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Change the Label, Avoid the Shame/Guilt. - 10/7/2007 6:21:14 PM   
MadRabbit


Posts: 3460
Joined: 8/9/2006
Status: offline 		A couple of recent threads have got me thinking.

I wonder sometimes if the endless debating over labels and words is used as a way to avoid dealing with personal shame and guilt.

Take the "Do we romanticize slavery?" thread. Maybe "consensual erotic servitude" is a better descriptor for M/S then "slavery". However, it doesn't do my desires and fantasies any justice. I fantasize about Owning another person. Owning a slave. I find that to be incredibly hot. Just because the label is different doesn't change what I get off on in my own mind.

Or that thread "About the word Sadist" where a wonderful person suggested we all stop calling ourselves sadists so we don't get associated with psychos and sociopaths. Maybe "consensual erotic pain play" is a better descriptor for what it is that I do, but still doesn't change the fact that I don't fantasize about "consensual erotic pain play". I fantasize about hurting women and making them cry. By common definition, I am a sadist, but hey...maybe if I change the label, I can avoid my own shame and guilt over getting a hard cock over hurting people.

Maybe "consensual non consensual rough body and sexual contact play" is a little easier on the ears then "Rape play". However, I seriously doubt people are getting off on "consensual non consensual rough body and sexual contact play" in their own minds. I would venture a guess and say they are getting off on the idea of being raped or doing the raping.

Or Age Play where people constantly disassociate it with any kind of pedophilia desires. But I don't know....when a Daddy Dom has his little girl dressed in that Catholic school girl outfit...I tend to wonder what exactly is going on in his head...

Whats wrong with just liking it? Perhaps admitting that we do, in fact, get off on bad things in our minds, but have no problem with it because we know the things that we are actually doing are not bad? (These questions are rhetorical)

This is just some musing and thoughts. I am not in anyway trying to point fingers, insult anybody, insult anyone's kink, suggest that you do have dirty thoughts if you really don't when participating in one of these kinks, or even attempt to say that this is a universal truth (or even a small town sized truth).

So anyone else out there like me who just flat out gets off on the thoughts and ideas of doing "bad things"?

Any confessions or any general thoughts would be appreciated.


< Message edited by MadRabbit -- 10/7/2007 6:35:34 PM >

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RE: Change the Label, Avoid the Shame/Guilt. - 10/7/2007 6:25:03 PM   
IrishMist


Posts: 7480
Joined: 11/17/2005
Status: offline 		Two words.

NICE POST

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RE: Change the Label, Avoid the Shame/Guilt. - 10/7/2007 6:27:54 PM   
dcnovice


Posts: 37282
Joined: 8/2/2006
Status: offline
quote:

Take the "Do we romanticize slavery?" thread. Maybe "consensual erotic servitude" is a better descriptor for M/S then "slavery". However, it doesn't do my desires and fantasies any justice. I fantasize about Owning another person. Owning a slave. I find that to be incredibly hot. Just because the label is different doesn't change what I get off on in my own mind.


If you're gonna riff on my thread, you could at least provide a link.

_____________________________

No matter how cynical you become,
it's never enough to keep up.

JANE WAGNER, THE SEARCH FOR SIGNS OF
INTELLIGENT LIFE IN THE UNIVERSE

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RE: Change the Label, Avoid the Shame/Guilt. - 10/7/2007 6:28:02 PM   
chellekitty


Posts: 3923
Joined: 3/27/2005
Status: offline 		but that would take the taboo-ness out of it and what fun would that be...

edited to add: if i wanted to be politically correct...well...i wouldn't be me...


< Message edited by chellekitty -- 10/7/2007 6:29:09 PM >

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RE: Change the Label, Avoid the Shame/Guilt. - 10/7/2007 6:31:26 PM   
MadRabbit


Posts: 3460
Joined: 8/9/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: dcnovice

quote:

Take the "Do we romanticize slavery?" thread. Maybe "consensual erotic servitude" is a better descriptor for M/S then "slavery". However, it doesn't do my desires and fantasies any justice. I fantasize about Owning another person. Owning a slave. I find that to be incredibly hot. Just because the label is different doesn't change what I get off on in my own mind.


If you're gonna riff on my thread, you could at least provide a link.


