RE: GOP must modernize to win on national stage (Full Version)

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tazzygirl -> RE: GOP must modernize to win on national stage (11/11/2012 6:53:00 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: flyhumbleguy

I don't think they necessarily need to jettison them but rather to stop promising policies as part of their platform that are sympatico with them on social policies. The GOP would benefit from taking a more libertarian approach on social issues and encouraging those groups to exert their influence in the free market.


Problem is that since Reagan and the "Moral Majority" most know that if they arent pandered to, they dont have to open the purse strings. And its those purse strings that dicate how an election is run.



SimplyMichael -> RE: GOP must modernize to win on national stage (11/11/2012 7:11:48 AM)

The way to change the debate is to change the primaries. Having tiny meaningless states choose the candidates for the rest of us dilutes the power of the middle and and delivers us idiots, time and time again, Obama, a one term senate nobody from the most crooked state around and Romney, a religious nutjob and a corporate raider? S

Seriously?

The initial field always has interesting intelligent candidates, but the fringes matter more in the smaller states. Let Texas, California and a few other actually important states decide who is viable. I dont care which party you belong to, having better candidates on both sides would greatly improve the national debate.



GreedyTop -> RE: GOP must modernize to win on national stage (11/11/2012 7:16:45 AM)

*NM*

totally different discussion and I like that this one has been civil, thus far...



fucktoyprincess -> RE: GOP must modernize to win on national stage (11/11/2012 7:48:38 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: SchrodingerSock

Yup i saw those exit figures on the bbc website interesting reading. And my dont they tell many a story Still, for some strange reason the GOP got what was it 48-49% of the electoral vote - I wouldn't imagine they have to change too much to get into power, not that i understand this.


What they got was 49% of the popular vote. I think Romney received about 40% of the electoral votes. I also believe it has been a long time since the GOP has won the popular vote.

I feel that given the changing demographics in America, that the GOP if it retains its current policies will not gain inroads (their main constituency appears to be old white males - this is not a growing demographic in the country). Also, given the way the electoral system works for Presidential elections, many states that are solidly GOP are also states with a low population, and thus a smaller number of electoral votes. And while the swing states will still be up for grabs in 2016, I'm not sure what type of small policy change would ensure getting those states. I see the need for an overhaul if they want to stay competitive.

I read somewhere that they are now going to try to pander for Hispanic vote by agreeing to immigration reform. But there is no evidence that Hispanics would vote Republican even if the Republicans in Congress supported immigration reform. And supporting immigration reform will surely annoy some of the more conservative jingoist Republicans. And changing their stance on immigration reform is still not going to address the many other issues that moderates are interested in. I still see an uphill battle for the GOP.

If they want to be Grand 'Ole Party then they have to stop being Grumpy Old Patriarchs. Can't have it both ways.



DomKen -> RE: GOP must modernize to win on national stage (11/11/2012 8:22:01 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: fucktoyprincess


quote:

ORIGINAL: SchrodingerSock

Yup i saw those exit figures on the bbc website interesting reading. And my dont they tell many a story Still, for some strange reason the GOP got what was it 48-49% of the electoral vote - I wouldn't imagine they have to change too much to get into power, not that i understand this.


What they got was 49% of the popular vote. I think Romney received about 40% of the electoral votes. I also believe it has been a long time since the GOP has won the popular vote.

206 of 538 = 38%

2004 was the last time the GOP won the popular vote. It's the only time they won the popular vote since 1988



fucktoyprincess -> RE: GOP must modernize to win on national stage (11/11/2012 8:24:27 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

quote:

ORIGINAL: fucktoyprincess


quote:

ORIGINAL: SchrodingerSock

Yup i saw those exit figures on the bbc website interesting reading. And my dont they tell many a story Still, for some strange reason the GOP got what was it 48-49% of the electoral vote - I wouldn't imagine they have to change too much to get into power, not that i understand this.


What they got was 49% of the popular vote. I think Romney received about 40% of the electoral votes. I also believe it has been a long time since the GOP has won the popular vote.

206 of 538 = 38%

2004 was the last time the GOP won the popular vote. It's the only time they won the popular vote since 1988

Thank you! Was too lazy this Sunday am to fact check....



vincentML -> RE: GOP must modernize to win on national stage (11/11/2012 9:45:59 AM)

~FR~
It is worth noting that the Republican Party is not a monolith like the Tory or Labour Parties. In the US, to make matters excrutiatingly amusing, each national party is composed of 50 state parties. The lines of downward discipline and upward allegience are weak. There are 30 Republican state governors. As of Nov 1st there were 22 Republican controlled state governments and 11 Democratic controlled state governments. The Nov 6th elections brought only minor changes to this scoreboard.

For a new party to emerge it would have to emerge as a power in a large number of states. For significant change to occur in the philosophy of the National Republican Party there would have to be, imo, some cataclismic event. Slavery and disUnion were the events that gave birth to the Republican Party and killed the Whigs. The Great Recession and World War 2 renewed the Democratic Party. The Civil Rights movement and street riots drove southern Dems into the Republican Party as it is constituted today.

The Republicans continue to be successful at the state and local level, and some speculate will continue to be so because big money donations have a greater impact down the line.

