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Nuclear Disarmament - 2/13/2007 10:59:43 AM   
Subject2Approval


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quote:

In exchange for fuel aid, North Korea agreed Tuesday to shut down its main nuclear reactor and eventually dismantle its atomic weapons program, just four months after the communist state shocked the world by testing a nuclear bomb. 

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/17117242/ 


I am very skeptical about this whole affair. Never once in the article did it state anything about Kim Jong.


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Subject2Approval

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RE: Nuclear Disarmament - 2/13/2007 12:31:32 PM   
meatcleaver


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Subject2Approval

quote:

In exchange for fuel aid, North Korea agreed Tuesday to shut down its main nuclear reactor and eventually dismantle its atomic weapons program, just four months after the communist state shocked the world by testing a nuclear bomb. 

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/17117242/ 


I am very skeptical about this whole affair. Never once in the article did it state anything about Kim Jong.



The neocons in the US administration will wage a propaganda war saying that N Korea can't be trusted because this is the last thing they want. The US wants to have a reason to deploy new missile systems around the world and N Korea is a good excuse. They can tell Russia and China it is because of N Korea they need them and not because of them or maybe this administration is determined to start a new cold war and its not because they are scared of Russia or China but because it keeps Americans in a state of fear and knowing their place. Each way it is as much for domestic consumption as foreign policy.

< Message edited by meatcleaver -- 2/13/2007 12:33:23 PM >

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RE: Nuclear Disarmament - 2/13/2007 12:43:58 PM   
mnottertail


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Status: offline 		The US has promised them this sort of aid for decades.

They are short of heating oil.  Short of electricity. Short of cooking oil.

This whole imbriglio started because we reneged on an agreement to finish an electrical plant for them the last time they said 'NukUlar'
So, they just said 'NukUlar' again (I wouldn't be surprised to find out that the chinese supplied them with the stuff to test with) BUT---China is not going to let them run around with nukes----They are the boss....this entire scenario was orchestrated by the chinese--- Ka, Fu, Chi, Sui, KU......

Doesn't matter if you believe this or not, doesn't matter if you research the veracity of my assertions..........it is what it is.

Ron   

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RE: Nuclear Disarmament - 2/13/2007 3:59:42 PM   
Subject2Approval


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Status: offline 		They're just going to make nicey nice til they get what they want.

I mean really couldn't this deal have been concluded 3 or 4 years ago. Like maybe before North Korea conducted its nuclear test, because after that they acquired enough additional plutonium to build anywhere from 6 to 10 nuclear weapons?

With that, and the way the world seems to be heading, do you think they really wanna give that up?


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Subject2Approval

A condom is the glass slipper for our generation. You slip one on when you meet a stranger. You dance all night, and then you throw it away. The condom, I mean, not the stranger. - Fight Club

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RE: Nuclear Disarmament - 2/14/2007 1:57:33 AM   
meatcleaver


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Subject2Approval

They're just going to make nicey nice til they get what they want.

I mean really couldn't this deal have been concluded 3 or 4 years ago. Like maybe before North Korea conducted its nuclear test, because after that they acquired enough additional plutonium to build anywhere from 6 to 10 nuclear weapons?

With that, and the way the world seems to be heading, do you think they really wanna give that up?



Probably the most ustable country with nukes is Pakistan which is the US's allie on the war on terror and a country that is so unstable it could implode, a country that is thought to have sold nuclear technology to some very disturbing characters. The fact that the US isn't alarmed by this suggests that its real motive for promoting N Korea as part of the axis of evil is for other reasons.

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RE: Nuclear Disarmament - 2/14/2007 5:00:46 AM   
WyrdRich


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quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

Ka, Fu, Chi, Sui, KU......
Ron   


      I think I have some understanding of what you mean with this recurring little ditty, Ron, but every time I try to search it, I get a list of judo schools.  Care to provide an intelligible synopsis or a link to one?  It's been quite a while since I read "The Art of War."

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RE: Nuclear Disarmament - 2/14/2007 5:12:43 AM   
meatcleaver


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quote:

ORIGINAL: WyrdRich

Care to provide an intelligible synopsis or a link to one?  It's been quite a while since I read "The Art of War."