I really wasnt trying to in all honesty, though, rereading this I can see how it comes off like that. Your thread just got me to thinking nor was I trying to say that was your intention when starting the thread. I thought it was actually a really good discussion.

The "Sadist" thread scored about a 9.5 on my Annoyance Scale. Yours didnt even register

< Message edited by MadRabbit -- 10/7/2007 6:34:11 PM >

_____________________________

Advice for New Dominants
The Unpolitically Correct Lifestyle Definitions

Obama is NOT the Messiah! He's just a VERY NAUGHTY BOY

(in reply to dcnovice)
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RE: Change the Label, Avoid the Shame/Guilt. - 10/7/2007 6:35:29 PM   
goodgirl85


Posts: 221
Joined: 4/16/2007
Status: offline 		I get out to even the thought of being made to cry, being "daddys little girl", and being "raped" .... I am a submissive, I am a pain slut. I love the pain just as much as I hate it. Part of the eroticism to me is the words. When my Dom says "everyone can see your head bobbing up and down, everyone knows what a little slut you are" makes giving him head in an empty parking lot in broad day light adjacant to a busy road all the more exciting. Hearing a person say "Daddys going to make you feel good" makes me wet. It is who I am. Do I go up to gramma and say hey gram, i like it when my boyfriend makes me cry because hes pretending to be my daddy raping me? no. But im not to softening the idea of what it is that I like to the people with similar kinks. Or some of my more understanding openminded friends.

and I agree with Irish Mist (btw thats great mixed with coke a cola) nice post. I dont know if thats what you wanted, but its what youre getting.

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RE: Change the Label, Avoid the Shame/Guilt. - 10/7/2007 6:37:08 PM   
MadRabbit


Posts: 3460
Joined: 8/9/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: goodgirl85

I get out to even the thought of being made to cry, being "daddys little girl", and being "raped" .... I am a submissive, I am a pain slut. I love the pain just as much as I hate it. Part of the eroticism to me is the words. When my Dom says "everyone can see your head bobbing up and down, everyone knows what a little slut you are" makes giving him head in an empty parking lot in broad day light adjacant to a busy road all the more exciting. Hearing a person say "Daddys going to make you feel good" makes me wet. It is who I am. Do I go up to gramma and say hey gram, i like it when my boyfriend makes me cry because hes pretending to be my daddy raping me? no. But im not to softening the idea of what it is that I like to the people with similar kinks. Or some of my more understanding openminded friends.

and I agree with Irish Mist (btw thats great mixed with coke a cola) nice post. I dont know if thats what you wanted, but its what youre getting.


*two thumbs up*

_____________________________

Advice for New Dominants
The Unpolitically Correct Lifestyle Definitions

Obama is NOT the Messiah! He's just a VERY NAUGHTY BOY

(in reply to goodgirl85)
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RE: Change the Label, Avoid the Shame/Guilt. - 10/7/2007 6:37:26 PM   
dcnovice


Posts: 37282
Joined: 8/2/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MadRabbit

quote:

ORIGINAL: dcnovice

quote:

Take the "Do we romanticize slavery?" thread. Maybe "consensual erotic servitude" is a better descriptor for M/S then "slavery". However, it doesn't do my desires and fantasies any justice. I fantasize about Owning another person. Owning a slave. I find that to be incredibly hot. Just because the label is different doesn't change what I get off on in my own mind.


If you're gonna riff on my thread, you could at least provide a link.


I really wasnt trying to in all honesty, though, rereading this I can see how it comes off like that. Your thread just got me to thinking nor was I trying to say that was your intention when starting the thread. I thought it was actually a really good discussion.

The "Sadist" thread scored about a 9.5 on my Annoyance Scale. Yours didnt even register


I was just (a) teasing and (b) shamelessly trying to draw traffic.

_____________________________

No matter how cynical you become,
it's never enough to keep up.

JANE WAGNER, THE SEARCH FOR SIGNS OF
INTELLIGENT LIFE IN THE UNIVERSE

(in reply to MadRabbit)
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RE: Change the Label, Avoid the Shame/Guilt. - 10/7/2007 6:37:28 PM   
Smythe


Posts: 369
Joined: 12/31/2005
Status: offline
you are kind of asking 2 questions. I do feel badly sometimes about how much I like hurting/controlling someone else. But I also know that calling it a different name wouldn't make any difference.

