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Observations about female subs.... - 10/2/2006 11:07:01 PM

MissJennifer001

Posts: 39
Joined: 6/23/2006
Status: offline

Hosting play parties has lead me to meet a lot of lifestyler's here in NYC. Most of whom have become framily (for those of you who don't get it..FRiends who have become fAMILY), some of which have become business and venture partners and of course there are some I can do without all together. Hosting these parties has educated me about the scene and the people in it quite a bit.

One of the things I've observed and watched carefully is the behavior of female submissives. I would like to state clearly, before I go any further, that I'm only discussing my own experiences and am in no way lumping all female subs together. So here goes... Many of the fem subs I've met seem to be in the scene only for attention. Any kind of attention, wether it be good or bad. I've known several fem subs who have been in abusive relationships and feel that it is part of the BDSM lifestyle. I've met so many of these women that I've become very weary of playing with fem subs (even casually).

I guess the real point of my post is actually a question: Have other Dommes/Doms encountered such women? If so, have you seen more of them than actual submissives (I don't accept anyone, male or female, as a submissive if they are obviously acting the part just to feel loved or accepted)? Have you seen this type of behavior in male subs? I'm very curious to hear other's thoughts on the subject.

Post #: 1

RE: Observations about female subs.... - 10/2/2006 11:11:34 PM

NakedOnMyChain

Posts: 2431
Joined: 11/29/2004
From: Indiana
Status: offline

To answer all of your questions: Yes. I have a word for them, "attention whores". I think it applies quite well to this scenario.

I have, however, been fortunate enough to meet many wonderful submissive women as well. I've just found the number of attention whores to be a bit larger. And then again, we all have a bit of attention whore in us somewhere.

_____________________________

"Oh, it's torture, but I'm almost there."
~The Cure

"I ask for so little. Just fear me, love me, do as I say, and I will be your slave."
~The Labyrinth

(in reply to MissJennifer001)

Post #: 2

RE: Observations about female subs.... - 10/2/2006 11:30:23 PM

MissJennifer001

Posts: 39
Joined: 6/23/2006
Status: offline

Thanks for the reply Naked! I too have met many great fem subs in my time, they just seem to be few and far between. Glad to know I'm not imagining it, though. And by the way, rock on with the Labyrinth quote!!

(in reply to NakedOnMyChain)

Post #: 3

RE: Observations about female subs.... - 10/3/2006 1:57:41 AM

EvilGeoff

Posts: 523
Joined: 8/24/2005
Status: offline

Another term... "drama queen".

They are not limited to this lifestyle, they are everywhere. And nor are attention whores or drama queens limited to the female submissive side of the equation. There are male subs, Dommes, Doms, and switches that fit the bill nicely too.

Of course, I'm an exhibitionist, so what do I know?

Look at me! Look at me! Look at me!
*LMBFHAO*

YIK,
- Geoff

(in reply to MissJennifer001)

Post #: 4

RE: Observations about female subs.... - 10/3/2006 2:41:37 AM

Mavis

Posts: 828
Joined: 2/8/2004
Status: offline

well, i can think of any number of ways maligning an entire group of people on this site might be construed as attention seeking and creating drama... but i'll wait to see how many subs meet me in the tent to assemble our spears...

(in reply to EvilGeoff)

Post #: 5

RE: Observations about female subs.... - 10/3/2006 2:55:08 AM

MasterKalif

Posts: 648
Joined: 5/24/2004
Status: offline

yes, true some do it just for the attention....one of them even online I could tell....whenever I would stop talking to her (she was obsesive), she would haunt me down to know what was going on, or seeking some attention from me....
Luckily Ive met other wonderful submissives and one in particular, hence I can safely say that not all are like that.

(in reply to Mavis)

Post #: 6

RE: Observations about female subs.... - 10/3/2006 3:52:56 AM

DivaDuchess

Posts: 402
Joined: 8/17/2006
Status: offline

I don't go for subs, We work with slaves. However, they are much the same in many cases. I ran across, about 10 years ago, a slave that approached me for training. After about a week ... her uniform changed. On the front of the white shirt is usually the word ... 'slave' or 'owned' ... hers read 'attention whore'. So I did find that one very cool as I call them that myself.

