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The shape of the body - 1/8/2007 8:45:59 PM

papabearscub

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First off, I don't want to offend anyone by what I'm getting ready to say and the questions that I'm going to pose. When I was having dinner with a friend that is in the lifestyle we were discussing different body shapes such as bbw v. supermodel. We were also discussing our shopping trip yesterday. We were in a plus size store and noticed the different ethnic backgrounds in the store. I gave me cause to think about the different cultures and how society plays a huge role in what we perceive is beautiful. I've also noticed this out in public in general.

Why does it seem more acceptable in the african american community for a woman to be a bbw/plus size? It seems to me that she is considered more beautiful and desirable than a caucasin woman who is bbw/plus size. Is there any truth or reasoning behind what I'm thinking and seeing? Yes, you could say that I wish bbw/plus size was more accepting in the caucasin community.

Why is a bbw/plus size so more acceptable in the lifestyle than in the vanilla, be it any ethnic group? Is it because bbw/plus size is easier to "manipulate"?

If Hollywood is to blame for what we deem beautiful and desirable, then why does it not affect every ethnic background?

Again, I didn't mean to offend anyone I was just looking for an answer or an opinion.

Post #: 1

RE: The shape of the body - 1/8/2007 8:56:47 PM

dcnovice

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Brave topic for your maiden post!

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RE: The shape of the body - 1/8/2007 8:58:05 PM

LuckyAlbatross

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quote:

ORIGINAL: papabearscub
Why does it seem more acceptable in the african american community for a woman to be a bbw/plus size? It seems to me that she is considered more beautiful and desirable than a caucasin woman who is bbw/plus size. Is there any truth or reasoning behind what I'm thinking and seeing? Yes, you could say that I wish bbw/plus size was more accepting in the caucasin community.

I am not completely sure other than to say that cultural preferences can span generations and can often be based on other things- if a woman's measure is based on her ability to do hard work, than a frail, thin frame isn't what you want. If a woman's measure is based on their stereotypical femininity, then frain thin frame is exactly what you want. Give a few generations of gender expectations and viola- you got yourself a whole set of cultural preferences.

quote:

Why is a bbw/plus size so more acceptable in the lifestyle than in the vanilla, be it any ethnic group? Is it because bbw/plus size is easier to "manipulate"?

Quite honestly IMO it's because most people come into the scene these days from online, and most of the people who spend a lot of time online are the ones who aren't terribly popular, who are not the most physically desireable, or who find they fit in in the "mainstream"- they aren't busy in the offline world. So they are online a lot. So they find out about bdsm and can study up on it a lot.

While I won't go so far or trite as to say "Fat women develop good personalities because they have to" there is some truth to the statement that if you don't fit into mainstream "norms" you do find a place for yourself elsewhere.

Once you have enough of them, it just becomes the norm. IME most of the fat chicks in the scene are actually a bit embarassed, uncomfortable and insecure about their weight. But there's enough of them to support eachother that it can easily be masked. I've seen it more than once where the hotter/younger piece of ass was very much snubbed by the fat hens of a scene.

quote:

If Hollywood is to blame for what we deem beautiful and desirable, then why does it not affect every ethnic background?

Oh, it does. And I don't think Hollywood is to blame at all.

< Message edited by LuckyAlbatross -- 1/8/2007 8:59:55 PM >

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Post #: 3

RE: The shape of the body - 1/8/2007 9:24:55 PM

redpetals

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Ahh.
This is right up my alley.
Even though I am sort of disappointed that it went in this direction.
I am telling you from personal experience..that there are as many insecure woman who are thin as there are those who are fat.
As a matter of fact, on the happiness and self acceptance level I would have to say that
I hear more thin woman pissin and moanin about their looks than a fatter woman does.
It might be my choice of friends.
But you don't see many bulemic bbw's do you?
Or am I uneducated on this?
And I think theres a lot of sourgrapes here
The real truth..is that once men experience bbw's in all our glory
(and we got some glory don't doubt it).They find it harder to go with a less cousioned ride.
Especially if they are sportin' jack hammers.
Just sayin'
grins....and is waiting for the "fat" police to show up.

