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Is there a double standard in the community? - 6/26/2006 5:29:30 AM

DomOrlMarried

Posts: 2
Joined: 6/20/2006
Status: offline

It's amazing to me the view of the lifestye when it comes to married men. A dominant with a sub/slave even though not married can ask his sub/slave to find another for them to play with or for he himself to play with solo and that is acceptable in the community as a dominant that is teaching his submissive the art of not being jealous. On the other hand, a submissive female that is married that wishes to "explore" the lifestyle is also accpeted, whether or not she does so with her spouses approval. But however, A Married Dominant who's wife is vanilla, and she understands the lifestyle probably as well if not better than most of the people here, but herself can not be anymore than she is, and knows her spouse helps subs/slaves experience the things they desire online and at times in real life, he himself is considered a fake, lowlife scum.My wife and I have been married 20 years. She is a wonderful wife and mother of 3. OVer that 20 years i've talked/trained and/or helped several submissives/slave explore the lifestyle in a safe, trusting, manner. I have done so, knowing that I was training them for another at sometime in the future, they themselves have also known that. I've helped them find who they are, and even assisted in helping them find the one that can give them what they desire 24/7. But yet, I am still a fake, scum, cheater to most here. It's amazing to me that it is so. We call ourselves alternative lifestyle, yet we are only alternative in the areas we feel is right for us and still judge those that don't fit into our idea of "dominant/submissive". If someone could explain that to me, that would be appreicated.

My wife is aware of what I have done in the past. Those that I associate in the lifestyle, understand my life, and the limitations I offer, yet we are still judged.

Dominant Orlando Married

Post #: 1

RE: Is there a double standard in the community? - 6/26/2006 5:35:31 AM

becca333

Posts: 1050
Joined: 4/11/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomOrlMarried

......But yet, I am still a fake, scum, cheater to most here. ......
Dominant Orlando Married

After just one post I'm not sure that 'most here' are even aware of your existance, let alone your lifestyle.

And since a hefty percentage here are probably married men playing around, I'm sure there's a lot of fellow feeling for you.

*Edited due to total lack of typing skills and shoddy proofreading. *sigh*

< Message edited by becca333 -- 6/26/2006 5:36:52 AM >

(in reply to DomOrlMarried)

Post #: 2

RE: Is there a double standard in the community? - 6/26/2006 5:42:05 AM

Wulfchyld

Posts: 2618
Joined: 12/7/2005
Status: offline

*plays with becca as wife watches*

Um... we can pretend she isn't watching

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Submission is not a gift... it is plunder!
Where there is a whip, there is a way!
Dom/mes of a feather, beat the f*ck out of slaves together

(in reply to becca333)

Post #: 3

RE: Is there a double standard in the community? - 6/26/2006 5:45:50 AM

DomOrlMarried

Posts: 2
Joined: 6/20/2006
Status: offline

I am not a big poster, have been on the site a while now, and other sites, just posting what i have found in general on the sites i have visited in the last 20 years of the lifestyle i've enjoyed. I do apologize if my first post was a bit controversial, but I needed to get it off my chest.

Respectfully

DomOrlMarried

(in reply to DomOrlMarried)

Post #: 4

RE: Is there a double standard in the community? - 6/26/2006 5:58:04 AM

becca333

Posts: 1050
Joined: 4/11/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Wulfchyld

*plays with becca as wife watches*

Um... we can pretend she isn't watching

You're evil, low and disgraceful.

I like that in a man.

(in reply to Wulfchyld)

Post #: 5

RE: Is there a double standard in the community? - 6/26/2006 5:58:53 AM

twicehappy

Posts: 2706
Joined: 2/5/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomOrlMarried

On the other hand, a submissive female that is married that wishes to "explore" the lifestyle is also accpeted, whether or not she does so with her spouses approval.

I'm sure LA could point you to the threads but there have been a few females"exploring"who were married and they were royally chewed up if they were doing so behind their husbands back.

Coming here and exploring with your spouses(male or female) approval is generally accepted.

I think everyones issue was with the lies, dishonesty and deception, along with the high probability of injuring an innocent partner.

quote:

But however, A Married Dominant who's wife is vanilla, and she understands the lifestyle probably as well if not better than most of the people here, but herself can not be anymore than she is, and knows her spouse helps subs/slaves experience the things they desire online and at times in real life, he himself is considered a fake, lowlife scum.

This is only your second post, so exactly where were you called scum?

I do admire your honesty in your profile because i agree with becca333(only half evil?)there are a lot of married men on here who lie about being married in order to have a little illicit fun.

_____________________________

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The human heart is not a finite container but an ever expanding universe with all the stars contained there in.