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Art_of_War

No doubt the Chineese were playing a game but even the Whitehouse must have some intelligent people that recognize that but then not all leaders are intelligent enough to listen to wise voices. There were enough wise voices in Washington warning against the Iraq invasion and they weren't listened to.

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RE: Nuclear Disarmament - 2/14/2007 6:00:11 AM   
boytoyroy


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Status: offline 		kim jung ill   , just stated the agreement to disarm is only temporary, !cannot believe these 6 nations are allowing him to use extortion .

< Message edited by boytoyroy -- 2/14/2007 6:04:15 AM >

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RE: Nuclear Disarmament - 2/14/2007 6:12:54 AM   
mnottertail


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Status: offline 		Ku-the void,

This is the big one, it is the don't listen to reason, don't listen to unreason, do what you set out to do regardless of outcome. Emptiness and dispassion..........

One reason the middle east has been fighting for years and will continue, and why we cant straighten it out....it is not a logical proposition....no American interference is desired there.

Now, the East--- where this came from originally is much better a player at this....
China is dispassionately controlling events in its sphere, and it is thinking in terms of thousands of years, while we can't get much beyond the 5 oclock news from day to day.

Ron

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RE: Nuclear Disarmament - 2/14/2007 7:25:51 PM   
Subject2Approval


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quote:

ORIGINAL: meatcleaver

Probably the most unstable country with nukes is Pakistan which is the US's allie on the war on terror and a country that is so unstable it could implode, a country that is thought to have sold nuclear technology to some very disturbing characters. The fact that the US isn't alarmed by this suggests that its real motive for promoting N Korea as part of the axis of evil is for other reasons.

quote:


In 1997, according to the C.I.A. report, Pakistan began paying for missile systems from North Korea in part by sharing its nuclear-weapons secrets. According to the report, Pakistan sent prototypes of high-speed centrifuge machines to North Korea. And sometime in 2001 North Korean scientists began to enrich uranium in significant quantities. Pakistan also provided data on how to build and test a uranium-triggered nuclear weapon, the C.I.A. report said. - The New Yorker



Pakistan an allie... It's more like "Keep your friends close, and your enemies closer"




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Subject2Approval

A condom is the glass slipper for our generation. You slip one on when you meet a stranger. You dance all night, and then you throw it away. The condom, I mean, not the stranger. - Fight Club

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RE: Nuclear Disarmament - 2/14/2007 7:49:57 PM   
Griswold


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Subject2Approval

quote:

In exchange for fuel aid, North Korea agreed Tuesday to shut down its main nuclear reactor and eventually dismantle its atomic weapons program, just four months after the communist state shocked the world by testing a nuclear bomb. 

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/17117242/ 


I am very skeptical about this whole affair. Never once in the article did it state anything about Kim Jong.



I'm sorry, I missed the point here. (I'll presume you had one).

You presumed that any head of a country, including ours would actually have something valid to say?

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RE: Nuclear Disarmament - 2/14/2007 8:00:54 PM   
HydroMaster


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Status: offline 		I'm a little ticked about this whole aid deal.  We let this little piss ant country blackmail us into helping them with some low grade nuclear fireworks.  It's bullshit, and I seriously doubt they'll stop testing.

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RE: Nuclear Disarmament - 2/14/2007 11:12:05 PM   
luckydog1


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Status: offline 		In case you didn't notice, there was a Coup in Pakistan in 1999.  The previous government was the one who was selling nuke parts and was very hostile to the USA, and basically put the Taliban in power.  The Taliban were formed in Pakistan, and the Pakistani Army aided in them in most of their early battles.  The CURRENT Gov is an ally of the USA, and has tried to calm the region, and is not proliferating nuke materials.  It doesn't get much press coverage but the Pakistan v India problem is huge, one of the major problems in the world.  They were testing Atom bombs on each others borders in the late 90s.

This is an Issue where Bush's diplomacy has been excelent. 

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RE: Nuclear Disarmament - 2/15/2007 1:57:14 AM   
meatcleaver


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quote:

ORIGINAL: luckydog1

In case you didn't notice, there was a Coup in Pakistan in 1999.  The previous government was the one who was selling nuke parts and was very hostile to the USA, and basically put the Taliban in power.  The Taliban were formed in Pakistan, and the Pakistani Army aided in them in most of their early battles.  The CURRENT Gov is an ally of the USA, and has tried to calm the region, and is not proliferating nuke materials.  It doesn't get much press coverage but the Pakistan v India problem is huge, one of the major problems in the world.  They were testing Atom bombs on each others borders in the late 90s.

