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RE: NFL Sob (or Brag) Thread - 3/10/2009 5:37:30 AM   
Rainfire


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And if I'm fair, I have to admit the same thing would happen to BSU probably as well, Kana. The thing is, sometimes, these smaller conference teams do have something that they might be able to hold their own against the giants. They might not win but they could. Weirder things have happened in sports. No one ever expected BSU to hold it's own against OK a couple of years ago in the Fiesta Bowl yet they went on to win. Everyone, including the local Idaho papers, while wishing the team best of luck, had the expectation we would lose. It shocked the world when the Broncos beat the Sooners.

The thing is, as long as the BCS refuses to let the teams try, well, we'll never know what might have happened.


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RE: NFL Sob (or Brag) Thread - 3/10/2009 6:11:24 AM   
KatyLied


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I can't see how the smaller college teams can compete with the big teams, mainly from a standpoint of recruitment.  There is no way they can field an equally competitive team, but I agree the BCS system needs some sort of over-haul.

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RE: NFL Sob (or Brag) Thread - 3/10/2009 8:56:06 AM   
cjan


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I prefer the college game because, imho, it is, generally,  played with more passion , team work and a sense of FUN. I also agree with what Rain suggested by saying that often a smaller school, less regarded team, beats a national power house because they have more heart, want it more, and may even be better coached. Although it does happen in the pros occasionally, the "on any given Sunday" experiencet is , imo, much more rare.

I also agree that the BCS system is not fair, nor was the previous system which it replaced. Because of the nature of football, a tournament , of course, wouldn't work. And the play-off system used by the pros , including wild card teams, seems to be impractical since the season for student athletes would be prolonged. On second thought...fuck school...let them play !


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RE: NFL Sob (or Brag) Thread - 3/10/2009 9:41:41 AM   
ThatDamnedPanda


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quote:

ORIGINAL: cjan

I prefer the college game because, imho, it is, generally,  played with more passion , team work and a sense of FUN. I also agree with what Rain suggested by saying that often a smaller school, less regarded team, beats a national power house because they have more heart, want it more, and may even be better coached. Although it does happen in the pros occasionally, the "on any given Sunday" experiencet is , imo, much more rare.

I also agree that the BCS system is not fair, nor was the previous system which it replaced. Because of the nature of football, a tournament , of course, wouldn't work. And the play-off system used by the pros , including wild card teams, seems to be impractical since the season for student athletes would be prolonged. On second thought...fuck school...let them play !



I'm not that much of a football fan at all anymore, but speaking as someone who used to love the pre-BCS bowl games, the current system is a travesty. In order to squeeze a few more bucks out of the arrangement, they've ruined a lot of the game. I used to absolutely love watching bowl games all day on New year's, because any one of 2 or 3 or sometimes (if we were really lucky) even 4 games had the potential to be the national championship game - and you never knew which one it was going to be until the day was over and you tallied up who won, who lost, and how big. And more importantly, neither did the players, so they played their absolute hearts out on every play. Sure, sometimes you wound up with a split championship, but I never saw that as a bad thing, because it meant that there were two teams who'd played at a such a superlative level it was impossible to agree which one was more spectacular than the other that year.

I also liked the rivalries that stemmed from the automatic bids - for example, every year, it was going to be Michigan, Ohio State, or Wisconsin in the Rose Bowl against the Trojans or the Huskies (often with the national championship on the line), and no matter who was playing who, someone had a score to settle from the last time they met. Every year, it was Nebraska or Oklahoma in the Orange Bowl against Miami, Florida, or Florida State, always with a score to settle and often with a championship at stake. Every year, you knew you were going to see a game. Now, the BCS championship game rotates between the 4 major bowls, so the continuity of the rivalries is disrupted, and 3 years out of 4, the game is meaningless in terms of the championship.

Now, you've got a system where only two teams go into the bowl season with a chance to win the crown, and they don't even play until the week after New Year's Day - and even then, on a Monday night, so the networks can squeeze more advertising dollars out of it. For the casual fan like me, New Year's Day is just a bunch of games that don't mean anything to anyone without a personal connection to the schools. 30 years ago I never would have believed it was possible, but they've actually found a way to make college football boring.


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RE: NFL Sob (or Brag) Thread - 3/10/2009 10:07:12 AM   
cjan


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Good points, Panda. I agree that under the old system it was more exciting and there was more incentive for college teams to play their hearts out. I also agree that it was more fun, and more just, to have controversy after the Bowl games as to who was #1 and the rivalries that engendered added more fuel and fun to the fire.

To me, the more the focus has become money and revenues, the more fun is sapped from both college and pro sports.


