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Nowhere in BDSM will you find PC - 7/14/2008 12:39:51 PM

LadyPact

Posts: 32566
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Ah, those wonderful little acronyms! We've done a real disservice to ourselves at times using them. In some of them (such as PC) the logic is good, but I doubt when it came up, it was never meant to be the end all, be all of everything.

Take, for example, the term politically correct. Sure, on the surface, this sounds like a wonderful idea. That everyone will be accepted, no matter what their kinks are in the lifestyle. How kumbiya of us.

Still, at the same time, it is supposed that *everyone will be accepted*. No matter how skewed there perceptions are, or what their kinks might be. Let's really examine that. How many are perfectly willing to say that YKINMY, but your kink is ok, when it starts talking about animals, or people who are not yet of proper age of consent, or a hundred other things? Just because this is a kink site, does that mean everything is acceptable?

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Post #: 1

RE: Nowhere in BDSM will you find PC - 7/14/2008 12:45:52 PM

Estring

Posts: 3314
Joined: 1/1/2004
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Nowadays, to judge something or someone, is almost as bad as smoking. Of course everyone makes judgements, and the ones who scream the loudest about being non judgemental are usually the ones who judge the most.

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Boycott Whales!

(in reply to LadyPact)

Post #: 2

RE: Nowhere in BDSM will you find PC - 7/14/2008 12:45:52 PM

CreativeDominant

Posts: 11032
Joined: 3/11/2006
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Certainly not in my eyes, Lady Pact. I have answered threads in which I've stated right out that...in my opinion only...there are some things that are not O.K. and should not be considered O.K. by someone of normal intelligence. Sure, there is a huge platform of what is acceptable and and of what is acceptable, even though it may not be acceptable to me specifically. Blood-letting is one example of this type of play/behavior for me. But I sincerely believe that there are some things that there should not be room on the platform for. Some of them mild, some of them not so mild...and I realize that there are no BDSM police, no committee, not anything to enforce guidelines. That does not stop me from being allowed to feel and think the way that I do.

I know there are plenty that disagree with that perspective.

(in reply to LadyPact)

Post #: 3

RE: Nowhere in BDSM will you find PC - 7/14/2008 12:54:11 PM

batshalom

Posts: 1990
Joined: 9/17/2007
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As long as the YKINMK involves living beings that can give viable consent, I try to be ok with it. Some things are not in my repetoire and will never be in my repetoire, some things I might try and reject, but if you want to do something that completely creeps me out (as long as that viable consent between all parties is given) I'm only creeped out for myself and don't try to force my opinion / morality on you.

(in reply to CreativeDominant)

Post #: 4

RE: Nowhere in BDSM will you find PC - 7/14/2008 1:08:41 PM

Missokyst

Posts: 6041
Joined: 9/9/2006
Status: offline

I believe a human being who is completely non-judgemental is either a sociopath, or does not have the mental acquity to determine right from wrong.
We hear a lot about people judging others and how horrible it is when you are on a kink site that we do not all sing the praises of everyones tastes, but it is human nature to hold things up to our own standard.
If you are going to put it out there, then you should be prepared for the fallout. People who think differently can either get over it, or they can sit on the pity me chair and whine about how unfair we are for not embracing their choices.
I make mental evaluations of people and situations all the time. It does not mean that my judgement has to be followed. If people want to do stupid stuff that is their choice. What they do doesnt affect me because I don't have to bed them.. but if they lay their story in front of me I do have the right to comment.
It is similar to when you see a really ugly car, or house you drive by every day. OMG.. how could they do that? And you move on to be assailed the next trip. Your reaction may be the same every day.. but you do move on.
Kyst

(in reply to batshalom)

Post #: 5

RE: Nowhere in BDSM will you find PC - 7/14/2008 1:14:37 PM

RedMagic1

Posts: 6470
Joined: 5/10/2007
Status: offline

There are particular acts I choose not to engage in myself, because they remind me of unhealthy things. However, when assessing another person, I tend to ignore the snapshot of what they do, and try instead to look at the context.

