Collarspace Discussion Forums


Home  Login  Search 

Santorum..Gas prices caused the recession


View related threads: (in this forum | in all forums)

Logged in as: Guest
 
All Forums >> [Community Discussions] >> Dungeon of Political and Religious Discussion >> Santorum..Gas prices caused the recession Page: [1]
Login
Message << Older Topic   Newer Topic >>
Santorum..Gas prices caused the recession - 2/27/2012 5:47:59 PM   
Lucylastic


Posts: 40310
Status: offline 		Lansing, Michigan (CNN) - Rick Santorum argued Monday that it was high gas prices, not dubious lending practices or complex Wall Street trades, which torpedoed the housing market in 2008 and brought on the current prolonged economic slump.

The Republican presidential candidate made the claim at a campaign event in Lansing, Michigan while accusing President Barack Obama of blocking the expansion of domestic energy production.

"We need to look at the situation with gas prices today," Santorum said. "We went into a recession in 2008 because of gasoline prices. The bubble burst in housing because people couldn't pay their mortgages because they were looking at $4 a gallon gasoline."

"Look at what happened," Santorum continued. "Economic decline. Here we are again. Trying to struggle out of a recession with Barack Obama and the federal government on the backs of business, not letting them grow. And now we have energy prices again, why? Because of government policy."

After the event, however, Santorum sought to clarify his remarks with reporters and described gas prices as a "factor" in the crisis, not necessarily the cause.

"I said that that was a factor. I'm sorry. I will make sure that I will be much more specific when I talk about it," Santorum said.

Asked if he misspoke, Santorum replied: "Energy prices were spiking up in the summer of 2008 and that was a factor."

Video and more
http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2012/02/27/santorum-high-gas-prices-caused-the-recession/

Maybe he forgot also that reliance on foreign oil is the lowest it has been in 16 years, maybe he should have used the word "factor" in his speech.
He comes across as a lying desperate loony.

_____________________________

(•_•)
<) )╯SUCH
/ \

\(•_•)
( (> A NASTY
/ \

(•_•)
<) )> WOMAN
/ \

Duchess Of Dissent
Dont Hate Love
Profile   Post #: 1
RE: Santorum..Gas prices caused the recession - 2/27/2012 6:06:38 PM   
kalikshama


Posts: 14805
Joined: 8/8/2010
Status: offline

(in reply to Lucylastic)
Profile   Post #: 2
RE: Santorum..Gas prices caused the recession - 2/27/2012 6:42:44 PM   
SoftBonds


Posts: 862
Joined: 2/10/2012
Status: offline 		UGH...shiver...
I HATE agreeing with Santorum, on anything, for any reason, even partially... yuck.
Shudder...
Anyway...
Urgh.
OK, I think I have a handle on it now.
Anyway.
At least I am disagreeing with what he would want me to think.
Focus:
OK.
This doesn't apply to the vast majority of foreclosures, but...
So when Americans were convinced by the mega-banks that homes were "an investment" and that they should buy the biggest house they could afford and send most of their money to the banks in mortgage payments, it led to a significant growth in the sizes of homes people bought. This accelerated the movement of people outside of town, as people moved further from work and accepted long commutes to get big houses and nice schools. This trend had already started, but it got ridiculous in the 2000's.
Then gas prices went up. Folks who were commuting an hour or more each way felt it worse than others. Suddenly those huge houses they could barely afford were not such a great idea. For me, doubling the price of gas costs me $50 a month, for those folks it was hundreds...
I think (hope) that we are returning to the idea of getting a home near our workplaces. It will save gas, which helps our personal finances, national trade balance, and strategic security. But I do have to admit that some of the least likely foreclosures were probably influenced by gas prices. Of course, the vast majority were caused by fly-by-night lending companies that set up lair's loans, sold them, and then ran off with the profits. Wish we could go back and sue the workers and owners of those companies for malpractice...

Edit: Want to make sure everyone realizes I'm not a supporter of Santorum...

< Message edited by SoftBonds -- 2/27/2012 6:43:41 PM >

(in reply to Lucylastic)
Profile   Post #: 3
RE: Santorum..Gas prices caused the recession - 2/27/2012 6:45:31 PM   
Lucylastic


Posts: 40310
Status: offline 		You Damned Santorum Supporter..Now Im gonna hurt you!!!!!!!

