Fearful Of Police (Full Version)

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LorraineCA -> Fearful Of Police (3/7/2014 9:43:32 PM)

1. I'm African American and my neighborhood is mostly African-Americans and Hispanics. We all fear the police; so much so that we walk in groups so that if I police officer stops us we can pull out our cellphone and video tape what is going on. The trouble happens when you walk alone.

2. I'm taking a Law Enforcement class and the instructor is an attorney and used to be the DA of Los Angeles. He claims that 98% of police officers are honest and full of good intentions. It's rare that a police officer will lie and it's best to think of them as "Peace Officers."

I was wondering how white people view police? Are you afraid of them?




Kirata -> RE: Fearful Of Police (3/7/2014 9:46:20 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: LorraineCA

I was wondering how white people view police? Are you afraid of them?

Well these aren't black websites:

PoliceStateUSA
PINAC

Personally, I don't trust police. But when you consider what some of them see and have to deal with day in and day out, it's not hard to understand how some of them get the way they are. That's not an excuse, but my policy is to give them the benefit of doubt and keep my mouth shut.

K.




DomKen -> RE: Fearful Of Police (3/7/2014 9:53:22 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: LorraineCA

1. I'm African American and my neighborhood is mostly African-Americans and Hispanics. We all fear the police; so much so that we walk in groups so that if I police officer stops us we can pull out our cellphone and video tape what is going on. The trouble happens when you walk alone.

2. I'm taking a Law Enforcement class and the instructor is an attorney and used to be the DA of Los Angeles. He claims that 98% of police officers are honest and full of good intentions. It's rare that a police officer will lie and it's best to think of them as "Peace Officers."

I was wondering how white people view police? Are you afraid of them?

I'm white and my oldest brother is retired law enforcement.

IME most police officers are just people doing a job. They are no more dishonest or corrupt than the next guy, probably a little less so. However the bad apples are very bad.

But understand their job is to get arrests and convictions. If a police officer wants to question you, about anything, give them the info that can be found on your ID and then shut up. If they take you into custody ask for an attorney and don't say or sign anything until you've spoken to one.




subrob1967 -> RE: Fearful Of Police (3/7/2014 10:14:50 PM)

Trust em? I am one.




Kirata -> RE: Fearful Of Police (3/7/2014 10:37:15 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: subrob1967

Trust em? I am one.

I'm the poster who said he doesn't trust police. Most cops are alright, some are cowboys. I have no way of knowing which they're going to be, and it's the same for them. They don't trust me either. When cops arrive on a scene they have no way of knowing which guy robbed the store and which one had nothing to do with it and just won a Citizenship Award. So they're going to treat everybody as suspects. Some people get offended by that. They think they're being treated like criminals because they're black or brown or whatever. I just expect it. If the people the cops were dealing with were all class valedictorians, they wouldn't be there in the first place. So I don't trust them to give me the benefit of doubt, to be on my side, or to "help" me.

K.




BecomingV -> RE: Fearful Of Police (3/7/2014 10:38:42 PM)

I'm white and I don't fear police, generally speaking. I am, however, keeping an eye on them. YouTube has videos of peaceful, American demonstrators being surrounded by forces that are dressed as soldiers and ride in on tanks. People have been hurt and arrested for doing absolutely nothing at all.

I was told by a guy who had been in the military, was deployed to Korea, Iraq and Afghanistan and worked at the NSA, that some years ago, during Bush, the American soldier's oath changed from, and I'm quoting loosely, "I promise to protect my President against all enemies, both foreign AND domestic." It used to say they'd protect their country. This change allows the President to treat citizens with lethal and military force.

I asked the soldier, without breaching any confidences, what was his advice for how any American family can prepare for the future. I was thinking of global warming and if I should move out of Florida soon, and if there was a better place to reside. But, his answer, "Every American needs to own a gun and be proficient in using it." Goosebumps.

So, I'm seeing the American police force become more militarized and I know that Bush expanded presidential powers to use them against us. Not afraid... but definitely paying attention.




TheHeretic -> RE: Fearful Of Police (3/7/2014 10:40:06 PM)

I don't like them, don't trust them, and interact with them in a completely different way than with any other sort of person I deal with.




