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RE: Nuclear Disarmament - 2/15/2007 3:08:44 PM

meatcleaver

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quote:

ORIGINAL: cyberdude611

The only reason Russia is involved is because at the end of World War 2, the Soviet Union agreed to take on responsibility for rebuilding the region that is today North Korea.

This is a real problem of perception many Americans have 'The only reason Russia is involved..' while I don't think they have much right to be involved, they have as much right as the USA to be involved, as does China and as does everyone else. When the USA tells a country it isn't their problem, the immediate response is, it isn't yours either! And you wonder why many countries have a problem with US foreign policy.

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RE: Nuclear Disarmament - 2/15/2007 5:54:22 PM

Subject2Approval

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Hwang Jang Yop, the highest-ranking North Korean government official ever to defect to South Korea, even said "It is nonsense to urge the North to abandon its nuclear weapons with Kim in place." He is also quoted saying "The North's nuclear test last year was not Kim's last card and the North Korean leader could still test fire more missiles and mount nuclear warheads on them."

I also read that in 2005 Kim Jong II stated that he wanted a nuclear free North Korea.... Yeah he acts like it.

This disarmament is only temporary. North Korea is going to get what they want, and then were back to where we were less than a year ago.

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RE: Nuclear Disarmament - 2/15/2007 6:35:41 PM

WyrdRich

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quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

Ku-the void,

This is the big one, it is the don't listen to reason, don't listen to unreason, do what you set out to do regardless of outcome. Emptiness and dispassion..........

Ron

Ok, got it. Thanks. The same thing Musashi was talking about with not caring if you live or die, only succeed.

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RE: Nuclear Disarmament - 2/15/2007 6:56:47 PM

SusanofO

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Personally, I think China is holding most of the cards right now, in terms of having the most influence in any nuclear disarmament or build-up that can ensue- they've got a huge economic trading base that the U.S. is very dependent upon (as are many other countries across the world), and also a huge population, and a lot of their own nuclear weapons.

I think the U.S. believing they have huge influence, in terms of tipping the scales heavily, as far as not having a nuclear power implode another nuclear power is slightly delusional.

I think the U.S. is still important, in terms of diplomacy, but - as has been pointed out by others, perhaps - China, India, Pakistan, Russia - these countries lie much closer to North Korea and its crazy leader, Kim Jong Il, and (I believe) they know it - and the damage they'd suffer if he got totally (or any more) out of control in terms of what he will do as far as firing a nuclear weapon, too. I see China as having the most power - but I see all of these afore-mentioned coutnries as potentially highly influential on eachother, in terms of actions towards arms build-up or disarmament.

Iran is one country I really worry about (based on what I've read, which isn't all that much) - because I do think their leadership is not only crazy, but perfectly willing to accept aid from anyone, in terms of helping develop their own nuclear weapons, and I also envsion Iran having no problem justifying exploding one in - the name of some religious-fervored motive, and a weapon that might be geographically pretty far-reaching, too. Of course it really won't matter what their motive is, if millions of people end up dead anyway, because of it.

- Susan

< Message edited by SusanofO -- 2/15/2007 7:14:56 PM >

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RE: Nuclear Disarmament - 2/15/2007 7:13:47 PM

Sinergy

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Hello A/all,

The sad truth about Detente and mutually assured destruction is that as long as the United States and the Soviet Union could blow each other up, nobody got involved in stupid wars which could escalate into horrible things.

The Soviet Union goes tango uniform. Dumbfuckistan elects monkeyboy to be God. He immediately goes to war with everybody on the planet, either using weapons or simply words, and insists that it is either his way or the highway.

I have a problem with Iran and North Korea getting the bomb. But I also have a problem with Monkeyboy having the bomb. I have even more of a problem with Monkeyboy attempting to bully everybody else on the planet into doing what he thinks.

Sinergy

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RE: Nuclear Disarmament - 2/15/2007 7:18:47 PM

SusanofO

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Yeah, I agree- I've got no trouble picturing why some countries think it's wrong the U.S. is so hot to have other countries promise not to hold, or get, any nukes (or dis-arm), when we've got lots of 'em (regardless of the fact we've sign a non-proliferation agreement. We've still got 'em, and that counts for a lot, in the eyes of a country that has none, or maybe just a few). Especially if they have "crazy neighbors", IMO.

- Susan

< Message edited by SusanofO -- 2/15/2007 7:19:48 PM >

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RE: Nuclear Disarmament - 2/15/2007 7:22:42 PM

Arpig

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Hey, if they actually do follow through, then they will be the 3rd nation to undertake nuclear disarmament...anybody know who the other two are?

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RE: Nuclear Disarmament - 2/15/2007 7:35:05 PM

SusanofO

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Russia and the United Kingdom? I know Russia is one of them (at least, they seem like they are). Oh wait. France?

- Susan

< Message edited by SusanofO -- 2/15/2007 7:37:04 PM >

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RE: Nuclear Disarmament - 2/15/2007 7:40:06 PM

Arpig

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Nope, to my knowledge there are only two countries that had nuclear weapons at one point, and unilaterally gave them up: Canada and Ukraine.

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RE: Nuclear Disarmament - 2/15/2007 7:41:46 PM

SusanofO

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Wow, thanks for telling me - I love learning new stuff like that. I was on Wikiepedia trying to look it up, I was so curious - but it didn't say.

- Susan

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RE: Nuclear Disarmament - 2/16/2007 2:31:13 AM

meatcleaver

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Arpig

Nope, to my knowledge there are only two countries that had nuclear weapons at one point, and unilaterally gave them up: Canada and Ukraine.

Libya gave up their ambitions. One could say that Canada is under the US umbrella and Ukraine is under the Russian umbrella but it is a step in the right direction as far as the world is concerned.

Britain still needs it penile extention for self esteem reasons though it doesn't seem to matter to them that it can only get an erection with the aid of the USA. France also needs a penile extension but it can get an erection under its own steam which is the whole point of it so it can wave it at the USA and shout 'I've got one too!!!'

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RE: Nuclear Disarmament - 2/16/2007 11:06:58 AM

Subject2Approval

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South Africa is the only nation in the world to date which voluntarily gave up nuclear arms it had developed itself.

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