RE: Meeting as Equals

Collarspace Discussion Forums

Home Login Search

RE: Meeting as Equals

View related threads: (in this forum | in all forums)

Logged in as: Guest

All Forums >> [Community Discussions] >> General BDSM Discussion >> RE: Meeting as Equals

Page: << < prev 1 2 [3]

Message

<< Older Topic Newer Topic >>

RE: Meeting as Equals - 7/7/2006 3:24:43 PM

songofeire

Posts: 40
Joined: 10/27/2005
Status: offline

Heavens! Will someone please explain to me how to get this vanilla logo off my posts?
Laughing madly, here.

Rosemary
SongofEire

(in reply to LadyHugs)

Profile

Post #: 41

RE: Meeting as Equals - 7/7/2006 3:44:04 PM

Slipstreme

Posts: 817
Joined: 1/1/2006
Status: offline

quote:

have often wondered whether or not dominants that post here view all submissives as unequal to them, not just the ones they own, but everyone that self identifies as a submissive.

Nope. Not me. Even my slave is my equal in some way or another, she is equally my slave as I am equally her Master, and could never value her less because of it.
People I don't know, they are my equals, people I know, equals still. Dominants = equals, submissives = equals, vanilla = equals. I do see normal interplay between dominance and submission in every day life, even among vanillas, however, irregardless of whether or not someone is submitting their will to me, I still see them as equals, for we are all human beings, no matter what.

I value all life, especially that of the one who is collared to me.

_____________________________

Living the Dichotomy

Painslut? How about "Endorphin Junkie"?

For information about "the furry thing" please check out my profile journal entry for: 1/17/2006

Alpha of a leather family of four. Master to the slave z.

(in reply to slavejali)

Profile

Post #: 42

RE: Meeting as Equals - 7/7/2006 3:46:00 PM

Slipstreme

Posts: 817
Joined: 1/1/2006
Status: offline

quote:

Heavens! Will someone please explain to me how to get this vanilla logo off my posts?
Laughing madly, here.

Post lots.

I don't remember how many postings you have to make to get it to go away, bit it will go away. It simply means you are new to the boards.

_____________________________

Living the Dichotomy

Painslut? How about "Endorphin Junkie"?

For information about "the furry thing" please check out my profile journal entry for: 1/17/2006

Alpha of a leather family of four. Master to the slave z.

(in reply to songofeire)

Profile

Post #: 43

RE: Meeting as Equals - 7/7/2006 4:03:19 PM

swtnsparkling

Posts: 1738
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline

quote:

I have seen a submissive post something, her input ignored, and then a dominant post the same thing a few posts down and a lot of people going out of their way to agree with him/her

I have seen this a time or two myself

_____________________________

Never make anyone a priority who treats you as an option 2003

Walk in Peace

A "No" uttered from deepest conviction is better than a "Yes" uttered merely to please

(in reply to juliaoceania)

Profile

Post #: 44

RE: Meeting as Equals - 7/7/2006 4:22:19 PM

BitaTruble

Posts: 9779
Joined: 1/12/2006
From: Texas
Status: offline

quote:

Basically I am curious as to whether or not you view inequalities in your interactions with others on CM? Personally I haven't seen much of that, but I have seen it crop up occasionally and I wonder how others feel about this or if it is in my mind and doesn't exist at all.

I haven't read through the rest of the responses yet, so don't know if anyone else admits to this or not, but I most certainly do and I see it as a flaw on my part. Part rose-colored glasses syndrome, part expecting perfection in one who claims they are dominant.

It's one of the reasons I'm less than perfect. ::chuckles:: I 'expect' dominants to behave in a certain way (call it a false hope for Utopian BDSM ::chuckles:: ) .. so when they don't, to me, they aren't dominants which, of course, is hogwash. They may be perfectly capable dominants and just not someone who would be a dominant to 'me.' Actually, the bias which I have in this regard 'is' one on which I am working.. to try to rid myself of that attitude.

So far, I'm unsuccessful with it and still hold prejudices against the dominant sect of humans engaged in BDSM M/s.

