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RE: restraining order, abuse, court..advice needed - 12/19/2007 1:33:30 PM   
awmslave


Posts: 599
Joined: 3/31/2006
Status: offline
quote:

He forced his way into her home, refused to leave, and sprained her wrist in the struggle before the police came. There is no civil discussion with someone that watches someone's house and then ambushes their way in by physical force.

We have here only one side of the story: rather trivial rejection case. I am aware that obsessive behavior happens and some men with big egos can not easily take rejection. Still, some people do not know how to end relationships.

(in reply to lilmonique)
Profile   Post #: 21
RE: restraining order, abuse, court..advice needed - 12/19/2007 1:36:14 PM   
Alumbrado


Posts: 5560
Status: offline 		Sure... and what could possibly be the down side to taking your adivce?

http://www.athealth.com/Consumer/disorders/DomViolFacts.html

(in reply to awmslave)
Profile   Post #: 22
RE: restraining order, abuse, court..advice needed - 12/19/2007 2:27:42 PM   
popeye1250


Posts: 18104
Joined: 1/27/2006
From: New Hampshire
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: laurell3

That's true popeye they are absolutely not a guarantee, however they remove law enforcment discretion from the equation and the penalties for violating them post OJ can be pretty stiff.


Laurell, that's sketchy, some small municipalities might have 2-3,000 restraining orders active and with jail overcrowding you're lucky if they do 7 days in jail.
Someone who's mentally ill can't understand the "reasoning" behind a restraining order anyway and doesn't care.
Restraining order or not if someone tries to get into your home you shoot them, in the back if neccessary.
A little "chat" with Vinnie and Nunzio or Sean and Kevin can do wonders.

< Message edited by popeye1250 -- 12/19/2007 2:29:27 PM >

_____________________________

"But Your Honor, this is not a Jury of my Peers, these people are all decent, honest, law-abiding citizens!"

(in reply to laurell3)
Profile   Post #: 23
RE: restraining order, abuse, court..advice needed - 12/19/2007 3:39:38 PM   
Stephann


Posts: 4214
Joined: 12/27/2006
From: Portland, OR
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: awmslave

We have here only one side of the story: rather trivial rejection case. I am aware that obsessive behavior happens and some men with big egos can not easily take rejection. Still, some people do not know how to end relationships.


Sure; when I give advice, I do so with the hopes of saying "if this is the whole of the facts, this is what should be done."  If it turns out she's a lying psychopathic bitch who chucks eggs at him every day on his way to work, then I'd have suggested something different.

Find work in a diner.

Stephan


_____________________________

Nosce Te Ipsum

"The blade itself incites to violence" - Homer

Men: Find a Woman here

(in reply to awmslave)
Profile   Post #: 24
RE: restraining order, abuse, court..advice needed - 12/19/2007 4:36:52 PM   
rsb


Posts: 3
Joined: 12/17/2007
Status: offline 		amslave,

You ARE kidding, right???  Sit down with him???  He's already forced his way into her house after sitting there waiting for her to come home....injured her while inside the home, which now makes it a home invasion, depending on what state she's in.  Obviously, he's got issues with being dumped.

The restraining order is at least something.  Get one, take photos of your wrist, and get copies of the doc's notes for the courts.  Chances are, he's done this before, and gotten away with it, hence his doing it this time.  Press charges, domestic abuse charges have restrictions for bail that if he violates them, they revoke it and he goes to jail until his court date.  These vary by state, but check into it.

As Ron said, hunker down.....but don't BACK DOWN!  I've seen it way too often in my job..women who are assaulted, and they just blow it off for various reasons.  Make sure you have friends who know about this guy, set up plans for daily contact with them, do whatever you need to do to be safe!

Good luck with this idiot.....be careful!

(in reply to awmslave)
Profile   Post #: 25
RE: restraining order, abuse, court..advice needed - 12/19/2007 4:38:08 PM   
lilmonique


Posts: 7
Joined: 3/31/2007
Status: offline 		Very true.  There are two sides to every story.  I am sure, when and if, it goes to court, the Judge will beable to separate fact from fiction, and since she does have a eyewitness (the neighbor), that eliminates the he said/she said bs to a certain extent.

