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Massive Fraud in 3... 2... 1 - 7/7/2013 3:26:40 PM   
Kirata


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Health insurance marketplaces will not be required to verify consumer claims

The Obama administration announced Friday that it would significantly scale back the health law’s requirements that new insurance marketplaces verify consumers’ income and health insurance status...

HHS gives up on Obamacare’s anti-fraud measures

With this news coming after the employer mandate delay announcement, the Obama administration has now openly conceded that it is in way over its head...


K.

< Message edited by Kirata -- 7/7/2013 3:27:19 PM >
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RE: Massive Fraud in 3... 2... 1 - 7/7/2013 4:02:51 PM   
jlf1961


Posts: 14840
Joined: 6/10/2008
From: Somewhere Texas
Status: offline 		I have always said that Obamacare was fucked up from the word go, after all the bullshit trying to make everyone happy, they created a law that basically means that everyone is fucked.

And dont tell me that the Republicans have offered anything better. Lets face it, affordable health care for both sides of the fence is about as likely as me being the only winner for both the power ball and mega millions when both of them are worth over a half billion after taxes.

_____________________________

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(in reply to Kirata)
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RE: Massive Fraud in 3... 2... 1 - 7/7/2013 5:39:51 PM   
defiantbadgirl


Posts: 2988
Joined: 11/14/2005
Status: offline 		Everyone should be eligible to sign up on the exchanges. Eligibility for subsidies should be based on income alone. Nobody should be forced to enroll in employer based insurance if subsidized health insurance on the exchange is more affordable. The whole point of the law is to make health care affordable, right? Affordable premiums do no good if workers still can't afford medical care because of their deductibles. Some employers only offer high deductible plans. I think an effort should be made to separate health insurance from employment. That would solve the issue of employees getting their hours cut and businesses refusing to hire full time. I believe that would lead to an increase in JOBS JOBS JOBS.

_____________________________


Only in the United States is the health of the people secondary to making money. If this is what "capitalism" is about, I'll take socialism any day of the week.


Collared by MartinSpankalot May 13 2008

(in reply to Kirata)
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RE: Massive Fraud in 3... 2... 1 - 7/7/2013 6:33:47 PM   
DesideriScuri


Posts: 12225
Joined: 1/18/2012
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quote:

ORIGINAL: defiantbadgirl
Everyone should be eligible to sign up on the exchanges. Eligibility for subsidies should be based on income alone. Nobody should be forced to enroll in employer based insurance if subsidized health insurance on the exchange is more affordable. The whole point of the law is to make health care affordable, right? Affordable premiums do no good if workers still can't afford medical care because of their deductibles. Some employers only offer high deductible plans. I think an effort should be made to separate health insurance from employment. That would solve the issue of employees getting their hours cut and businesses refusing to hire full time. I believe that would lead to an increase in JOBS JOBS JOBS.


This is where you are wrong. This wasn't about affordable care. It isn't actually making care affordable. It is shifting the cost of care onto those who make more money. The actual cost of the care provided isn't going to go down, that is, get more affordable overall. It's simply cost shifting. And, it's really about shifting the cost of insurance, not the cost of care.


_____________________________

What I support:

  • A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  • Personal Responsibility
  • Help for the truly needy
  • Limited Government
  • Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)

(in reply to defiantbadgirl)
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RE: Massive Fraud in 3... 2... 1 - 7/7/2013 7:00:48 PM   
defiantbadgirl


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quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

This is where you are wrong. This wasn't about affordable care. It isn't actually making care affordable. It is shifting the cost of care onto those who make more money. The actual cost of the care provided isn't going to go down, that is, get more affordable overall. It's simply cost shifting. And, it's really about shifting the cost of insurance, not the cost of care.



I meant it would reduce the cost of care to people with low incomes, but you are right in what you say. The beauty of single-payer health care is the ability to control the cost of the health care and drugs (compare the cost of an expensive drug in the US to the cost of the same drug in Canada). The American government is controlled by corporations. Members of congress vote the way they are told to vote by the special interests that finance their campaigns. That's why single-payer, which would've had the ability to control costs, wouldn't pass even with a Democrat controlled Congress. As long as the United States is run by the corporations for the corporations, controlling the actual cost of care like other countries with single-payer systems do will be extremely difficult, if not impossible.