Fundamental for me is whether you take responsibility for yourself, and for others. I will not have high regard for your "kink" if you hold someone's life, health or psyche in unsteady hands.

_____________________________

Not with envy, not with a twisted heart, shall you feel superior, or go about boasting. Rather in goodness by action make true your song and your word. Thus you shall be highly regarded, and able to live in peace with all others.
- 15th century Aztec

(in reply to Missokyst)

Post #: 6

RE: Nowhere in BDSM will you find PC - 7/14/2008 1:31:06 PM

silkncarol

Posts: 318
Status: offline

I agree with you CreativeDominant.....we all have the right to decide what is acceptable within our own moral and safety standards. When i'm ever asked my opinion, i'm more than happy to give it, but i also don't feel the need to drag out my soapbox and preach or lecture anyone else on their kinks....As long as i don't have to participate and all involved are consenting then i'm certainly not gonna be the moral police.

There's someone out there for everyone..... not my kink, move on!

quote:

ORIGINAL: CreativeDominant

Certainly not in my eyes, Lady Pact. I have answered threads in which I've stated right out that...in my opinion only...there are some things that are not O.K. and should not be considered O.K. by someone of normal intelligence. Sure, there is a huge platform of what is acceptable and and of what is acceptable, even though it may not be acceptable to me specifically. Blood-letting is one example of this type of play/behavior for me. But I sincerely believe that there are some things that there should not be room on the platform for. Some of them mild, some of them not so mild...and I realize that there are no BDSM police, no committee, not anything to enforce guidelines. That does not stop me from being allowed to feel and think the way that I do.

I know there are plenty that disagree with that perspective.

_____________________________

We attract hearts by the qualities we display. We retain them by the qualities we possess.

Shoes can change your life................. Cinderella

(in reply to CreativeDominant)

Post #: 7

RE: Nowhere in BDSM will you find PC - 7/14/2008 1:33:39 PM

thetammyjo

Posts: 6322
Joined: 9/8/2005
Status: offline

I don't think PC (if such a thing ever existed, I personally think it's a made up strawman for neo-cons) was ever about being accepted.

It would have been about not limited people via the use of limiting language -- if sex, gender, race, age, etc truly isn't important then way use specific terms for them? Language not only reflects but shapes our perception of the world and our place in it.

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Love, Peace, Hugs, Kisses, Whips & Chains,

TammyJo

Check out my website at http://www.thetammyjo.com Or www.tammyjoeckhart.com

And my LJ where I post fiction in progress if you "friend" me at http://thetammyjo.livejournal.com/

(in reply to LadyPact)

Post #: 8

RE: Nowhere in BDSM will you find PC - 7/14/2008 1:35:04 PM

RedMagic1

Posts: 6470
Joined: 5/10/2007
Status: offline

Dr. TammyJo, I am vanilla-challenged. What do you prescribe?

_____________________________

Not with envy, not with a twisted heart, shall you feel superior, or go about boasting. Rather in goodness by action make true your song and your word. Thus you shall be highly regarded, and able to live in peace with all others.
- 15th century Aztec

(in reply to thetammyjo)

Post #: 9

RE: Nowhere in BDSM will you find PC - 7/14/2008 1:38:00 PM

thetammyjo

Posts: 6322
Joined: 9/8/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: RedMagic1

Dr. TammyJo, I am vanilla-challenged. What do you prescribe?

What are you even talking about?

Who even heard of such a term as "vanilla-challenged"? Making up supposed PC terms does not equal proof of PC or anything such concept.

_____________________________

Love, Peace, Hugs, Kisses, Whips & Chains,

TammyJo

Check out my website at http://www.thetammyjo.com Or www.tammyjoeckhart.com

And my LJ where I post fiction in progress if you "friend" me at http://thetammyjo.livejournal.com/

(in reply to RedMagic1)

Post #: 10

RE: Nowhere in BDSM will you find PC - 7/14/2008 1:39:14 PM

RedMagic1

Posts: 6470
Joined: 5/10/2007
Status: offline

Oh, God, I'm sorry. I'll use a smiley icon next time. Please don't mind my feeble attempt at humor.