In regards to ending the relationship, she asked him to no longer phone, contact her in any way, and to stay off her property.  Because she did this, if he contacts her one more time (according to the police) by either phone, or in person, he can be convicted of stalking.  The reason she asked him to stay away was due to him coming over unannounced, looking in and banging on windows when she refused to answer the door.

Regardless of two sides to every story, I cannot think of one reason to justify forcing entry into someone's home, refusing to leave, and then physically harming that person.  That alone speaks volumes of a person's character, and I am a firm believer that violence is not the answer to any situation.

(in reply to Stephann)
Profile   Post #: 26
RE: restraining order, abuse, court..advice needed - 12/19/2007 4:49:57 PM   
popeye1250


Posts: 18104
Joined: 1/27/2006
From: New Hampshire
Status: offline 		Lilmonique, sure it is!
If the guy has two broken legs and two broken arms he can't even hurt himself.
I know some people in Boston who always break *both* arms, "so he can't even wipe his ass."

_____________________________

"But Your Honor, this is not a Jury of my Peers, these people are all decent, honest, law-abiding citizens!"

(in reply to lilmonique)
Profile   Post #: 27
RE: restraining order, abuse, court..advice needed - 12/19/2007 4:53:34 PM   
LadyChef


Posts: 105
Joined: 11/11/2007
Status: offline 		Normally, I would say.."Contact and retain a very good lawyer"...but things have changed.  If  you ever have him over your house again, make sure you watch "Madea's Family Reunion" the movie- not the play. Learn about "Gritball"- maybe this guy who can't keep his hands to himself wants to play that game.

< Message edited by LadyChef -- 12/19/2007 4:54:34 PM >

_____________________________

You reap what you sow

(in reply to lilmonique)
Profile   Post #: 28
RE: restraining order, abuse, court..advice needed - 12/19/2007 5:24:09 PM   
slaveboyforyou


Posts: 3607
Joined: 1/6/2005
From: Arkansas, U.S.A.
Status: offline 		He can file in small claims court against your friend.  If that happens, tell your friend to GO TO COURT.  If she doesn't answer the summons and fails to appear; he will win by default.  Also, tell her not to be afraid of small claims court.  It's not a big deal.  It's very informal, and she is not going to be in any trouble.  This guy will have to prove that all of the money and things he gave her were loans.  Without witnesses and/or something in writing, he doesn't have a chance in hell of winning.  It will probably only take up about 2 hours of your friend's time.  After that, he can't refile the case again. 

I sued an ex, and I won by default.  Of course my little adventure with the courts was quite different from your friends.  I had a written contract and witnesses about a loan I gave.  Your friend's ex will have to claim they had an oral contract, which isn't worth shit without witnesses. 

(in reply to LadyChef)
Profile   Post #: 29
RE: restraining order, abuse, court..advice needed - 12/19/2007 5:34:26 PM   
farglebargle


Posts: 10715
Joined: 6/15/2005
From: Albany, NY
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: lilmonique
What would you do?


Carry a handgun at all times, and be willing to use it to end any confrontation where you feel in physical danger.

Consult an attorney first, and have them handy in case you need to defend yourself.

_____________________________

It's not every generation that gets to watch a civilization fall. Looks like we're in for a hell of a show.

ברוך אתה, אדוני אלוקינו, ריבון העולמים, מי יוצר צמחים ריחניים

(in reply to lilmonique)
Profile   Post #: 30
RE: restraining order, abuse, court..advice needed - 12/19/2007 5:38:26 PM   
lilmonique


Posts: 7
Joined: 3/31/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: slaveboyforyou

He can file in small claims court against your friend.  If that happens, tell your friend to GO TO COURT.  If she doesn't answer the summons and fails to appear; he will win by default.  Also, tell her not to be afraid of small claims court.  It's not a big deal.  It's very informal, and she is not going to be in any trouble.  This guy will have to prove that all of the money and things he gave her were loans.  Without witnesses and/or something in writing, he doesn't have a chance in hell of winning.  It will probably only take up about 2 hours of your friend's time.  After that, he can't refile the case again. 

I sued an ex, and I won by default.  Of course my little adventure with the courts was quite different from your friends.  I had a written contract and witnesses about a loan I gave.  Your friend's ex will have to claim they had an oral contract, which isn't worth shit without witnesses. 


Do they actually serve papers in person or by mail?  I'm not sure if small claims is different in that regard?

