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Navigating Monogamy in a Sea of Poly - 2/10/2009 8:51:54 PM

SimplyMichael

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I am putting together a class on monogamy (teaching it in LA and SF) called Navigating Monogamy in a Sea of Poly and I am interested in the problems people have faced and how they have overcome them. I would like to hear from people who identify as monogamous and who are active in their local bdsm scene.

I know the difficulties I have faced both when I am single and when I am with someone. The class will be structured around first dealing with how single people can become couples and how couples can remain so despite the subtle poly pressure that exists in most places.

My experience however is limited to my local community and SF and I want a broader perspective. I am also not a woman and seek their experiences dealing with all this.

What I am curious about are things like how does someone who doesn't play casually and who doesn't have a partner get to be a "known" person. I am going to talk about the usual stuff, volunteering, finding a platonic partner to play with, attending discussion groups, etc. I am looking for some real outside the box stuff and I figured the amazing people here have come up with some unique ways of dealing with that.

I also am going to go over the pressures put on couples and how to deal with being active in a scene where poly is OFTEN seen as the norm.

(note: please don't bash poly or feel offended by any of the stuff in this thread)

< Message edited by SimplyMichael -- 2/10/2009 9:01:33 PM >

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RE: Navigating Monogamy in a Sea of Poly - 2/10/2009 8:56:22 PM

AquaticSub

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quote:

ORIGINAL: SimplyMichael

I also am going to go over the pressures put on couples and how to deal with being active in a scene where poly is seen as the norm.

Not bashing or offended... I just want to move where poly is the norm. It's pretty accepted but I wouldn't say it's the norm where I am, unless one counts simply scening with others as being poly.

Still, it sounds interesting and I hope you get some good responses.

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(in reply to SimplyMichael)

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RE: Navigating Monogamy in a Sea of Poly - 2/10/2009 9:06:06 PM

SimplyMichael

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Thanks, I fixed that.

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RE: Navigating Monogamy in a Sea of Poly - 2/10/2009 10:05:20 PM

welcomerain

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Well, when I was younger I'd sometimes get propositioned and get upset about it.

Now I just say it's a hard limit and move on. If someone propositions me I assume they don't know me and they're hopeful, and if someone persists after being told no, I assume they're assholes. Not much different than any other dating hazard, really.

To be honest, once I learned to handle the "pressure" firmly, it stopped being a problem. (For me anyway. Your mileage may vary.)

I also don't think that poly is really considered the norm by many people. I think most people believe monogamy is the norm but they'd be perfectly happy to pick up a spare partner or two for bragging rights. The only poly relationships I've witnessed that actually worked grew naturally out of a third person's closeness to both members of a couple.

(in reply to SimplyMichael)

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RE: Navigating Monogamy in a Sea of Poly - 2/11/2009 2:56:40 AM

Evility

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You really have to be joking. A sea of poly? I was in a poly relationship for four years in a city (Atlanta) which boasts a fairly vibrant fetish community. I don't know where this sea of poly that you allude to exists but it sure does not exist in Atlanta. The average submissive female - and we are talking a serious majority here - is looking for The One with no interest at all in playing second fiddle. If you really are interested in teaching a class on these topics and tackling the problems people face you need to turn the topic around 180 degrees. It may be hard to find your monogamous mate in all of this but it is not hard to find monogamous people. Being a married poly person was tantamount to being a hunchbacked cyclops.

A sea of poly... you really had me going there for a minute.

(in reply to SimplyMichael)

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RE: Navigating Monogamy in a Sea of Poly - 2/11/2009 3:31:39 AM

CatdeMedici

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Maybe I am missing something here, could be that I am thick--but I don't get the "sea of poly"----unless you refer to being committed to one and playing or having a D/s with another, but I don't see that as poly---so maybe there needs to be a definition of "poly" ( as I see it-- a familial arrangement or a way of 24/7 life) or maybe that is based on regions.

I just don't see in My Southern world a preponderence of "poly"--I DO see a consistent perpetuation of monag.

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RE: Navigating Monogamy in a Sea of Poly - 2/11/2009 3:35:48 AM

agirl

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Echoing the above posts..poly is certainly not the norm here either.(UK) Playing with people other than your partner etc, yes, but not poly relationships.

agirl

(in reply to CatdeMedici)

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RE: Navigating Monogamy in a Sea of Poly - 2/11/2009 3:55:46 AM

littlewonder

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I have found the poly issue to be a huge problem in bdsm.

I am completely and strictly monogamous and finding a man who is as well in this "world" is a rare and almost impossible find.

It seems the majority are poly. I'm to the point where if I have to deal with poly anymore then I'll probably just give up altogether and join a nunnery.

I'm just not poly and never will be.

(in reply to agirl)

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RE: Navigating Monogamy in a Sea of Poly - 2/11/2009 5:15:53 AM

crouchingtigress

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Wonderful topic!...its going to be a wonderful class Micheal...I had no idea this was a problem but I can see it.

I am from a very poly leather family, here in HI, but I was intrigued to hear from the replies that that is very unusual.

quote:

What I am curious about are things like how does someone who doesn't play casually and who doesn't have a partner get to be a "known" person.

