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RE: Critical Mass - 7/27/2008 8:22:51 PM   
Evility


Posts: 915
Joined: 12/19/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Vendaval
Around here, you do well to brake for livestock and wildlife, bicyclists and skateboarders.


This apparently is not a group of cyclists that a driver might wait for. This is a planned and premeditated rolling roadblock made of a long procession of bicycles. It seems like it is more designed to be an obstruction than to raise public awareness. For every motorist who gets the message there will be two that they piss off. Hope they don't meet up with one of those pissed off drivers down the road.

< Message edited by Evility -- 7/27/2008 8:23:19 PM >

(in reply to Vendaval)
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RE: Critical Mass - 7/27/2008 11:00:39 PM   
ownedgirlie


Posts: 9184
Joined: 2/5/2006
Status: offline 		I think the idea is to raise awareness by creating such a mess on the roads that they get media time.  They want to piss people off.  That's how they get in front of the news cameras.

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Good is the enemy of great.

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RE: Critical Mass - 7/27/2008 11:22:56 PM   
DomKen


Posts: 19457
Joined: 7/4/2004
From: Chicago, IL
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MissIsis

WOW!!! And I thought these Chicago drivers here were bad!

It would be really nice if the powers that be really wanted to help make alternative transportation a bigger reality.  I don't ride a bike these days, but I might think about it, if I felt a little safer & didn't have such a long commute.  Bike Riders really shouldn't be sharing the road with cars that weigh so much more than the bikes they are riding, & with vehicles that are traveling so much faster than they can be going.  Cities could help by making bike lanes and walking lanes a priority.  They seem to find enough money for enough of their other pet projects.  I am sure they could figure out something. Maybe set aside certain roads just for bicyclists & others for drivers, if they can't build bike & pedestrian routes.  With as close as the streets are in Chicago & other major cities, how difficult could that really be? 

I don't know where in the Chicago area you live but there are some excellent bike paths. The lakefront path is an excellent commuter route on weekdays and runs essentially uninterupted from Hollywood to the South Shore Country Club. While I don't see them getting a ton of use there are dedicated bike lanes on several major streets in the city, Roosevelt and Lawrence I'm sure off with a few others IIRC. There's also a very nice path that runs along the Fox river, assuming the area isn't still flooded, that serves as a pretty direct route although there are a fair number of road crossings to deal with.

(in reply to MissIsis)
Profile   Post #: 23
RE: Critical Mass - 7/28/2008 2:58:20 AM   
MissIsis


Posts: 473
Joined: 1/1/2005
Status: offline 		I live in the beautiful suburb of Aurora.  I work in Willowbrook, a 20 mile commute.  There is at least one really nice path out this way that goes into at least Naperville.  Unfortunately, 20 miles is a bit much for me to try to commute by bike, & wouldn't keep me all the way out of the flow of the heavier traffic.   The train is still hit or miss to try to get a bike on.  I think they are getting better, but some people still seem to be having problems depending on when they are going & if they are trying to get to work during rush hour with finding bike room on the trains.  Getting more bikes on the road is still a great idea, but I think we have a long way to go before more people take to them for commuting. 

I have not yet been brave enough to try to drive to Chicago, or any of the highways out here, except a small part of I-88.  Those drivers terrify me.

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RE: Critical Mass - 7/28/2008 6:39:45 AM   
DomKen


Posts: 19457
Joined: 7/4/2004
From: Chicago, IL
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quote:

ORIGINAL: MissIsis

I live in the beautiful suburb of Aurora.  I work in Willowbrook, a 20 mile commute.  There is at least one really nice path out this way that goes into at least Naperville.  Unfortunately, 20 miles is a bit much for me to try to commute by bike, & wouldn't keep me all the way out of the flow of the heavier traffic.   The train is still hit or miss to try to get a bike on.  I think they are getting better, but some people still seem to be having problems depending on when they are going & if they are trying to get to work during rush hour with finding bike room on the trains.  Getting more bikes on the road is still a great idea, but I think we have a long way to go before more people take to them for commuting. 

