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RE: Immigration Action Unconstitutional - 12/18/2014 6:59:40 PM

Musicmystery

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Actually, it's categorized differently in different states.

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RE: Immigration Action Unconstitutional - 12/19/2014 4:22:03 AM

thishereboi

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

It really does.

He claimed it was a misdemeanor not a criminal act. I tried to explain that they were the same thing which they are and he came back with a link stating they would be subject to civil penalties. Now there is a difference between a misdemeanor and a felony, but they are both criminal acts. And criminal penalties were not brought up in my post so they have no bearing on it.

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RE: Immigration Action Unconstitutional - 12/19/2014 6:43:46 AM

Musicmystery

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And as was explained, whether a misdemeanor is considered a crime varies from state to state. The clarification was relevant. New Jersey, for example, doesn't even recognize misdemeanors.

Maybe uninteresting to you, maybe not the point you cared to stress, but relevant nonetheless.

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RE: Immigration Action Unconstitutional - 12/19/2014 1:25:43 PM

joether

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quote:

ORIGINAL: BamaD

quote:

ORIGINAL: cloudboy
If todays laws were in place 50 and 100 years ago, you might not be here either. The people haven't changed, the laws have.

As much as immigration has built and contributed to the USA (this is an undeniable fact), anti-immigration bigotry has been firmly in place for each wave. You are your ilk are both wrong and consistent in this regard.

Laws have been liberalized. And you miss the point that anti-illegal aliens is not remotely the same as anti alien.

'Liberalized'? LOL! Tell me, what is the definition of the word 'Liberal"? What is the word's origin? For a person so in favor of freedoms, your against Liberalis....

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RE: Immigration Action Unconstitutional - 12/19/2014 1:34:51 PM

joether

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quote:

ORIGINAL: ultragirly
btw, per congressional study are about 45% of H1B visas fraudulent. meaning it's not only people crossing the borders at night, but also those welcomed foreign workers and their employers who commit crimes.

What is the name of this 'congressional study'? Who is the author(s)? When was it published? Is this the US Congress? or a state congress/legislative body?

If your going to post percentages and viewpoints from well recognized individuals and organizations; its a good idea to post the source of said information. We've had a few people state stuff well out of context, and even the exact opposite of the source material they were quoting.

quote:

ORIGINAL: ultragirly
should you work for a company and that company employs H1B people you can assume (by statistic) that about every second is a cheater or your employer respectively.

I should automatically assume the company is up to no good, based on no evidence or facts? Because judges in a court of law....do.....require the evidence and facts. And the burden of evidence falls to the accusing, not those being accused.

quote:

ORIGINAL: ultragirly
Microsoft has about 17.000 H1B people .... going to boycott them?

Got a source for this accusation?

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RE: Immigration Action Unconstitutional - 12/19/2014 6:22:33 PM

DesideriScuri

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quote:

ORIGINAL: joether
'Liberalized'? LOL! Tell me, what is the definition of the word 'Liberal"? What is the word's origin? For a person so in favor of freedoms, your against Liberalis....

LMFAO!!! You're so full of it, Joether!! Now, you're trying to claim that the original political meaning of "liberalism" is the same as it is today?!? Holy Fucking Hell Batman!!!

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RE: Immigration Action Unconstitutional - 12/19/2014 8:21:21 PM

MrRodgers

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Aylee

quote:

ORIGINAL: KenDckey

http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/volokh-conspiracy/wp-content/uploads/sites/14/2014/12/Juarez-Escobar.pdf

US V Juarez-Escobar appears to be the first case of what will probably be many on the executive action of Obama on immigration. Obama lost in the Western District Court of PA. Interesting read regardless of which side of the aisle you are on.

It looks as though this ruling leaves open challenges to Marbury v. Madison.

In US vs Nixon, the SCOTUS ruled that the president (exec. branch) had full discretion over which federal laws it will or will not prosecute. So the exec, order in question is of course constitutional.

< Message edited by MrRodgers -- 12/19/2014 8:23:10 PM >

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RE: Immigration Action Unconstitutional - 12/19/2014 8:22:48 PM

MrRodgers

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quote:

ORIGINAL: tj444

quote:

ORIGINAL: thishereboi

quote:

ORIGINAL: tj444

quote:

ORIGINAL: BamaD

quote:

ORIGINAL: hot4bondage

quote:

ORIGINAL: cloudboy

Obama has said the emphasis should be on aliens who have committed criminal acts and not on Aliens who have US citizen children and spouses who have lived in the USA for over 5 years.

That emphasis might be oversimplified. Is someone who manages to stay under the radar for years necessarily a better citizen than someone who gets caught with a joint as soon as they get here?

It also ignores the fact that they have committed a criminal act by being here "without documentation"

A good percentage of illegal immigrants came to the US legally on legit visas which expired and that is just a misdemeanor (like jaywalking), and not criminal act..

I think you mean felony not criminal act. Saying it's a misdemeanor not a criminal act is like saying that object on my desk is a orange not a piece of fruit.