Also a new one for me because my community is so small here, can you explain a few things to me?

What is a known person?
Why does one want to be one?
What are you defining as playing casually?

I am in a differnt shcool when it comes to finding partners then many I have met, I dont think it has anything to do with how many fish in the sea, I think you create the person you want to be with in your heart, and list those qualitys somewhere, and then work hard to become that person....vibration attracts vibration...like attracts like...and one day they are just there and you hangout with them for a while....maybe a really long time...maybe not depends on what you need to learn from eachother, and what you long term goals are. Thats just me...

So what I am hearing that you are asking is "How does a single mon person find another single mon person with out playing with everyone..."

Being a self identified slut it is sort of hard to get my head around this one....but I am trying.

I would think that you could talk about writing really explicit profiles, since like attracts like, maybe hanging out with other mon couples? What about asking the poly couples who they know that identifys as monogoumus...can they play matchmaker?

I think becoming a known person is fairly easy, like you said volunteer with your group, put yourself out there, be the one that has to do the emails, throw a bbq once a month for the group, take on the harder admin tasks ect....Folks notice a person like that very quickly and go out of thier way to support that person in thier personal goals....or at least that has been my experiance.

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RE: Navigating Monogamy in a Sea of Poly - 2/11/2009 5:49:15 AM

catize

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Perhaps you are labeling this incorrectly. I think it might be an issue of monogamy vs. non-monogamy rather than polyamoury. There is a difference.
It would seem to me that it is a matter of priorities. What is more important; being true to yourself and wait for the right partner, accepting the fact that this may limit you for now? Or putting yourself out there to gain experience? Every person must make that decision on their own.
I would think that a person could garner admiration and notice; become ‘known’ in the community, if they are consistent and self assured enough to not give in to peer pressure.
Admittedly, I have no experience with BDSM groups. But I would hazard a guess that these communities are much like any other. Those who have the courage of their convictions will surely stand out.

< Message edited by catize -- 2/11/2009 5:50:21 AM >

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RE: Navigating Monogamy in a Sea of Poly - 2/11/2009 6:01:55 AM

CallaFirestormBW

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Wow, after 30 years of struggling to find people open to the idea of poly -at all-, it seems strange to see a post intimating that poly is the -norm-. It certainly hasn't been "the norm" in RDU, Houston, Syracuse (NY), OK City, Anchorage, or Atlanta while we were around.

I -have- noticed that the young folks in my (adult) offsprings' generation have fewer problems with it than we did, but even among them, it's considered unusual.

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RE: Navigating Monogamy in a Sea of Poly - 2/11/2009 6:06:01 AM

CallaFirestormBW

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quote:

ORIGINAL: littlewonder

I have found the poly issue to be a huge problem in bdsm.

I am completely and strictly monogamous and finding a man who is as well in this "world" is a rare and almost impossible find.

It seems the majority are poly. I'm to the point where if I have to deal with poly anymore then I'll probably just give up altogether and join a nunnery.

I'm just not poly and never will be.

I have to wonder if the issue isn't that guys you're encountering are "poly" per se, but that there are a large contingent of individuals, leaning a bit heavily, in my experience, into the male gender pool, who use the word "poly" to indicate that they're pre-planning infidelity to their partner -- ie., setting the partner up so that, later on, when they decide that the cookie they have isn't enough, and they get caught with their hands in the cookie jar, they can say "oh, but honey, I -told- you I wasn't monogamous".

Hey, Michael... that may be something to address... how to stand out as something special from the 'wankers' when one is monogamous and single in the community, and how to encourage individuals who may have been burned by situations like the above to take a chance on one of the 'good guys'.

< Message edited by CallaFirestormBW -- 2/11/2009 6:19:19 AM >

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RE: Navigating Monogamy in a Sea of Poly - 2/11/2009 6:17:11 AM

RedMagic1

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Hi Calla,

What do you think of this as a working hypothesis?

Groups and their interest in poly:

1) Gay male masters - requirement
2) Gay male subs - strong interest, at least in gangbang scenes
3) Straight male masters - strong interest
4) Straight male nilla - curious
5) Lesbians of any orientation - varies widely
6) Straight female nilla - hard limit

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RE: Navigating Monogamy in a Sea of Poly - 2/11/2009 6:18:47 AM

RCdc

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How you define monogamy? Lots of people play casually with others but consider themselves monogamous because the relationship itself is what matters and do not have sex with others. Play is not considered, nor does it equal, sex. Also, just like 'poly', there are different types of monogamy, so clarification would be helpful.

Also what is meant by 'known'. Do you mean how do you get to know another monogamous person, or how do you become known community wise(such as teaching demos, or putting together a class like yourself). I was a single person who never contemplated anything but monogamy and I still helped to host a munch and get involved with other 'community' activities, just as I do now in a monogamous relationship.
It's rare that people assume we are poly and try it on. It's more common for people to respond with surprise when the find out we are monogamous and you get questions, but its never uncomfortable or unpleasent. People on the whole are pretty cool.

the.dark.