(in reply to DomOrlMarried)

Post #: 6

RE: Is there a double standard in the community? - 6/26/2006 6:00:54 AM

meatcleaver

Posts: 9030
Joined: 3/13/2006
Status: offline

Yes. As in all walks of life, double standards and hypocrisy is rife.

(in reply to DomOrlMarried)

Post #: 7

RE: Is there a double standard in the community? - 6/26/2006 6:01:14 AM

cloudboy

Posts: 7306
Joined: 12/14/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomOrlMarried

On the other hand, a submissive female that is married that wishes to "explore" the lifestyle is also accpeted, whether or not she does so with her spouses approval.

Married people have it complicated because if they open up their marriage, they are kind of going poly-in-reverse, and that is tricky driving. If a spouse decides to "cheat," I can tell you that the folks here castigate such behavior regardless of gender. (I haven't seen a double standard.)

What matters most is what your partners and you yourself think. When you and the important primary people in your life are happy and satisfied, who gives a shit what others "accept."

(in reply to DomOrlMarried)

Post #: 8

RE: Is there a double standard in the community? - 6/26/2006 6:01:38 AM

Wulfchyld

Posts: 2618
Joined: 12/7/2005
Status: offline

Um... who? Me?

_____________________________

Loki, forum god of Mischief

Submission is not a gift... it is plunder!
Where there is a whip, there is a way!
Dom/mes of a feather, beat the f*ck out of slaves together

(in reply to becca333)

Post #: 9

RE: Is there a double standard in the community? - 6/26/2006 6:01:51 AM

Driver1961

Posts: 459
Joined: 9/8/2005
Status: offline

He enters, dips His lid...

'DomOrlMarried I say this respectfully.   You have explained yourself quite nicely here and I understand your question. Yes your question is entirely open to individual subjective interpretation. The fact that some dissaprove of you is entirely their opinon, the fact that you presumeably approve of married female subs is entirely your opinion.

In my opinion your strength (just as any married persons' strength) is lacking.   There may be married pple (cyber or real-time) who participate in the Lifestyle with their Vanillas full consent- yet I have not met one to date.   Lots say this and say that but don't stand up with strength in real-time.   Why should you be upset if someone judges you in this manner?   Strength means Strength just as a spade is a spade.

I do not have the 'double standard' you complain of. To express AND act with truth is strength.   This starts within oneself.   How can someone commit to strength or pronounce self-strength within Lifestyle Understanding if they are committed by law to another- consequently my conclusion is that these married people lack the understanding of the Lifestyle (insult my understanding) and certainly lack the strength of self reliance.

I believe that the necessity for 'online training' prior to real-time is a crock. Many Dom/mes and Subs would gladly direct newcommers to information to enable their understanding and their introduction to a real time munch. The lack of this only serves to damage the Lifestyle and sell 'Velcro' collars.

It may be your gig and others but I don't subscribe to your plight.'

I welcome your further thoughts that may extend may journey.

With respect and regards,

Driver1961. Sir to His loving WildChild.

_____________________________

Dance as though nobody is watching!

(in reply to DomOrlMarried)

Post #: 10

RE: Is there a double standard in the community? - 6/26/2006 6:01:56 AM

stef

Posts: 10215
Joined: 1/26/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomOrlMarried

It's amazing to me the view of the lifestye when it comes to married men. A dominant with a sub/slave even though not married can ask his sub/slave to find another for them to play with or for he himself to play with solo and that is acceptable in the community as a dominant that is teaching his submissive the art of not being jealous.

I'm not sure what the "art of not being jealous" has to do with it. If both parties are amenable to the addition of a third, who cares what the reasons behind it are?

quote:

On the other hand, a submissive female that is married that wishes to "explore" the lifestyle is also accpeted, whether or not she does so with her spouses approval.

That hasn't been my experience. Women who cheat on their spouses aren't given any greater latitude than men who cheat on their spouses here.

quote:

But however, A Married Dominant who's wife is vanilla, and she understands the lifestyle probably as well if not better than most of the people here, but herself can not be anymore than she is, and knows her spouse helps subs/slaves experience the things they desire online and at times in real life, he himself is considered a fake, lowlife scum.

Again, that hasn't been my experience. He is a lowlife scum only if the wife isn't aware of and ok with his extramarital activities.

quote:

My wife and I have been married 20 years. She is a wonderful wife and mother of 3. OVer that 20 years i've talked/trained and/or helped several submissives/slave explore the lifestyle in a safe, trusting, manner. I have done so, knowing that I was training them for another at sometime in the future, they themselves have also known that. I've helped them find who they are, and even assisted in helping them find the one that can give them what they desire 24/7. But yet, I am still a fake, scum, cheater to most here.

