get people to *watch*. They are popular.
I'm not sure why certain people don't attend demos/munches/workshops. I know my only regular haunt is CMunch, and that's cos I like the people up there and have made friends (frequently, the demos make me faint, I certainly don't go up for that experience, though they are interesting before I lose coherence.)
I would guess some people are more private and wouldn't go regardless of the demo content, some people aren't interested in the demos because of their nature (but this doesn't explain why they don't go to munches), some people like what they do in private and don't want to mingle.
At the end of the day, you can't be everything to everyone, and so you have to pick an audience. At something like LAM, you have options. There's the no glitter workshop which will discuss something for the "long term want to learn on own share knowledge" type you referred to, there's the stage show for the glitzy crowd pulling demo, and there's all the stalls and stuff to (hopefully) keep the doors open and the show on the road. At something smaller, you don't have the same level of "option".
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Even at kinkfest, the number of people who walked out of the pet play workshop I was in was about half. It's possible there (or somewhere similar) to do nonSM workshops because you have a large number of people to pull your 20 viewers from. If you've got 400 odd people wandering about, chances are you'll get 30 of them to listen to a talk on psychology. If all you have is the 30 people at your munch, and you need them to come back next month so you can pay for your space and keep running... you're going to do things to keep them entertained and unless there is the demand, you won't get esoteric philosophical discussions on power exhange and the psychology of WIITWD.
For a start, I absolutely adored the pet demo at KF. It totally rocked and personally I find that is exactly the kind of demo that needs to be more accessable for people.
I'm going to interject another opinion and say that workshop was dire. If I hadn't had to stay to run it, I would have walked out. It was poorly delivered, dull, SirGuy, though a lovely man, can't deliver a speah to save his life... yes there was a good Q&A, but you had to still be awake, and care, to engage in it. As someone who'd gone in will little interest in the subject, he didn't fan the spark at all, merely stomped on it.
Different strokes for different folks, I'm not saying he needed more showbiz flair, just that, I thought the demo was awful.
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I have to admit to being confused by your comment on munches. I am not an advocate of demos or talks at munches personally. It makes them far more inaccessable for people to get involved in the local scene and not particularly encouraging for new people. I have never held or attended a munch which was paid for, nor one that has demos in a public setting - I wouldn't view those as a munch at all. Munches are social settings, not a time to teach - other than by example. Demos and munches are seperate entities.
*edit to ad - On reflection, I am going to assume CMunch being an influence on your thoughs about munches. Personally - and maybe this will not make me many friends but meh - but I find it a misleading 'name'. At least on IC it does openly advertise that it isn't like a standard munch because it does advertise itself as a mini fet fair. But the majority of munches do not have the facilities that CMunch does.
the.dark.
Ah, yes, well, oops on the munch point. I've tried to use "demo" and "munch" in the more commonly accepted sense from here on out.
Secondly, I can't see anyone stopping liking you on the basis of a querey/comment/critique of an event name. I'm sure no-one is that shallow *smiles*
Thirdly, yes, most munches are in pubs/cafes and involve people sitting around and nattering. With that in mind, I've had hypno work demo-d at a munch. Not the nice (boring to look at) fluffy stuff I get up to, but the flash-y showbiz "look, I'm going to drop you into a trance "NOW" and you will obey" stuff. It makes me giggle. I've also seen rope demo-d at a munch, simple ties, hair bondage, stuff like that. No-one was suspended from the pub ceiling, more's the pity.
So, back to the "why only S&M" at munches, and here's where I'm going to not make many friends. People like to chest thump. They like to be seen as something great and wonderful. Sitting in a munch explaining how you have a very nice, quiet, peaceful, power-exchange relationship with you wife, and it's been going on for umpteen years, and you love each other very much etc... doesn't have the same "wow" factor in terms of "how uber am I" that "and last week, I whipped this girl with a single tail, and I'm so amazing at doing that, she, like, orgasmed all the time". People talk about S&M because it makes them seem great and inflates their ego in a way that the "long term relationship monogamy philosophy psychology" discussion just doesn't do.
I don't dispute that this excludes people from the scene who do want to engage in that sort of discussion. I know from time to time I am one of those people (would have loved to have gone to the psychology talks at KF, for example). I'm not one to sit in public and share with strangers how amazingly I play (not that I don't play in a most amazing way, mind you, for I am uber and wonderful, and the merest suggestion that they might come into contact with my crop makes subs and doms alike wither into jelly like goo). Like I said previously, I go to the munches/events I do because I have friends going, not to watch demos or have indepth discussions, they are tangents, my main goal is to see my far flung geographically friends.
I think there has to be a balance, between satisfying everyone, and, as repetative as it sounds, if you think there is something missing from your local scene, do something about it and fill the gap. Start a discussion group, that meets once a month purely to discuss a given topic, invite a speaker in, have a book club one month after all reading the same text... If you want something, go out and make it happen.
You won't stop the chest beaters, to showing off-ers, the people who want to discuss the finer points of how to use a cane, the people who want the big flashy edge play demos... they have their niche, if it's not yours, carve your own.
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and that He enjoys being "waited on" by me and that He expects it and receives it and that I enjoy it as much as He does. There are really no barriers to how we relate to each other in public. Except for being fully clothed and Him not doing as many physical things to me as He'd like, we interact in public much the same as we do at home. Lots of subtle, D/s stuff going on......................luci
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