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RE: Navigating Monogamy in a Sea of Poly - 2/11/2009 6:19:55 AM

Metamorph

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Evility

The average submissive female - and we are talking a serious majority here - is looking for The One with no interest at all in playing second fiddle.

Exactly. Not sure where this "Sea of Poly" is... never seen it myself.

(in reply to Evility)

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RE: Navigating Monogamy in a Sea of Poly - 2/11/2009 6:21:49 AM

SassySarijane

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From: KC Area Missouri
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There are quite a few in my local community who are poly. I have had serious offers to join 3 poly families if I ever decide to give up monogamy. No pressure from them, but more the assurance that I would be very welcome with them if I ever wanted to join them and that they think very highly of me and consider me at the least to be a friend. These are people I know in person and have for 1-3 years.

I'm just not wired for poly. I have no problem accepting those into poly, I just have no desire to get into a relationship beyond friendship with them. The only times I've had any problems with people into poly or felt pressured by them have been in an online setting; and those I believe weren't poly so much as harem builders so to speak as that is how they came off.

Edited to add that I am basing my reply on poly that includes sex as I see many keep asking for clarification of what the OP means by poly.

< Message edited by SassySarijane -- 2/11/2009 6:25:33 AM >

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RE: Navigating Monogamy in a Sea of Poly - 2/11/2009 7:03:43 AM

DavanKael

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Hi, Michael----
Gotta join the confused voices regarding the pervasiveness of poly-. Now, granted, I am an East Coaster and we're not nearly as progressive as the West Coast about most things but in over a decade of identifying as poly-, thinking of it being dominant or even pervasive anywhere is pretty difficult to wrap my brain around.
Non-monogamy and casual play seem to be a huge thing in the bdsm world. Those things aren't inherently poly, though, in my universe, I'd need to have either of those behaviors fit within a poly paradigm (Were I being actively poly) to entertain doing them.
Rather than focusing on poly, I would think that broadening out as I've identified above may serve you well.
Davan

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RE: Navigating Monogamy in a Sea of Poly - 2/11/2009 7:08:39 AM

cjan

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Ah yes, The Sea of Poly lies just Over the Rainbow just beyond Oz.

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RE: Navigating Monogamy in a Sea of Poly - 2/11/2009 7:24:19 AM

Missokyst

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Here on the west coast casual play tends to be more common. I would not say poly as much as .. convienience. There are many opportunities for play parties and playing with people you may have just met. Sex is not as casual, though I do not go behind closed doors.
I am monogamous. I don't play casually. I don't have occasional partners to let some steam off. When I am in need, my subconscious finds an out. I sometimes wonder if people who are maso and do not know it are the klutzs of the world. I do think there are still a lot of people seeking "the one", but in my observation more of them are just out for a bit of excitement, sex, fresh meat. It is probably the biggest reason I stay monogamous and chaste.
But as for keeping my name up there.. I run a group. I sometimes organise events, I am fairly talkative and not afraid to say what I think. I do go to local parties so that I am not forgotten, but generally people don't forget me for reasons unknown to me. I think if you are not casual and are monogamous there are other ways to stay in the game, but it takes effort.

Kyst

< Message edited by Missokyst -- 2/11/2009 7:26:31 AM >

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RE: Navigating Monogamy in a Sea of Poly - 2/11/2009 7:30:10 AM

CreativeDominant

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Add my voice to those who think you might want to clarify or redefine your tems, Michael.

I want to be in a relationship with one. I am monogamous in the relationship arena whereas polyamourous...to me anyway...involves relationships of a more serious nature with more than one. I've discussed this with a lot of submissive friends and in asking them, I've heard that:
They would be O.K. with their dominant playing...but not having any sexual contact with...other partners. Monogamy with "beat" privileges.
They would be O.K. with their dominant allowing others to "play" them but not touch them sexually. Submissive monogamy with "beat" privileges.
They would be O.K. with their dominant playing someone and touching them sexually BUT NOT having genital-to-genital/mouth contact nor being involved with that person...other than as casual friends...outside the play arena. Dominant non-monogamy but not polyamourous.
They would be O.K. with their dominant "loaning" them for play and sexual touch BUT NOT having genital-to-genital/mouth contact nor being involved with that person...other than as casual friends...outside the play arena. Submissive non-monogamy but not polyamourous.
They'd be O.K. with their dominant not only "beating" others but also having sex with them AS LONG AS the relationship remains casual outside the "play" area and does not detract from the main relationsip nor become part of the relationship. Dominant non-monogamy with full privileges but NOT polyamourous.
They'd be O.K. with their dominant not only "loaning" them to others for "beating" but also for sexual play AS LONG AS the partner is a known entity and at least a casual friend BUT DOES NOT detract from the main relationship nor become part of the main relationship. Submissive non-monogamy with full privileges but NOT polyamourous.

As noted, I've spoken about this with submissives and, to a lesser extent, with other dominants and when you go back through the threads, you can see the types of situations I've noted mentioned. But...in my world at least...that is not polyamory. I tend to see Knight's relationship with Alendra and Kyra as a form of a poly family. They are certainly not casually involved with each other and there is a relationship that exists among all three as well as relating to each other on a one-to-one basis.

(in reply to SimplyMichael)

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