(in reply to slaveboyforyou)
Profile   Post #: 31
RE: restraining order, abuse, court..advice needed - 12/19/2007 5:43:20 PM   
crouchingtigress


Posts: 4387
Joined: 3/19/2006
From: Maui
Status: offline 		most  small claim courts refuse to get in to separating possessions during relationships. in addition to wasting the courts time they feel that things are given and received during relationships and that's that...possession is 9 10tth of the law....so unless he has a signed document of the supposed loans his case will be thrown out.



_____________________________


Service slut, durable plaything, and ponypenquincatdogpig, to Lee Harrington

This is him

"Its none of my buisness what other people think of me."




(in reply to slaveboyforyou)
Profile   Post #: 32
RE: restraining order, abuse, court..advice needed - 12/19/2007 5:51:25 PM   
angelikaJ


Posts: 8641
Joined: 6/22/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: awmslave

It surprises me how fast people are these days bringing in authorities, police, layers SWAT team. I am seeing just a small conflict of very personal matter between two individuals that could have been solved without confrontation. Why not just sit down with your former boyfriend and discuss things.


Because he injured her!

(in reply to awmslave)
Profile   Post #: 33
RE: restraining order, abuse, court..advice needed - 12/19/2007 5:55:25 PM   
Driver1961


Posts: 459
Joined: 9/8/2005
Status: offline 		He dips His lid,

I love  what constitutes America!



Shoot him in the back?   Carry a handgun???  God so blesses Americans.

_____________________________

Dance as though nobody is watching!

(in reply to crouchingtigress)
Profile   Post #: 34
RE: restraining order, abuse, court..advice needed - 12/19/2007 6:02:17 PM   
slaveboyforyou


Posts: 3607
Joined: 1/6/2005
From: Arkansas, U.S.A.
Status: offline
quote:

Do they actually serve papers in person or by mail?  I'm not sure if small claims is different in that regard?


They do it both ways.  It's up to him how he want's the papers served.  It differs in every state, but for the most part this is how it breaks down:

He can have the papers served through certified mail.  That method costs the least, but she has to accept and sign for it in order to be served.  She can ask the mailman who sent it.  It will be sent by the court for him.  She doesn't have to accept it. 

He can have the papers served through the Sherrif or a court certified process server.  Both of those are more expensive.  They usually charge around $50 to $100 to do that.  But it's effective. 

The bottom line to all of this is that this entire process will cost him money.  Unless he's a moron, he knows he doesn't have a chance in hell of winning a civil suit.  He is probably doing this to cause her alarm.  Tell her not to worry about it.  If he does do this, it's not a big deal.  She can counter his lawsuit with one of her own.  She is incurring medical costs for the sprained wrist, and there is a police report verifying the incident.  She has every right to sue him for that, and she would probably win.  Of course this guy may be a wacko, and I understand her not wanting to antagonize him further.  If he makes any more threats, she needs to document the time and method.  If she can, tell her to record the phone calls.  Terroristic threatening is a serious offense in most places. 

< Message edited by slaveboyforyou -- 12/19/2007 6:15:57 PM >

(in reply to lilmonique)
Profile   Post #: 35
RE: restraining order, abuse, court..advice needed - 12/19/2007 6:19:18 PM   
soul2share


Posts: 7084
Joined: 12/18/2007
From: somewhere out there.....
Status: offline 		Just one quick note about taping phone calls.....in most states, unless the party knows he is being taped, the calls are inadmissable in the courts.  Of course, this lout sounds dumb enough to still continue calling even once he knows they are being recorded!

Let him do his thing with small claims court...at this point in time, your friend needs to be more concerned with her own safety.  Deal with the civil stuff when it pops up, but if you start criminal proceedings against him, he just may slink back to whatever rock he crawled out from under.  And once a civil judge hears what the jackass did, he'll be outta there real fast!

BTW slaveboy...pretty collar and cuffs!

< Message edited by soul2share -- 12/19/2007 6:20:17 PM >

_____________________________

I have to stop saying "How stupid can you be?"...people are starting to take it as a challenge!

*Not a fuck was given.*

(in reply to slaveboyforyou)
Profile   Post #: 36
RE: restraining order, abuse, court..advice needed - 12/19/2007 6:27:23 PM   
laurell3


Posts: 6577
Joined: 5/5/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: slaveboyforyou

quote:

Do they actually serve papers in person or by mail?  I'm not sure if small claims is different in that regard?