< Message edited by cjan -- 3/10/2009 10:08:21 AM >


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RE: NFL Sob (or Brag) Thread - 3/10/2009 5:23:02 PM   
happypervert


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quote:

ORIGINAL: ThatDamnedPanda

I'm not that much of a football fan at all anymore, but speaking as someone who used to love the pre-BCS bowl games, the current system is a travesty. In order to squeeze a few more bucks out of the arrangement, they've ruined a lot of the game. I used to absolutely love watching bowl games all day on New year's, because any one of 2 or 3 or sometimes (if we were really lucky) even 4 games had the potential to be the national championship game - and you never knew which one it was going to be until the day was over and you tallied up who won, who lost, and how big. And more importantly, neither did the players, so they played their absolute hearts out on every play. Sure, sometimes you wound up with a split championship, but I never saw that as a bad thing, because it meant that there were two teams who'd played at a such a superlative level it was impossible to agree which one was more spectacular than the other that year.


WOW! This is a strange argument, but when you're knocking college football based on nothing but the bowl games then it's obvious you never paid much attention to it anyway.

It's especially amusing to see your claim that 3 or 4 bowl games could be for the national championship when in fact that was only if the number 1 team lost -- then the fortunes would determined by something as mystical as a poll. So really, there was only 1 game for the championship, and if the #1 team lost the other teams were playing merely to impress voters -- that is hardly playing for championship.

For all the griping about the current system, it is a vast improvement over the past system where a "champion" was elected. Only on rare occasions would the #1 and #2 teams meet in a bowl game to to determine who was better, and one of those games (Penn State vs Miami in the '87 Fiesta Bowl) still holds the record for the highest ratings for a college football game. Now, maybe casual observers such as yourself would have preferred to see Penn State play their heart out against another opponent while hoping Miami would lose their bowl game, but apparently a lot of folks enjoyed watching them play their hearts out against Miami . . . and win.

Anyway, you can complain about the system all you want, but it looks like your opinion hardly matters when revenues are up while you're not even watching. I'm sure the powers that be who run the BCS can live with that.


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RE: NFL Sob (or Brag) Thread - 3/13/2009 9:24:21 PM   
cloudboy


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How are you feeling about Rex Ryan taking over the head coaching job of the JETS?

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RE: NFL Sob (or Brag) Thread - 3/14/2009 6:11:56 AM   
KatyLied


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I would be interesting in hearing from fans of all teams with head coaching changes.  In particular I'm interested in hearing from Browns and Broncos fans (especially with the Jay Cutler drama situation).

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RE: NFL Sob (or Brag) Thread - 3/14/2009 10:16:52 AM   
slvemike4u


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On the Rex Ryan thing....holding my breath.Till some evidence manifests itself it is still "the same old jets"...and that ain't a good thing.

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RE: NFL Sob (or Brag) Thread - 3/14/2009 11:17:12 AM   
KatyLied


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Jay Cutler has put his primary home in Denver on the market.

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RE: NFL Sob (or Brag) Thread - 3/15/2009 4:19:30 AM   
cloudboy


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As a Ravens fan, the Cutler and Matt Cassell stories are just shocking. A franchise QB is very difficult to find and getting one in the NFL draft is a crap shoot.

KC took a great leap forward for a paltry #2 pick to acquire Cassell, and DEN has become unmoored since casting out Shanahan.

Its possible to be good without a great QB: PITT (Kordell Stewart, Neil O'Donnell), BAL (Dilfer), and TB (Brad Johnson) --- but the money teams year in and year out have the QB position locked down (Pitt-Roethelsberger, IND -- Manning, NE -- Brady.)

Neither TB or BAL repeated as SB champions, and PITT went without a SB between Bradshaw and Big Ben.


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RE: NFL Sob (or Brag) Thread - 3/15/2009 6:10:20 AM   
KatyLied


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Cloudboy - It's better for a team to accept a lower draft pick in a trade.  Teams are hating to pay such high contracts to unproven rookies, so it probably wasn't bad for the Pats to take that deal.  Plus, it was Beilichick working with his friends. 

But I can't solve the problem of Denver considering to rid itself of Cutler.  He is stung about it and I wonder what the situation will do to that team this season.  I view him as a franchise QB and think they were out of their minds to consider trading him for Cassel (Cassel, qb'ing a team that had enjoyed easiest schedule last season, sort of making him a bit unproven)

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RE: NFL Sob (or Brag) Thread - 3/15/2009 6:47:45 AM   
maybemaybenot


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According to CBS4 in Florida, Cleveland Browns WR Donte Stallworth is being detained by police for questioning after accidentally running into a pedestrian with his car Saturday morning on the eastbound MacCarthur Causeway on Miami Beach.

http://www.dawgsbynature.com/2009/3/14/797176/breaking-donte-stallworth

Very sad all around.. I cannot imagine causing somone's death, even if it was accidently.

