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RE: Religion and Serial Killers - 7/26/2012 7:48:41 AM   
Moonhead


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quote:

ORIGINAL: jlf1961
You are confusing anti social behavior disorder with sociopathic disorder.

Isn't one a subset of the other?

_____________________________

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(in reply to jlf1961)
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RE: Religion and Serial Killers - 7/26/2012 9:06:46 AM   
Nosathro


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From: Orange County, California
Status: offline 		The DSM, now #5, I believe, it has been awhile list the various mental disorders. In the diagnosis there are five axis. The first axis is the major disorder, such as depression, Bi-polar, etc. The second axies is used for personality disorders, these disorders would include histonic, ego mania, etc. I think this is what he is referring to, there is an anti social disorder for this axies. Then axies three is medical, fourther is employment/family and the fifth is a GAF score, would be interesting to know what Holmes GAF is?

(in reply to Moonhead)
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RE: Religion and Serial Killers - 7/26/2012 9:47:22 AM   
jlf1961


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From: Somewhere Texas
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Moonhead


quote:

ORIGINAL: jlf1961
You are confusing anti social behavior disorder with sociopathic disorder.

Isn't one a subset of the other?



No, they are two different things entirely.

_____________________________

Boy, it sure would be nice if we had some grenades, don't you think?

You cannot control who comes into your life, but you can control which airlock you throw them out of.

Paranoid Paramilitary Gun Loving Conspiracy Theorist AND EQUAL OPPORTUNI

(in reply to Moonhead)
Profile   Post #: 43
RE: Religion and Serial Killers - 7/26/2012 10:18:46 AM   
Moonhead


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Joined: 9/21/2009
Status: offline 		Right. I thought they'd dumped sociopathy as a separate category a while back and it was now treated as the antisocial behaviour disorder's lunatic fringe.

_____________________________

I like to think he was eaten by rats, in the dark, during a fog. It's what he would have wanted...
(Simon R Green on the late James Herbert)

(in reply to jlf1961)
Profile   Post #: 44
RE: Religion and Serial Killers - 7/26/2012 9:17:07 PM   
hlen5


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quote:

ORIGINAL: SadistDave

quote:

ORIGINAL: hlen5


quote:

ORIGINAL: SadistDave

Currently, the majority of mass murderers in the world tend to strap on bomb vests and blow themselves up in a fit of Islamic extremism.

It's just not politically correct for the FBI to say that.

-SD-


Would someone who sits at a computer screen playing with a toggle switch half-way around the world qualify as a mass murderer? Especially considering the vague encompassing parameters employed as to whom deserves the drone-load?
3

Well, if you want to have this ridiculous argument... I will agree it is murder and I'm pleased as punch to do it. It is a function of a military at war to kill people. I'm actually pro-death when it comes to legitimate reasons people should just die, so you may want to read this post and re-think this position before you respond.

If we are going to figure that the actions of a military as murder, I am more than willing to concede that point for you. And if we are going to count government sanctioned acts a murder, I suggest you look up the CDC website and find the statistics for all the state sponsored murder caused by abortions in America. You might want to look extra hard at the racist practices of the left of placing an overwhelming number of abortion clinics in poor black neighborhoods and the number of black children snuffed by the lefts brand of legalized murder. I'll get to that in a minute...

In American liberal land, it is a function of peace to innocently murder huge segments of the population through abortion. I'm pretty sure that as someone who is pro-death, my understanding that genocide for political purposes is just plain evil puts me on a higher moral plane than people who don't see the distinction between genocide in peace and collateral damage in war.

I'll save you some trouble. Here are the numbers from 2007 that clearly show that liberals who support abortion are supporting the genocide of the American black. Again, I'll save you some trouble. After discounting all the cases the CDC did not count, there were still 827,609 abortions in 2007. Of those. Scan down to table 13, and you will find that the average for the number of black who recieve abortions every year is pretty stable around 38%.

So, if you're a liberal and you support abortion, I'd say the numbers are pretty clear that you not only take the prize for state sanctioned murder, but it also negates the argument that conservatives are racist. They are the only people standing between American blacks and this liberal induced genocide.
If you would care to debate this point and show that drones killed more than 827,609 in 2007, I'd love to see your data. I'm willing to bet that you are tragically misinformed on this point. Oh wait, here it is! Lets see... This is America in Afghanistan and Pakistan... The 8 year high (that's eight years as compared to 2007 numbers on abortion) comes to a whopping 5,300 or so if we add those years together. Well shy of the 827,600 mark of 2007 state sanctioned murders supported by the liberals at abortion clinics around the country.