Kirata -> RE: Fearful Of Police (3/7/2014 10:45:24 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: BecomingV

if I should move out of Florida soon, and if there was a better place to reside...

Well that's easy. The answer is no! [:D]

[image]http://wallpaperswa.com/thumbnails/detail/20121201/beach%20hammock%20palm%20trees%20belize%201600x1200%20wallpaper_wallpaperswa.com_44.jpg[/image]

K.




GoddessManko -> RE: Fearful Of Police (3/7/2014 11:20:00 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: LorraineCA

1. I'm African American and my neighborhood is mostly African-Americans and Hispanics. We all fear the police; so much so that we walk in groups so that if I police officer stops us we can pull out our cellphone and video tape what is going on. The trouble happens when you walk alone.

2. I'm taking a Law Enforcement class and the instructor is an attorney and used to be the DA of Los Angeles. He claims that 98% of police officers are honest and full of good intentions. It's rare that a police officer will lie and it's best to think of them as "Peace Officers."

I was wondering how white people view police? Are you afraid of them?


Honestly never been to LA, only Santa Barbara and Ojai. I know I live in a black middle/upper middle class area and it's generally very quiet and uneventful out here. I also lived in the "ghetto" as a poor college student. It was actually weirdly awesome. People were very receptive of me even though I talk like a "small asian woman" and was this sheltered suburban girl, LOL. I remember playing scrabble with this guy who was an ex felon and just feeling so bad ass (my gosh, I was a dork). Never really had cops bother me either.
I don't know, this country is weirdly color struck, I really don't see color at all, maybe because I'm a transplant. Some cops are nice, some are jerks. But you also have to understand the high level of stress law enforcement officers deal with and I believe it's worse if you don't trust them, then in turn they will distrust you. It just makes sense.
A vicious cycle so to speak.




FrostedFlake -> RE: Fearful Of Police (3/7/2014 11:45:55 PM)

There are people, and then there are cops. No cop has ever been one of my friends and the other way too. The basic problem is, when a cop says black is white, every other cop in the world backs him up. If they didn't do that, every single one of them would be accountable to the law. As it is, a cop has to be an embarrassment, no wait, Joe Arpaio, there is NOTHING a cop can do that you can do anything about. Complaints USDOJ Civil Rights follow a circular path. Pretty soon you are talking to the same cops about what dicks they are. And you are welcome to complain again.

Jump back 1000 years. How much does the Duke care if a peasant whines about being mishandled by the Shireves' men? There you go. Not satisfied? Jump back another thousand years. Same question. Keep going. If you want to keep your bully-boys, you have to protect them from the natural consequences of their abhorrent behavior. If you lose your bully-boys to your own justice, who will protect you from the peasants?




SadistDave -> RE: Fearful Of Police (3/7/2014 11:47:31 PM)

I don't have any problems with the police. I work with the public and see them quite a bit. I treat the police with respect and honesty whenever I have to deal with them. I look them in the eye, I smile, and I say polite things. I've made it a point to get to know the ones I see on a regular basis at work by name. When I'm away from work, I smile at the officers as they drive by and give them a little half-assed salute to acknowledge them. I talk to them when I see them standing around at the gas station or just hanging around places. Most importantly, I just kinda make it a point not to break the law...

-SD-




PyrotheClown -> RE: Fearful Of Police (3/8/2014 12:01:16 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: LorraineCA

1. I'm African American and my neighborhood is mostly African-Americans and Hispanics. We all fear the police; so much so that we walk in groups so that if I police officer stops us we can pull out our cellphone and video tape what is going on. The trouble happens when you walk alone.

2. I'm taking a Law Enforcement class and the instructor is an attorney and used to be the DA of Los Angeles. He claims that 98% of police officers are honest and full of good intentions. It's rare that a police officer will lie and it's best to think of them as "Peace Officers."

I was wondering how white people view police? Are you afraid of them?


