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RE: Personal incomes still falling - 8/26/2013 6:59:58 AM   
Lucylastic


Posts: 40310
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phydeaux


Let me use little words.

1. I said that obamacare was forcing employees into part time jobs.
You said - no its not - look at all these other countries that are doing the same thing. And since they are doing it - it can't be obamacare.


To which my reply was: the fact that other countries are shedding full time jobs into part time jobs does nothing to prove that obamacare isn't have the effect I - and thousands of others have noted.

Its so obviously true I welcome your ridiculous arguments.

2. As for knowing 'everything about insurance' - no. But I wonder if you know anything about it.


ya ya blah blah
I proved that part time jobs were happening outside of the ACA act arena, and then said that it was a rw meme, because it was a factor before the ACA and continues to be a factor in the US UK and canada.
The fact that you rwnjs are using it as an excuse to cut more full time jobs AND blame the ACA is certainly not lost.

http://www.epi.org/publication/a-decade-of-flat-wages-the-key-barrier-to-shared-prosperity-and-a-rising-middle-class/

EPI’s The State of Working America, 12th Edition (Mishel et al. 2012) provides a comprehensive assessment of recent decades’ wage and benefits trends and an extensive analysis of the causes of wage stagnation and wage inequality. In this paper we document the economy’s continuing failure to provide real wage gains for most workers. We track wage trends (and, where possible, compensation trends, which include not just wages but also fringe benefits such as health care and pensions) using both employer-based and household-based survey data. We focus primarily on trends since 2007, the year the Great Recession began. We generally examine year-over-year trends using calendar years, though to assess the most recent trends we also include year-over-year trends using just the first half of each year. We also discuss these trends in the context of patterns since 2000, as the 2000–2007 business cycle—and especially the recovery years of that business cycle, 2002–2007—were characterized by dismal wage growth. In some cases we provide data going back to 1979, as most workers have experienced weak wage growth for more than three decades.

This paper’s key findings include:

According to every major data source, the vast majority of U.S. workers—including white-collar and blue-collar workers and those with and without a college degree—have endured more than a decade of wage stagnation. Wage growth has significantly underperformed productivity growth regardless of occupation, gender, race/ethnicity, or education level.

During the Great Recession and its aftermath (i.e., between 2007 and 2012), wages fell for the entire bottom 70 percent of the wage distribution, despite productivity growth of 7.7 percent.

Weak wage growth predates the Great Recession. Between 2000 and 2007, the median worker saw wage growth of just 2.6 percent, despite productivity growth of 16.0 percent, while the 20th percentile worker saw wage growth of just 1.0 percent and the 80th percentile worker saw wage growth of just 4.6 percent.
The weak wage growth over 2000–2007, combined with the wage losses for most workers from 2007 to 2012, mean that between 2000 and 2012, wages were flat or declined for the entire bottom 60 percent of the wage distribution (despite productivity growing by nearly 25 percent over this period).
Wage growth in the very early part of the 2000–2012 period, between 2000 and 2002, was still being bolstered by momentum from the strong wage growth of the late 1990s. Between 2002 and 2012, wages were stagnant or declined for the entire bottom 70 percent of the wage distribution. In other words, the vast majority of wage earners have already experienced a lost decade, one where real wages were either flat or in decline.

This lost decade for wages comes on the heels of decades of inadequate wage growth. For virtually the entire period since 1979 (with the one exception being the strong wage growth of the late 1990s), wage growth for most workers has been weak. The median worker saw an increase of just 5.0 percent between 1979 and 2012, despite productivity growth of 74.5 percent—while the 20th percentile worker saw wage erosion of 0.4 percent and the 80th percentile worker saw wage growth of just 17.5 percent.

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(in reply to Phydeaux)
Profile   Post #: 41
RE: Personal incomes still falling - 8/26/2013 7:13:01 AM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline
BLS 2007 ------- Uh, when did Obamacare pass?
http://www.bls.gov/opub/mlr/2009/10/art1full.pdf

The ridiculous claim is not the one that says Obamacare has nothing to do with it, in fact, the claim that it is due to Obamacare is patently stupid.


According to CPS annual estimates, part-time workers
made up 17 percent of all employed persons 16 years
and older in 2007, about the same percentage as in the
previous few years. BLS estimates show that part-time
workers tend to be younger than full-time workers,
although they are also disproportionately likely to be
older, near or of retirement age. Part-time workers are
concentrated in the service sector, in industries such as
retail, social services, and food services. Women are far
more likely than men to work part time, with roughly
one-quarter of all employed women usually working
part-time hours. Research has shown that part-time
workers are less likely than full-time workers to receive
employer-based benefits, such as health care coverage or
pensions.
2
Most studies also find that part-time workers
earn less than comparable full-time workers, although
some research suggests that this is not so for certain
populations, such as highly educated women.
3
One important characteristic of part-time workers is
that most of them appear to favor their work arrangement over working full-time hours. The BLS classifies
part-time workers into those who report noneconomic
reasons for working such hours and those who report
economic reasons for doing so. Economic reasons comprise slack work or business conditions, inability to
find full-time work, and seasonal work. Noneconomic
reasons include childcare problems, other family or
personal obligations, and being in school, among other
reasons. Researchers often consider noneconomic reasons to indicate voluntary part-time work, a hypothesis
which assumes that workers choose their employment
arrangement and would not prefer full-time hours.
Economic reasons are often considered to indicate involuntary part-time work, a hypothesis which assumes
that these workers would prefer full-time hours, given
the opportunity to work such hours.
4
Table 1 presents 2007 CPS data on workers’

