Collarspace Discussion Forums


Home  Login  Search 

Essay arrest baffles experts


View related threads: (in this forum | in all forums)

Logged in as: Guest
 
All Forums >> [Casual Banter] >> Off the Grid >> Essay arrest baffles experts Page: [1]
Login
Message << Older Topic   Newer Topic >>
Essay arrest baffles experts - 4/27/2007 10:24:50 AM   
pahunkboy


Posts: 33061
Joined: 2/26/2006
From: Central Pennsylvania
Status: offline 		http://www.suntimes.com/news/metro/360827,CST-NWS-essay27.article

Police Thursday released portions of an essay used to charge a Cary-Grove High School student with disorderly conduct, leaving several experts puzzled at an arrest based on such schoolwork.
Asked to write about whatever he wanted in a creative writing class...

this hysteria has gone too far!!!!!

tthis is akin to thought police!
Profile   Post #: 1
RE: Essay arrest baffles experts - 4/27/2007 10:43:40 AM   
gypsygrl


Posts: 1471
Joined: 10/8/2005
From: new york state
Status: offline 		How could a written document be considered disordly conduct by any stretch of the imagination?

What could it do beside just kind of sit there doing nothing?

Maybe I should clean up my papers, though, just in case.  They're spread all over my kitchen table in a disorderly mess. :)


_____________________________

“To be happy is to be able to become aware of oneself without fright.” ~Walter Benjamin


(in reply to pahunkboy)
Profile   Post #: 2
RE: Essay arrest baffles experts - 4/27/2007 10:47:17 AM   
Alumbrado


Posts: 5560
Status: offline 		Another shot of KY applied to the proverbial slippery slope...

(in reply to gypsygrl)
Profile   Post #: 3
RE: Essay arrest baffles experts - 4/27/2007 10:54:15 AM   
pahunkboy


Posts: 33061
Joined: 2/26/2006
From: Central Pennsylvania
Status: offline 		the students were instructed to NOT censure themselfs in the creative writing class. this is alarming. it makes anything you ever wrote- a potential- for- charges, regardless of context- regardless of fictional or simply thoughts out loud.

i dont recal any type of precedent for this.

(in reply to Alumbrado)
Profile   Post #: 4
RE: Essay arrest baffles experts - 4/27/2007 11:05:32 AM   
NeedToUseYou


Posts: 2297
Joined: 12/24/2005
From: None of your business
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: pahunkboy

http://www.suntimes.com/news/metro/360827,CST-NWS-essay27.article

Police Thursday released portions of an essay used to charge a Cary-Grove High School student with disorderly conduct, leaving several experts puzzled at an arrest based on such schoolwork.
Asked to write about whatever he wanted in a creative writing class...

this hysteria has gone too far!!!!!

tthis is akin to thought police!


Yeah, it's ridiculous. This why I'm against all thought based laws. It starts with "good" sounding laws like "hate crime legislations" and drifts and drifts and drifts. You can't open a box, and expect it not spill out in areas unforeseen initially.

So, now we are to the point, where creative writing is only acceptable in a narrow band of accepted thought. Hrmmmm, Stephen King is fucked.

This is disturbing though, as I used to enjoy creative writing class, and I'd take full advantage of the non-censor. Dead babies, rape, murder, (never sex with the dead, but just because I didn't think about it, LOL), that was the point to me to write the most fucked up horrific shit I could think of.








< Message edited by NeedToUseYou -- 4/27/2007 11:06:07 AM >

(in reply to pahunkboy)
Profile   Post #: 5
RE: Essay arrest baffles experts - 4/27/2007 11:10:18 AM   
selfbnd411


Posts: 598
Joined: 7/23/2005
Status: offline 		"A second disorderly count accuses Lee of alarming first-year teacher Nora Capron by writing that "as a teacher, don't be surprised on [sic] inspiring the first CG shooting,'' an apparent reference to Cary-Grove High."

Sounds like the police did the right thing to me.  Free speech is not limitless.  Just try telling your neighbors that you'll burn their house down and poison their milk and find out just where those limits are.