It worked. She actually had people approach her at malls and such and ask her about her shirt. When she was faced with strangers, not in the lifestyle, asking her to explain the statement ... she was forced to see herself as others see her. It took some time, but she turned out very well. Her current Mistress loves her to pieces.

In any case, it depends on the Dom/Domme's desire to reach a person. There are always reasons why a sub/slave or anyone acts the way they do. The key is to find out if you as the Dom/Domme are willing to help that person change if the action is not a positive one.

_____________________________

Duchess

Courage is not the absence of Fear,
But rather the judgement that,
Something else is more important than Fear.

The Brave may not live forever,
But the Cautious do not live at all.

(in reply to MasterKalif)

Post #: 7

RE: Observations about female subs.... - 10/3/2006 3:53:13 AM

SirLordTrainer

Posts: 820
Joined: 5/6/2004
From: Indy
Status: offline

Of the submissive (and slave) women Ive encountered over the years Ive been pretty fortunate in meeting the ones who are more in tune with themselves and the lifestyle, although Ive seen My share of the 'attention getters' usually at munches. I just detach and ignore them, both.

_____________________________

Accepting one's own imperfections eliminates a roadblock to progress.

(in reply to MissJennifer001)

Post #: 8

RE: Observations about female subs.... - 10/3/2006 4:09:45 AM

Gem

Posts: 100
Joined: 2/11/2004
Status: offline

Brightest Blessings

Many in the NYC area in the scene are just Tops and Bottoms. It is all about the play and very rarely about the service. That is all very cool, except when you hear the word submissive you expect certain behavior. Also I have found that brat subs are found to be extremely popular and sought after in the NYC area, which explains the attention whore thing.

Again this is just my observation from years of spending time in the NY community.

Blessed Be
Gem

(in reply to MissJennifer001)

Post #: 9

RE: Observations about female subs.... - 10/3/2006 7:41:03 AM

MasterFireMaam

Posts: 5587
Joined: 3/1/2006
From: Charleston, WV
Status: offline

I'm encountered people like this of all sexes, genders and orientations. It doesn't have anything to do with females or submissives.

Master Fire

_____________________________

The power of who we are can be intoxicating. The power of who we could be is humbling.
-----
Ms Relationship Books
-----
BDSM How-To Books

(in reply to MissJennifer001)

Post #: 10

RE: Observations about female subs.... - 10/3/2006 8:33:31 AM

toservez

Posts: 1733
Joined: 9/7/2006
From: All over now in Minnesota
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterFireMaam

I'm encountered people like this of all sexes, genders and orientations. It doesn't have anything to do with females or submissives.

Master Fire

I echo this settiment. There are people in all walks of life both male and female that are either attention seekers or needing to feel like they belong and many times both.

You probably get a higher percentage of that with active public players but before judgement the question also is that it takes two to tango and what do the Doms and Dommes do with these people you encounter? Do they run away from them, use them or actually have a nice relationship with them? It still comes down to whatever works for the people involved.

The flip side is also very relevent. There are many Dommes and Doms in this life that are playing at it and not "truly" dominant as well. It is life being life.

(in reply to MasterFireMaam)

Post #: 11

RE: Observations about female subs.... - 10/3/2006 8:39:16 AM

LotusSong

Posts: 6334
Joined: 7/2/2006
From: Domme Emeritus
Status: offline

This is what happens on the last stop of "relationship row".

(in reply to MissJennifer001)

Post #: 12

RE: Observations about female subs.... - 10/3/2006 8:45:38 AM

juliaoceania

Posts: 21383
Joined: 4/19/2006
From: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
Status: offline

I do not think that femsubs are alone in creating drama or seeking attention, someone has to feed them or they would not stay in the lifestyle so to speak...