What exactly are you basing this on? As becca already pointed out, most people here aren't even aware that you walk the earth.

quote:

It's amazing to me that it is so. We call ourselves alternative lifestyle, yet we are only alternative in the areas we feel is right for us and still judge those that don't fit into our idea of "dominant/submissive". If someone could explain that to me, that would be appreicated.

For what it's worth, you're judging all of us, or at least "most here." Why do you find it so hard to believe that others would judge you as well? Do you espect that others should be held to a different standard than you are?

~stef

_____________________________

Welcome to PoliticSpace! If you came here expecting meaningful BDSM discussions, boy are you in the wrong place.

"Hypocrisy has consequences"

(in reply to DomOrlMarried)

Post #: 11

RE: Is there a double standard in the community? - 6/26/2006 6:06:44 AM

michaelGA2

Posts: 1533
Joined: 4/26/2006
Status: offline

well, thank You very much, Sir. i'm glad i am not the only one in this lifestyle that has been getting the same shit as You.

yes, it is a double standard and married or attached males are, for the most part, concidered scum of the Earth.

no offense people, but women can do anything they want to, regardless of what it is, while men are shunned.

_____________________________

Are we having fun, yet?

(in reply to DomOrlMarried)

Post #: 12

RE: Is there a double standard in the community? - 6/26/2006 6:07:19 AM

naughtyzoot

Posts: 2
Joined: 11/10/2005
Status: offline

Of course there is a double standard. how can there not be. cheating is cheating, right?! there will always be the opinion that participating in the lifestyle while married to a vanilla is wrong. it's not my place to judge either way. i will say this, and i honestly believe it, the human race is not meant to be monogomous. people will look outside a "committed" relationship if they think for one second that their needs aren't being met. i say this from experience as i not only looked elsewhere with my first Master that i served for 10 years and then my vanilla husband that would not dominate me. does that make me a bad person!?! i think not. i think it prepared me for my current relationship where all of my needs are being met so i have no need to look outside. then there is the question of, is it acceptable for a submissive to look elsewhere to meet needs and not ok for a Dom. i think here it's the belief that a Dom/me should set an example for others, where a submissive is there to serve. it all boils down to communication. not all people who look to the lifestyle to meet needs are as honest with their vanilla mates. they sneak around and lie. and not all people will accept the fact that even though You say Your vanilla wife knows and accepts what You do, that that makes it all right. my opinion here, is to do what You think is right and not worry so much about what others think. and if You are that concerned with the opinions of others, i suggest You not tell anyone that You are married.

respectfully submitted,

MasterSahasnaughtyzoot

(in reply to DomOrlMarried)

Post #: 13

RE: Is there a double standard in the community? - 6/26/2006 6:15:04 AM

LuckyAlbatross

Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline

quote:

I'm sure LA could point you to the threads but there have been a few females"exploring"who were married and they were royally chewed up if they were doing so behind their husbands back.

Well I don't know that we've had many threads on THAT particular topic, but we certainly have had many about cheating.

There is a certain double standard in wiitwd. But this is no surprise. We had a thread not so long ago with a female sub asking if people thought it was ok for her to rebound with a guy still in another relationship- and other men and women were encouraging her to do so and that it was ok. It is true that women are given more of a green light when it comes to this behavior.

But that doesn't make it more accepted on the whole- and you're right in that affairs very rarely ever actually work in the long term.

_____________________________

Find stable partners, not a stable of partners.

"Sometimes my whore logic gets all fuzzy"- Californication

(in reply to twicehappy)

Post #: 14

RE: Is there a double standard in the community? - 6/26/2006 6:26:12 AM

CreoleCook

Posts: 321
Joined: 10/9/2005
Status: offline

[Quote]

We call ourselves alternative lifestyle, yet we are only alternative in the areas we feel is right for us and still judge those that don't fit into our idea of "dominant/submissive". If someone could explain that to me, that would be appreicated.

Dominant Orlando Married
[/quote]

Long story short? Perception is what this entire "Life style" is based upon. How you perceive yourself, how others perceive you, how you perceive others. As much as the masses claim to not "judge" others, it happens even more within those "Lifestyle" circles than without.

Not withstanding your example of married people with open relationships wanting to find others willing to explore with them. Now I do agree with some responses... if you are married, and going behind your spouses back, that's cheating, and shows that person is not trustworthy, or at the very least, not having much integrity. On the other side of that same token, if you are in an existing relationship, where it has been discussed between both parties involved in the relationship, and is agreed upon to have alternate partners for play/ sex/ etc., then (in my opinion) I say go for it.

