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Motivations of Submission (and a personal ramble) - 5/2/2007 6:36:11 PM   
GeekyGirl


Posts: 905
Joined: 8/21/2006
Status: offline 		I was having this conversation with a dominant friend of mine the other day...I was trying to do some soul searching and figure out WHY I am drawn to this lifestyle (especially with the recent allegations that I'm a "wannabe" and a "domme-in-disguise" etc).

He said to me that "the older you get, the less it will matter why...just accept it."

I'm not sure I agree with that...I think perhaps it's crucial to know WHERE your desire for submission comes from. Do you think it's important to understand the reasons why?

I have noticed trends among the motivations for submission...for example, I see women who are submissive because they truly are giving and altruistic people who gain great pleasure from making others happy and taking care of them. It seems that these women are often in service-oriented jobs (or they are stay at home moms.) It seems that their entire sense of accomplishment is tied up in being able to make someone elses life better.

I've noticed other submissive who come from a background of abuse, and it almost seems that their motivation for submission is to enjoy "abuse" within the confines of a loving relationship, because on some subconscious level "abuse" is all they know and are comfortable with..therefore they seek to meet their need for "abuse" within a positive environment.

I'm sure there's lots of other motivations but these are two that I've heard from other subs on a regular basis.

I've been doing a lot of introspection and I'm coming to believe that my need for submission is really strongly tied to my youth and losing my biological father at an early age. It might sound cliche but I think there is truth to it. He and my mother went through a very violent divorce when I was young. He told me he didn't love me, kidnapped me twice to "get at" my mother, and then finally one night he just left without saying goodbye. I always felt that I got cheated out of the "father/daughter" experience.

My stepdad was a good guy but young and clueless and not very affectionate...more of a big brother type who never really stepped into that "father" role in my mind.

I think that now as an adult I seek BDSM as a way to find this dominant, protective father figure who expects me to obey him but also dotes on me and showers me with affection the way my real father never did...I think this is why "service submission" doesn't make sense to me. It's because my motivation isn't "I want to please." Rather it is , "I want to be a good girl so Daddy will give me attention". It's ultimately a selfish motivation. Does that make me a "wannabe?" Because my submission and obedience is tied to his reciprocating by giving me the attention I've always craved?

Perhaps this is why I set such strict parameters on the type of person I will or will not submit to and under what circumstances that submission will occur...because ultimately my goal is selfish and the minute I feel that he steps out of his "daddy role" , my submission abruptly ends as my needs are no longer being met.

It's only within the BDSM context that I've found the type of relationship I seek...where this kind older man loves me and pats my head, and tells me what to do and tucks me into bed and punishes me when I'm bad...but punishes me with love. This person who expects me to obey but also treats me like "daddy's little girl" and gives me oodles of attention.

I think this is why, for me, I can't be with a dominant who I percieve as selfish (or unfatherly.) I have to have this feeling that every action he does is in the nature of making me a better person and "raising" me properly. This is why I'd never be with a dom who (using our most recent debate as an example) would tell me to lose 20 lbs or he won't commit to me. Because to me, that would be an unfatherly thing to do. Daddies are supposed to love you unconditionally as opposed to being concerned with how you look. The minute he made such an "unfatherly" statement, my submission would grind to a halt and I'd tell him to get the hell out of my life. Now if he was telling me to do something (like lose weight) for my health, it would be different. But if I felt his motivation was selfish, it wouldn't work with me.

He would have to be the figure who is dominant but in a completely altruistic manner. "You must do as I say because it's what's best for you" as opposed to do "do what I say because it's your job to serve me."

The need for kinky sex even plays into that same dynamic. I need this "daddy" figure who hurts me (by beating me, humiliating me, etc in the bedroom) because in my mind this mirrors the pain my real father put me through. Only with my Dom, I get to go through that pain, and when it's over, he's there to hold me and tell me I'm a good girl and say he loves me...basically to "kiss it and make it better" in a way that my real parent never did. I seek the kinky sex experiences over and over because it is a continual affirmation that THIS daddy isn't going to leave..he might hurt me but he hurts me because he loves me and he reassures me that he will always be there to heal my hurts and make the wrong places right again.