(in reply to NeedToUseYou)
Profile   Post #: 6
RE: Essay arrest baffles experts - 4/27/2007 11:18:23 AM   
NeedToUseYou


Posts: 2297
Joined: 12/24/2005
From: None of your business
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: selfbnd411

"A second disorderly count accuses Lee of alarming first-year teacher Nora Capron by writing that "as a teacher, don't be surprised on [sic] inspiring the first CG shooting,'' an apparent reference to Cary-Grove High."

Sounds like the police did the right thing to me.  Free speech is not limitless.  Just try telling your neighbors that you'll burn their house down and poison their milk and find out just where those limits are.



It says a second disorderly charge, doesn't that infer, that the disorderly charge for the essay is  seperate from that other quote you referenced. So, wouldn't that mean that the essay alone was the grounds for the original charge?

Anyway, the kid has no police record, an honors student, and this was done(the essay), in creative writing class.

It's bullshit.

People need to lighten up a bit.

(in reply to selfbnd411)
Profile   Post #: 7
RE: Essay arrest baffles experts - 4/27/2007 11:38:54 AM   
farglebargle


Posts: 10715
Joined: 6/15/2005
From: Albany, NY
Status: offline 		We are no longer, as a culture, brave enough to deserve Freedom.



_____________________________

It's not every generation that gets to watch a civilization fall. Looks like we're in for a hell of a show.

ברוך אתה, אדוני אלוקינו, ריבון העולמים, מי יוצר צמחים ריחניים

(in reply to NeedToUseYou)
Profile   Post #: 8
RE: Essay arrest baffles experts - 4/27/2007 11:51:30 AM   
domiguy


Posts: 12952
Joined: 5/2/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: selfbnd411

"A second disorderly count accuses Lee of alarming first-year teacher Nora Capron by writing that "as a teacher, don't be surprised on [sic] inspiring the first CG shooting,'' an apparent reference to Cary-Grove High."

Sounds like the police did the right thing to me.  Free speech is not limitless.  Just try telling your neighbors that you'll burn their house down and poison their milk and find out just where those limits are.



There is a huge difference between a "creative writing" course which is fiction and someone writing a letter directed as a threat....It's such a shame that we live in a world where the idea of freedom is "that if you are not doing anything wrong than you have nothing to worry about."...This type of policing always works out wonderfully for all involved.

_____________________________



(in reply to selfbnd411)
Profile   Post #: 9
RE: Essay arrest baffles experts - 4/27/2007 1:01:27 PM   
Casie


Posts: 450
Joined: 1/5/2006
Status: offline 		obsurd. Im sure the ACLU will be all over this lol

(in reply to domiguy)
Profile   Post #: 10
RE: Essay arrest baffles experts - 4/27/2007 3:07:00 PM   
GoddessDustyGold


Posts: 2822
Joined: 4/11/2004
From: Arizona
Status: offline 		I don't believe there should have been a criminal action against the boy, but if we don't learn to look for potential warning signs, especially in view of what just happened, then we can expect no less t5han mroe of the same.  And we should not be shocked if it happens again.    
Writings such as this should be brought to the attention of parents and counselors.  Then the appropriate action is taken.  Not an arrest certainly.  But a good talking too regarding the inappropriateness of such "joking", and a chance to see where the kid is going.  Probably nowhere...but, it is still a responsibility to ensure that this isn't some sort of warning sign that is going to be ignored.  People request help in many ways.  If he doesn't need it, but just a little guidance regarding expressing himself more appropriately, fine...   Why would he take a creative writing assingment and want to express himself in such a violent manner?  Because he can?  Why is that even attractive to him and the first things that spring to mind?  So...I'm just saying.
So yes, it is the repsonsibility of parents and teachers to be thought police to a certain extent. 
I am sure I am going to get slapped around for this one! 