Again, this Lifestyle is what you make of it. I know several couples who enjoy just the D/s side of things, without fetish play. I know a few people who love the fetish play, but are unwilling to give over to D/s, other than during the "play." I know people who claim 24/7, and hey, if they can do it, I'm happy for them. I know some men fantasize about seeing a female with some sort of animal (Beastiality.) Hey, that's their cup of tea, not mine. I know men who will leave marks on a woman's body, just as I know women who will show off those marks at the drop of a dime, proudly! Diversification makes this Lifestyle such a wonderful arena to explore.

There's my two cents... well, I gave a nickel. Keep the change.

(in reply to DomOrlMarried)

Post #: 15

RE: Is there a double standard in the community? - 6/26/2006 6:39:19 AM

MsSonnetMarwood

Posts: 1898
Joined: 2/10/2005
From: Eastern Shore, Maryland
Status: offline

I believe in theory, there is no double standard.   I haven't seen anyone say "if you're a woman and cheating, it's ok, but if you're a man and cheating, it's not".  However - due to the overabundance of males interested in kink vs. the underabundance of females, certainly, women are going to be able to get away with it more than men will.  Frankly, I think there are a lot more men out there looking for a part-time kink situation than there are women.

Of course, the cheating becomes a moot point if the spouse is fine (and available to say so) with the relationship being an open one. If you're getting crap about being a cheater, make sure you are being upfront before anything else is said about the agreement you have with your spouse.   Yes, you're going to chase a lot of women off who do not want to be in such a position - but letting them get to know you then slipping that info in later isn't going to score you any points either.

Alas, men who are involved elsewhere are NOT in great demand for the most part, whether or not they have "permission".   If you have experience being poly and your wife is fine with sitting down and talking with a potential, that's a plus. If you have no experience, that makes it a lot of "ifs" to deal with.

< Message edited by MsSonnetMarwood -- 6/26/2006 6:42:18 AM >

_____________________________

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Deja Moo: The feeling you've heard this bull somewhere before.

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Post #: 16

RE: Is there a double standard in the community? - 6/26/2006 6:43:00 AM

KennelDeSade2

Posts: 210
Joined: 9/19/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomOrlMarried
But yet, I am still a fake, scum, cheater to most here. It's amazing to me that it is so.

Sorry guy, but I don't see that attitude expressed enough to understand why you consider it to be a common thing.

_____________________________

Rules? Just one: I say, she does.
Everything else, is just details.

(in reply to DomOrlMarried)

Post #: 17

RE: Is there a double standard in the community? - 6/26/2006 6:44:56 AM

JohnWarren

Posts: 3807
Joined: 3/18/2005
From: Delray Beach, FL
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: KennelDeSade2

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomOrlMarried
But yet, I am still a fake, scum, cheater to most here. It's amazing to me that it is so.

Sorry guy, but I don't see that attitude expressed enough to understand why you consider it to be a common thing.

I agree. Poly is so common in the scene that it hardly rates notice. It's only when one partner is nonconsenting that people see a problem.

For example, I'm a married man who has a number of play partners and I haven't seen any of the condemnation that the OP seems to find rife.

< Message edited by JohnWarren -- 6/26/2006 6:50:55 AM >

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Post #: 18

RE: Is there a double standard in the community? - 6/26/2006 6:45:15 AM

CrappyDom

Posts: 1883
Joined: 4/11/2006
From: Sacramento
Status: offline

I never enjoyed pity parties.

(in reply to KennelDeSade2)

Post #: 19

RE: Is there a double standard in the community? - 6/26/2006 6:48:42 AM

LordTemporal

Posts: 12
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline

I would like to respond to some statements you made and address some misconceptions under which you seem to be laboring. First, you say that "A dominant with a sub/slave even though not married can ask his sub/slave to find another for them to play with or for he himself to play with solo and that is acceptable in the community as a dominant that is teaching his submissive the art of not being jealous." I tend to personally believe that it is not proper for a dom to send his current sub or slave out to find another sub or slave, after all...how is she able to demonstrate or display his dominant personality...and who in the world would essentially submit to another by proxy? As for it teaching the sub the "art of not being jealous"?...what worth is this art?...isn't it instead a thinly disquised way of saying "I want a threesome"?...while poly arrangements are common in this lifestyle, they are workable, only if the two people that are together already, jointly desire them, and seek them out together...so, ultimately a dom telling a sub to forego her own emotions, and find him another to have sex with, when it is not her desire as well, is only teaching her one thing, that the One she is giving all of her attention, service and adoration to, wants to only give her a portion of his in return.