As well, I tend to have more compassion for submissives, feel more empathy for them, and I'm much more forgiving of transgressions and will give the benefit of the doubt. Something I've noticed is that submissives, in general, seem to be much quicker at recognizing their errors and apologizing than dominants do. (At least the submissives with whom I engage) and even when a dominant acknowledges an error, I've seldom seen an apology forthcoming (with some notable exceptions .. and those dominants go WAY up on my personal esteem/respect gauge). When a submissive falls, it's a shorter drop to me because my expectation is lower .. and when a dominant falls, it seems to be from great height and because the height is so great, in my eyes, they are broken almost beyond repair. I view dominants as those who should set an example.. they are the leaders, teachers by default, mentors and if they are engaging in public discourse.. I think they should take care not to fuck up and if they do, admit it then let it go and move on.

Like I said, it's a flaw and I'm working on it. Rationally I know that dominants are people too, not Gods.. and if I keep telling myself that enough, maybe one day, I'll actually believe it.

Celeste

_____________________________

"Oh, so it's just like
Rock, paper, scissors."

He laughed. "You are the wisest woman I know."

(in reply to juliaoceania)

Profile

Post #: 45

RE: Meeting as Equals - 7/7/2006 5:19:22 PM

juliaoceania

Posts: 21383
Joined: 4/19/2006
From: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: BitaTruble

I haven't read through the rest of the responses yet, so don't know if anyone else admits to this or not, but I most certainly do and I see it as a flaw on my part. Part rose-colored glasses syndrome, part expecting perfection in one who claims they are dominant.

So far, I'm unsuccessful with it and still hold prejudices against the dominant sect of humans engaged in BDSM M/s.

Like I said, it's a flaw and I'm working on it. Rationally I know that dominants are people too, not Gods.. and if I keep telling myself that enough, maybe one day, I'll actually believe it.

Celeste

Thanks for your candor Celeste. I have noticed this phenomena in chat also, and actually it is even worse when people talk on a mic for example. I have noticed a certain amount of fawning adoration from more than a few submissives in chat, and then the condescending treatment of submissives as needing a big strong dominant one to make everything okay... every problem can be solved by a dom, but advice from a fellow submissive was often considered second rate. I have not suffered much from this starry eyed syndrome because I have much faith in my own opinions, even "if" I am a submissive (last line said tongue in cheek).

Actually I have seen less condenscending behavior here than in the voice chats I have been to. I have felt as though 99% of the dominant people here respect and expect submissives to be able to walk and chew gum at the same time for example. I have read many strong and beautiful submissives as well (you are definitely included in that category Celeste, along with many others...including our LA who is an advocate against weak submission...smiles). I think it took me a while to even notice this at all on CM because it is so subtle I figured I may have imagined it...

_____________________________

Once you label me, you negate me ~ Soren Kierkegaard

Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

(in reply to BitaTruble)

Profile

Post #: 46

RE: Meeting as Equals - 7/7/2006 5:20:37 PM

truesub4u

Posts: 2949
Joined: 11/17/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: swtnsparkling

quote:

I have seen a submissive post something, her input ignored, and then a dominant post the same thing a few posts down and a lot of people going out of their way to agree with him/her

I have seen this a time or two myself

Happens quite alot on these boards..I just laugh and go on.

Mr D.... respect... equals.. same thing.. you're either going to get the same respect as a person...and treated equally.... or going to get little to no respect as an idiot..still gonna equal the same thing... so respect and equal can at times equal the same thing.

_____________________________

Wisdom is knowing what to do next, Skill is knowing how to do it, and Virtue is doing it.

(in reply to swtnsparkling)

Profile

Post #: 47

RE: Meeting as Equals - 7/7/2006 5:30:42 PM

Slipstreme

Posts: 817
Joined: 1/1/2006
Status: offline

Just out of curiosity, why does a discussion on equality always end up in bemoaning how subs and Doms are treated, or treat each other in chat or in board postings?

I must not chat enough to know these things.

My .02 on board postings. I have seen many Dominants flamed because they made honest mistakes. I have seen many Dominants who you just want to throw your fist through. At the same time though, I have never seen a single Dominant here, who has been coddled and cared about for any of their mistakes, pit falls or problems they are having with their life/ relationship etc, as I have seen with submissives. No one ever seems to want to put their arm on that Doms shoulder and say, "you'll do better next time", or "it will get better, you'll see" or something along those lines. Its usually something along the lines of, "look how screwed up you are", "you should have known better" and the like. (Yes, in some cases that kind of attitude is warrented.) Dominants have feelings too.