_____________________________

Dusty
They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety
B Franklin
Don't blame Me ~ I didn't vote for either of them
The Hidden Kingdom


(in reply to pahunkboy)
Profile   Post #: 11
RE: Essay arrest baffles experts - 4/27/2007 3:14:43 PM   
GoddessDustyGold


Posts: 2822
Joined: 4/11/2004
From: Arizona
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: pahunkboy

the students were instructed to NOT censure themselfs in the creative writing class. this is alarming. it makes anything you ever wrote- a potential- for- charges, regardless of context- regardless of fictional or simply thoughts out loud.

i dont recal any type of precedent for this.


No...it gives those in the life guidance roles an opportunity to see if someone is approaching life in a manner that might get them into trouble later on.  Because it is fiction, in the boy's mind, that makes it alright?  It is fiction and exposure to this stuff that causes the next real life incident.  Everyone is still screamining about all the copycats. 
If someone was writing about suicide and sadness, would it not be the responsible thing to check in with the writer and see what is driving this writing?  And perhaps you find that they are still trying to work through the suicide of a friend, or the sadness of some things in life.  How badly would you feel if you ignored this and said,. "I can't be a part of the though police" and then that person killed himself?.
Again, I repeat, I absolutely disagree with a knee jerk reaction of having the boy arrested.  That is way off the mark.  But don't get that overreaction confused with the fact that it seems like most are saying, it is fiction, it was a school assignment, and it is nobody's business and his privacy was invaded.  
ACLU indeed...hmmmmmm

_____________________________

Dusty
They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety
B Franklin
Don't blame Me ~ I didn't vote for either of them
The Hidden Kingdom


(in reply to pahunkboy)
Profile   Post #: 12
RE: Essay arrest baffles experts - 4/27/2007 4:37:21 PM   
Vendaval


Posts: 10297
Joined: 1/15/2005
Status: offline 		I second the recommendation of having him talk to a counselor
and having a talk with the parents to express concern.  But having
him arrested is a misuse of police authority.
 
Please make note that he is also age 18, a legal adult in our society,
no longer a minor. In addition this was a creative writing class with
express written instructions to not censor ideas.

_____________________________

"Beware, the woods at night, beware the lunar light.
So in this gray haze we'll be meating again, and on that
great day, I will tease you all the same."
"WOLF MOON", OCTOBER RUST, TYPE O NEGATIVE


http://KinkMeet.co.uk

(in reply to pahunkboy)
Profile   Post #: 13
RE: Essay arrest baffles experts - 4/28/2007 8:15:46 AM   
Legman1


Posts: 25
Joined: 8/3/2006
Status: offline 		This is a backlash arrest. Hopefully it wont hold up in court.

Security is no excuse for the loss of our basic freedoms.

(in reply to Vendaval)
Profile   Post #: 14
RE: Essay arrest baffles experts - 4/28/2007 8:47:42 AM   
selfbnd411


Posts: 598
Joined: 7/23/2005
Status: offline 		Apparently the "creative writing" in question wasn't so creative.  It's easy to say "oh, it's just fiction.  The police overreacted."  None of us has any actual responsibility to see that this adult doesn't go and kill his classmates.  Put yourself in the shoes of that young teacher.  Would you feel threatened if an 18 y/o wannabe soldier of fortune said this about you?

"Most new/young teachers are laid back, and cooperative with students as feedback and input into the curriculum and atmosphere. My current English teacher is a control freak intent on setting a gap between herself and her students like a 63 year old white male fortune 500 company CEO, and a illegal immigrant. If CG was a private catholic school I could understand, but wtf is her problem. And baking brownies and rice crispies does not make up for it, way to try and justify yourself as a good teacher while underhandidly looking for complements on your cooking. No quarrel on you qualifications as a writer, but as a teacher, don’t be surprised on inspiring the first cg shooting."

Full text can be found at:
http://www.nwherald.com/articles/2007/04/27/news/local/doc46323cf53fd2a594795423.txt

This isn't some kid writing a piece of fiction.  This is a case of an adult making a conscious effort to intimidate his classmates and teacher using the threat of violence.