In my experience people love drama, and seek attention. People have been abused, people in general show these traits

I have not been a part of knowing many other subs who are involved with play parties and going to lifestyle events. I would not mind doing these things one day, but my experience with people in groups is that drama follows... and I am usually blessed that I am out of the loop of the drama because it is on a need to know basis, and I do not need to know...This is why I am usually not a joiner, but an observer of such things....

_____________________________

Once you label me, you negate me ~ Soren Kierkegaard

Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

(in reply to MissJennifer001)

Post #: 13

RE: Observations about female subs.... - 10/3/2006 8:46:00 AM

Bleedingpretty

Posts: 1
Joined: 9/21/2006
Status: offline

Hmmm. i don't know. Define the word 'attention whore'. i consider my self one. i crave attention from whoever i happen to be with. i yearn for His touch. my behavior reflects this. i obey not only because i know it makes Him happy, but because when He is happy He will reward me in some form or another. Do i expect these things? Never. It is just the natural ways of things. i will not scream at the top of my lungs in a crowded room because i need all eyes focused on me. i only crave one Persons affection..so..hmph...i hope this brings some insight on things.

(in reply to LotusSong)

Post #: 14

RE: Observations about female subs.... - 10/3/2006 9:11:56 AM

WhipTheHip

Posts: 1004
Joined: 7/31/2006
Status: offline

I love attention whores. I don't see anything wrong with craving attention
and affection. Without attention whores, there would be little interesting
to watch on television or see at the movies.   No doubt Maralyn Monroe
was an attention whore. I wonder who here would have called Maralyn
Monroe an "attention whore" to her face.   Johnathan Winters, William
Shatner, Robin Williams, Jim Carey are all attention whores.

"Pain slut" "Attention whore"   These are just epithets, pejoratives, and
derogatory terms to describe different kinds of people with needs different
than your own.   I find the bdsm community to be full of (crack) pots calling
kettles black.

I once hired a crack-addicted hooker to whip me, and found it funny that
she called me a pervert. Many of the comments I hear from people in the
bdsm community remind me of her. She saw no irony in her comment,
and neither do the apparently perfect people in the bdsm community who
are in such a great position to judge the character flaws of others. I guess
it would be too much to ask people living in glass houses not to throw stones.

I am very accepting of people with all kinds of personalities. Females
who love attention light up and cheer up whatever room they are in. My
mother was such a woman.

People who are bi-polar, or hypo-manic tend to be attention whores. They
have very high highs, and very low lows. I love them for that, for having a
broader range of emotion than the average person, and it is a pleasure
for me to accomodate the extra needs they have. The truth is I find
exhibitionist, attention whores much more attractive, erotic, and sexual
than non-attention whores.

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder.

This judgMENTALISM is just another version of "my religion is better
than your religion, and my kink is better than your kink, and there is
nothing wrong with me, I am normal, perfectly sane, and "okay," and
you are not, and I am in the perfect position to judge you and others,
because I am God, you're not.

People in the bdsm community riding around on high horses are
like clowns prancing around dressed in tuxedos.

< Message edited by WhipTheHip -- 10/3/2006 9:27:13 AM >

_____________________________

(in reply to Bleedingpretty)

Post #: 15

RE: Observations about female subs.... - 10/3/2006 9:35:03 AM

WhipTheHip

Posts: 1004
Joined: 7/31/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: SirLordTrainer
Of the submissive (and slave) women Ive encountered over the years Ive been pretty fortunate
in meeting the ones who are more in tune with themselves and the lifestyle, although Ive seen
My share of the 'attention getters' usually at munches. I just detach and ignore them, both.

What a crock of bullcrap. Just because sub is more bottom than
submissve does not they are not in tune with themselves. Just because
a sub is not for you, does not mean she is not for me. You are not the
Pope of Rope, and you don't get to define who is more tune with
"the lifestyle." I am just as much into bdsm as you are. I have my
tastes and you have yours. There is no need for you denigrate my
tastes. If you don't denigrate my tastes, I won't denigrate yours. This
is one reason why the majority of people into bdsm don't participate
in community activity, because so many people in the community
spend so much time judging others, and putting others down for being
different. Different whips and lashes for different folks. Different
strokes for different folks. JFC!!!