_____________________________

(•_•)
<) )╯SUCH
/ \

\(•_•)
( (> A NASTY
/ \

(•_•)
<) )> WOMAN
/ \

Duchess Of Dissent
Dont Hate Love

(in reply to SoftBonds)
Profile   Post #: 4
RE: Santorum..Gas prices caused the recession - 2/27/2012 7:01:16 PM   
slvemike4u


Posts: 17896
Joined: 1/15/2008
From: United States
Status: offline 		Always willing to hurt folks...and here I am begging You for years to hurt me.....and nothing.

_____________________________

If we want things to stay as they are,things will have to change...Tancredi from "the Leopard"

Forget Guns-----Ban the pools

Funny stuff....https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNwFf991d-4


(in reply to Lucylastic)
Profile   Post #: 5
RE: Santorum..Gas prices caused the recession - 2/27/2012 7:03:26 PM   
erieangel


Posts: 2237
Joined: 6/19/2011
Status: offline 		Softbonds, I get what you're saying and I agree with you that living a long way from work is a factor, I don't think that's what Santorum was saying. Anyway, while I read Santorum's remarks all I could think was 'yeah, and it all happened under Bush's administration'. Though to be fair, the housing bubble started under Clinton and got ridiculous after the repeal of Glass/Steagal.

Santorum would have everybody believe that domestic production is low, but Obama has kept Bush's oil policy in place and there is now more oil production in the Continental US than ever--also many off shore drilling sites have opened up. But all this oil production does no good if it isn't being refined and I've heard from several sources that refineries having been working to, and even above capacity.

(in reply to SoftBonds)
Profile   Post #: 6
RE: Santorum..Gas prices caused the recession - 2/27/2012 7:09:09 PM   
DaddySatyr


Posts: 9381
Joined: 8/29/2011
From: Pittston, Pennsyltucky
Status: offline 		I think any rise in gas prices helps to worsen a situation that's already bad.

I would posit that no matter where a person lives, if they're unemployed and honestly looking for work, they spend more money, driving to all those interviews than a person that has a "regular" commute. Yes, I know. The person that lives in Downtown Dallas who's looking for work doesn't have as long of a commute as say ... (I don't know. Houston's too far away to commute, daily. Right?) a person who lives 70 miles outside Dallas who's driving in, every day. But, they sure spend a lot of fuel on all those "little trips". Talk about adding insult to injury. You're unemployed. Now spend three times as much as you used to, when commuting to try and find work.

I don't like agreeing with Senator Santorum, either but, even a broken clock is right, twice a day.



Peace and comfort,



Michael

_____________________________

A Stone in My Shoe

Screen captures (and pissing on shadows) still RULE! Ya feel me?

"For that which I love, I will do horrible things"

(in reply to slvemike4u)
Profile   Post #: 7
RE: Santorum..Gas prices caused the recession - 2/27/2012 7:14:37 PM   
thishereboi


Posts: 14463
Joined: 6/19/2008
Status: offline 		So you don't think it was a factor in it?

_____________________________

"Sweetie, you're wasting your gum" .. Albert


This here is the boi formerly known as orfunboi


(in reply to Lucylastic)
Profile   Post #: 8
RE: Santorum..Gas prices caused the recession - 2/27/2012 9:25:03 PM   
MrRodgers


Posts: 10542
Joined: 7/30/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: SoftBonds

UGH...shiver...
I HATE agreeing with Santorum, on anything, for any reason, even partially... yuck.
Shudder...
Anyway...
Urgh.
OK, I think I have a handle on it now.
Anyway.
At least I am disagreeing with what he would want me to think.
Focus:
OK.
This doesn't apply to the vast majority of foreclosures, but...
So when Americans were convinced by the mega-banks that homes were "an investment" and that they should buy the biggest house they could afford and send most of their money to the banks in mortgage payments, it led to a significant growth in the sizes of homes people bought. This accelerated the movement of people outside of town, as people moved further from work and accepted long commutes to get big houses and nice schools. This trend had already started, but it got ridiculous in the 2000's.
Then gas prices went up. Folks who were commuting an hour or more each way felt it worse than others. Suddenly those huge houses they could barely afford were not such a great idea. For me, doubling the price of gas costs me $50 a month, for those folks it was hundreds...
I think (hope) that we are returning to the idea of getting a home near our workplaces. It will save gas, which helps our personal finances, national trade balance, and strategic security. But I do have to admit that some of the least likely foreclosures were probably influenced by gas prices. Of course, the vast majority were caused by fly-by-night lending companies that set up lair's loans, sold them, and then ran off with the profits. Wish we could go back and sue the workers and owners of those companies for malpractice...