_____________________________


Only in the United States is the health of the people secondary to making money. If this is what "capitalism" is about, I'll take socialism any day of the week.


Collared by MartinSpankalot May 13 2008

(in reply to DesideriScuri)
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RE: Massive Fraud in 3... 2... 1 - 7/7/2013 7:13:25 PM   
MrBukani


Posts: 1920
Joined: 4/18/2010
Status: offline 		It has little to do with the cost of healthcare.
It has to do with profits.
Take the blue pill, it's x

(in reply to defiantbadgirl)
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RE: Massive Fraud in 3... 2... 1 - 7/7/2013 7:26:36 PM   
dcnovice


Posts: 37282
Joined: 8/2/2006
Status: offline
quote:

This wasn't about affordable care. It isn't actually making care affordable.

I discussed this once with the health-care wonk I know best, who lives and breathes this stuff and advises major corporations about managing their health-care costs. He said the ACA had two goals: (a) boosting access to health care and (b) lowering health-care costs. His verdict is that it does (a) but not (b).

_____________________________

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it's never enough to keep up.

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INTELLIGENT LIFE IN THE UNIVERSE

(in reply to DesideriScuri)
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RE: Massive Fraud in 3... 2... 1 - 7/7/2013 7:35:07 PM   
defiantbadgirl


Posts: 2988
Joined: 11/14/2005
Status: offline 		The greedy corporations that run this country won't allow Congress to vote yes on anything that will cut costs because cutting costs will cut their profits. That's why the health care law takes care of one issue and not the other.

_____________________________


Only in the United States is the health of the people secondary to making money. If this is what "capitalism" is about, I'll take socialism any day of the week.


Collared by MartinSpankalot May 13 2008

(in reply to dcnovice)
Profile   Post #: 8
RE: Massive Fraud in 3... 2... 1 - 7/7/2013 9:31:38 PM   
MrRodgers


Posts: 10542
Joined: 7/30/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

quote:

ORIGINAL: defiantbadgirl
Everyone should be eligible to sign up on the exchanges. Eligibility for subsidies should be based on income alone. Nobody should be forced to enroll in employer based insurance if subsidized health insurance on the exchange is more affordable. The whole point of the law is to make health care affordable, right? Affordable premiums do no good if workers still can't afford medical care because of their deductibles. Some employers only offer high deductible plans. I think an effort should be made to separate health insurance from employment. That would solve the issue of employees getting their hours cut and businesses refusing to hire full time. I believe that would lead to an increase in JOBS JOBS JOBS.


This is where you are wrong. This wasn't about affordable care. It isn't actually making care affordable. It is shifting the cost of care onto those who make more money. The actual cost of the care provided isn't going to go down, that is, get more affordable overall. It's simply cost shifting. And, it's really about shifting the cost of insurance, not the cost of care.


You've got it, this is America after all. So it still is as always...about the money and who profits which I wrote about long ago. All bills and regulations of the large markets are written by the profiteers. Obamcare so-called...is no exception.

So the truth is just like the bullshit that doctors. will leave medicare en masse if not flush enough to pay billions...proves or will prove to be just yet another cash cow for industry.

As for the fraud by the enrollees. Could be only a short time before it catches up to medicare, the gift to doctors and hospitals...that keeps on giving.

Oh and by the way, the cost of medical care to the truly poor...was zero. Now it will either cost something with or without a subsidy or even they are fined. More Chomsky 101 even if one needs govt. to help pick up the tab.

Profiteers absolute love these kinds of programs.

< Message edited by MrRodgers -- 7/7/2013 9:38:18 PM >

(in reply to DesideriScuri)
Profile   Post #: 9
RE: Massive Fraud in 3... 2... 1 - 7/7/2013 9:37:40 PM   
thishereboi


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quote:

ORIGINAL: defiantbadgirl

The greedy corporations that run this country won't allow Congress to vote yes on anything that will cut costs because cutting costs will cut their profits. That's why the health care law takes care of one issue and not the other.