< Message edited by WhipTheHip -- 10/3/2006 9:37:05 AM >

_____________________________

(in reply to SirLordTrainer)

Post #: 16

RE: Observations about female subs.... - 10/3/2006 9:40:46 AM

Celeste43

Posts: 3066
Joined: 2/4/2006
From: NYS
Status: offline

So because I have insecurities and need him to keep loving me, I'm not a real submissive only a drama queen and an attention whore? Learn something new every day. Guess that means I can stop doing his laundry and cooking his dinner.

(in reply to WhipTheHip)

Post #: 17

RE: Observations about female subs.... - 10/3/2006 9:58:07 AM

RedSavageSlave

Posts: 733
Joined: 9/12/2006
Status: offline

I am not exactly sure what being an attention whore has to do with whether or not someone is submissive. I am a self proclaimed "Attention Whore Extraordinaire" and will try to get attention where ever I can get it.. but that has nothing to do with whether or not I am obedient. Whether or not I submit. Whether or not I follow the expectations and instructions of my owner. It happens to be a personality quirk. Being an attention whore is NOT being a brat or a drama queen. These are three different distinctions.

Now if it interferes with a doms ability to get someone to submit, then that just means that perhaps there is a compatibility issue going on. Or that the dominant has not gotten that submissive to the point where their submission is immediate. If you want to blame someone's personality for that lack.. go right ahead.. but it just shows me that perhaps the understanding of where submission actually comes from and what it really is..is a bit lacking.

_____________________________

My give a damn's busted.

So many thoughts, so few of them rational

(in reply to Celeste43)

Post #: 18

RE: Observations about female subs.... - 10/3/2006 10:04:24 AM

marieToo

Posts: 3595
Joined: 5/21/2006
From: Jersey
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: WhipTheHip

quote:

ORIGINAL: SirLordTrainer
Of the submissive (and slave) women Ive encountered over the years Ive been pretty fortunate
in meeting the ones who are more in tune with themselves and the lifestyle, although Ive seen
My share of the 'attention getters' usually at munches. I just detach and ignore them, both.

What a crock of bullcrap. Just because sub is more bottom than
submissve does not they are not in tune with themselves. Just because
a sub is not for you, does not mean she is not for me. You are not the
Pope of Rope, and you don't get to define who is more tune with
"the lifestyle." I am just as much into bdsm as you are. I have my
tastes and you have yours. There is no need for you denigrate my
tastes. If you don't denigrate my tastes, I won't denigrate yours. This
is one reason why the majority of people into bdsm don't participate
in community activity, because so many people in the community
spend so much time judging others, and putting others down for being
different. Different whips and lashes for different folks. Different
strokes for different folks. JFC!!!

There is nothing wrong with someone speaking from their experience. In his experiences he has met women who he feels have been in tune with themselves as opposed to those who havent. Why such an emotional rant?

_____________________________

marie.

I give good agita.

(in reply to WhipTheHip)

Post #: 19

RE: Observations about female subs.... - 10/3/2006 10:24:56 AM

MissJennifer001

Posts: 39
Joined: 6/23/2006
Status: offline

Thanks for all the replies people! Let me clarify a couple of things from my original post: When I said that a lot of the fem subs I've encountered were in the lifestyle purely for attention I didn't mean the vain, look at me type. I'm talking about a much deeper kind of attention seeking. Not to be cliche, but I mean the "I need attention that my mommy and/or daddy didn't give me" attention. Of course everyone needs attention, but my specific thought here was about female subs/slaves/bottoms (whatever you want to call them, I hate all of these labels and terms associatated with the scene but play along for the sake of the ones who can't think outside the box). I more than realize that this is an issue in any lifestyle and with any gender. The type of people most of you have described are just what you said, attention whores. Those types I don't mind, it's their thing, it's what gets them off. The people I'm talking about are the ones who feel that being treated like a slave is the only way they can be loved. I could go on for a while about this, but I've got to go be productive in some way. Again, thanks for the replies and input! Blessed be, ya'll!

(in reply to Celeste43)

Post #: 20

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