Edit: Want to make sure everyone realizes I'm not a supporter of Santorum...

The fact is, most of the foreclosures were precipitated by mortgage lending to people who were unqualified or otherwise...outright mortgage fraud. This was Countrywide and a few others who were writing $billions a week in mortgages. A few of the principals will be indicted.

Recall, Fannie and Freddie bought these up clearly outside the historical lending ratios.Then [they] borrowed to make even more. Bonuses baby...got to achieve the numbers boys and we get bonuses.

Next, bankers didn't just get that magical AAA rating, the the big investment banks borrowed to buy more...to sell more. What could better than a AAA rating on toilet paper. After a couple years of this...well, you begin to get the picture.

Gas prices just simply on the rise by then had little additional effect on any defaults.

(in reply to SoftBonds)
Profile   Post #: 9
RE: Santorum..Gas prices caused the recession - 2/27/2012 9:28:03 PM   
SoftBonds


Posts: 862
Joined: 2/10/2012
Status: offline 		Oh, I agree entirely with you. I think that gas prices had a tiny effect, and crooked lenders had the largest effect.
That said, thishereboi seems to want to debate it...

_____________________________

Elite Thread Hijacker!
Ignored: ThompsonX, RealOne (so folks know why I don't reply)

The last poster is often not the "winner," of the thread, just the one who was most annoying.

(in reply to MrRodgers)
Profile   Post #: 10
RE: Santorum..Gas prices caused the recession - 2/27/2012 11:26:31 PM   
SilverBoat


Posts: 257
Joined: 7/26/2006
Status: offline 		Santorum said "caused" to a particular audience because he thought he could get away with hyping their rightwing-mob mentality, and not get called to task for rhetorical excess (actually lying about cause-effect 'factors'). When he got called on it, he started crawfishing to cover his ass, but you can bet your sweet bippy he'll keep pulling psychological stunts like that.

Sure, oil/gas/energy prices factored into the beginning of the recession, but as the economy slowed, demand for fuels dropped, which lowered its prices.

And for those of you who blame fraudulent mortgages for the economic collapse, I'd recommend some reading about mortgage 'bundling' and 'tranches', and about debt and credit 'instruments' ... The primary cause of the US (and global) economic collapse had its origins in $400+Trillion (yes, Trillions, 25yrs-worth of US-GDP) of face-value and penalty clauses in complex contracts that banks and brokers had signed with each other, and they'd jiggered each other so viciously that none of them knew who owed who how much. Since they'd figured to collect those Hundred-Trillions out of interest on the millions of mortgages, and they'd insured each other against default, the whole mess imploded when they realized how f**ked they all were, and stopped loaning money to anybody and started trying to claw their balance sheets back into reality.

If the Fed hadn't pumped $20-Trillion in 0.25% loans into the bank/broker crooks' operations, there wouldn't be anything resembling recovery going on. YMMV of course, but how many $100k houses would $500-Billion in economic stimulus buy? The $20-Trillion tops the total value of US residential real-estate. At some point in all that, an intelligent citizen ought to notice their government had sold them out to $Trillions in financial fraud. It doesn't say much for the US public that so few have noticed.

(in reply to SoftBonds)
Profile   Post #: 11
RE: Santorum..Gas prices caused the recession - 2/28/2012 2:35:34 AM   
Politesub53


Posts: 14862
Joined: 5/7/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: thishereboi

So you don't think it was a factor in it?


No it wasnt, not by a long way. Worldwide the reason was down to one thing in 2008. The financial markets.