I have not yet been brave enough to try to drive to Chicago, or any of the highways out here, except a small part of I-88.  Those drivers terrify me.


Metra gets pretty crowded on the line in from Aurora so getting a bike on it during rush hour is probably a bad idea.

Driving on the interstates around here can be pretty intimidating. I'm not real comfortable with 80 or 85 mph being the cruising speed. I try to limit my on the interstate driving to off peak times and stick to the right lane at a speed I'm comfortable with.

You should definitely make it into the city though. Drivers on the city streets still tend to do dumb stuff but at least do it at slower speeds so its simply frustrating rather than life threatening. The city in the summer is worth it.

(in reply to MissIsis)
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RE: Critical Mass - 7/28/2008 2:44:21 PM   
Thadius


Posts: 5091
Joined: 10/11/2005
Status: offline 		I completely agree there is nothing like the city during the summer.  When I was contracted to the park district, I would have to go out to the regional park admin buildings, and on Fridays it always meant a trip to the South Shore Cultural Center (Its at the SS country club, and also where stables for the CPD are located).  The drive there was great, but the best part was that would be the last call of the day, so I got to come back up LSD into the city, and usually would keep on going all the way up to Hollywood.  I sincerely miss those days.

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(in reply to DomKen)
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RE: Critical Mass - 7/28/2008 3:37:47 PM   
slaveboyforyou


Posts: 3607
Joined: 1/6/2005
From: Arkansas, U.S.A.
Status: offline 		http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yyqR_8hHsUo

A video of these jackasses acting like infants. 

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Profile   Post #: 27
RE: Critical Mass - 7/28/2008 4:04:20 PM   
DomKen


Posts: 19457
Joined: 7/4/2004
From: Chicago, IL
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: slaveboyforyou

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yyqR_8hHsUo

A video of these jackasses acting like infants. 

Did you watch this all the way through? Who is always at fault in rear end collisions? Are you claiming the bikes were thrown under the minivan?

(in reply to slaveboyforyou)
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RE: Critical Mass - 7/28/2008 5:03:17 PM   
slaveboyforyou


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From: Arkansas, U.S.A.
Status: offline
quote:

Did you watch this all the way through? Who is always at fault in rear end collisions? Are you claiming the bikes were thrown under the minivan?


Yeah I watched it all the way through.  I saw a bunch of immature losers harrassing an elderly couple with foul language and vandalism.  They did throw their bikes underneath their van, and it was obvious that's what they did.  They also bashed out their windshield, and one of them was talking about removing the lug nuts from the van's front wheel. 

(in reply to DomKen)
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RE: Critical Mass - 7/28/2008 5:33:46 PM   
Alumbrado


Posts: 5560
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

quote:

ORIGINAL: slaveboyforyou

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yyqR_8hHsUo

A video of these jackasses acting like infants. 

Did you watch this all the way through? Who is always at fault in rear end collisions? Are you claiming the bikes were thrown under the minivan?


Did you watch any of it? 

Those morons who were commiting the crime of preventing the elderly couple from leaving, put their bikes under the tires (at 1:14 seconds you can see the yellow bike upright in front of the unmoving van's grill, at 1:17 the rider in tan pants dismounts and tilts the bike, instead of moving out of the way, while the others vandalize the van, ....at 1:26 the bike is placed so that it's uncrushed yellow wheel is now behind the van's front tire on the passenger side....then they started screaming "Somebody's under there!!!",and  faking outrage and sobs,  by the end, they were lining up to claim that several people, including children had been injured by the elderly couple.



(in reply to DomKen)
Profile   Post #: 30
RE: Critical Mass - 7/28/2008 5:35:13 PM   
DomKen


Posts: 19457
Joined: 7/4/2004
From: Chicago, IL
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: slaveboyforyou

quote:

Did you watch this all the way through? Who is always at fault in rear end collisions? Are you claiming the bikes were thrown under the minivan?