I'm probably rambling and I'm not sure that this makes any sense...it's partially a way for me to get my own feelings out in print as I try to really figure out my own psyche.

I'm be interested to hear what has motivated others to submission and how they felt about the journey of discovering that motivation.


_____________________________

"It's nothing that I understand, but when in your arms you have complete power over me. So be gentle if you please, 'cause your hands are in my hair, but my heart is in your teeth and it makes me want to make you near me always."
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RE: Motivations of Submission (and a personal ramble) - 5/2/2007 6:53:07 PM   
sweetnurseBBW


Posts: 2464
Joined: 1/26/2006
From: North Carolina
Status: offline 		It was just something that when I found it I knew it was were I belonged. I had a boyfriend in college break up with me because he said I was too submissive. I was shocked, I was just being me. My roomate was in the lifestyle and took me to a munch. It was like a epiphany. It was like"this is me". 

_____________________________

Sir Pain's pain slut

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RE: Motivations of Submission (and a personal ramble) - 5/2/2007 7:08:54 PM   
minnetar


Posts: 1272
Joined: 4/11/2007
Status: offline 		Did you change your avatar to remove your photo or am i losing it? 

sorry,
minnetar

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RE: Motivations of Submission (and a personal ramble) - 5/2/2007 7:09:57 PM   
ChainedExistence


Posts: 507
Joined: 2/5/2005
Status: offline 		You are a very introspective girl, and have probably defined very accurately your draw toward being a submissive. For a long time I did the same-had the need to search out my reasons for being. In my case,  I was trying to justify what seemed to run in opposition to so many things I expected to be true about myself. I was supposed to be the good little girl who never stepped out of line and who never would dream of having a wanton bone in my body. I went to church like I was supposed to, not because I believed everything I heard, but simply because I was supposed to. I tolerated sex, because it's supposed to be that boring, right? I put up with a horrible marriage because I was supposed to. Eventually I quit letting the "supposed to's" have their way when some life events made me question living such an imitation of a life.  Not to say I totally disregarded everything I knew, I just quit doing everything because I was supposed to, and took more of a stand for what I felt in my heart. My parents were surprised that I wanted out of my marriage, for example, but came to see what a torture it had been for me. I found them surprisingly supportive. I've ended up with someone who excites me every time I lay eyes on him, and I can't say anything about our life together is boring. Like your Dom friend though, I am content in this moment to "just accept it." It matters less and less WHY I got here, it's enough that I finally DID.Master plays with that "supposed to be a good girl" side of me that will always be there to some extent,  but it works because as much as I have changed, there are some parts of me that never will. I don't have to wonder why so much anymore, I just get to be happy.

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RE: Motivations of Submission (and a personal ramble) - 5/2/2007 7:15:36 PM   
IrishMist


Posts: 7480
Joined: 11/17/2005
Status: offline
quote:

He said to me that "the older you get, the less it will matter why...just accept it."

I don't know, I kind of agree with this.

When I was younger, in my first relationship; it was only because it was how HE wanted things to be, and I loved him desperatly enough to learn about the lifestyle.

As the years went on, it became less because of how he wanted it, and more about how we wanted it.

So yes, I can see his point in saying that.

_____________________________

If I said something to offend you, please tell me what it was so that I can say it again later.


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RE: Motivations of Submission (and a personal ramble) - 5/2/2007 7:38:05 PM   
velvetears


Posts: 2933
Joined: 6/19/2006
Status: offline 		For myself i used to question why i desired the things i did and i spent a good amount of time in analysing myself, much the way you did, and found events from my childhood and later years that only in retrospection i could say were clues to what my nature was.  i don't think it's necessarily the older one gets the less important it is but more the longer you live with the realization of who you are, the less important figuring out why becomes simply because you come to accept it better and the need goes away to "figure it out"

i don't think there is any "right" or "wrong" motivation to be submissive.  There will always be others who think their way is "better" or "more" then yours.  Perhaps they feel better putting others down for a motivation they can't possibly understand or maybe it threatens them or in their eyes they feel less valid somehow if other people live it differently then them.  Don't allow them to affect you or make you feel less valid in your own choices.  You have every right to create the relationship in this lifestyle that works for you and the one you bring into your life.  Thanks for sharing your thoughts i enjoyed getting to see how you brought it altogether and made sense of all the events in your life that influenced your submission.