Edited to add: I don't want to get into a "PC" discussion, but I do believe that "owning words" (like queer spoken here) has a positive effect, as does the use of terms that are actively supportive (senior instead of old).

< Message edited by RedMagic1 -- 7/14/2008 1:45:21 PM >

_____________________________

Not with envy, not with a twisted heart, shall you feel superior, or go about boasting. Rather in goodness by action make true your song and your word. Thus you shall be highly regarded, and able to live in peace with all others.
- 15th century Aztec

(in reply to thetammyjo)

Post #: 11

RE: Nowhere in BDSM will you find PC - 7/14/2008 1:44:56 PM

Shawn1066

Posts: 987
Joined: 10/7/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyPact
Just because this is a kink site, does that mean everything is acceptable?

I don't believe it is. I've never been a firm believer in the train of thought that I should mindlessly accept what everybody else does just because I happen to take part in my own little niche. There are things that people do that I don't necessarily approve of and there are even things that other people do that I condemn. It's one of my rights as a human being. I'm allowed to judge as I see fit. Just as everybody else is.

DV's Fox

(in reply to LadyPact)

Post #: 12

RE: Nowhere in BDSM will you find PC - 7/14/2008 1:57:22 PM

LaTigresse

Posts: 26123
Joined: 1/15/2006
Status: offline

I am not PC. I've been known to say on the forums that I am judgemental. And, then I get nicely reprimanded for being judgemental. Annnnnnnnnd, I don't care. I am still going to be the way I am. It is my own personal moral compass.

All the time I see people write about things they do, or insinuate such, that I find appalling and disgusting. I try, note.....try.... to avoid voicing my opinion. Especially when it just doesn't matter. It's none of my business as a general rule. I am not always sucessful and often times get judged in return. I accept that. I am okay with that. I don't care if people do not agree with me. Their life is theirs, and mine is mine. I try to do what works for me and make decisions based on who those decisions will affect. Not many on here will ever be affected by any of my personal life choices.

_____________________________

My twisted, self deprecating, sense of humour, finds alot to laugh about, in your lack of one!

Just because you are well educated, articulate, and can use big, fancy words, properly........does not mean you are right!

(in reply to LadyPact)

Post #: 13

RE: Nowhere in BDSM will you find PC - 7/14/2008 2:03:12 PM

HeavansKeeper

Posts: 1254
Joined: 5/14/2007
Status: offline

Lady Pact,

I interpret being politically correct as having nothing to do with tolerance. They go hand in hand, but that doesn't mean everything must be accepted. I consider polical correctness to be a use of respectful terms to convey your opinion in a civil manner.

Non-PC:
Those fuckin' kikes own everything.

PC:
The Jewish population has a large marketshare of important industries.

_____________________________

The Loving Owner of HisHeavan

... You've waited your whole life for this moment...

(in reply to LadyPact)

Post #: 14

RE: Nowhere in BDSM will you find PC - 7/14/2008 2:11:22 PM

ExSteelAgain

Posts: 1803
Joined: 7/2/2006
From: Georgia
Status: offline

The site obviously limits what can be said here. Sort of like some things you can say in Richmond County, but not in Columbia County. Ya know?

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You can paint a cinder block bright pastel pink, but it's still a cinder block. (By Me.)

(in reply to LadyPact)

Post #: 15

RE: Nowhere in BDSM will you find PC - 7/14/2008 2:22:21 PM

dcnovice

Posts: 37282
Joined: 8/2/2006
Status: offline

quote:

I am vanilla-challenged. What do you prescribe?

Take two episodes of The Brady Bunch and call me in the morning.

_____________________________

No matter how cynical you become,
it's never enough to keep up.

JANE WAGNER, THE SEARCH FOR SIGNS OF
INTELLIGENT LIFE IN THE UNIVERSE

(in reply to RedMagic1)

Post #: 16

RE: Nowhere in BDSM will you find PC - 7/14/2008 2:31:02 PM

Shawn1066

Posts: 987
Joined: 10/7/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: dcnovice

quote:

I am vanilla-challenged. What do you prescribe?