Yeah I watched it all the way through.  I saw a bunch of immature losers harrassing an elderly couple with foul language and vandalism.  They did throw their bikes underneath their van, and it was obvious that's what they did.  They also bashed out their windshield, and one of them was talking about removing the lug nuts from the van's front wheel. 

Not in that video you didn't. No windshield damage although a windshield wiper did get lifted off the windshield. No. the bikes were not thrown under the van. The scene begins with people scrambling to get off their bikes before the minivan rolled over the bike and biker instead of just the bikes.

You might want to watch it again.

(in reply to slaveboyforyou)
Profile   Post #: 31
RE: Critical Mass - 7/28/2008 5:40:02 PM   
Alumbrado


Posts: 5560
Status: offline 		Rolled over the bikes...moving their position from the front of the van to the side, while leaving the rims unbent? 

(in reply to DomKen)
Profile   Post #: 32
RE: Critical Mass - 7/28/2008 5:56:07 PM   
slaveboyforyou


Posts: 3607
Joined: 1/6/2005
From: Arkansas, U.S.A.
Status: offline
quote:

Not in that video you didn't. No windshield damage although a windshield wiper did get lifted off the windshield. No. the bikes were not thrown under the van. The scene begins with people scrambling to get off their bikes before the minivan rolled over the bike and biker instead of just the bikes.

You might want to watch it again.


I've watched it a couple of times, and I've seen other videos of the same incident.  The bikers did bash the window in.  Guess what?  The elderly couple didn't get charged with anything.  LOL. 

Here's another video of one of these assholes pretending to have his foot run over.  The woman with her child just drive off and run over a couple of bikes.  LOL.  It's exactly what I would have done, and again the cops didn't charge the driver with any crime. 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PF7uY9ydMYc&feature=related

(in reply to Alumbrado)
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RE: Critical Mass - 7/28/2008 6:03:36 PM   
SophiaCorrupted


Posts: 69
Joined: 2/3/2008
Status: offline 		I don't have a problem with these guys breaking the law to make their points, but the fact that they seem to be getting all pissy when someone breaks the law in retaliation (Or worse, just to get downt he street) then I can't really side with them. I say this as someone who biked to school everyday for the last two semesters.

< Message edited by SophiaCorrupted -- 7/28/2008 6:04:49 PM >

(in reply to slaveboyforyou)
Profile   Post #: 34
RE: Critical Mass - 7/28/2008 6:07:35 PM   
Alumbrado


Posts: 5560
Status: offline 		No windshield damage? Funny that no one else seems to have trouble seeing it.... 1:17 to 1:24 again.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n1eReGrbzkA&feature=related

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Profile   Post #: 35
RE: Critical Mass - 7/28/2008 6:30:50 PM   
slaveboyforyou


Posts: 3607
Joined: 1/6/2005
From: Arkansas, U.S.A.
Status: offline
quote:

No windshield damage? Funny that no one else seems to have trouble seeing it.... 1:17 to 1:24 again.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n1eReGrbzkA&feature=related


Yep and notice the victim of these neo-hippie assholes said they ran a red light.  They apparently think that traffic laws don't apply to them, but should be strictly enforced for automobiles. 

(in reply to Alumbrado)
Profile   Post #: 36
RE: Critical Mass - 7/28/2008 6:36:35 PM   
Alumbrado


Posts: 5560
Status: offline 		And the irony is that those who embrace these passive aggressive Dworkinist bully tactics don't realize that by giving the wheel of violence and dishonesty a spin, they are making it harder for other cyclists to get respect.

And for what? 'The Cause'? Or the thrill of trying to scare an elderly couple from the safety of a mob? 