When they talk about cutting costs and the aca they are mainly talking about cutting costs to medicare and medicaid. you know the ones the government runs not the greedy corps. And yes it does address many issues involving CMS and cutting costs. Now whether or not it works is another story.

_____________________________

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(in reply to defiantbadgirl)
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RE: Massive Fraud in 3... 2... 1 - 7/7/2013 9:42:19 PM   
MrRodgers


Posts: 10542
Joined: 7/30/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: thishereboi


quote:

ORIGINAL: defiantbadgirl

The greedy corporations that run this country won't allow Congress to vote yes on anything that will cut costs because cutting costs will cut their profits. That's why the health care law takes care of one issue and not the other.



When they talk about cutting costs and the aca they are mainly talking about cutting costs to medicare and medicaid. you know the ones the government runs not the greedy corps. And yes it does address many issues involving CMS and cutting costs. Now whether or not it works is another story.

...not the greedy corps. ? Who do you think are the recipients of most of our medical care costs ? Prices will likely skyrocket now that everybody has to pay and as stated...will get help to do just that.

< Message edited by MrRodgers -- 7/7/2013 9:43:10 PM >

(in reply to thishereboi)
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RE: Massive Fraud in 3... 2... 1 - 7/7/2013 9:44:29 PM   
thishereboi


Posts: 14463
Joined: 6/19/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MrRodgers

quote:

ORIGINAL: thishereboi


quote:

ORIGINAL: defiantbadgirl

The greedy corporations that run this country won't allow Congress to vote yes on anything that will cut costs because cutting costs will cut their profits. That's why the health care law takes care of one issue and not the other.



When they talk about cutting costs and the aca they are mainly talking about cutting costs to medicare and medicaid. you know the ones the government runs not the greedy corps. And yes it does address many issues involving CMS and cutting costs. Now whether or not it works is another story.

...not the greedy corps. ? Who do you think are the recipients of most of our medical care costs ? Prices will likely skyrocket now that everybody has to pay and as stated...will get help to do just that.


I was referring to one of the purposes of the ACA.

_____________________________

"Sweetie, you're wasting your gum" .. Albert


This here is the boi formerly known as orfunboi


(in reply to MrRodgers)
Profile   Post #: 12
RE: Massive Fraud in 3... 2... 1 - 7/8/2013 6:42:28 AM   
DesideriScuri


Posts: 12225
Joined: 1/18/2012
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: thishereboi
quote:

ORIGINAL: MrRodgers
quote:

ORIGINAL: thishereboi
quote:

ORIGINAL: defiantbadgirl
The greedy corporations that run this country won't allow Congress to vote yes on anything that will cut costs because cutting costs will cut their profits. That's why the health care law takes care of one issue and not the other.

When they talk about cutting costs and the aca they are mainly talking about cutting costs to medicare and medicaid. you know the ones the government runs not the greedy corps. And yes it does address many issues involving CMS and cutting costs. Now whether or not it works is another story.

...not the greedy corps. ? Who do you think are the recipients of most of our medical care costs ? Prices will likely skyrocket now that everybody has to pay and as stated...will get help to do just that.

I was referring to one of the purposes of the ACA.


Riiiiight, and the purpose of the Patriot Act?
    quote:

    UNITING AND STRENGTHENING AMERICA BY PROVIDING APPROPRIATE TOOLS REQUIRED TO INTERCEPT AND OBSTRUCT TERRORISM (USA PATRIOT ACT) ACT OF 2001


What is wrong with that, right?

_____________________________

What I support:

  • A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  • Personal Responsibility
  • Help for the truly needy
  • Limited Government
  • Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)

(in reply to thishereboi)
Profile   Post #: 13
RE: Massive Fraud in 3... 2... 1 - 7/8/2013 10:34:51 AM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: dcnovice

quote:

This wasn't about affordable care. It isn't actually making care affordable.

I discussed this once with the health-care wonk I know best, who lives and breathes this stuff and advises major corporations about managing their health-care costs. He said the ACA had two goals: (a) boosting access to health care and (b) lowering health-care costs. His verdict is that it does (a) but not (b).