I have to feel very convinced of the mutuality and consensuality of what I am doing, otherwise, I might start to feel abusive.

And I am so tender hearted about animals and other defenseless beings. Go figure.
Smythe


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RE: Change the Label, Avoid the Shame/Guilt. - 10/7/2007 6:38:12 PM   
Stephann


Posts: 4214
Joined: 12/27/2006
From: Portland, OR
Status: offline 		Simpy put, there will always be people who enjoy adopting labels (and/or the ideas behind them.)  I'm with you; I'm a sadist, I like my slave calling me Master, my sub calling me Sir.  Those labels have power.  I'm quite sure I enjoy them in a vacuum as well; I would expect these things living as a hermit.  So I know I'm not interested in 'the lifestyle' as a means of rebelling against what society thinks I should be doing.

Yet everywhere you go, there will always be people telling you how much you're not supposed to live the way you are.  If you're an honest, hardworking, devoted Catholic, someone out there will tell you that you're too uptight, worry too much about materialism, and have faith in a false religion with an empty God concept.  Bisexuals face prejudice from straights and gays alike, science geeks will be mocked by jocks, and stamp collectors will be denied enterance to furry festivals. 

I say let the little minds hate away; the life I'm livin is above and beyond anything they could ever dream of.

Stephan

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RE: Change the Label, Avoid the Shame/Guilt. - 10/7/2007 6:40:16 PM   
MadRabbit


Posts: 3460
Joined: 8/9/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: dcnovice

I was just (a) teasing and (b) shamelessly trying to draw traffic.


As long as we're cool. I dont want this thread to erupt into anything negative.

_____________________________

Advice for New Dominants
The Unpolitically Correct Lifestyle Definitions

Obama is NOT the Messiah! He's just a VERY NAUGHTY BOY

(in reply to dcnovice)
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RE: Change the Label, Avoid the Shame/Guilt. - 10/7/2007 6:41:32 PM   
MadRabbit


Posts: 3460
Joined: 8/9/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Stephann

Yet everywhere you go, there will always be people telling you how much you're not supposed to live the way you are.  If you're an honest, hardworking, devoted Catholic, someone out there will tell you that you're too uptight, worry too much about materialism, and have faith in a false religion with an empty God concept.  Bisexuals face prejudice from straights and gays alike, science geeks will be mocked by jocks, and stamp collectors will be denied enterance to furry festivals. 

I say let the little minds hate away; the life I'm livin is above and beyond anything they could ever dream of.

Stephan

 
Thats a really good point. Thanks for mentioning that.

_____________________________

Advice for New Dominants
The Unpolitically Correct Lifestyle Definitions

Obama is NOT the Messiah! He's just a VERY NAUGHTY BOY

(in reply to Stephann)
Profile   Post #: 12
RE: Change the Label, Avoid the Shame/Guilt. - 10/7/2007 6:41:41 PM   
goodgirl85


Posts: 221
Joined: 4/16/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MadRabbit

quote:

ORIGINAL: goodgirl85

I get out to even the thought of being made to cry, being "daddys little girl", and being "raped" .... I am a submissive, I am a pain slut. I love the pain just as much as I hate it. Part of the eroticism to me is the words. When my Dom says "everyone can see your head bobbing up and down, everyone knows what a little slut you are" makes giving him head in an empty parking lot in broad day light adjacant to a busy road all the more exciting. Hearing a person say "Daddys going to make you feel good" makes me wet. It is who I am. Do I go up to gramma and say hey gram, i like it when my boyfriend makes me cry because hes pretending to be my daddy raping me? no. But im not to softening the idea of what it is that I like to the people with similar kinks. Or some of my more understanding openminded friends.

and I agree with Irish Mist (btw thats great mixed with coke a cola) nice post. I dont know if thats what you wanted, but its what youre getting.