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RE: The shape of the body - 1/8/2007 10:56:34 PM

LadyEllen

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From: Stourport-England
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OMG - another "fat" thread, along with the potential for racism too! This has to be the most dodgy post of the month that hasnt yet got pulled LOL!

Going for the racism vote, my opinion is that AC women are attractive whatever their body shape! I dont think its their skin colour that is more "forgiving" - its that in general I find, they are just far happier in themselves (did you notice the stereotyping there LOL!?) and this positivity shines through and makes them more attractive than their average white counterparts who often seem to be down on themselves for not looking like Barbie.

It's what's on the inside that makes a woman attractive, simple as that.

Now for some anecdotal evidence (always good to stir things up!);

My (white) ex sister in law; blonde, pretty, hourglass figure etc - but a total monster in her character that makes her unattractive to others (male and female) whatever she looks like, though she thinks she's Barbie of course.

My (white) ex mother in law (her mother); severely overweight since her 20s (problem after pregnancy), doesnt think she's attractive, but a happier, more positive more feminine woman you couldnt find; and that makes her attractive.

Now, the only question is whether I prefer ketchup or BBQ sauce....

E

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RE: The shape of the body - 1/8/2007 11:04:49 PM

redpetals

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that is a tough one..my advice..go with mayo..

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RE: The shape of the body - 1/8/2007 11:20:29 PM

UtopianRanger

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quote:

Why does it seem more acceptable in the african american community for a woman to be a bbw/plus size? It seems to me that she is considered more beautiful and desirable than a caucasin woman who is bbw/plus size. Is there any truth or reasoning behind what I'm thinking and seeing? Yes, you could say that I wish bbw/plus size was more accepting in the caucasin community.

I think your on the money here.....and Emerald is probably right, too. I also know that from being friends with and listening to some of the lyrics in the songs from some of the brothers, many like big girls.

Didn't ''Mix-a-lot'' put out one called '' Baby Got Back ''

- R

< Message edited by UtopianRanger -- 1/9/2007 12:08:52 AM >

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Post #: 7

RE: The shape of the body - 1/8/2007 11:52:27 PM

redpetals

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whoa ..
fat girls are easier to manipulate?
pah leeez
I can not believe you said that ,and it seems you said it also as a put down.
Not a bad thing when your lifes calling is to be a GOOD SUBMISSIVE....
LOL LOL
There should be "fat awareness " groups.
But since there isnt I am going to volunteer.
No body in my entire life has EVER called me easy to manipulate.
Please stop making blanket statements like this.
It serves no purpose really.

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RE: The shape of the body - 1/9/2007 12:01:14 AM

FelinePersuasion

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where did someone say fat women are easy to manipulate. I missed it.

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RE: The shape of the body - 1/9/2007 12:05:32 AM

CalliopePurple

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I don't think the OP meant manipulation in the "played like a puppet" sense. I think s/he meant there's more to play with in a scene. But maybe that's just my optimism speaking.

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RE: The shape of the body - 1/9/2007 12:11:01 AM

UtopianRanger

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quote:

ORIGINAL: redpetals

whoa ..
fat girls are easier to manipulate?
pah leeez
I can not believe you said that ,and it seems you said it also as a put down.
Not a bad thing when your lifes calling is to be a GOOD SUBMISSIVE....
LOL LOL
There should be "fat awareness " groups.
But since there isnt I am going to volunteer.
No body in my entire life has EVER called me easy to manipulate.
Please stop making blanket statements like this.
It serves no purpose really.

That was the last part of the quote that hung-on but I didn't agree with - My mistake. But I do agree with the other part

- R

_____________________________

"If you are going to win any battle, you have to do one thing. You have to make the mind run the body. Never let the body tell the mind what to do... the body is never tired if the mind is not tired."

-General George S. Patton

(in reply to redpetals)

Post #: 11

RE: The shape of the body - 1/9/2007 2:08:50 AM

eyesopened

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Perhaps African Americans spent a couple of centuries with more pressing social problems than body image?