It does both. Not to the extent I wished it would, but I have been over and over this before. There are many aspects of this law that do lower costs.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to dcnovice)
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RE: Massive Fraud in 3... 2... 1 - 7/8/2013 10:37:00 AM   
thishereboi


Posts: 14463
Joined: 6/19/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

quote:

ORIGINAL: thishereboi
quote:

ORIGINAL: MrRodgers
quote:

ORIGINAL: thishereboi
quote:

ORIGINAL: defiantbadgirl
The greedy corporations that run this country won't allow Congress to vote yes on anything that will cut costs because cutting costs will cut their profits. That's why the health care law takes care of one issue and not the other.

When they talk about cutting costs and the aca they are mainly talking about cutting costs to medicare and medicaid. you know the ones the government runs not the greedy corps. And yes it does address many issues involving CMS and cutting costs. Now whether or not it works is another story.

...not the greedy corps. ? Who do you think are the recipients of most of our medical care costs ? Prices will likely skyrocket now that everybody has to pay and as stated...will get help to do just that.

I was referring to one of the purposes of the ACA.


Riiiiight, and the purpose of the Patriot Act?
    quote:

    UNITING AND STRENGTHENING AMERICA BY PROVIDING APPROPRIATE TOOLS REQUIRED TO INTERCEPT AND OBSTRUCT TERRORISM (USA PATRIOT ACT) ACT OF 2001


What is wrong with that, right?


You want to talk about the patriot act, start a thread on it. That is not what my post was about.


_____________________________

"Sweetie, you're wasting your gum" .. Albert


This here is the boi formerly known as orfunboi


(in reply to DesideriScuri)
Profile   Post #: 15
RE: Massive Fraud in 3... 2... 1 - 7/8/2013 10:42:59 AM   
RacerJim


Posts: 1583
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline 		Obamacare was never about healthcare per se but, rather, about more government control over the people...the very reason the Founding Father's declared independence from England and the exact opposite of the intent of the U.S. Constitution.

(in reply to thishereboi)
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RE: Massive Fraud in 3... 2... 1 - 7/8/2013 10:45:19 AM   
Moonhead


Posts: 16520
Joined: 9/21/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: RacerJim

Obamacare was never about healthcare per se but, rather, about more government control over the people...the very reason the Founding Father's declared independence from England and the exact opposite of the intent of the U.S. Constitution.

Care to show your working out on that one?

_____________________________

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(in reply to RacerJim)
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RE: Massive Fraud in 3... 2... 1 - 7/8/2013 10:54:56 AM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline 		Oh that is easy, Moon... because national healthcare as insurance was never a part of the Constitution.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to Moonhead)
Profile   Post #: 18
RE: Massive Fraud in 3... 2... 1 - 7/8/2013 11:04:51 AM   
Moonhead


Posts: 16520
Joined: 9/21/2009
Status: offline 		Hmmmm. Presumably they shouldn't be using antisepsis, painkillers, anaesthesia and other medical technologies undreamed of during the 18th century if it's purely a constitutional matter, then. I'm reminded of Ralf Hutter (of Kraftwerk)'s comments about fundamentalist musicians who presumably don't take a similar approach to technology when they visit their dentist. Somebody is showing more backbone than the '70s boogie guitar bores did...

_____________________________

I like to think he was eaten by rats, in the dark, during a fog. It's what he would have wanted...
(Simon R Green on the late James Herbert)

(in reply to tazzygirl)
Profile   Post #: 19
RE: Massive Fraud in 3... 2... 1 - 7/8/2013 1:08:39 PM   
tj444


Posts: 7574
Joined: 3/7/2010
Status: offline 		JMO.. but I think that they are simply saying this to get everyone to sign up for ACA, its to suck people in.. once they do and the dust settles.. at some point I fully expect they will indeed start verifying everyone's income & if they do qualify, blah blah blah.. which is also why this has been put into the IRS dept..

_____________________________

As Anderson Cooper said “If he (Trump) took a dump on his desk, you would defend it”

(in reply to Kirata)
Profile   Post #: 20
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