If the US economy is so fragile a fluctuation in oil prices makes it collapse, then its time to ditch capitalism.
I think Santorum is confusing boom and bust, which sometimes happens when there is an oil crisis, with financial meltdown. These are two completely seperate events. The man was clearly playing to the gallery.

To put it bluntly....... Misspoke, my arse.

(in reply to thishereboi)
Profile   Post #: 12
RE: Santorum..Gas prices caused the recession - 2/28/2012 5:20:23 AM   
kalikshama


Posts: 14805
Joined: 8/8/2010
Status: offline 		Hopefully, gas prices today comes under normal thread drift.

http://articles.latimes.com/2012/feb/21/business/la-fi-gas-prices-20120221

1. maintenance at California refineries

2. heightened tensions over Iran's nuclear program. And Monday, crude futures jumped to a nine-month high after Iran said it had halted some oil shipments

3. Republican presidential primary hopeful Rick Santorum on Monday blamed President Obama's "radical environmentalist policies" for the increasing gasoline prices.

4. gas prices in the U.S. typically head higher with the onset of spring as more drivers hit the road and refineries in pollution-prone regions begin the tricky switch, mandated by environmental rules, from the winter gasoline formula to summer gas, which is more expensive to produce.*

5. hedge fund managers who have poured billions of dollars into the commodities market are driving up the price of oil and gasoline.

--------

* Why is summer fuel more expensive than winter fuel?

...winter-grade fuel uses more butane, with its high Reid Vapor Pressure (RVP) of 52 PSI, as an additive. Butane is inexpensive and plentiful, contributing to lower prices.

(in reply to Lucylastic)
Profile   Post #: 13
RE: Santorum..Gas prices caused the recession - 2/28/2012 6:21:11 AM   
Hippiekinkster


Posts: 5512
Joined: 11/20/2007
From: Liechtenstein
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: thishereboi

So you don't think it was a factor in it?
I made a post over a year ago (damned if I know how to search back that far) in which I said the same thing... that the rise in fuel prices (not just gas, but diesel, heating oil (not sure about natural gas)) was a contributary factor in the Great Housing Bubble Collapse.



_____________________________

"We are convinced that freedom w/o Socialism is privilege and injustice, and that Socialism w/o freedom is slavery and brutality." Bakunin

“Nothing we do, however virtuous, can be accomplished alone; therefore we are saved by love.” Reinhold Ne

(in reply to thishereboi)
Profile   Post #: 14
RE: Santorum..Gas prices caused the recession - 2/28/2012 7:31:12 AM   
Owner59


Posts: 17033
Joined: 3/14/2006
From: Dirty Jersey
Status: offline 		Odd......in that cons spent a lot of their time denying that there was a recession.

_____________________________

"As for our common defense, we reject as false the choice between our safety and our ideals"

President Obama

(in reply to Hippiekinkster)
Profile   Post #: 15
RE: Santorum..Gas prices caused the recession - 2/28/2012 7:38:51 AM   
SternSkipper


Posts: 7546
Joined: 3/7/2004
Status: offline
quote:

Odd......in that cons spent a lot of their time denying that there was a recession.


Not at all.... If they acknowledged the recession's actual existence they would have to acknowledge who brought it about and how it was the longest in the memory of most living people. AND they would have to acknowledge that not only did things stabalize a great deal under Obama, that they are slowly getting better.

Too Slow GOP. Well next time YOU Take MY ASSETS OUT FOR A JOYRIDE....





Attachment (1)

_____________________________

Looking forward to The Dead Singing The National Anthem At The World Series.




Tinfoilers Swallow


(in reply to Owner59)
Profile   Post #: 16
Page:   [1]
All Forums >> [Community Discussions] >> Dungeon of Political and Religious Discussion >> Santorum..Gas prices caused the recession Page: [1]
Jump to:





New Messages No New Messages
Hot Topic w/ New Messages Hot Topic w/o New Messages
Locked w/ New Messages Locked w/o New Messages
 Post New Thread
 Reply to Message
 Post New Poll
 Submit Vote
 Delete My Own Post
 Delete My Own Thread
 Rate Posts




Collarchat.com © 2025
Terms of Service Privacy Policy Spam Policy

0.156