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Taking your Pet to the Vet. - 7/25/2006 11:54:29 PM

SavageEu

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I was wondering if any has had the experience of having your sub, after a good beating have to go to the hospital? To me this is something practical to know. If I whip my pet good then she walks out and breaks her leg, as in the play did not hurt her just an accident. Has anyone had to deal with hopsital staff. I know some states require notification of police in instances of what they think is assault.

I am sure this would be avoided at all costs but sometimes crap happens.

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RE: Taking your Pet to the Vet. - 7/26/2006 12:04:11 AM

popeye1250

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From: New Hampshire
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Ahhhh,...NO.

(in reply to SavageEu)

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RE: Taking your Pet to the Vet. - 7/26/2006 2:38:59 AM

Vancouver_cinful

Posts: 1911
Joined: 2/3/2004
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This is another good reason both subs and doms are wise to discuss their BDSM activities with their family doctor, and build a trust and understanding about the activities they engage in.

Although your family doctor will not be the one attending you in emergency, telling the attending doctor that you're involved in BDSM and have discussed this with your family doctor, can go a long way to calming the situation. The attending doctor will then have an option of calling your doctor and discussing the case.

It also means you will have had some experience in discussing this with health professionals, and it'll be easier for you to keep a level head, in a stressful time. Nervousness or discomfort will be picked up by an attending doctor and it won't act in your favour, since it may look like guilt.

Should worse come to worse, and the law is called in, your family doctor will make a very credible witness for your side.

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(in reply to SavageEu)

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RE: Taking your Pet to the Vet. - 7/26/2006 2:10:57 PM

thegunslinger

Posts: 81
Joined: 6/4/2006
From: Grand Rapids, Michigan
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Two pieces of advice: Study your state laws, have a copy of your contract with you

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RE: Taking your Pet to the Vet. - 7/26/2006 2:16:21 PM

MrDiscipline44

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What is the contract supposed to do? It's really meaningless in the eyes of the law other then to be used against you.

Thats if they even have a contract.

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Have you slapped your slave today?

(in reply to thegunslinger)

Post #: 5

RE: Taking your Pet to the Vet. - 7/26/2006 2:24:29 PM

Yang4yin

Posts: 1677
Joined: 7/26/2006
From: NC (USA)
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quote:

ORIGINAL: thegunslinger

Two pieces of advice: Study your state laws, have a copy of your contract with you

If the condition isn't serious enough to require a trip to the hospital, you may want to go to a kink aware medical practioner. There's a list for several states here:

http://www.ncsfreedom.org/kap/

(in reply to thegunslinger)

Post #: 6

RE: Taking your Pet to the Vet. - 7/26/2006 2:26:57 PM

Estring

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That happened to me. I gave my slave a good beating and then she had to go to the hospital. It happens quite frequently. She is a nurse, so she has to go to the hospital everytime she is scheduled to work.

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(in reply to SavageEu)

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RE: Taking your Pet to the Vet. - 7/26/2006 2:30:18 PM

scottjk

Posts: 335
Joined: 4/18/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: SavageEu

I was wondering if any has had the experience of having your sub, after a good beating have to go to the hospital? To me this is something practical to know. If I whip my pet good then she walks out and breaks her leg, as in the play did not hurt her just an accident. Has anyone had to deal with hopsital staff. I know some states require notification of police in instances of what they think is assault.

I am sure this would be avoided at all costs but sometimes crap happens.

This is a good topic. I'll throw in what I know.

The most important thing I know is this:

In most states, if not all, if you're in the US, no one can consent to assault. What that means is that anyone can file charges on behalf of the percieved victim, with or without the victim's consent. The good news is that lifestyle communities are working with local police so that they can recognize and deal with the lifestyle in a positive manner and take appropriate action if any is warrented.

I haven't heard of anything like this directed towards hospitals, doctors and ERs, though. cinful is quite correct; you should have discussions and understandings with your doctors and therapists. If they feel that they can't cope with it, you'll definately will have to either drop the lifestyle, or change doctors and therapists on a case by case basis. There are a couple Kink Aware Professionals lists out there on the web and they can be googled.

There's also the gender factor that you have to consider as well. (well, this is just my opinion, please be gentle) There's more likely to be a stir with the medical community if you're female, and the biggest claim you're going to run into is the Stockholm Syndrome (sp?). It's an emotional hot button with many. They'll tend to ignore the protests of a woman that has the markings of a scene on her because they'll think that she's identified with, and therefore emotionally bonded with the top and will defend the 'abuser'. Of course, this is worst case, and if the ER staff is insisting that the victim is abused. (Again, the gender thing is my opinion and I have no evidence, but it seems common sense)

I HATE to spread fear, doubt and uncertainty, but there's what I can think of in terms of risk in playing. A little fun, with an accident, can lead to at least a few days in jail while things either get sorted, or the DA decides to file charges or not.

It goes without saying this is a major concern in the community.

Any lawyers out there that can add to or correct my posting?