_____________________________

Religion is for people who are scared of hell, Spirituality is for people who have been there

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RE: Motivations of Submission (and a personal ramble) - 5/2/2007 7:38:30 PM   
spanklette


Posts: 882
Joined: 2/22/2005
Status: offline 		Well, my motivations for being submissive are ultimately selfish. It's what I enjoy doing and the dynamic that fits me the best. Being submissive or slave may seem like the most unselfish act in the world, from an outsider looking in...but, if it's consentual, then that selflessnes kind of dissolves.

Don't get me wrong, I have seen submissives do selfless things for their Dominant partners...but the motivation to join the lifestyle is very self aware.

I don't know why it appeals to me. Honestly, I really don't care, as long as I'm not bringing some sort of neuroses on myself by submitting to the will of a Dominant partner. 

If it pleases you to find out the "why's", then by all means search them out. At the very worst, you will come to know yourself better so there's really no harm in being self-aware and wondering more about your own nature.

_____________________________

~spanklette~

"The important thing is this: to be able at any moment to sacrifice what we are for what we could become. " Charles du Bois

"Please don't shout, can't you see I'm not listening." Billie Myers

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RE: Motivations of Submission (and a personal ramble) - 5/2/2007 7:44:35 PM   
juliaoceania


Posts: 21383
Joined: 4/19/2006
From: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
Status: offline 		My motivation to submission is altruistic, to please others, it is sexual too. When I first began to explore this side of myself it was with someone that was a distant "sir/master" figure. I was good with that at the time, and found it arousing in its own weird way. It was nothing like being a Daddy's girl/woman. I am a woman, but there is the Daddy/girl element too. I was not looking for a Daddy when I found Sinergy. I did not know how it would feel to be in this sort of dynamic, now I would not change it for anything.

My motivation to submit is not to replace the father I lost (he passed away when I was 13), but I found out through my submission that my inner 13 year old needed healing, and I truly feel this relationship has healed me. No one can know the pain of losing a beloved father at that age unless they have went through it. Part of me got left behind there, and that is the part of me that my Daddy has been cultivating. I do not think he knows what it has meant to me. I am overcoming fears, embracing my future partially because of him.

So while finding a Daddy to nurture me was not what I was looking for, not the motivation for my submission, but it was a gift the Universe handed to me to heal me. That healing is mine no matter what happens.

I think we can have multiple motivations all at once, and some of them will take precident over others depending where we are in life. You are on a very long journey of self discovery, and what motivates you today may not be what motivates you a decade from now.

< Message edited by juliaoceania -- 5/2/2007 7:48:23 PM >

_____________________________

Once you label me, you negate me ~ Soren Kierkegaard

Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

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RE: Motivations of Submission (and a personal ramble) - 5/2/2007 7:52:59 PM   
peppermint


Posts: 5175
Joined: 10/18/2005
From: Montana
Status: offline 		Years ago i discovered there were others who had similar needs and feelings as my own.  I was happy to find where i felt i belonged.  I also needed to know why i am the way i am.  I searched the internet, reading everything i could in the hopes of discovering the answer to my question.  I talked with people.  I spent month upon month wanting to discover the answer to "Why me?". 

Then one night while writing a letter to a submissive friend of mine i discovered the answer.  The answer was very simple.  It does not matter why i am the why i am.  What matters is that i accept and love myself for what i am.  I  am no longer bothered with the question of why. 




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RE: Motivations of Submission (and a personal ramble) - 5/2/2007 8:27:07 PM   
slaveish


Posts: 1086
Joined: 2/19/2007
Status: offline 		Unless you are feeling negative feelings toward your submission, the reason why is superfluous. It doesn't matter. If it fills a need for you, makes you feel good, and harms no one, "why" is just something with which to confuse and irritate yourself.

Take it past D/s. Does it matter ~why~ you like flowers or swimming or reading good books? Nope, not really. Does it take anything away from your enjoyment by figuring out the why? Nope, probably not. Get out of your head. You're going to intellectualize the event until it becomes nothing more than a numb idea.