*two thumbs up*


thank you. *curtsies*

(in reply to MadRabbit)
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RE: Change the Label, Avoid the Shame/Guilt. - 10/7/2007 6:44:16 PM   
kirii


Posts: 79
Status: offline
When others ask me why I do what I do, my response is always the same.
I like abuse. I don’t get off on it sexually; but I do find that a hard, brutal beating lifts my spirits and puts a smile on my face.
And yes, when I say hard, and brutal BEATING, I mean just that. Blood dripping, bruises everywhere, cuts, welts, burns, scars… all of it puts a smile on my face.
I tell people that I like being abused; it is not only the truth, but well, I also like the shock value that comes from saying such a thing.
I could care less what words others use to ‘validate’ what they do in their own minds and to others. I could care less what others actually think about what I do.
I live my life for myself; so that I am happy and fulfilled.
Everyone else can do what they want, where they want, how they want; and use any word they feel good about to describe it. That is their choice; just as I have made mine.

(in reply to MadRabbit)
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RE: Change the Label, Avoid the Shame/Guilt. - 10/7/2007 6:49:46 PM   
chiaThePet


Posts: 2694
Joined: 2/4/2007
Status: offline 		I am consumed by the beautiful torment of the darkness of my desires.

I will ponder the guilt of such, when and if i should encounter it.

I am what I am, what else can I be.

chia* (the pet)

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You can stick me in the corner, but I'll probably just end up coloring on the walls.

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RE: Change the Label, Avoid the Shame/Guilt. - 10/7/2007 6:53:24 PM   
RRafe


Posts: 2060
Joined: 8/29/2007
Status: offline 		It's fine to be a pervert with wierd kinks. I get annoyed with people trying to justify that as a sacred lifestyle too. Just freakin do it.

And if other people don't like it-blow them off-you aren't fucking them.

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RE: Change the Label, Avoid the Shame/Guilt. - 10/7/2007 6:54:54 PM   
HisXshadow


Posts: 12
Joined: 1/26/2007
Status: offline 		Almost everything in our lives is watered down. Our society has turned into one of "nanny", save us from ourselves, god forbid the shadow of darkness falls on us from any direction be it our television, our interactions with each other or...*gasp* our sexuality. It's hard for people to look in the mirror and admit to the darkness..."well, hmmm...I seem to enjoy hurting other people...but that's not ok! Well, I'm going to do it anyways, but I'll call it something different and I'll feel better about it." instead of just admitting that they really, really, really like to hurt people. There is an equal amount of dark to light in every one of us. Few of us realize that, fewer admit to it and even fewer embrace it. 

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RE: Change the Label, Avoid the Shame/Guilt. - 10/7/2007 7:32:35 PM   
RRafe


Posts: 2060
Joined: 8/29/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: HisXshadow

Almost everything in our lives is watered down. Our society has turned into one of "nanny", save us from ourselves, god forbid the shadow of darkness falls on us from any direction be it our television, our interactions with each other or...*gasp* our sexuality. It's hard for people to look in the mirror and admit to the darkness..."well, hmmm...I seem to enjoy hurting other people...but that's not ok! Well, I'm going to do it anyways, but I'll call it something different and I'll feel better about it." instead of just admitting that they really, really, really like to hurt people. There is an equal amount of dark to light in every one of us. Few of us realize that, fewer admit to it and even fewer embrace it. 


And the lack of integration leads to shame and confusion.

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I seem to be some wierd combination of Ren and Stimpy

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RE: Change the Label, Avoid the Shame/Guilt. - 10/7/2007 7:38:46 PM   
Celeste43


Posts: 3066
Joined: 2/4/2006
From: NYS
Status: offline 		I don't see any value to shame. It just attacks your core and damages you.

Personally I like the value neutral new labels you came up with. They explain what is going on without giving any chance for a knee jerk, emotion without thinking, response. And any time you can remove a knee jerk response and encourage thought is a good thing IMO.

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RE: Change the Label, Avoid the Shame/Guilt. - 10/7/2007 8:06:52 PM   
diphyes


Posts: 18
Joined: 10/5/2007
From: Room 302
Status: offline 		I wish to be "fucked like a whore". I do not want to "participate in a brief suspension of reality in which I am objectified with careful regard to my limits after which there will be cuddles", regardless of whether or not that is actually what happens. Human beings are really finicky with our words, aren't we? Especially when they relate to our sense of identity, or [with more relevance] our kicks.

_____________________________

Many are the wand bearers;
I bear with me no sign;
Yet, I was mad, was drunken,
Ere yet I tasted wine;
Nor bleeding grape can slacken
The thirst wherewith I pine;
And the god, the true Iacchus,
Hears now this song of mine. - Edith Thomas

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