Was the recent election result really so great an event to cause significant change in the Republican coalition? Not convinced, although dearly wished for.



tweakabelle -> RE: GOP must modernize to win on national stage (11/12/2012 4:49:01 AM)

quote:

Was the recent election result really so great an event to cause significant change in the Republican coalition? Not convinced, although dearly wished for.


If the posts by some of our resident Republicans here, or the statements being made in the media by GOP leaders are anything to go by, your pessimism is more than justified. Since the election we have been treated to a succession of blame-shifting, alternating with exercises in victim-hood that would make any welfare cheat green with jealousy - all to explain away the 'wrong' election results. For example, check out the OP at the " A or B, not yes or no" thread here.

The only people proposing viable life saving measures for the terminally ill GOP are those on the centre and the Left. Perhaps all of us on the Left ought to shut up and leave the Right to its victim status - these proponents of "personal responsibility" enjoy it like it's their comfort zone. Personally, I'm very comfortable with having the Right as permanent losers - it is to everyone's benefit (except the 1% who are the beneficiaries of the Right's policies)



Moonhead -> RE: GOP must modernize to win on national stage (11/12/2012 5:20:01 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: GreedyTop

Reposted from elsewhere:

Here in the UK, Conservatives like to talk about “progressive conservatism”. And while many might not be able to explain fully what it means, the party’s reform process and evolution put the Conservatives in No 10 for the first time in 13 years.

I'm sure that's the spin Cameron likes to put on it, but it was more a coalition government with a snivelling bitch who makes most of the male submissives on here look like Goreans with a bigger 'tache than Tom Sellack and the whole country being pissed off with Labour's refusal to reverse it's move to the right under Blair when Broon took over than any alleged rebranding of the Conservative party or anything Cameron actually did.



GreedyTop -> RE: GOP must modernize to win on national stage (11/12/2012 5:50:57 AM)

Moonie, the person that wrote the article has only been living in the UK for about 6? yrs, I think (I forget when she moved. She's an American expat, if the article didn't make it clear).

Before she moved, she worked in the political halls of DC.

For the record, she considers herself a Republican.



ElChupa -> RE: GOP must modernize to win on national stage (11/12/2012 5:55:44 AM)

Do we pander to those that have their hands out? The obamaphone electorate? We have the socialist party already. Santa Clause. Is it wise for the party to become socialism light? I think not. Leftists/socialists always have the easiest job. Just promise them stuff! Who cares who pays for it. It's much harder to be the party of work hard, pay your taxes, get rewarded for your labor, quit spending money we don't have. We have a sea change in this country and of course it is horrible. We have willingly become of nation of people with their hands out, beggars. Remember the war on poverty? BILLIONS and BILLIONS spent on that. The results? The poverty level has actually gone up. BUT, liberals feel good! It's all about liberals feeling good, folks, not about actually doing anything constructive. I think Republicans give too much credit to the American electorate. I have them totally figured out. The answer for me now is asset protection, asset hiding, block, stop, slow, whatever it takes to halt socialism.



Moonhead -> RE: GOP must modernize to win on national stage (11/12/2012 5:57:53 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: GreedyTop

Moonie, the person that wrote the article has only been living in the UK for about 6? yrs, I think (I forget when she moved. She's an American expat, if the article didn't make it clear).

Before she moved, she worked in the political halls of DC.

For the record, she considers herself a Republican.

I know that, but I still think that's a bit of a false premise to start her essay off from.



GreedyTop -> RE: GOP must modernize to win on national stage (11/12/2012 6:10:54 AM)

Moonie, if you don't mind, I'd like to forward your comment to her, and see what she says?



Moonhead -> RE: GOP must modernize to win on national stage (11/12/2012 6:17:34 AM)

Go for it.
;)
I have no argument with most of her piece, but saying that it was a revamp that won Cameron the last election is nonsense: he didn't win anything, and a coalition emerged from a hung parliament.



GreedyTop -> RE: GOP must modernize to win on national stage (11/12/2012 6:23:50 AM)

thanks, doll :) (love to you and the Gothyone!)  I will post her reply when I hear back!



Moonhead -> RE: GOP must modernize to win on national stage (11/12/2012 6:29:53 AM)

Thank you.
I just wondered if she thinks that the coalition is a rebranding rather than an alliance because she's more used to a two party system...



Owner59 -> RE: GOP must modernize to win on national stage (11/12/2012 6:29:55 AM)

GOP Could Soon 'Cease To Exist,' Republican Says



GreedyTop -> RE: GOP must modernize to win on national stage (11/12/2012 6:33:14 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Moonhead

Thank you.
I just wondered if she thinks that the coalition is a rebranding rather than an alliance because she's more used to a two party system...


or maybe she was writing aimed towards the Americans who don't really grasp UK politics (which would be most of the folks here).  We'll see.  I don't know how long it will take for her to reply (or, really, even if she will).



Moonhead -> RE: GOP must modernize to win on national stage (11/12/2012 6:48:04 AM)

Well, that's definitely a possibility as well. That does simplify the main reason Cameron "won" the election out of the discussion, though, which isn't helpful.



GreedyTop -> RE: GOP must modernize to win on national stage (11/12/2012 8:42:46 AM)

oops.  just realized that I didn't edit your response before sending it to her (re: submissive males, etc).


Guessing here:  probably not going to hear back... LOL



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