This is an Issue where Bush's diplomacy has been excelent. 


It changes nothing, Pakistan is still an unstable country that can implode and the US doesn't seem that interested in the fact it has nukes. Just because the regime isn't officially selling nuclear technology doesn't mean disident scientists aren't, there is no real central control and very little loyalty to the government which is why the Pakistani government can't be as robust against terrorism as the Bush administration would like.

How many attempts has their been on the Pakistani Presidents life? Three? four? seven? Ten? We will probably never know and the Pakistani government doesn't control most of the tribal areas to the east of the country and the ones it does, it colludes with the Taliban. Very stable indeed.

< Message edited by meatcleaver -- 2/15/2007 1:59:33 AM >

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RE: Nuclear Disarmament - 2/15/2007 4:13:38 AM   
NavyDDG54


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quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

The US has promised them this sort of aid for decades.

They are short of heating oil.  Short of electricity. Short of cooking oil.


Ron   
\

Perhaps if he spent money on powering his country and not on nukes he might have what his country needs.

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RE: Nuclear Disarmament - 2/15/2007 12:08:18 PM   
mnottertail


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Status: offline 		Perhaps not..............

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RE: Nuclear Disarmament - 2/15/2007 12:21:08 PM   
caitlyn


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quote:

ORIGINAL: meatcleaver
It changes nothing, Pakistan is still an unstable country that can implode and the US doesn't seem that interested in the fact it has nukes.


Have you consdered that the military might we keep in the region, might make your above point, somewhat pointless? 

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RE: Nuclear Disarmament - 2/15/2007 12:58:02 PM   
cyberdude611


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quote:

about this whole affair. Never once in the article did it state anything about Kim Jong.
quote:

ORIGINAL: meatcleaver

quote:

ORIGINAL: Subject2Approval

quote:

In exchange for fuel aid, North Korea agreed Tuesday to shut down its main nuclear reactor and eventually dismantle its atomic weapons program, just four months after the communist state shocked the world by testing a nuclear bomb. 

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/17117242/ 


I am very skeptical about this whole affair. Never once in the article did it state anything about Kim Jong.



The neocons in the US administration will wage a propaganda war saying that N Korea can't be trusted because this is the last thing they want. The US wants to have a reason to deploy new missile systems around the world and N Korea is a good excuse. They can tell Russia and China it is because of N Korea they need them and not because of them or maybe this administration is determined to start a new cold war and its not because they are scared of Russia or China but because it keeps Americans in a state of fear and knowing their place. Each way it is as much for domestic consumption as foreign policy.


That has nothing to do with it. If North Korea develops nukes, that gives reason for South Korea and Japan to also develop nukes, which is something the Chinese do not want.
The US is involved because of a mutural protection treaty signed between the US, Japan, South Korea, and Australia. This treaty lasts in perpetuity, in other words...forever. Japan is very, very important to the United States today both strategically and economically. In fact, the Japanese holds 40% of the US national debt. And South Korea is rising in importance. So the US is going to protect those two countries from North Korea and China.

The only reason Russia is involved is because at the end of World War 2, the Soviet Union agreed to take on responsibility for rebuilding the region that is today North Korea.

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RE: Nuclear Disarmament - 2/15/2007 3:04:02 PM   
meatcleaver


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quote:

ORIGINAL: caitlyn

quote:

ORIGINAL: meatcleaver
It changes nothing, Pakistan is still an unstable country that can implode and the US doesn't seem that interested in the fact it has nukes.


Have you consdered that the military might we keep in the region, might make your above point, somewhat pointless? 


??? You're military might couldn't stop Iraq imploding and that was relatively stable if not very nice before you intervened.

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RE: Nuclear Disarmament - 2/15/2007 3:08:11 PM   
subrob1967


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Status: offline 		Bohica

Just like the Carter admin, Bush 41 admin, & Clinton admin.

We need to whack that little fucker once and for all.

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