Shall we can stick to the topic of religious extremists and someone can provide the numbers that supports this theory that extreme Catholics or rabid Protestants kill more people than extreme Islamists?-SD-


Answering what I've bolded...

- Is this what you actually do for a living?

- So your theory is that the left is conspiring to abort only black pregnancies? Since when do political parties designate where clinics should be placed?

- I'm sure American Blacks are humbly grateful for Conservatives saving them from their own self-determination.

Who made any assumption that Christian nuts kill more (or less) people than Islamic nuts?

Actually SD, I did take the thread off topic a little, so you're right to call me on that. The thing I was objecting to however, was that the subject was serial killers. Not political mass murderers. I was drawing a comparison between collateral damage from either suicide bombers or drone bombers. Do you know that the only criteria for being a legitimate drone target is being a male of fighting age and being in the drop zone?

Lest I go even further off topic, I won't comment on this thread again.

(in reply to SadistDave)
Profile   Post #: 45
RE: Religion and Serial Killers - 7/27/2012 2:53:05 AM   
Aswad


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quote:

ORIGINAL: SadistDave

It's just not politically correct for the FBI to say that.


Actually, like most agencies, they say that quite often.

What they also point out, quite correctly, is that it's not really a domestic problem.

You need to bear in mind that the conditions in, say, Somalia are somewhat different than the conditions in the USA.

IWYW,
— Aswad.



_____________________________

"If God saw what any of us did that night, he didn't seem to mind.
From then on I knew: God doesn't make the world this way.
We do." -- Rorschack, Watchmen.


(in reply to SadistDave)
Profile   Post #: 46
RE: Religion and Serial Killers - 7/27/2012 8:45:15 AM   
jlf1961


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From: Somewhere Texas
Status: offline 		One must remember there is a difference between a serial killer and a killer like Holmes, who would be considered a spree killer or mass murderer.

_____________________________

Boy, it sure would be nice if we had some grenades, don't you think?

You cannot control who comes into your life, but you can control which airlock you throw them out of.

Paranoid Paramilitary Gun Loving Conspiracy Theorist AND EQUAL OPPORTUNI

(in reply to Aswad)
Profile   Post #: 47
RE: Religion and Serial Killers - 7/27/2012 8:47:48 AM   
Moonhead


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Status: offline 		Quite a big difference, in fact. They're radically different syndromes.
Apart from anything else, serial killers don't want to get caught and are a bit more discriminating about their victims.

_____________________________

I like to think he was eaten by rats, in the dark, during a fog. It's what he would have wanted...
(Simon R Green on the late James Herbert)

(in reply to jlf1961)
Profile   Post #: 48
RE: Religion and Serial Killers - 7/27/2012 4:30:41 PM   
Rule


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quote:

ORIGINAL: jlf1961
So, what kind of influences does religion have on the mind of a serial killer, or is it just a random statistic due to the fact that most americans are religious in some form or another?

Religion and laws are crutches for sociopaths and narcissists who by definition lack the function of innate ethics. If some serial killers became more deeply religious before commencing a killing spree or series, then I would suspect that their lack of innate ethics had worsened and that they were driven to become more religious in order to compensate for that deterioration - and failed.

(in reply to jlf1961)
Profile   Post #: 49
RE: Religion and Serial Killers - 7/27/2012 5:55:14 PM   
Edwynn


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quote:

ORIGINAL: jlf1961

According to an FBI profile:

quote:

The FBI gave the standard profile of a serial killer, He is a person with few friends. He became much more religious just before he started murdering people. After reading all the available studies I could find and studying all the articles in the newspapers for over 30 years, I find what is most outstanding is Serial killers were sexually inhibited by their strong religious upbringing.

Nearly all serial killers are very devout men who were raised by members of Pentecostal sects, fundamentalist Catholics or were 'hard-shell' Baptists and Methodists."

