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Kofi Goes to Iran - 9/3/2006 4:02:41 PM   
Level


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Status: offline 		Annan gets little satisfaction in Iran



By NASSER KARIMI, Associated Press Writer 11 minutes ago

The U.N. chief got little satisfaction Sunday at the close of his trip to Tehran, snubbed by Iran's leader over international demands to stop enriching uranium and ignored in warnings not to incite hatred by questioning the Holocaust.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060903/ap_on_re_mi_ea/iran_nuclear

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RE: Kofi Goes to Iran - 9/3/2006 4:04:37 PM   
Estring


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Status: offline 		Annan get no... satisfaction.

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RE: Kofi Goes to Iran - 9/3/2006 4:19:17 PM   
MmakeMme


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From: NC
Status: offline 		Drumning up oil business for his son, no doubt. ~taking a dim view of Mr. Annan~

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RE: Kofi Goes to Iran - 9/3/2006 10:00:04 PM   
CrappyDom


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From: Sacramento
Status: offline 		Iran now holds all the cards thanks to the incompetent bungling of GWB.  Bush overthrew our bulwark against Iran and tried to install Iran's double agent as President, lucky for us, that failed.  However, the current Shia leadership owes a huge debt to Iran for harboring many of them along with their relatives during Saddam's rein. 

In addition, our military is bogged down in Iraq, our equipment is wearing out, our troops are spread too thin, and the incompetence of the administration is making everything worse almost daily.

So all Iran has to fear is airstrikes and their bunkers are hardened against our best penetrator bombs.  In addition, Iran has the ability to cause great unrest in Iraq which would further tie us down and risk undoing whatever progress we have made.

In addition, Iran can shut down the oil coming out of the Straights of Hormuz which would surely cause oil to exceed $100 a barrel.

In short, they know we can talk shit, we can thump our chest, but we can't do anything other than strike futilely and they know it.

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RE: Kofi Goes to Iran - 9/3/2006 10:28:36 PM   
meatcleaver


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Status: offline 		I'm with CD. Iran holds all the cards, why should it play ball, would any other country?

As for the holocaust issue I think for Iran this is a baiting issue. It sees the west throwing insult after insult their way so they are throwing some back. Childish but since when has international politics not been childish?

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RE: Kofi Goes to Iran - 9/3/2006 10:32:35 PM   
CrappyDom


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Status: offline 		When dealing with adults, the one who can provoke the other to act crazy wins.  I think Iran is doing exactly that.  They want America to go over the top in accusations against Iran and for the rest of the world to look at us and go "they are going crazy again" and ignore us.

Funny how easy it is for smart people to manipulate idiots, but then again Iran has always gotten what it wanted from Republican presidents, from Raygun on down.

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RE: Kofi Goes to Iran - 9/4/2006 2:22:18 AM   
seeksfemslave


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Status: offline 		Edited CD said.....
quote:

ORIGINAL: CrappyDom
........ but then again Iran has always gotten what it wanted from Republican presidents, from Raygun on down.


Who was the Pres. and what did she do when Eyeraq invaded Eyeran ?
Only arskin?

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RE: Kofi Goes to Iran - 9/4/2006 3:56:43 AM   
MistressBebe1


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Status: offline 		Can someone explain to me why questioning the Holocaust is such a big deal that some countries made it illegal to deny it ever happened?  I mean, obviously it DID happen but why make such a big thing out of people who deny it?. Since when has it been illegal to be wrong.  

You can question any Holocaust that's happened in the history of mankind so long as its not the Jewish one.

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RE: Kofi Goes to Iran - 9/4/2006 4:22:09 AM   
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quote:

ORIGINAL: MistressBebe1

Can someone explain to me why questioning the Holocaust is such a big deal that some countries made it illegal to deny it ever happened?  I mean, obviously it DID happen but why make such a big thing out of people who deny it?. Since when has it been illegal to be wrong.  

You can question any Holocaust that's happened in the history of mankind so long as its not the Jewish one.



A lot of it has to do with the Holocaust being tied into WW II, which obviously was one of the watermark events of recent human history.
 
It shouldn't be illegal to be wrong, but if I ever make it to Grand Poopah of the Universe, it will be illegal to be stupid, which much of the denyers seem to excel at.

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RE: Kofi Goes to Iran - 9/4/2006 4:52:48 AM   
meatcleaver


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quote:

ORIGINAL: MistressBebe1

Can someone explain to me why questioning the Holocaust is such a big deal that some countries made it illegal to deny it ever happened?  I mean, obviously it DID happen but why make such a big thing out of people who deny it?. Since when has it been illegal to be wrong.  

You can question any Holocaust that's happened in the history of mankind so long as its not the Jewish one.



Germany was I believe the first country to make denial of the holocaust a crime because it was their history. One has to give credit to Germany for being one of the few countries that has fully and whole heartedly accepted its guilt. I can't think of any other country that doesn't rationalise its crimes.

< Message edited by meatcleaver -- 9/4/2006 4:53:32 AM >

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RE: Kofi Goes to Iran - 9/4/2006 4:56:36 AM   
philosophy


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Status: offline 		"I can't think of any other country that doesn't rationalise its crimes."

MC, think you may have forgotten the truth and reconciliation commission in South Africa.....but i agree with your substantive point..... 