"The Immigration and Nationality Act (INA) contains only civil penalties for an immigrant who overstays her visa. This means that immigrants with an expired visa will not be charged criminally or serve time in jail."

http://www.ehow.com/facts_6107442_crime-overstaying-visa_.html

Violation of a civil act is not criminal and thus is not even a misdemeanor.

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RE: Immigration Action Unconstitutional - 12/20/2014 1:52:08 PM

cloudboy

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The real crux of the immigration problem for Tea Party Republicans, a small extremist group, is two combined elements.

(1) They don't like illegal immigrants.

(2) The don't have a solution.

It is somewhat similar to the TARP and GM Bailout. They didn't like what happened, but thank God the Tea Party didn't exist back then. Because, God knows, they also would not have had a solution to the liquidity crisis.

The Tea Party is hyper-reactionary. It would rather punish people (immigrants) or institutions (insolvent banks) than help the economy and nation. Holding fast to moral imperatives trumps being adult and swallowing a solution they don't like. This is partly why they hate Obama, he did what they didn't like (Tarp and Deferred Action), yet each action helps the USA move forward.

The Tea Party is a bit like having a petulant child in Congress, and it's why Gail Collins noted, "The only thing Mitch McConnell hates worse than the Democractic agenda is Ted Cruz."

< Message edited by cloudboy -- 12/20/2014 1:55:58 PM >

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RE: Immigration Action Unconstitutional - 12/20/2014 2:01:22 PM

Aylee

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quote:

ORIGINAL: cloudboy

The real crux of the immigration problem for Tea Party Republicans, a small extremist group, is two combined elements.

(1) They don't like illegal immigrants.

(2) The don't have a solution.

It is somewhat similar to the TARP and GM Bailout. They didn't like what happened, but thank God the Tea Party didn't exist back then. Because, God knows, they also would not have had a solution to the liquidity crisis.

The Tea Party is hyper-reactionary. It would rather punish people (immigrants) or institutions (insolvent banks) than help the economy and nation. Holding fast to moral imperatives trumps being adult and swallowing a solution they don't like. This is partly why they hate Obama, he did what they didn't like (Tarp and Deferred Action), yet each action helps the USA move forward.

The Tea Party is a bit like having a petulant child in Congress, and it's why Gail Collins noted, "The only thing Mitch McConnell hates worse than the Democractic agenda is Ted Cruz."

The US is moving forward? Household incomes have fallen. I do not think "forward" means what you think it means.

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RE: Immigration Action Unconstitutional - 12/20/2014 3:02:45 PM

cloudboy

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Mitt Romney in a debate v. Obama in 2011 said his mission would be to bring unemployment below 6%.

Go look at the figure now. For another reference point, refer to your 2009 401K statement and your current one.

Americanized children have been able to go to school, seek employment, get drivers licenses. Their parents are no longer sick with worry about them. This traces back to executive actions taken in 2011.

Moving forward means addressing problems, not complaining about them. The Tea Party filibustered the Dream Act in the Senate, harpooned Immigration reform talks within the Republican party, and now seeks to roll back executive actions. Each action by them in the past was inaction, and now it actually seeks a regressive roll back.

Inaction in 2009 would have resulted in a global Great Depression.

< Message edited by cloudboy -- 12/20/2014 3:05:29 PM >

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RE: Immigration Action Unconstitutional - 12/20/2014 6:25:39 PM

CreativeDominant

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quote:

ORIGINAL: cloudboy

Mitt Romney in a debate v. Obama in 2011 said his mission would be to bring unemployment below 6%.

Go look at the figure now. For another reference point, refer to your 2009 401K statement and your current one.

Americanized children have been able to go to school, seek employment, get drivers licenses. Their parents are no longer sick with worry about them. This traces back to executive actions taken in 2011.

Moving forward means addressing problems, not complaining about them. The Tea Party filibustered the Dream Act in the Senate, harpooned Immigration reform talks within the Republican party, and now seeks to roll back executive actions. Each action by them in the past was inaction, and now it actually seeks a regressive roll back.

Inaction in 2009 would have resulted in a global Great Depression.

And your proof of that?

While it seems to be a favored stance on the part of some on the left that if you believe in the law and that those who've done things legally should be ahead of those that have not, then you must be Tea Party...there are actually some of us who believe that to be true and we aren't tea party. Another thing, cloud...we are not anti-people, we are anti-ACTION of those people. Though again, that is a favored tactic of some on the left...make it the people we're against and not their actions.

Let's all clap hands for Obama's unemployment. Though you might want to look at this chart first: http://data.bls.gov/timeseries/LNS14000000

Several interesting things...when he was first elected in November 2008; the figure started to rise until it was in the 9's. It stayed there quite awhile. When it started to look in October like they would...and then the Republican swept things this November, the number to its lowest level in the 6 yrs he's been in office.

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RE: Immigration Action Unconstitutional - 12/23/2014 12:59:26 PM

mnottertail

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And as it happened he was the Deporter in Chief.

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