< Message edited by Alumbrado -- 7/28/2008 6:47:29 PM >

(in reply to slaveboyforyou)
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RE: Critical Mass - 7/28/2008 7:31:37 PM   
DomKen


Posts: 19457
Joined: 7/4/2004
From: Chicago, IL
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Alumbrado

No windshield damage? Funny that no one else seems to have trouble seeing it.... 1:17 to 1:24 again.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n1eReGrbzkA&feature=related

That's to a different video.

I do see what might be damage in that video but it is still quite clear that the scene in the original video shows a person getting off their bike as the van rolls forward on to it. Anyway as it was an attempt to leave the scene legally the bikers were allowed to stop it. Clearly the people in the van were in no physical danger, the woman and the man both interacted with the crowd without injury so that excuse for attempting to flee the scene is bogus. If the bikers were violating the red light that is not shown and is possible but the fact remains if you hit someone from behind it is always your fault.

BTW in 3 summers working as a bike messenger including the incident I described up thread I never saw a driver ticketed for hitting or running over a bike. Despite the fact that my blood was all over the guys hood, my bike's front wheel was crumpled and the guy was stopped halfway through a u turn in the middle of a major street the investigating officer restrained me while letting the driver leave the scene without allowing me to get his insurance info or writing him a ticket for anything beyond the illegal u turn. So claiming a lack of charges as proof of anything just proves you have no idea about what really goes on out on the street.

(in reply to Alumbrado)
Profile   Post #: 38
RE: Critical Mass - 7/28/2008 7:43:29 PM   
Thadius


Posts: 5091
Joined: 10/11/2005
Status: offline 		Ken,

I agree with the notion that vast majority of the people involved in the over 300 cities that have Critical Mass rides are just out having fun, and enjoying the ride.

However, most of the videos available are shot by and posted by members of Critical Mass and could be argued that they wouldn't show anything incriminating.

Just think about the Chicago rides they begin between 5pm and 6pm on a Friday evening, what effects do you think they have on the masses?  There's a CM 101 video floating around someplace, that talks openly about neglecting traffic laws like traffic lights "for the safety of the ride", what about the safety of the folks not in the ride?

_____________________________

When the character of a man is not clear to you, look at his friends." ~ Japanese Proverb

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Profile   Post #: 39
RE: Critical Mass - 7/28/2008 8:03:40 PM   
Alumbrado


Posts: 5560
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

quote:

ORIGINAL: Alumbrado

No windshield damage? Funny that no one else seems to have trouble seeing it.... 1:17 to 1:24 again.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n1eReGrbzkA&feature=related

That's to a different video.

I do see what might be damage in that video but it is still quite clear that the scene in the original video shows a person getting off their bike as the van rolls forward on to it. Anyway as it was an attempt to leave the scene legally the bikers were allowed to stop it. Clearly the people in the van were in no physical danger, the woman and the man both interacted with the crowd without injury so that excuse for attempting to flee the scene is bogus. If the bikers were violating the red light that is not shown and is possible but the fact remains if you hit someone from behind it is always your fault.

BTW in 3 summers working as a bike messenger including the incident I described up thread I never saw a driver ticketed for hitting or running over a bike. Despite the fact that my blood was all over the guys hood, my bike's front wheel was crumpled and the guy was stopped halfway through a u turn in the middle of a major street the investigating officer restrained me while letting the driver leave the scene without allowing me to get his insurance info or writing him a ticket for anything beyond the illegal u turn. So claiming a lack of charges as proof of anything just proves you have no idea about what really goes on out on the street.


No, that's to a news piece about the exact same video, pausing the original on the exact same broken window that you claim is undamaged, and showing the exact same yellow bike being placed first in front of the van, and then behind its front tire...with zero damage to the bike's own rim...

No idea what goes on out in the street?  Here's a novel idea...how about you take up the claims of lack of charges with the person who actually posted them, instead making up more and more easily disproven nonsense?



(in reply to DomKen)
Profile   Post #: 40
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