_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30


(in reply to Lucylastic)
Profile   Post #: 42
RE: Personal incomes still falling - 8/26/2013 7:22:38 AM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline
Data extracted on: August 26, 2013 (10:21:04 AM)

Employment, Hours, and Earnings from the Current Employment Statistics survey (National)

Series Id: CES0500000002
Seasonally Adjusted
Super Sector: Total private
Industry: Total private
NAICS Code: -
Data Type: AVERAGE WEEKLY HOURS OF ALL EMPLOYEES

Download:
Year Jan Feb Mar Apr May Jun Jul Aug Sep Oct Nov Dec Annual
2006 xxx xxx 34.4 34.6 34.5 34.6 34.6 34.5 34.5 34.5 34.5 34.7
2007 34.5 34.5 34.6 34.6 34.6 34.6 34.6 34.6 34.5 34.5 34.5 34.6
2008 34.6 34.6 34.7 34.6 34.6 34.6 34.5 34.5 34.4 34.4 34.3 34.1
2009 34.2 34.0 33.9 33.8 33.8 33.8 33.8 33.8 33.9 33.8 33.9 33.9
2010 34.0 33.9 34.0 34.1 34.2 34.1 34.2 34.2 34.3 34.3 34.2 34.3
2011 34.2 34.3 34.3 34.4 34.4 34.3 34.4 34.3 34.4 34.4 34.4 34.5
2012 34.5 34.6 34.5 34.5 34.4 34.4 34.4 34.4 34.5 34.3 34.4 34.5
2013 34.4 34.5 34.6 34.5 34.5 34.5(P) 34.4(P)
P : preliminary


OBAMA is trying to take your part-time work away!!!!!! LOL.

< Message edited by mnottertail -- 8/26/2013 7:32:21 AM >


_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30


(in reply to mnottertail)
Profile   Post #: 43
RE: Personal incomes still falling - 8/26/2013 9:32:09 AM   
DomKen


Posts: 19457
Joined: 7/4/2004
From: Chicago, IL
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Phydeaux
Ah, so you're a mind reader on top of your many other skills.
And whether Rand Paul is a liar (as you once again allege without evidence) is immaterial. Millions on the right want a small govt.

Just admit you were wrong - and move on. Of course.. I don't think you've ever admitted you were wrong. Ever. About anything.

How precisely does the government get smaller with Rand Paul? He wants to ban abortions which will take more law enforcement. He does not support reducing defense spending which is by far the biggest part of government. Just like every other con he just claims he wants to shrink government but its just a scam.

And one more time about this Vice Presedential candidacy of Rand Paul's who is on top of this ticket you made up?

< Message edited by DomKen -- 8/26/2013 9:33:17 AM >

(in reply to Phydeaux)
Profile   Post #: 44
RE: Personal incomes still falling - 8/26/2013 9:33:51 AM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline
Plus he is the king of pork, government may shrink in oversight, but will increase exponentially in spending with Rand Paul anywhere around.

http://www.nationalreview.com/corner/252748/rand-paul-already-selling-out-veronique-de-rugy

Get me pork out of committee for Kentucky!!!!

OHMYGERD. The National Review, doesn't come any more nutsucker than that for a source. Not even The Heritage Foundation.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/ryan-has-record-of-pushing-for-and-earmarking-federal-funds-for-his-district/2012/08/17/92c099dc-e874-11e1-936a-b801f1abab19_story.html


< Message edited by mnottertail -- 8/26/2013 9:45:05 AM >


_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30


(in reply to DomKen)
Profile   Post #: 45
RE: Personal incomes still falling - 8/26/2013 11:23:40 AM   
thompsonx


Posts: 23322
Joined: 10/1/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Phydeaux

Second Issue: corporations do not pay taxes. Taxes imposed on a corporation are passed on to consumers in the form of higher prices. So either way, consumers pay either in the direct form (government taxes) or the indirect form (higher prices).


So if all corporate taxes were eleminated then the prices of consumer goods would go down?

quote:

The really pernicious thing about this is the side effects of corporate taxes: taxes impose a regulatory burden on a company. It takes incredible amounts of time to comply with Uncle Sams burdens.


Yes you are right the government forces corporations to put hand rails on stairways and requires buildings over x stories tall to have elevators. Do you find this pernicious and burdensom?

quote:

So fewer corporations are formed, fewer products are developed etc.


Would you have any validation for this moronic,peurile nonsense?

quote:

But additionally, when corporations close and jobs are shipped overseas,


Corporations do not close, it is the corp which transfers the jobs overseas.

quote:

the monies that would go to US citizens now goes to supporting chinese citizens.


No, the money that used to go to u.s. citizens now goes to the corporation while the chinese citizen works for slave wages.

quote:

Look, as a thought experiment: What would happen if the corporate tax rates were set to zero.

Sure, the initial effect would be that corporate profits would soar. But after that - what are the companies going to do with their money?

They are either going to
-give it to consumers in the form of stock dividends


Only if the consumer owns stock in said company


quote:

Essentially, we can give the money to the government so *they* can decide what to do with it, or, you can let individuals and corporations keep their money so *they* can decide what to do with it.



How would you support the govt. with no taxes? Would you do away with govt?

quote:

And generally speaking - I would rather millions of people keep their money - and decide how to invest it - than the govt.


In a country of 300+million you wish to keep the money in the hands of the millions as in 2% of 300,000,000

< Message edited by thompsonx -- 8/26/2013 11:27:53 AM >

(in reply to Phydeaux)
Profile   Post #: 46
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