(in reply to SavageEu)

Post #: 8

RE: Taking your Pet to the Vet. - 7/26/2006 3:07:45 PM

truesub4u

Posts: 2949
Joined: 11/17/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Yang4yin

quote:

ORIGINAL: thegunslinger

Two pieces of advice: Study your state laws, have a copy of your contract with you

If the condition isn't serious enough to require a trip to the hospital, you may want to go to a kink aware medical practioner. There's a list for several states here:

http://www.ncsfreedom.org/kap/

Lot of good that will do you if there's not a local one. And sometimes driving hours away isn't the best thing to do.

As to the OP... let them bring in the law...as you're laughing about it... no ones gonna take it all that serious. Specially once the information is given. They may look at you funny... but that will about it. It's all in how you express what happened.

Play nervous.. they'll think you're covering...laugh and both tell the same... they'll let it go.

Edited to add.............. from personal experience.

< Message edited by truesub4u -- 7/26/2006 3:09:27 PM >

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(in reply to Yang4yin)

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RE: Taking your Pet to the Vet. - 7/26/2006 3:29:45 PM

sweetnurseBBW

Posts: 2464
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From: North Carolina
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As a nurse I have treated people with injuries not related to play but saw the marks. Legally as a nurse I have to ask " Was this consentual?" if they say yes then we are done, if they say no then thats a whole new topic.

(in reply to SavageEu)

Post #: 10

RE: Taking your Pet to the Vet. - 7/26/2006 3:47:08 PM

Vancouver_cinful

Posts: 1911
Joined: 2/3/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: truesub4u

Lot of good that will do you if there's not a local one. And sometimes driving hours away isn't the best thing to do.

You're so right on that, girly. And that's why I advocate educating your doctor to become kink-aware. Sometimes you have to be the one who opens their eyes, and gets them interested enough to do the research.

Family doctors have an obligation to be sensitive toward their patients emotional and sexual health, something many of us forget.

As far as I'm concerned if my family doctor isn't openminded enough, and intelligent enough, to have this conversation with me, non-judgementally, I'm thinking she's the wrong doc for me. Simple as that.

Mind you, here in Canada, we are not limited in who we can see. We can choose our doctors without HMO limitations and such. Biggest issue is living in a small town and not having a lot to choose from. I'm lucky I live in a big city.

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Cin

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My Karma Account is huge, but I just can't seem to make a withdrawal!!

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Post #: 11

RE: Taking your Pet to the Vet. - 7/26/2006 8:45:19 PM

SavageEu

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Joined: 7/8/2006
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Well I have read through the state laws here and they are unclear to me atleast. Assault being willful and unlawful. So as some have brought up in another thread how are sports (boxing, footbal, ect) allowed? Bascialy it seems like if they are consenting to it (getting on the field) then it would be much harder to press charges. Of course our Domesitic laws give special coverage to those in a 'dating' relationship.

So that would mean to me that if you are close to your sub then you are actually going to get more punishment than if you were just playing with someone. Now we have had fetish balls, and BDSM clubs here and no one batted an eye (well except a few far right websites) so I would think, that most resonable people, would understand and it would not be a problem.

Luckily we have a good doctor and when I find my Pet I will let him know what is going on so that he can help if the worst happens. And I doubt there will be a contract. The real fear here is that all it takes is one very religious person (of which there are a lot here) to decide that I am now a target. Well it was mainly a brainstorm to get other opinions on the matter and first hand experience if anyone had (thank you to the ones who did and shared that).

From what I have seen most things heal and any wounds would be treated well to heal as quickly as possible. But as they say, you pays your monsy and takes your chances. And since both state senators and I think most congressmen are conservative here I doubt there will be much push for a Consensual amendment to the assault law. Though with a jury I guess you only have to convince one of them.

(in reply to Vancouver_cinful)

Post #: 12

RE: Taking your Pet to the Vet. - 7/26/2006 9:00:53 PM

DreamyLadySnow

Posts: 359
Joined: 1/23/2005
Status: offline

I can't speak for anyone south of the border but there have been very few instances of consensual bdsm partners being charged up here.
One lady even had an aneursim at a play party (ambulance guy called the cops) but it all turned out fine. The aneurism had nothing to do with play, just coincidence.

It may be illegal (common assault is all you can consent to up here, not bondge, or aggravated assault) but not likely to get you charged. The cops have actual crimes to worry about.
Or at least that's what my lawyer friends tell me.

LS

(in reply to SavageEu)

Post #: 13

RE: Taking your Pet to the Vet. - 7/26/2006 9:02:45 PM

ChainedExistence

Posts: 507
Joined: 2/5/2005
Status: offline

That list of Kink Aware Professionals isn't all that much help when there's ONE listed for the entire state, and that one is 3 hours away! I talked to a doctor once that said while he was aware, he wouldn't necessarily want to put his name on such a list, so as not to shock his other patients. That's probably the case with many other health professionals. I'm not sure how you could " test the waters" to see how your doctor responds, but in this day of HMOs and such, you often don't have many choices anyway.
As for doctors and nurses, they, like many people who deal with the public, are obligated by law to report any suspicion of abuse. They don't have to interview you to find out anything...they can simply report it and pass it on to authorities. It's probably best to be very up front about it ahead of time...but I could be wrong...are there any doctors in the house, or lawyers who can answer this question better?