It may be cultural. i live in the south where a great many (white) men prefer a larger woman and i've lived in southern california where a great many men of any race would be embarassed to be seen with a female not up to the barbie-doll standard.

i've been skinny (98lbs) and i've been fat (140lbs) and i've noticed more complimentary looks when i had more curves than angles.

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RE: The shape of the body - 1/9/2007 3:32:36 AM

SlaveAkasha

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Joined: 9/30/2006
From: Indiana
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quote:

But you don't see many bulemic bbw's do you?
Or am I uneducated on this?

It's not really true that most bulimics are thin. It's pretty easy to be bbw and also bulimic. With me, I have been for years now and that's one reason I can't seem to lose weight very easily anymore. When you binge/purge in the beginning..you lose a lot of weight very fast (that part was great), but when you try to stop..it comes back just as fast and probably more-so. Now, even though I am bulimic, I don't lose weight from it at all and when I do try to lose weight in a healthy way..it takes way longer. No one would ever guess by looking at me all the damage I have done to myself with it, nor the hurt it has caused. They just see a person that eats too much and they think all I have to do is eat less and it will come off.

I am doing that now.. eating better, but I have to workout tons and not put too much in my body at all for me to lose just a couple of pounds. Granted it will be worth it because of health, but it's sure a damn long road to get there.

I really haven't had trouble finding men for myself over the past years. I found that when I thought a lot of myself, so did they. When I put myself down a lot, they could sense I wasn't a happy person and I didn't attract them the same way.

My Master loves me for who I am, he never mentions the weight..even when I do, he tells me he loves me and if I want to lose it for me, he will support me 100%.

I don't personally think it's that black men prefer bigger women, they just don't mind when there are nice curves in place. On the other hand, most men of any race I know.. don't mind if there are some curves to play with either..both in the vanilla world, and this one.

Just cause it's on a runway, doesn't mean that society finds it attractive.. it just means they can't teach a hanger to walk.

His Kasha

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Post #: 13

RE: The shape of the body - 1/9/2007 4:50:03 AM

FangsNfeet

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I'd take Lane Bryant over Victoria Secret any day of the week. After all, the more the cushin, the better the pushin.

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RE: The shape of the body - 1/9/2007 5:04:03 AM

Lashra

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Different areas of the world have their own "standard" for what is considered beautiful. That standard gets handed down from generation to generation. I am white and I prefer to date people that have meat on their bones and are tall thats my personal preference. My Father was tall and had a few extra pounds so perhaps my model for what is attractive in a man was set by him?

I've often heard that men are attracted to women who in some way remind them of their Mothers. Now I do not know how true that is, but I do know that two of the men I was in long term relationships with had Mothers that were a bit heavier and had red hair. So...there might be a bit of truth to it, in some cases.

~Lashra

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RE: The shape of the body - 1/9/2007 5:29:39 AM

Chakota

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If one is going to make the assumption a size 14 and up is a BBW, (God I hate titles) then its only logical to assume a 10/12 offers lesser allure. Nonsense, the mystical magical sensual appeal emitting from a woman irrespective of color is as individualized as is her personality itself.

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RE: The shape of the body - 1/9/2007 5:40:53 AM

mymasterssub69

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i'm a black bbw and to answer your queries (from my own pov and i apologize ahead of time if i personally offend anyone).

being a black bbw woman isn't generally accepted within the African-American community. if you look at the current rap/hip hop videos, you would't see someone with my 5*DD/30-32 size in them. Nope - they are slinky, shapely young African women wearing hoochie clothes. clothes i might say that show practically everything skin-wise and which i could never wear due to my size.

yet i find it i'm generally sought after and accepted by white men (vanillas and in this lifestyle) because they love to have a black bbw like me. why - i usually ask them. they respond - we know what we want, they love the extra cushion to hold and feel, we have sexy curves, very confident on how we look and feel, etc. i'm not saying African-American males don't find us sexy either ...there is a small percentage who do however they also want that beautiful slim fly girl they've seen on the latest Jay-Z video or a white/bi-racial supermodel type.

there was a time during the Victorian era where being bbw was acceptable in society. the bigger a woman's breasts, the larger the men would offer dowries to marry his bride. yet when the Gibson Girl look became fashionable being bbw was out of style. if you look at the fashions from the 30s, 40s, and 50s - mostly hourglass and slim. there were very few "fat girl" shops to clothe any bbw. Hollywood and fashion magazines constantly dictate to women what is hot and what is not. I applaud Dove for starting their Real Women campaign to sell their products.