Studies after study show serial killers are a product of this environment, not genetics.

source


However there is a study that says there are other influences on the mind of a serial killer.

quote:

A startling amount of criminals on death row have been clinically diagnosed with brain disorders. A recent study has demonstrated that 20 out of 31 confessed killers are diagnosed as mentally ill. Out of that 20, 64% have frontal lobe abnormalities. (1) A thorough study of the profiles of many serial killers shows that many of them had suffered sever head injuries (to the frontal lobe) when they were children. To discover why damage to the frontal lobe could be a cause of serial killing, one must look at the function of the frontal lobe of the brain.

source


According to yet another study it is a combination of environment and a mental disorder. On a recent science channel study, one doctor studied the brains of serial killers and noticed they all had the same problems, however, he also noted that his brain scans had the same abnormality.

So, what kind of influences does religion have on the mind of a serial killer, or is it just a random statistic due to the fact that most americans are religious in some form or another?




In every, and I mean EVERY instance of mass killings since and including the first incident in Arkansas (or so we think) and at Columbine, prescription antidepressants or other behavioral modification drugs were involved.

Lets get to first things first, keep the crap religion or politics out of it.

Not quite what you were looking for, was it?



< Message edited by Edwynn -- 7/27/2012 5:56:57 PM >

(in reply to jlf1961)
Profile   Post #: 50
RE: Religion and Serial Killers - 7/27/2012 6:54:07 PM   
jlf1961


Posts: 14840
Joined: 6/10/2008
From: Somewhere Texas
Status: offline 		You might want to research just how many anti depressant medications are prescribed in the US. Just because the person is on these medications does not mean they are going to go off a shoot people.

I am bipolar, have an anti-social personality disorder, take anti depressants and mood stabilizers AND I own firearms.

Worried?

_____________________________

Boy, it sure would be nice if we had some grenades, don't you think?

You cannot control who comes into your life, but you can control which airlock you throw them out of.

Paranoid Paramilitary Gun Loving Conspiracy Theorist AND EQUAL OPPORTUNI

(in reply to Edwynn)
Profile   Post #: 51
RE: Religion and Serial Killers - 7/27/2012 10:56:15 PM   
Aswad


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quote:

ORIGINAL: jlf1961

Worried?


Don't know about Edwynn, but for me: not in the least. Until and unless you show up crazy or tell me you have specific plans to go crazy, I'm not going to be concerned. And even then, there's about an ocean worth of distance seperating us. However, my personal experiences tell me serotonin reuptake inhibitors can, in rare instances, increase the risk of something turning out badly. I've been on most of the major classes of antidepressant drugs, and the serotonin reuptake inhibitors were the only ones that had this odd tendency to make me feel less sensitive to the potential for adverse outcomes and less invested in good outcomes. That more or less translates to a partial sense of detachment that could, if one were already inclined to go crazy, make it more likely that one actually would. Not by much, and I suspect it would even out all in all, plus this is anecdotal, but it makes me interested in seeing more research done into the possibility of a connection.

That said, you have 300 million people, a lot of places with high target density, few safety nets to ensure people have something to lose, and ample opportunities for anyone to go crazy (e.g. ready availability of guns when one has already gone over the edge). It strikes me as a combination that is far more relevant than drugs, religion, etc. For that matter, when people are having a hard time, drugs and religion are the two first things they tend to turn to, so it's not exactly as if the direction of causality is particularly clear in regard to those two. Living a messed up life under poor conditions, but not so far out that one can't go over the top, is- if memory serves- one of the best predictors of violence.

Where I live, if you're messed up to the extent the Aurora killer was, you'll be encouraged to settle for welfare instead of trying to go the route of a high workload education and high stress profession, and you'll have that to fall back on if you do try and fail. The USA has no such alternative, realistically, so anyone too messed up to have a good shot at surviving has to try at something that'll most likely fail, and will be exposed to stressors that may outstrip one's coping skills in the process. While I'm all for the idea that people should stand on their own if they can, it seems ludicrous to expect them to just lie down and die quietly in the midst of an extremely wealthy environment if they can't. That's not so much a question of entitlement as a realistic view of what an individual is likely to bear and a perspective on the just world bias (which is in itself a double edged sword).

IWYW,
— Aswad.



_____________________________

"If God saw what any of us did that night, he didn't seem to mind.
From then on I knew: God doesn't make the world this way.
We do." -- Rorschack, Watchmen.


(in reply to jlf1961)
Profile   Post #: 52
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