(in reply to Yang4yin)

Post #: 14

RE: Taking your Pet to the Vet. - 7/26/2006 10:34:20 PM

SavageEu

Posts: 197
Joined: 7/8/2006
Status: offline

And most of this has been centered on basically just beating (canes, crops, whip, ect). I can't even imagine the complications if you were into branding, ritual cutting, or something like that. Well, I know a defense lawyer near me, I can ask him about it but it would probably only apply to this state with the usual disclaimers that its not legal advice and such.

(in reply to ChainedExistence)

Post #: 15

RE: Taking your Pet to the Vet. - 7/26/2006 10:38:39 PM

txpet

Posts: 200
Joined: 4/29/2006
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Assault is always illegal ... it is the battery part (the actual hitting) that MAY be legal ... it is in Texas ... consentual battery IS legal in this state ... it may be the only state but i am not certain

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RE: Taking your Pet to the Vet. - 7/26/2006 10:43:32 PM

SexyRed

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Joined: 8/19/2004
Status: offline

Funny that this topic came up, I had to go to a local emergency medical facility today as a result of something that happened over the weekend. It was my first time there and it was apparent that it was the result of something "unusual". I tried to banter about it, but I was upset (I made the mistake of seeing my ex and he did something to me that I did not want) and the doctor asked so many questions about how did this happen, that I got very paranoid.

He kept asking me if I wanted to report something and I said no, just treat me. He also asked how I could enjoy such things; I said I normally do but this was an exception.

It was a very uncomfortable situation to say the least.

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Post #: 17

RE: Taking your Pet to the Vet. - 7/26/2006 10:51:05 PM

HarryVanWinkle

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The closest I've ever come to this situation is having a physical the day after getting a heavy whipping. My back was a mass of bruises. The doctors didn't say anything about it. I think the huge, shit eating grin on my face might have had something to do with it.

In such a situation, if the doctor asked about the marks, I'd recommend explaining that the marks were the result of completely consensual, rough sex play. If they start asking prying questions, refuse to answer. If they call the cops, refuse to talk to them.

(in reply to SavageEu)

Post #: 18

RE: Taking your Pet to the Vet. - 7/26/2006 10:59:04 PM

SavageEu

Posts: 197
Joined: 7/8/2006
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Well from my states statutes :
An assault is any willful and unlawful attempt or offer with force or violence to do a corporal hurt to another.
A battery is any willful and unlawful use of force or violence upon the person of another.

So Assault includes 'threat' of force and Battery is actual force. I would think that Battery would be the thing illegal every where then.

Note there are exceptions to these definitions, mostly police using force to subdue people. But this was interesting :

4. When committed by a parent or the authorized agent of any parent, or by any guardian, master or teacher, in the exercise of a lawful authority to restrain or correct such person's child, ward, apprentice or scholar, provided restraint or correction has been rendered necessary by the misconduct of such child, ward, apprentice or scholar, or by such person's refusal to obey the lawful command of such parent or authorized agent or guardian, master or teacher, and the force or violence used is reasonable in manner and moderate in degree;

Hehe, no I don't think that would get you out of any trouble just because you said you were the Pet's Master.

Lacking in that section is anything about sports, martial arts, or any other more vanilla activities were people can get hurt.

(in reply to SexyRed)

Post #: 19

RE: Taking your Pet to the Vet. - 7/27/2006 7:31:01 AM

trixr4kids

Posts: 18
Joined: 7/27/2006
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Some of us are brave enough to ask and lucky enough to have Doctors who know we're into BDSM. It took me over a year to mention it to my GYN. I finally told her I was into S&M and ask if I came in her office bruised would she have to report it. She laughed and said "I know there's no way someone would do something to you you didn't like that you'd protect so in your case I'd see you with your bruises and not have a problem with it." I ask if I could refer my sub friends to her and she said her judgement would have to be on a case by case basis. With me she knows I'm not abused, with others it would be up to the sub and her to decide if she felt the other girl was safe or not. I also mentioned my participation in BDSM to my primary Doctor. He turned bright red & started sweating, but also said no he'd not report me, but he thought I was in need of counceling as S&M is just to wierd for him to say he's comfortable with it. Needless to say I try to not go see him marked up just out of consideration of his opinion, but I know I could go to him if I had a scene situation I though needed medical attention.
If I got hurt and needed to go to the hospital I would go without question. If they did report me I'd have my Primary Doc & Gyn on top of my family and friends to attest to the fact I consensually participate in S&M play & am not being abused.

(in reply to SavageEu)

Post #: 20

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