Take two episodes of The Brady Bunch and call me in the morning.

That entire family has just like one bathroom and a maid I don't even think that they pay. They can't possibly be vanilla.

DV's Fox

(in reply to dcnovice)

Post #: 17

RE: Nowhere in BDSM will you find PC - 7/14/2008 3:07:38 PM

CallaFirestormBW

Posts: 3651
Joined: 6/29/2008
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Shawn1066

I don't believe it is. I've never been a firm believer in the train of thought that I should mindlessly accept what everybody else does just because I happen to take part in my own little niche. There are things that people do that I don't necessarily approve of and there are even things that other people do that I condemn. It's one of my rights as a human being. I'm allowed to judge as I see fit. Just as everybody else is.

DV's Fox

I have no issue whatsoever with people deciding that something isn't their 'kink' and choosing not to participate. Where I -do- have an issue is when a person or group of people decide that, because -they- aren't comfortable with something, nobody should be allowed to do it.

My requirement is that the people that I scene with be capable of giving informed consent. Yes, I require that they're aware of what is happening, are intelligent enough to understand the possible risks of what we're about to do, that they understand their role in getting through the scene not only -safely- but pleasurably, and that I have explained what -I- intend to do to keep them as safe as possible under the circumstances. I do my best to make sure they're not "under the influence", and make sure that nobody has coerced them into participating. That's the best I can do. If they say "Ok, pierce me" at that point, I'm going to do my damndest to give us both an awesome scene.

My "kink" includes a lot of interest in what many people consider to be "edge play". I know that most people who gravitate towards BDSM don't like the kind of play that I enjoy. I have no intention of pushing it on anyone, or even participating when I suspect that the person on the other end of my scalpel, flame, or needle doesn't understand what's about to happen... but I don't believe that anyone has the right to deny my practices as "obscene" or "bad" just because they don't like what I do.

All of us make judgements. We do it all day long, every single day that we're alive. Without making judgements, we wouldn't be able to survive. It is when we apply -our- biases and judgements indiscriminately to other people's lives and practices that I start having real issues. I don't have any particular interest in having other peoples' biases dictating my life. I accept full responsibility for my own choices, and expect that those who participate with me are going to accept responsibility for their choices -- if they don't want to do that, they don't have to play with me. I don't agree with our society's tendency to legislate my behavior so -they- feel more comfortable.

Calla Firestorm

_____________________________

***
Said to me recently: "Look, I know you're the "voice of reason"... but dammit, I LIKE being unreasonable!!!!"

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(in reply to Shawn1066)

Post #: 18

RE: Nowhere in BDSM will you find PC - 7/14/2008 3:57:52 PM

Evility

Posts: 915
Joined: 12/19/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyPact
Just because this is a kink site, does that mean everything is acceptable?

Everything that involves consenting adults - sure. I'm totally okay with whatever the Joneses want to do tonight as long as they don't want to do it here in my home. I really don't get all lathered up about stuff other people do just because it's not my cup of tea.

The two examples you mentioned just happened to be crimes. I hope I live long enough to figure out why those same two examples are always tossed into this discussion. Consent seems like such a simple concept.

(in reply to LadyPact)

Post #: 19

RE: Nowhere in BDSM will you find PC - 7/14/2008 4:20:38 PM

LuckyAlbatross

Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: thetammyjo
I don't think PC (if such a thing ever existed, I personally think it's a made up strawman for neo-cons) was ever about being accepted.

It would have been about not limited people via the use of limiting language -- if sex, gender, race, age, etc truly isn't important then way use specific terms for them? Language not only reflects but shapes our perception of the world and our place in it.

Ditto. People who are against PC tend to be against some extreme irrational version of PC- not what actually most people use and endorse. Just like a lot of people are against "feminists" when they are really against a particular type of feminist dogma having nothing to do with the simple concept of ensuring everyone is given the same potential options, regardless of sex.

_____________________________

Find stable partners, not a stable of partners.

"Sometimes my whore logic gets all fuzzy"- Californication

(in reply to thetammyjo)

Post #: 20

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