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RE: Kofi Goes to Iran - 9/4/2006 6:05:01 AM   
seeksfemslave


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quote:

ORIGINAL: seeksfemslave

Edited CD said.....
quote:

ORIGINAL: CrappyDom
........ but then again Iran has always gotten what it wanted from Republican presidents, from Raygun on down.


Who was the Pres. and what did she do when Eyeraq invaded Eyeran ?
Only arskin?


Seems I will have to answer my own question then. At the start of the war I believe it was J Carter.....then believe it or not R Raygun. and do you know what he did....he offered major military support to...err the name just escapes me for a second ..should really know this because I believe he is on trial right at this moment.
Anybody know who it was ?

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RE: Kofi Goes to Iran - 9/4/2006 6:30:46 AM   
seeksfemslave


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Status: offline 		With regard to denial of the Holocaust being made criminal,  it does seem odd when one considers the fact that disgusting though it is, it is not a rare event.

Why I believe even the US had a go in the 19th century.

Maybe it points to the political clout of certain groups, I dont know. One thing I do know is that while the West in general and the US in particular holds the Arabs to disadvantage for the warcrimes of the Nazis, by their unwavering support for the Israel position in the Middle East, then stabilty in that region and hence the wider world is not likely.

No doubt if anyone rises to this they will believe that I support Israel's extermination. WHICH I DONT !

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RE: Kofi Goes to Iran - 9/4/2006 6:38:04 AM   
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quote:

ORIGINAL: seeksfemslave

quote:

ORIGINAL: seeksfemslave

Edited CD said.....
quote:

ORIGINAL: CrappyDom
........ but then again Iran has always gotten what it wanted from Republican presidents, from Raygun on down.


Who was the Pres. and what did she do when Eyeraq invaded Eyeran ?
Only arskin?


Seems I will have to answer my own question then. At the start of the war I believe it was J Carter.....then believe it or not R Raygun. and do you know what he did....he offered major military support to...err the name just escapes me for a second ..should really know this because I believe he is on trial right at this moment.
Anybody know who it was ?


Maybe it was the "she" that threw some off lol.
 
Let's see........ my cousin Earl is on trial.... won't wear a seatbelt...... no...... hmm...

_____________________________

Fake the heat and scratch the itch
Skinned up knees and salty lips
Let go it's harder holding on
One more trip and I'll be gone

~~ Stone Temple Pilots

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RE: Kofi Goes to Iran - 9/4/2006 8:06:00 AM   
CrappyDom


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Status: offline 		Raygun was president when the Iran war started and he armed both sides.  They had illegal and stupid arms deals with the Iranian "moderates", a myth the Republicans just can't shake.

Oddly enough those weapons for Iran were helped along their way by Israel...

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RE: Kofi Goes to Iran - 9/4/2006 10:40:38 AM   
WyrdRich


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quote:

ORIGINAL: CrappyDom

When dealing with adults, the one who can provoke the other to act crazy wins. 



     Unfortunately, this is all too accurate.  Mike Wallace was on the recieving end of it in his interview with the Iranian President a few weeks back.  Ahmadinijad (probably mis-spelled that) kept smiling and refusing to answer the Israel question and then accused Wallace of getting angry.  It's an infuriating mode of discourse that makes real verbal communication or negotiation impossible.

     A truly neutral observer will spot it very quickly.  When I was judging HS debates, it was a guaranteed loss UNLESS the party on the recieving end lost composure.  Then it would mean a low points score and a nasty comment on the critique sheet.

     Of course, choosing to turn off verbal communication in this way is a dangerous game.  There are other, more primal, means of communication if matters cannot be resolved with the civilized ones.  Especially when you are dealing with a redneck who is right.

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RE: Kofi Goes to Iran - 9/4/2006 11:39:28 AM   
NorthernGent


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Status: offline 		I think there is a slight misunderstanding here. The holocaust can be questioned in all countries - questioned in the sense of how many people actually died. So it is wrong to say it is illegal to question certain aspects of the holocaust.

Of course it is illegal to deny it happened in Germany, Austria and others but then what sort of person would go out of their way to claim the holocaust never happened and it is debatable whether or not the people who think like this should be afforded civil rights. If these types of people want civil rights then behave like adults not half-wits.

Regards 

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RE: Kofi Goes to Iran - 9/4/2006 11:45:59 AM   
WyrdRich


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quote:

ORIGINAL: NorthernGent
it is debatable whether or not the people who think like this should be afforded civil rights.



     You are starting to worry me North.

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RE: Kofi Goes to Iran - 9/4/2006 11:46:46 AM   
Estring


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quote:

ORIGINAL: CrappyDom

Raygun was president when the Iran war started and he armed both sides.  They had illegal and stupid arms deals with the Iranian "moderates", a myth the Republicans just can't shake.

Oddly enough those weapons for Iran were helped along their way by Israel...


I keep waiting for you to mention Jimmy Carter's huge blunders when it came to Iran. His abandonment of the Shah, and his weakness and indecisiveness played a big part in how things have gone for us in that region. How come no mention of him? Oh that's right. He was a Democrat.  

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RE: Kofi Goes to Iran - 9/4/2006 11:50:55 AM   
NorthernGent


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Status: offline 		Rich,

Don't be worried, I'm a harmless creature really...............can often be found at night scurrying towards the buffet and making nests in marshland like a wildman. Not much to worry about.

Regards

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