_____________________________

You only lose what you cling to. ~~Gautama Sidharta

If we have no peace, it is because we have forgotten that we belong to each other. ~~Mother Teresa

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RE: Motivations of Submission (and a personal ramble) - 5/2/2007 8:30:39 PM   
catize


Posts: 3020
Joined: 3/7/2006
Status: offline 		I know several dominant folk who were abused or abandoned as children and they believe that impacted their choice to be dominant.  And I have known many others who faced the same and yet they are vanilla.  Two people can face or endure the same event yet process and cope with it in very divergent ways.
Some people find introspection helpful, others have no need. 
I did feel the need in the beginning when I first began to explore my submissive side.  Whether my conclusions are accurate or not, I believe it helped me to accept myself and the life I have chosen to live.
Pffffft  to those who call you a wannabe……..all that means is that they want you to be what fits their definition, not yours. 
Be honest about your motivations with a prospective dominant and there will be someone who understands and has the same motivation.

_____________________________

"Power is real. But it's a lot less real if it's not perceived as power."
Robert Parker, Stranger in Paradise

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RE: Motivations of Submission (and a personal ramble) - 5/2/2007 8:37:22 PM   
MsCara


Posts: 31
Joined: 6/26/2004
Status: offline 		For me I was raised this way.   I remember my father kneeling and brushing my mothers hair.  He wasn't "allowed" to tell us what to do.  Even as a young teen I knew "something" was different.   My mother told me my grandmother was the same way.  My grandfather wasn't allowed to sleep unless he was at the foot of the bed or on the floor.  Here is the weird part .. I am the oldest of 7, 2 were adopted.  Over the past 4 years or so I have found out the 5 siblings not adoted are all living this way.  My sister is submissive, all but 1 brother is Dominant .. my youngest brother submissive.   We were all surprised by the fact and the way we discovered the "secret" was .. I wore my symbol to my sisters while visiting her.  She laughed, I laughed ... strange huh?  
C.

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RE: Motivations of Submission (and a personal ramble) - 5/2/2007 8:40:22 PM   
AquaticSub


Posts: 14867
Joined: 12/27/2005
Status: offline 		Honestly, I have no more idea where my submissiveness comes from then I do where my bisexuality comes from.

I just know it's hot when I'm told to get on my knees and I know it's hot when I get to play with boobies.

_____________________________

Without my dominance you cannot submit. Without your submission I cannot dominate. You are my equal in this, though our roles are different.-Val

It was ok for him to beat me but then he tried to cuddle me! - Me

Member:Clan of the Scarlet O'Hair

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RE: Motivations of Submission (and a personal ramble) - 5/2/2007 8:40:23 PM   
MsCara


Posts: 31
Joined: 6/26/2004
Status: offline 		<<<<---    does anypne know why this vanilla cone is here?  
C.

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RE: Motivations of Submission (and a personal ramble) - 5/2/2007 8:41:30 PM   
AquaticSub


Posts: 14867
Joined: 12/27/2005
Status: offline 		Cause you haven't posted a lot.

Better question: Why does everyone care?

_____________________________

Without my dominance you cannot submit. Without your submission I cannot dominate. You are my equal in this, though our roles are different.-Val

It was ok for him to beat me but then he tried to cuddle me! - Me

Member:Clan of the Scarlet O'Hair

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RE: Motivations of Submission (and a personal ramble) - 5/2/2007 8:43:26 PM   
MsCara


Posts: 31
Joined: 6/26/2004
Status: offline 		thanks !

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RE: Motivations of Submission (and a personal ramble) - 5/2/2007 8:46:43 PM   
Ericus1


Posts: 47
Joined: 1/13/2007
Status: offline 		for me, knowing why i serve is important; not for the reason why i serve though.  it is important to know myself.  the first rule is "know yourself."  It is very good that you have spent the time understanding yourself. 

Now, accept yourself as you are.  Find someone who accepts you for who you are.  And be happy in life. 