Well,personally,I'm white,but I'm deathly allergic to cops
they make me break out in running lol

there's been a few times I've been genuinely glad to see an officer of the law,mostly after I've called them on some sort of incident or what not..
On the other side of the coin,there's been quiet a few times I've dreaded seeing a cop,but mostly cause I was involved in something that wasn't legal......
A few child hood chums of mine even became cops.
(one of which was dirty as fuck and got fired for dealing meth,he wasn't a racist thou..)
Having said that,I have run across a few asshole cops,but it's rare.
not rare enough thou.san bernardino county is corrupt as fuck


as far as race goes,it all depends on where you are
in LA and other areas with large populations of poor black or Hispanic people,the cops tend to profile a lil more compared to areas with more integration,or just less crime
(poor people any where of any color commit more crime the people who aren't poor...at least crime that you're average police officer has to deal with)
they're not looking at your skin color per say,just the demographic.

except for the south,where racism is prevalent....




MercTech -> RE: Fearful Of Police (3/8/2014 12:06:39 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: BecomingV

I was told by a guy who had been in the military, was deployed to Korea, Iraq and Afghanistan and worked at the NSA, that some years ago, during Bush, the American soldier's oath changed from, and I'm quoting loosely, "I promise to protect my President against all enemies, both foreign AND domestic." It used to say they'd protect their country. This change allows the President to treat citizens with lethal and military force.

attention.


This was the oath I swore:
quote:


§ 502. Enlistment oath: who may administer

(a) Enlistment Oath.— Each person enlisting in an armed force shall take the following oath:
"I, XXXXXXXXXX, do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; and that I will obey the orders of the President of the United States and the orders of the officers appointed over me, according to regulations and the Uniform Code of Military Justice. So help me God."
(b) Who May Administer.— The oath may be taken before the President, the Vice-President, the Secretary of Defense, any commissioned officer, or any other person designated under regulations prescribed by the Secretary of Defense.


And, on the main topic, I do not fear the police but I lost my trust of police departments many years ago.
The defining moment came from doing Shore Patrol duty with the local police force. Every single shift meeting would close with "And remember, there are only two kinds of people in this world: Police Officers and potential criminals". So many places in this country; the siege mentality has become so bad the officers don't think of how they can maintain the peace but what can they charge you with.

Legal precedent plays a huge factor too:
The police are not obligated to help the individual
The police are not obligated to tell you the truth but may lie in order to elicit compromising admissions.
Police are considered a "professional witness" and it literally takes photographic evidence to dispute the the statements of an officer whereas photographing an officer is unlawful in many jurisdictions.

Also, I really consider a 2am warrant serving by throwing a flash-bang through the window and hitting the door with a battering ram very questionable. Is a secret police stye raid in the wee hours of the morning really something we should, as citizens, tolerate?




wittynamehere -> RE: Fearful Of Police (3/8/2014 12:15:05 AM)

I don't know why you're making this about race, but regardless, no I absolutely don't trust the pigs. 98% of them are good? More like 2% - if that. None are to be trusted or respected.




BamaD -> RE: Fearful Of Police (3/8/2014 12:16:47 AM)

FR
I have spent most of my life around cops.
About 5% shouldn't be allowed out without armed adult supervision.
About 85% it is a job like any other.
About 10% are genetically predisposed to protect people. You could almost call them heroic.
The problem with most peoples view of cops is that the 5% get 95% of the press.




BecomingV -> RE: Fearful Of Police (3/8/2014 12:39:46 AM)

http://newsone.com/2023676/police-brutality-against-blacks/

This article was written in 2012 and it highlights some of the matters that, I think, prompted your OP. While I admire the career of the writer, she does point to the 4th Amendment in the Bill of Rights as if it were still intact. Has she not heard of the Patriot Act and how it squashed the 4th Amendment into history?

I'm involved in human rights' activism so the racial/police/justice system problem comes up a lot. I'm white, I'm aware and I care. More than platitudes, I educate myself on the issues and vote accordingly. I sign petitions. I donate money and time and skills. Often, to no avail. I'm going to keep trying. I am not okay with black people's systemic oppression in my country.

I must admit to an intellectual resentment of black men, though. Way back when, black men and women joined with white women to get the vote. The black men saw that if they dumped the women, they could advance. They betrayed us. For that reason, the issue of racism, while very important, is not my personal priority. Women's rights are.

I also want to agree with the poster who said that if you treat cops like you and they are on the same side, then you won't tap into their trained paranoia. Let them know all is well.