(in reply to Legman1)
Profile   Post #: 15
RE: Essay arrest baffles experts - 4/28/2007 9:26:32 AM   
Termyn8or


Posts: 18681
Joined: 11/12/2005
Status: offline 		There has to be a line drawn. First of all, his necrophillic subject matter never should've seen the light of day, except maybe on an internet forum in the form of fiction (hint hint). If those were the rules, which pretty much said "get as wild as you can", I don't see a problem.

Now there IS a problem here. About the reference to inspiring a CG shooting. I DO have a problem with that. To tell someone that they might inspire a shooting is a bit close to saying that they would be the target. What else makes sense. It should've been investigated then. That particular statement is significant, while the one 'they' focus on is not.

T

(in reply to selfbnd411)
Profile   Post #: 16
RE: Essay arrest baffles experts - 4/28/2007 9:05:40 PM   
GoddessDustyGold


Posts: 2822
Joined: 4/11/2004
From: Arizona
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: selfbnd411

Apparently the "creative writing" in question wasn't so creative.  It's easy to say "oh, it's just fiction.  The police overreacted."  None of us has any actual responsibility to see that this adult doesn't go and kill his classmates.  Put yourself in the shoes of that young teacher.  Would you feel threatened if an 18 y/o wannabe soldier of fortune said this about you?

"Most new/young teachers are laid back, and cooperative with students as feedback and input into the curriculum and atmosphere. My current English teacher is a control freak intent on setting a gap between herself and her students like a 63 year old white male fortune 500 company CEO, and a illegal immigrant. If CG was a private catholic school I could understand, but wtf is her problem. And baking brownies and rice crispies does not make up for it, way to try and justify yourself as a good teacher while underhandidly looking for complements on your cooking. No quarrel on you qualifications as a writer, but as a teacher, don’t be surprised on inspiring the first cg shooting."

Full text can be found at:
http://www.nwherald.com/articles/2007/04/27/news/local/doc46323cf53fd2a594795423.txt

This isn't some kid writing a piece of fiction.  This is a case of an adult making a conscious effort to intimidate his classmates and teacher using the threat of violence.

How old is this boy? I am trying to remember if he is already 18 or almost 18...
I would not only be concerned about the content, but I would be very worried that a student could reach this stage in education and not know how to spell some very simple words, have such lousy sentence structure, and think it is appropriate to use the term "wtf" in a school paper.
And then we wonder...

Edited to add:  His punctuation stinks too! 

< Message edited by GoddessDustyGold -- 4/28/2007 9:07:00 PM >

_____________________________

Dusty
They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety
B Franklin
Don't blame Me ~ I didn't vote for either of them
The Hidden Kingdom


(in reply to selfbnd411)
Profile   Post #: 17
RE: Essay arrest baffles experts - 4/28/2007 9:29:27 PM   
Arpig


Posts: 9930
Joined: 1/3/2006
From: Increasingly further from reality
Status: offline 		A total travesty...a fucking joke except that it is real. Things have gone to far!

_____________________________

Big man! Pig Man!
Ha Ha...Charade you are!

Why do they leave out the letter b on "Garage Sale" signs?

CM's #1 All-Time Also-Ran


(in reply to pahunkboy)
Profile   Post #: 18
RE: Essay arrest baffles experts - 4/29/2007 6:23:06 AM   
pahunkboy


Posts: 33061
Joined: 2/26/2006
From: Central Pennsylvania
Status: offline 		well then, this poses another question. is the pen mightier then the sword?

all day long the tv beams images of viollance and destruction.

it would appear that everyone is a terrorist. what about the 4th amandemmment.

think outside the box and the kgb in on u

(in reply to Arpig)
Profile   Post #: 19
Page:   [1]
All Forums >> [Casual Banter] >> Off the Grid >> Essay arrest baffles experts Page: [1]
Jump to:





New Messages No New Messages
Hot Topic w/ New Messages Hot Topic w/o New Messages
Locked w/ New Messages Locked w/o New Messages
 Post New Thread
 Reply to Message
 Post New Poll
 Submit Vote
 Delete My Own Post
 Delete My Own Thread
 Rate Posts




Collarchat.com © 2025
Terms of Service Privacy Policy Spam Policy

0.172