Remember the words of Budda  "There is no way to happiness.  Happiness is the way."

ericus

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RE: Motivations of Submission (and a personal ramble) - 5/2/2007 8:53:27 PM   
slavegirljoy


Posts: 1207
Joined: 11/6/2006
From: North Carolina, USA
Status: offline 		For me, there is certainly the element of a very strong want/need to feel that i belong, truly belong, to a very strong man.  In the beginning, the man i belonged to was most definitely a father-figure.  He was almost 15 years older than me, previously married, the father of 2 kids (who weren't much younger than me), very knowledgeable and worldly and i hung on His every word and learned everything i could. 
 
There is still some of that element in my need to be submissive, but it isn't as great as it was before and i'm not sure if it is because i have grown or if it is that that particular man was just very special and i haven't found anyone else who is like that for me.  He was my first Master, He was my teacher, and He was a very strong father-figure.  i still need to belong to a strong man, who i respect, but He doesn't necessarily need to be a father-figure for me to feel submissive to Him.
 
But, besides the need/desire of knowing that i belong to a very strong man and the tremendous feeling of security i get from that, there is another element that is nearly as powerful in motivating me to be a submissive.  That is that i get to be completely uninhibited toward sex.  i don't have any feelings of shame, because, "i'm not really doing it for me",  i'm doing it "because my Master wants me to do it and makes me do it", and that makes it okay for me to be shamelessly and wantonly sexual.  It makes it okay for me to be very sexual.  There's no fear of feeling like i am a "bad girl", since my sexual behavior is under the direction and control of my Master and "i'm doing it because i have to", "to please Him".
 
What's more important to me than needing to please, though, is the need to feel that i am useful and of service.  i am good at taking care of others, but only if they matter to me, not in general.  i'm really just task-oriented and i get a great deal of satisfaction from just knowing that i have completed a task extremely well, with or without getting a pat on the head or some other form of approval from anyone else.  i know i did a good job and that's all i need to feel good about myself.  Of course, my Master is always telling me how much He appreciates what i do, but i don't need to hear it and sometimes i even feel that He is making too big a deal about what i do. 
 
slave joy
Owned property of Master David

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RE: Motivations of Submission (and a personal ramble) - 5/2/2007 9:08:34 PM   
behindmirrors


Posts: 340
Joined: 8/5/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: GeekyGirl

I'm be interested to hear what has motivated others to submission and how they felt about the journey of discovering that motivation.



Well, I'm also in the selfish motivation camp, along with spanklette. I am here because this is what I wanted, and I made the choice to step forward and pursue it- and happened to discover that my boyfriend whom I had opened up to was a Dominant...a happy thing indeed, though sometimes I wonder, looking back, if I didn't know that all along in some way.

I don't really think of what I can do for others as my first and foremost (not altruistic, not at all- even when I do something for someone, I do it because of the personal gain I will recieve), and although I came from an abusive background, I did my healing before I stepped into this lifestyle, and don't carry any desire to be treated the way I was in the past. My motivations are, in their essence, internal. I felt a deep connection to the man I love, and I wanted to be his, so I asked for it. I have not held a regret about that choice, because I was never compelled into it- I was ready to take that step, and with some knowledge that it might be well-recieved, I took it. Our relationship is a trade agreement, with both sides gaining satisfaction from the arrangement- otherwise, I would not be here.

I think we all have moments where we try to place ourselves into a category, and try to figure out how we ended up the way we are. I particularly liked Aqua's comment (I like being told to kneel and boobies too, haha!), because it does kind of sum it up- I like what I like, and I am pursuing that. It's good because it makes me happy. I gain that happiness from doing what I do, and that's how I know my motivation- because it fulfills me in a way I want to be fulfilled.

behindmirrors.

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RE: Motivations of Submission (and a personal ramble) - 5/2/2007 9:26:37 PM   
Stazia


Posts: 49
Joined: 4/17/2007
Status: offline 		well i have a strange feeling that i am going to get flamed for writing this but here goes..
i think that i was just born this way.  i think that gentically my internal wireing says what i like/want/need in a mate is that of a dom.  i could fight it as well as trying to go upstream in a flash flooded river. as far back as i can remember what i wanted in a man was that of a dom, i just lacked the proper vocabulary to phrase it that way.  i was never abused as a child, both of my parents are still alive today, and until i was half way through high school they stayed married.  just as the fact that i was born with blue eyes, i think i was born a submissive.  thats my two cents anyway.

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