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The One Thing No One Says About Iraq - 9/5/2007 6:41:58 PM   
dcnovice


Posts: 37282
Joined: 8/2/2006
Status: offline 		We've had a lot of posts about Iraq here at dear old Collarme, and supporters of the war have said many things about why we needed to invade Iraq and must remain there now.

I've noticed an interesting omission, though. I've yet to see anyone say, "I believe in the Iraq war, and I'm enlisting to fight it." Support for the war seems to rest on the handy assumption that other people will attend to the minor details of fighting and dying.

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RE: The One Thing No One Says About Iraq - 9/5/2007 8:20:00 PM   
Casie


Posts: 450
Joined: 1/5/2006
Status: offline 		I doubt you'll have much luck finding people like that. Tho, I'm sure there are a few. Just not here on collarme. It's so easy to say you support a war if you aren't fighting it and seeing it first hand.

(in reply to dcnovice)
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RE: The One Thing No One Says About Iraq - 9/5/2007 8:21:11 PM   
TheHeretic


Posts: 19100
Joined: 3/25/2007
From: California, USA
Status: offline 		         You might be right, DC.   We've had a few active-duty posters drift through the forums but I don't recall seeing them really dive into the Iraq topic, much less declare it was why they enlisted.  I know we have a few with significant others in combat zones who don't say much.  Perhaps it feels unlucky.

        As for myself, you haven't seen anything from me about why we "needed" to invade Iraq.  When I assert that a surrender/retreat would be a bad choice, I'm saying that knowing it places two brothers in harm's way.  Does that count?  Sorry.  A previous Bush already had two chances to get my ass killed, not to mention being in a first strike location under Reagan.   



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RE: The One Thing No One Says About Iraq - 9/5/2007 8:31:29 PM   
Owner59


Posts: 17033
Joined: 3/14/2006
From: Dirty Jersey
Status: offline 		Lives In The Balance Jackson Brown  Ive been waiting for something to happen
For a week or a month or a year
With the blood in the ink of the headlines
And the sound of the crowd in my ear
You might ask what it takes to remember
When you know that youve seen it before
Where a government lies to a people
And a country is drifting to war

And theres a shadow on the faces
Of the men who send the guns
To the wars that are fought in places
Where their business interest runs

On the radio talk shows and the t.v.
You hear one thing again and again
How the u.s.a. stands for freedom
And we come to the aid of a friend
But who are the ones that we call our friends--
These governments killing their own?
Or the people who finally cant take any more
And they pick up a gun or a brick or a stone
There are lives in the balance
There are people under fire
There are children at the cannons
And there is blood on the wire

Theres a shadow on the faces
Of the men who fan the flames
Of the wars that are fought in places
Where we cant even say the names

They sell us the president the same way
They sell us our clothes and our cars
They sell us every thing from youth to religion
The same time they sell us our wars
I want to know who the men in the shadows are
I want to hear somebody asking them why
They can be counted on to tell us who our enemies are
But theyre never the ones to fight or to die
And there are lives in the balance
There are people under fire
There are children at the cannons
And there is blood on the wire





http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article11924.htm

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RE: The One Thing No One Says About Iraq - 9/5/2007 8:32:02 PM   
Sanity


Posts: 22039
Joined: 6/14/2006
From: Nampa, Idaho USA
Status: offline 		I haven't seen too many who claim to oppose the liberation of the Iraqi people signing up as human shields to defend Al-Qaeda-in-Iraq, either though.

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RE: The One Thing No One Says About Iraq - 9/5/2007 8:34:13 PM   
DesertRat


Posts: 2774
Joined: 11/29/2004
From: NM/USA
Status: offline 		~fr~
Around here, people show support for the war by flying flags on their huge, gas sucking trucks and SUVs. It reminds me of the sacrifices the "greatest generation" made during The Big One...uh...wait...they...oh, forget it.

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It's crackers to slip a rozzer the dropsy in snide!--Chief Dead St. Knockout, 1933, Liverpool
Damn the crops. I'll only find peace at the end of a rope.--Winston Van Loo, 1911

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RE: The One Thing No One Says About Iraq - 9/5/2007 8:37:24 PM   
Owner59


Posts: 17033
Joined: 3/14/2006
From: Dirty Jersey
Status: offline 		Why should anyone go to that god forsaken place?