Yes, I have seen submissives who were scolded, and Dominants flaunt themselves like asses saying that the only thing the submissive needs is a "good Dominant", however, it pains me to see that when this type of discussion takes place, people seem to fail to acknowledge the fact it seems most people have this view that Dominants aren't allowed to make mistakes or have problems, any problems, even if they have nothing to do with the D/s dynamic at all.

_____________________________

Living the Dichotomy

Painslut? How about "Endorphin Junkie"?

For information about "the furry thing" please check out my profile journal entry for: 1/17/2006

Alpha of a leather family of four. Master to the slave z.

(in reply to juliaoceania)

Profile

Post #: 48

RE: Meeting as Equals - 7/7/2006 5:35:24 PM

juliaoceania

Posts: 21383
Joined: 4/19/2006
From: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
Status: offline

Not true, I have as much compassion for a dominant that has been hurt as I do a submissive... there is probably at least one domme/dominant that can attest to that...

and no this thread has not digressed into who is not treated right... I think it has been an honest examination of our own prejudices when dealing with others because of a label we give ourselves.. most of us do not think about this stuff connsciously.. I actually think this has been a most civil thread.

Edited to amend the first few lines slightly... if that is your perception then it may well be valid...Ha Ha....sorry, had a knee jerk reaction because I do feel compassion for everyone, but that doesnt mean that all people do... my bad.

< Message edited by juliaoceania -- 7/7/2006 5:38:22 PM >

_____________________________

Once you label me, you negate me ~ Soren Kierkegaard

Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

(in reply to Slipstreme)

Profile

Post #: 49

RE: Meeting as Equals - 7/7/2006 5:38:36 PM

Sinergy

Posts: 9383
Joined: 4/26/2004
Status: offline

Hello A/all,

I posted something about this a year or two ago. I was a martial arts instructor at a studio where the studio custom was to refer to us instructor types as "Sir" or "Madam." It gave me the screaming heebie jeebies to have people I didnt know refer to me deferentially in that manner. It was the custom, so I learned to adapt.

Fast forward a bit to my interactions in WIITWD. I go to play parties and munches. People say "Oh, your a Dominant so you wear the blue name tag." Then I have people I dont know coming up to me and referring to me as Sir, or sometimes Madam if I am wearing my kilt that night. I bite down my screaming heebie jeebies and ask them politely to call me "Sinergy" or what I used to go by.

I will not be kept down. I just want to be free to ride my machine and not be hassled by The Man. I learn. I adapt. I overcome. I visit Kinkos and buy green name tags. Now when people approach me at play parties and munches they ask for my name and we talk as two people. If they ask which side of the flogger I identify with, I will probably tell them.

I believe that respect is earned. Showing me respect when I cannot recall ever doing something to earn such respect in the other person's mind seems to diminish the concept of respect to me.

As usual, this is just me and I could be wrong.

Sinergy

_____________________________

"There is a fine line between clever and stupid"
David St. Hubbins "This Is Spinal Tap"

"Every so often you let a word or phrase out and you want to catch it and bring it back. You cant do that, it is gone, gone forever." J. Danforth Quayle

(in reply to truesub4u)

Profile

Post #: 50

RE: Meeting as Equals - 7/7/2006 5:42:02 PM

Slipstreme

Posts: 817
Joined: 1/1/2006
Status: offline

Thanks julia. Unfortunately, I have yet to see anyone try to be nice to a Dominant who needs it. I must have missed those posts. Thankfully I have yet to screw up badly enough to get the flames thrown at me, that seem to invariably happen. :P

I did however, recently find out though, one of the local communities seem to be a lot more civil than anything someone could find online, and I wholeheartedly think, anyone who is feeling discouraged with the community here on collarme should take some time learning about theirs. But that is a topic to be saved for another discussion.

_____________________________

Living the Dichotomy

Painslut? How about "Endorphin Junkie"?

For information about "the furry thing" please check out my profile journal entry for: 1/17/2006

Alpha of a leather family of four. Master to the slave z.

(in reply to juliaoceania)

Profile

Post #: 51

RE: Meeting as Equals - 7/7/2006 5:47:41 PM

irishbynature

Posts: 551
Joined: 5/11/2006
Status: offline

Julia: excellent question.