They do it both ways.  It's up to him how he want's the papers served.  It differs in every state, but for the most part this is how it breaks down:

He can have the papers served through certified mail.  That method costs the least, but she has to accept and sign for it in order to be served.  She can ask the mailman who sent it.  It will be sent by the court for him.  She doesn't have to accept it. 

He can have the papers served through the Sherrif or a court certified process server.  Both of those are more expensive.  They usually charge around $50 to $100 to do that.  But it's effective. 

The bottom line to all of this is that this entire process will cost him money.  Unless he's a moron, he knows he doesn't have a chance in hell of winning a civil suit.  He is probably doing this to cause her alarm.  Tell her not to worry about it.  If he does do this, it's not a big deal.  She can counter his lawsuit with one of her own.  She is incurring medical costs for the sprained wrist, and there is a police report verifying the incident.  She has every right to sue him for that, and she would probably win.  Of course this guy may be a wacko, and I understand her not wanting to antagonize him further.  If he makes any more threats, she needs to document the time and method.  If she can, tell her to record the phone calls.  Terroristic threatening is a serious offense in most places. 



Process of service and all procedural questions vary widely by jurisdiction.  She really needs to know her own.  However, it's not as simple as chosing your own method of service.  Many states require personal service.  If personal service is not attainable after diligent efforts then you can request alternate service by certified mail.  If you cannot serve by certified mail and can verify your attempts you can do service by leaving which usually requires paying a process server so they can swear the service was to a valid address verified to be the person you are suing.  There is additionally now a requirement in most states to prove if you are utilizing alternate service that the person you are serving is not an active member in any military service.

Again, her local domestic violence agency will help her find resources for the correct answers for her jurisdiction.  Legal advice is only as good as the area where the person is located and we don't know what that is.

_____________________________

I cannot be defined by moments in my life, but must be considered for by the entirety of my existence.

When you fail to consider that I am the best judge for what is right for me, all of your opinions become suspect to me.

(in reply to slaveboyforyou)
Profile   Post #: 37
RE: restraining order, abuse, court..advice needed - 12/19/2007 6:47:01 PM   
slaveboyforyou


Posts: 3607
Joined: 1/6/2005
From: Arkansas, U.S.A.
Status: offline 		That is absolutely true Laurell, that's why I said it varied.  In my own state, you choose which method you use.  I have used both.  With process servers, it's best to hire one with a good reputation and experience.  The one I hired served the papers in less than a week. 

Monique, here is a link to Michigan's self help guide to small claims court.  It will have all the information your friend needs. 

http://courts.michigan.gov/scao/selfhelp/smallclaims/sc_help.htm#serve

(in reply to laurell3)
Profile   Post #: 38
RE: restraining order, abuse, court..advice needed - 12/19/2007 6:55:00 PM   
lovingpet


Posts: 4270
Joined: 6/19/2005
Status: offline 		Restraining order, press charges, show up if he presses a civil claim and file a civil action of her own.  He is already guilty of stalking (in many jurisdictions), home invasion, and assault.  This is not my most well thought out response, but this is not a difficult call in my mind.  These are what little protection she has and, of course, they can and do backfire.  That is where the help of a DV shelter, attorney, and victim's advocate are all helpful and recommended.  Common sense and a little extreme measure to protect are good, but she must keep in mind that the man must threaten her with equal or greater force and peril as she plans to use in order to claim self-defense with a great level of success.  There are such charges as excessive force and involuntary manslaughter that can come by overreacting in the event of threats.  Except in the case of life-threatening situations, passive observation and recording is best.  It also sounds as though she has residual trauma from the event psychologically.  I would encourage her to seek help in that regard as well.

Best wishes,
lovingpet

(in reply to slaveboyforyou)
Profile   Post #: 39
RE: restraining order, abuse, court..advice needed - 12/19/2007 7:03:57 PM   
kdsub


Posts: 12180
Joined: 8/16/2007
Status: offline 		Now just myself…why does she want to keep anything the creep gave her?…Give it back and say so long. Hell clothes too… you mean she can’t get along without them?

Then buy a gun and learn how to use it…change the locks and get an alarm system.

Get the restraining order and follow thru with the prosecution.
Butch

(in reply to Alumbrado)
Profile   Post #: 40
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