Our army`s there to protect the looting of oil.


"liberation of the Iraqi people" ,my ass!

< Message edited by Owner59 -- 9/5/2007 8:40:48 PM >

_____________________________

"As for our common defense, we reject as false the choice between our safety and our ideals"

President Obama

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RE: The One Thing No One Says About Iraq - 9/5/2007 9:18:09 PM   
pollux


Posts: 657
Joined: 7/26/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: dcnovice

We've had a lot of posts about Iraq here at dear old Collarme, and supporters of the war have said many things about why we needed to invade Iraq and must remain there now.

I've noticed an interesting omission, though. I've yet to see anyone say, "I believe in the Iraq war, and I'm enlisting to fight it." Support for the war seems to rest on the handy assumption that other people will attend to the minor details of fighting and dying.


You don't know many active-duty military people, do you?

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RE: The One Thing No One Says About Iraq - 9/5/2007 9:25:30 PM   
CuriousLord


Posts: 3911
Joined: 4/3/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: dcnovice

I've noticed an interesting omission, though. I've yet to see anyone say, "I believe in the Iraq war, and I'm enlisting to fight it." Support for the war seems to rest on the handy assumption that other people will attend to the minor details of fighting and dying.


Two things.
1.  They're there.
2.  Just because someone believes in something doesn't mean they're willing to pay for it.  Want to critize them?  Tell me if you think starvation in Africia is a good thing to fight, then tell me how you're signed up for a mission trip over there to help things out.

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RE: The One Thing No One Says About Iraq - 9/6/2007 5:22:17 AM   
PrettyCassandra


Posts: 4
Joined: 7/25/2007
Status: offline


During Vietnam the fighting itself was all over the tv and this changed many people's minds about the war.  They have gotten smarter at controlling the media these days. There was one show on A& E where they were interviewing soilders and reinacting what is going on over there.  It was pulled.  It is very easy to vilify people you don't know or haven't seen for awhile.  You can make them into anything you want in your imagination. 



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RE: The One Thing No One Says About Iraq - 9/6/2007 5:50:56 AM   
pahunkboy


Posts: 33061
Joined: 2/26/2006
From: Central Pennsylvania
Status: offline 		IM SO SICK of hearing about the iraq.  i tune it out.

nevfer before in my lifetime hacve so many wanted change. but im afriad - we are stuck. we broke it- we bought it.

see?

(in reply to PrettyCassandra)
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RE: The One Thing No One Says About Iraq - 9/6/2007 8:09:08 AM   
farglebargle


Posts: 10715
Joined: 6/15/2005
From: Albany, NY
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity

I haven't seen too many who claim to oppose the liberation of the Iraqi people signing up as human shields to defend Al-Qaeda-in-Iraq, either though.



By "Liberation" you mean the ethnic cleansing of the various provinces of Iraq by the Local Strongmen and their Militias?

The Shiia have either killed off or driven off the local Sunni and Kurds.
The Sunni have either killed off or driven off the local Shiia and Kurds.
The Kurds heave either killed off or driven off the local Shiia and Sunni.

That's a lot of Freedom and Liberty, when you're shot dead because your freaking name is "Omar"!



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RE: The One Thing No One Says About Iraq - 9/6/2007 8:30:27 AM   
thompsonx


Posts: 23322
Joined: 10/1/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: pollux

quote:

ORIGINAL: dcnovice

We've had a lot of posts about Iraq here at dear old Collarme, and supporters of the war have said many things about why we needed to invade Iraq and must remain there now.

I've noticed an interesting omission, though. I've yet to see anyone say, "I believe in the Iraq war, and I'm enlisting to fight it." Support for the war seems to rest on the handy assumption that other people will attend to the minor details of fighting and dying.


You don't know many active-duty military people, do you?


pollux:
I know lots of active duty military.  The warriors amongst them could care less who the target is...it is all about the "rock and roll".
The non warriors are not much in favor of the war in Iraq as they view it as a war of aggression and aggrandizement in which they are asked to bleed and die for the benefit of the rich.
thompson

(in reply to pollux)
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RE: The One Thing No One Says About Iraq - 9/6/2007 8:31:18 AM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline 		ditto.