I don't view any Dom/Domme as 'higher' but as an equal. (Disclaimer: excluding my Dominant, however-He earned my friendship, trust, and my respect as well; hence, He earns the title "Master or Sir."

_____________________________

What seems nasty, painful, or evil, can become a source of beauty, joy, and strength, for those who have the vision to recognize it as such. Henry Miller

(in reply to juliaoceania)

Profile

Post #: 52

RE: Meeting as Equals - 7/7/2006 6:01:45 PM

Slipstreme

Posts: 817
Joined: 1/1/2006
Status: offline

quote:

"Sir" or "Madam."

Growing up in the south has me using Sir and Ma'am all the time, even towards the submissive types. It is just something only familiarity will knock out of me. :P

_____________________________

Living the Dichotomy

Painslut? How about "Endorphin Junkie"?

For information about "the furry thing" please check out my profile journal entry for: 1/17/2006

Alpha of a leather family of four. Master to the slave z.

(in reply to irishbynature)

Profile

Post #: 53

RE: Meeting as Equals - 7/7/2006 6:09:43 PM

RavenMuse

Posts: 4030
Joined: 1/23/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Slipstreme
Thanks julia. Unfortunately, I have yet to see anyone try to be nice to a Dominant who needs it. I must have missed those posts.

Yep, you must have because they have been there. Probably more than I remember and I can remember a couple.

_____________________________

This above all: to thine own self be true,
And it must follow, as the night the day,
Thou canst not then be false to any man.

Owner of metalmiss

(in reply to Slipstreme)

Profile

Post #: 54

RE: Meeting as Equals - 7/7/2006 6:16:43 PM

LadyHugs

Posts: 2299
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline

Dear songofeire, Ladies and Gentlemen;

You wrote;

quote:

ORIGINAL: songofeire

This question made me think about the various meanings of the word equal...such as equal in what way, and does having power make you better than, and does reliquishing power make you less than, and other odd mental meanderings.
As groups, I do not believe that Dominants have greater value than submissives. The relationship between them is symbiotic...they need each other equally, in order to have the meetings or the lives that they want.
Within a relationship, it might at first seem that the Dominant's needs are the ones being served, until one looks deeper and sees that the submissive's need to serve and obey are just as important to her as his are to him.
In fact, I have sometimes wondered if it isn't that the satisfaction of my craving for the sensations of total surrender may be what I seek...that the Dominant who can best make me need to obey and submit is threfore the one I most want to serve.
So then, who is serving whom? The only satisfactory answer to who's on top, lies, again, in the concept of symbiosis.
And symbiosis implies equality of partners, even if one serves, and one is being served.

Rosemary
SongOfEire

Very well said. Good job.

In a relationship it is very fluid. Having independent power it is a current, much like electricity and or power. Co-dependent, to which one recieves power and one supplies power or 'submits' power. However, it is not held long but re-invested into back into the giving power. Or, feeding the slave/submissive. Yet, the slave/submissive feeds the Master/Mistress/Dominant.

Because no one person is perfect, at times the power is drawn to compensate for weakness in the moment or person and, to compliment or compensate, the other will do the same. Before we create a union, be it friendship, a military body, a government, a job, a relationship and or marriage and in this community, a M/s or D/s union it is a fluid, living exchange. We come and approach as independent powers. Like magnets though, the positive and negative can join but, two negatives/two positives repell away from the same force yet, separation of both with a line, much like the line that is created by M/s or D/s, the traits of dominants are that of regulating power and the submissives supply the power, which feed the power exchange. However, if a person takes without replacing the energy back then power is lost and perhaps starved as to cause the relationship to die. What makes BDSM, M/s and D/s different; equal powers of individuals come together and make a choice who will be authority and who submits to authority.

Respectfully submitted for consideration,
Lady Hugs

(in reply to songofeire)

Profile

Post #: 55

RE: Meeting as Equals - 7/7/2006 8:19:26 PM

sirrenders

Posts: 5
Joined: 10/15/2005
Status: offline

I treat everyone as my equal whether they are or not. This includes other dominants and submissives as well. The majority of dominants I have encountered need to feel superior to their submissives. I fully understand how important it is that my Master perceive his superiority to me. Again it is just part of the dynamics.

(in reply to slavejali)

Profile

Post #: 56