I'm trying to be careful and clear. I don't want to come off like those who say women need to dress differently or they need to accept at least some responsibility for the rape-y nature, choices and actions of the predator who attacked them. Baloney! Get the focus off of the victims and onto the sick and damaged rapists. Oh, and get their brothers to man up on the subject, too.

Anyway, I do think there is a failure to prepare young black people to assimilate into American culture. Slavery descendants may feel motivated to reject the society which enslaved them, but I posit that their parents need to step up and help them get over it. Be angry, act civil and intelligent and make changes... but don't live in anger.

I see, in my daily life, black people who double park, disrupting the flow for others. I see slow, meandering walks in front of moving cars with a confrontational stare added in for what? Ego? Is that how power is attained? How pathetic and what a waste. Oh, and they look stupid... you know, Darwinism and all that. They reflect poorly on their elders in this way. I also sit in my own house and my teeth vibrate because some entitled idiot decides to blare their radio with what I think should be unlawful levels of bass.

So, I generally see, in my city, black people who refuse to act in ways that respect the rights of others. If I were a cop, who was trained to spot criminals, I don't know how I would not recognize the hostility and aggression in these acts.

Maybe in other cities, people are experiencing the racial interactions differently?

In short, I don't know that black people fear cops so much as reject and hate cops. It's a global statement, of course, which implies exceptions.

Another take on this is that I am white. Do I fear black cops more than I fear white cops? Maybe. I do check to see if the black guy is putting out racist vibes.




stef -> RE: Fearful Of Police (3/8/2014 1:30:15 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: subrob1967

Trust em? I am one.

Mall cops aren't police officers.




slavekate80 -> RE: Fearful Of Police (3/8/2014 2:17:31 AM)

Yes, though I do have some privilege - I'm not afraid that they're going to target me for brutality and leave me dead or almost dead. I'm afraid that they'll harass me, tell lies, and either slap me with garbage tickets I can't pay or haul me into jail for things I didn't do but can't defend against because it's my word against theirs. I once went briefly to jail (got out same day) for public intoxication when I was completely sober and had been doing nothing but sitting quietly in a car. The car got stopped, cop decided to give us sobriety tests, and what do you know, my gait wasn't absolutely perfect because I was on loose gravel in five-inch heels. No scientific analysis, just "your ankle turned a little, you must be drunk, you're going to jail." That's the kind of thing I fear and why I try to avoid police. They have the power to do almost anything they want to people who don't have a ton of money to hire great lawyers, and while there are good officers who don't abuse that power, there are also enough bad ones who do as to make dealing with any officer you don't know risky.




joether -> RE: Fearful Of Police (3/8/2014 3:15:14 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: BamaD
I have spent most of my life around cops.
About 5% shouldn't be allowed out without armed adult supervision.
About 85% it is a job like any other.
About 10% are genetically predisposed to protect people. You could almost call them heroic.
The problem with most peoples view of cops is that the 5% get 95% of the press.


Well shit, we finally agree on something!





jlf1961 -> RE: Fearful Of Police (3/8/2014 4:08:44 AM)

I cant say I am or ever was afraid of the police, and locally, I know most of the sheriff's deputies who patrol the area of the county I live in. Hell, we are either fishing or hunting hogs together.

Most of them are late 30's or older. The city cops are pretty cool, there are a couple of them that are gung ho and typical pricks.

The DPS troopers around here are pretty strict, even assholes at times. I mean they pull you over and give you warnings for anything up to 10 miles over the limit. Then there are the ones that will pull off the road and help change a tire, or like when I had the procedure on my kidney, pulled in next to my niece and I when I started cramping and had to get out of the car. He had a couple of bottles of water in his cruiser, insisted I drink them and waited till I was able to get in the car, on the chance we would need to get me to the ER.

The only bad cop that I can remember was a DPS trooper who would get drunk after going off duty, then go home and beat the shit out of his wife. One night after he had beat her to the point her ears bled, he passed out, she wrapped him in a bed sheet, then sewed it up so he could not get out.

When she was satisfied with her work, she proceeded to beat the living hell out of him with a broom handle.

There were two trials after he got out of the hospital, she got six months suspended for simple assault. He got 8 years for aggravated assault with intent, 4 counts.

What I am saying is that cops attitudes depend on environment.




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