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RE: The shape of the body - 1/9/2007 6:27:21 AM

BlkTallFullfig

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You haven't seen the 2 live crew videos have you? LMAO.
I'm not praising 2live crew, I'm just saying...

To the OP: As for the cultural differences:   I would say African Americans often have so many more pressing issues, that we generally don't become ubber superficial, skinny obssessed until we're done with most of that...   Than there are those with all the issues, and body image problems, which sucks twice as much as their white counterparts in my opinion.
I won't completely disagree with your stereotypes, but don't want to support or add to them either.

quote:

LuckyAlbatross
Quite honestly IMO it's because most people come into the scene these days from online, and most of the people who spend a lot of time online are the ones who aren't terribly popular, who are not the most physically desireable, or who find they fit in in the "mainstream"- they aren't busy in the offline world. So they are online a lot. So they find out about bdsm and can study up on it a lot.

I disagree. There is no shortage of groups for big people out there... And when I've gone clubbing, I don't think I've ever seen a woman too big to get sex at the end of the night if she wanted that, but that has only been my observation.
I agree that online afforded me the opportunity to name what it is that I am, and why I need an alternative type of relationship, but make no mistake about it, I've never lacked for people to do/be with before this if that were all I wanted/needed. M

< Message edited by BlkTallFullfig -- 1/9/2007 6:36:23 AM >

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RE: The shape of the body - 1/9/2007 6:43:21 AM

justheather

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Chakota

If one is going to make the assumption a size 14 and up is a BBW

Not meaning to split hairs here, but I know some very lean size 14 bombshells who are most definitely not BBW's.
I think it has more to do with proportion and BMI than it does what size you wear.

To the OP:

quote:

Why is a bbw/plus size so more acceptable in the lifestyle than in the vanilla, be it any ethnic group? Is it because bbw/plus size is easier to "manipulate"?

Im not so sure it's about anything being "more acceptable" so much as it might be that many people who engage in D/s are seeking something in a partner that is more than skin deep.
I know that the dom in my life, while he appreciates outer beauty, attends to the aesthetic of a woman's submission far more earnestly than he does the size of her thighs when he is considering someone for a potential power-exchange relationship.
Im not saying "All D/s'ers are Deeper than All Vanilla People" but I am saying that what is required from a submissive (or a dom, for that matter) has to do with matters of the heart and mind far more than it has to do with size or shape, and people who are looking for that magical connection probably place the physical characteristics a little further down on the list of priorities.
As for myself, physical attraction is highly dependent on emotional, psychological and spiritual compatibility. People get more or less attractive (physically) in my eyes as I get to know them, based on who they are on the inside. I think that is a common phenomenon, not just some wacky thing that happens to me.

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And the table perfectly level
When you cut me out of my life
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Post #: 19

RE: The shape of the body - 1/9/2007 7:08:57 AM

LuckyAlbatross

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quote:

I disagree. There is no shortage of groups for big people out there... And when I've gone clubbing, I don't think I've ever seen a woman too big to get sex at the end of the night if she wanted that, but that has only been my observation.
I agree that online afforded me the opportunity to name what it is that I am, and why I need an alternative type of relationship, but make no mistake about it, I've never lacked for people to do/be with before this if that were all I wanted/needed. M

Oh I agree- even at 205 pounds, and completely insecure and getting sex for all the wrong reasons, I could get it pretty much whenever I wanted. I was answering the question as to why there seem to be a higher percentage of fat people in the scene versus percentage vanilla and why it seems to be so much more accepted.

I wish more people in this post would discuss the questions- why do certain cultures seem to have different body preferences? and why do fat people seem to be more accepted in bdsm? rather than just rehashing the obvious "We're all beautiful! It's all about the inside!"

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Post #: 20

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