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RE: The One Thing No One Says About Iraq - 9/6/2007 8:35:49 AM   
domiguy


Posts: 12952
Joined: 5/2/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity

I haven't seen too many who claim to oppose the liberation of the Iraqi people signing up as human shields to defend Al-Qaeda-in-Iraq, either though.


Oh my God....It's alive!  What in the fuck have you been up to, dude?  Running your SUV over some hippies?

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RE: The One Thing No One Says About Iraq - 9/6/2007 8:38:14 AM   
popeye1250


Posts: 18104
Joined: 1/27/2006
From: New Hampshire
Status: offline 		Too many people and companies are making too much money from Iraq.
There are more "contractors" there than military personel!
After 9/11 I called all the branches of the military to try to get back in.
But I wanted back in to go after al qeada and Bin Laden not to end up in someplace like Iraq!
McCain and a lot of others either just don't get it or are trying to pull the wool over our eyes when they say; "if we leave Iraq will become a breeding ground for terrorists."
Is that so?
And what about Syria, Iran, Saudi Arabia, Egypt, Yemen, Dubai and all the other arab countries?
Somehow they're "not" breeding grounds for terrorists?
Correct me if I'm wrong but wearn't most of the hijackers from Egypt, Saudi Arabia and Yemen?

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RE: The One Thing No One Says About Iraq - 9/6/2007 8:42:38 AM   
thompsonx


Posts: 23322
Joined: 10/1/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity

I haven't seen too many who claim to oppose the liberation of the Iraqi people signing up as human shields to defend Al-Qaeda-in-Iraq, either though.

Sanity:
From most accounts Iraq has less freedom now than they did under So damned insane.
BTW have you gone down to enlist yet?
thompson
 

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RE: The One Thing No One Says About Iraq - 9/6/2007 8:56:50 AM   
Sinergy


Posts: 9383
Joined: 4/26/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: pahunkboy

we broke it- we bought it.



Speak for yourself.  I actively opposed the war prior to AnencephalyBoy invading.

If you voted for the  neo-cons, you broke it, you bought it.

Feel free to go clean up your mess and dont inflict it on the rest of us.

Sinergy 



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"There is a fine line between clever and stupid"
David St. Hubbins "This Is Spinal Tap"

"Every so often you let a word or phrase out and you want to catch it and bring it back. You cant do that, it is gone, gone forever." J. Danforth Quayle


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RE: The One Thing No One Says About Iraq - 9/6/2007 9:02:11 AM   
Owner59


Posts: 17033
Joined: 3/14/2006
From: Dirty Jersey
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Sinergy

quote:

ORIGINAL: pahunkboy

we broke it- we bought it.





Speak for yourself.  I actively opposed the war prior to AnencephalyBoy invading.

If you voted for the  neo-cons, you broke it, you bought it.

Feel free to go clean up your mess and dont inflict it on the rest of us.

Sinergy 




ditto

< Message edited by Owner59 -- 9/6/2007 9:03:04 AM >

_____________________________

"As for our common defense, we reject as false the choice between our safety and our ideals"

President Obama

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RE: The One Thing No One Says About Iraq - 9/6/2007 10:14:21 AM   
cyberdude611


Posts: 2596
Joined: 5/7/2006
Status: offline 		But you forget that a vast majority of the soldiers over there DO support the war. A former Marine was on TV the other day. He was injured in Iraq and he said he would go back if he could.

Its a big argument used by the Dems that if you support war, you should fight it. And that's just a political cheap shot. Not everyone can fight a war. Not everyone can play football. You have to be of certain physical type to play that game or else you are just not going to survive your first hit. Some people have health issues. Some people are single-parents. Everyone's situation is different. Are you saying it is wrong for those people to favor the war? I guess you think that only healthy 20-30 year olds are allowed to support a war?

By flooding the military with people who are not physically able to meet the demands, you weaken the force as a whole. And if you ask our soldiers over there, they dont want people there who dont want to be there to help win. They dont want a military draft. It will hurt morale.

You know, Bill Clinton was a draft dodger. The Dems didnt seem to have any problem when he sent our boys over to fight in Somalia or Hati or Bosnia. I didnt hear a peep. But if a Republican president avoided the draft...the Democrats start whining. You guys got a double-standard going there....

(in reply to Owner59)
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