                                    mbmbn

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RE: NFL Sob (or Brag) Thread - 3/15/2009 6:49:59 AM   
KatyLied


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I saw that, it's sad.

to mbmbn - glad to see you checking in.


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RE: NFL Sob (or Brag) Thread - 3/15/2009 8:00:09 AM   
cloudboy


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Even with the high draft pick argument to justify the "low trade value" of Cassell, its just hard for me to believe that another team like SF didn't offer two #2 picks or a #2 and a #3. (You get the idea.)

I don't get the Cutler situation, you'd think Leinhardt and Young, the other QBs of his class might be on the trading block. Shanahan obviously knew what he was doing when he traded up to get him. Shanahan also did a good job of drafting WRs (Brandon Marshall and Eddie Royal) both selected outside RD 1 of the draft. Finding good QBs and WRs is difficult --- its much easier to identify OL and DL talent and to find LBs and other positions as well.


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RE: NFL Sob (or Brag) Thread - 3/15/2009 8:19:13 AM   
KatyLied


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quote:

I don't get the Cutler situation, you'd think Leinhardt and Young, the other QBs of his class might be on the trading block.


I would like to see Leinart starting somewhere, anywhere, he seems to be languishing at this point.  I think it's over for Young, I'm not convinced he ever had the smarts for the job.  Was it ever determined that he could actually read defenses?


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RE: NFL Sob (or Brag) Thread - 3/15/2009 8:47:15 AM   
Lordandmaster


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But the champion is STILL elected--only now it's by a bizarre consortium of pollsters and computers.   I don't consider that progress, and I do take Panda's point that in the past, more bowl games had the potential to affect that final voting.  Anyway, in today's system, the team that wins the so-called national championship game is automatically crowned national champion in one of the polls, but not in the other.  That's why we still get split championships.

I've never seen any reason why the top division of college football is the only collegiate sport without a playoff or championship tournament.  (Other than money, of course.)

As for Denver and the Cutler situation...I think the two quarterbacks are very close; neither one is a game-changer.  Cassel led the league in sacks last year--that's never a stat to be proud of--and proved only that he's a reliable NFL quarterback, not that he's capable of saving a franchise.  Cutler is also a good-but-not-great quarterback and I don't see that he has made serious improvements in his first three years in the league.  The truly great quarterbacks take major steps forward by their third year.  But even if he's not the next Joe Montana, with the right surrounding cast, he's certainly good enough to win a Super Bowl with: reliable completion percentage, healthy yards-per-attempt, and interceptions are under basically control (though last year's 18 was a bit of a high figure for the passing systems of today).  And that's why I think they were crazy to antagonize him.

Experimenting with bold typeface this morning a la tabloid journalism...

quote:

ORIGINAL: happypervert

For all the griping about the current system, it is a vast improvement over the past system where a "champion" was elected.

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RE: NFL Sob (or Brag) Thread - 3/16/2009 5:06:02 AM   
KatyLied


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Jay Cutler has demanded a trade!

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RE: NFL Sob (or Brag) Thread - 3/16/2009 6:04:36 PM   
TheUtopian


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quote:

ORIGINAL: KatyLied

I would be interesting in hearing from fans of all teams with head coaching changes.  In particular I'm interested in hearing from Browns and Broncos fans (especially with the Jay Cutler drama situation).


I'm happy the great Samurai has stepped up to the helm to bring some vision, cohesiveness and a lot more smash-mouth type football back into the Niners fold.

At the same time, I'm a little disappointed with his most recent selection of Jimmy Raye for offensive coordinator. But for now, I will trust him with that selection and see what happens within the draft and these mini camps.

I like the fact that we hardly used any of our cap space to resign a couple of key veteran free agents and picked up a receiver with some separation speed. We also relied on Daniel Snyder's super impulsive bahavior to land an underated defensive end who is beginning to come into his own.

I was also impressed with our patience regarding Alex Smith and the reworking of his contract. Smith was mishandled from the beginning by Nolan.....and I'm eager to see this kid get a fresh start. The measurables are there....the mind just needs to reorganize itself.

With the tenth pick, I'm holding out for Everette Brown or Orakpo - But something tells me we're going to select Oher or Smith with our first selection. With our second pick, I'd like to see us select Delmas or Larry English.....and then I hope we pick up another back in the third round.






- R


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RE: NFL Sob (or Brag) Thread - 3/16/2009 6:06:52 PM   
Lordandmaster


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The Jets would love him.
 
I'm really getting off on this bold stuff.

quote:

ORIGINAL: KatyLied

Jay Cutler has demanded a trade!

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