Next, you say that "a submissive female that is married that wishes to "explore" the lifestyle is also accepted, whether or not she does so with her spouses approval."...I tend to disbelieve this as well, especially the part about doing it without her husbands approval, or knowledge...certainly she will be pursued...but by trolls, players, wannbes and leghumpers...not by someone that is serious about the lifestyle. The reason I believe this is that we all know that within a D/s or M/s relationship, trust is paramount. A person must be worthy of trust, because when a sub is bound hand and foot, helpless and vulnerable, is not the time for her to discover that the person approaching her with an implement that in the wrong hands can kill or maim, is not entirely worthy of her trust.  Anyone that is breaking a marriage vow, what could arguably be considered the most sacred of all vows, is innately unworthy of any degree of trust. How could you trust a person that is lying to someone else to be with you? The only way I see this as being acceptable, is if the sub in question, has discussed it openly with her husband, and is going forward with his knowledge and acceptance...and she is able to prove that.

Next, you state that you have trained subs, saying "I have done so, knowing that I was training them for another at sometime in the future"...I don't understand this at all...if you are mentoring them...teaching them lifestyle knowledge, that is fine...but a mentor has no physical involvement with the sub in question, they don't "train" per se...they merely advise.   A "trainer" is one that physically demonstrates lifestyle activities and teaches a sub how to please, the basic fallacy being that the only person the "trainer" is teaching the sub to please, is the trainer himself...which of course would be of limited use when the sub is with the one that will be her actual Master...what YOU view as the lifestyle, is most assuredly NOT what I view as the lifestyle, so were I to take on one of the subs you have "trained", I'd have to tell her to forget everything she thinks she knows, because that is not what I want from her...How do I know this?...simple...I am writing this post, telling you that I don't agree with your thoughts and philosophies here...mentoring a sub, giving her true, solid lifestyle information is quite acceptable, as long as it is given with the caveat that not all dominants view things the same way.

As for you, you state that "My wife is aware of what I have done in the past"...and that she understands that you are in the lifestyle...but is she aware and accepts that you are still doing it?...you never stated precisely that she is aware that you continue to pursue the lifestyle today. As for a married dom, who is pursuing a mentoring role with a submissive, with the full knowledge and acceptance of his wife, I see nothing wrong with that, so far as the wife does not, and the sub that is being mentored fully understands as well, that you are married. Again, it has to do with trust, and trustworthiness...if the dom in question is being entirely honest with all parties involved, and has their blessings...then where is the harm?   But again, I will state that the whole idea of "training" a sub...physically teaching her lifestyle activities, with the sole idea of "turning her over to another dom for ownership" is ludicrous. It's like wearing another person's new shoes, to "break them in"...ultimately they aren't broken in for the owner, but for the wearer...ie..you let someone else break in your shoes, you've got a pair of shoes that are only comfortable for them....so the entire basis of your argument of simply "training"...is of limited worth.

Last but certainly not least...let's face it...there are a great deal of married men on here and on other lifestyle sites, most of them without their spouse's knowledge...they seem to be attracted to D/s and M/s sites, because they have the missconception that because a woman is submissive, they won't say no...we all know that nothing could be further from the truth. However, these trolling men don't have a grasp of the lifestyle, so they continue to prey here. So, don't squawk that you are the only true and worthy married man here, that you are worth something, that you aren't just cheating on your wife...just because you are the only snake that doesn't bite, doesn't mean that you will be looked upon with appreciation. No, instead you will likely be treated as if you were like all the other vipers...ie..if it looks like a snake, hisses like a snake...and has the wedding ring of a snake, chop it's head off quick before it can strike. Your plea for tolerance, for understanding will largely fall upon deaf ears, because why should a sub accept a married mentor or trainer, when there are so very many other qualified, intelligent, worthy and SINGLE doms out there, that are not only able to teach them, but ultimate collar and own them...and train them for lifetime use that suits THEM...

Oh, and speaking of tolerance...part of tolerance is allowing others their opinions, whether you feel they are justifiable, or not...so, my last suggestion to you is you showed a remarkable lack of tolerance to others opinions, when you wrote your rant about not being acceptable. Where was your tolerance of their opinions about married men, when you wrote that?

My best suggestion for you, since you seem to believe that a female sub that is indulging in this lifestyle without the knowlege, support, and acceptance of her spouse is just fine and dandy, that you limit yourself to "training" this type only...I think you would receive the same satisfaction, without causing any ill will amongst those others that you feel are so intolerant.

LT

< Message edited by LordTemporal -- 6/26/2006 6:55:37 AM >

(in reply to becca333)

Post #: 20

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