RE: Reversing your "role" when playing...

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oneluckysub -> RE: Reversing your "role" when playing... (11/1/2011 3:58:53 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LadyHibiscus Personally, I don't get the women who would "lose all respect" for their man if he wanted something or other. If you even suspect that you have that in you, don't even try it. Personally, I think having my back flogged feels great (as long as they follow freakin directions!) and what's the big deal if he lies on the bed and you get a workout? To ME, it's the same as a massage. I would like to think that making him happy would be good, and you would dig that. You could also find that you like topping. Who knows, maybe you're a secret sadist!! It's been known to happen--actually, some of the most creative tops I have ever met were submissive. Trust your gut, and don't be afraid to NOT take a chance if you think that things might change in a bad way. I have never been with a Dom who wanted me to Top him so I have spent some time thinking about this and found that I needed to get some more perspectives before I could even make a decision if I would be able to do it. My guts says that if he likes it and wants me to do it, I will enjoy doing it. Partially, because he would have to tell me what to do and, at least for a little while, tell me how to do it. I would still be following his orders so I dont think I would lose any respect for him because of it. Thanks for the input that you all have provided. And yes Lady Hibiscus, I may just have a sadistic streak in me!

LillyBoPeep -> RE: Reversing your "role" when playing... (11/1/2011 4:14:07 PM)
i don't really know what i'd think. i think a lot of people conflate topping with domination and bottoming with submission, and so, if they felt that they had to dominate their Ms/Ds, then they'd feel conflicted and it might challenge their relationship. if they could separate topping and domination, it might change the way they see it, but as is, it's a perfectly reasonable frame of mind. i've had the relationship where my M used topping as an extension of domination, and the current relationship with my Top friend who is a play partner, but that's where it ends. i've never been asked to top a partner who also dominates me (i've never been asked to top, period). The only things i could see myself doing as a "Top," would be rope, and cell popping, but those are more art things to me, than an active enforcement of a state of domination. so how do you define topping? is it connected with/an extension or an expression of domination, or just an activity? i don't really have any interest in topping. that said, there have been some things i've been interested in where someone might take that as a top/bottom situation. i dunno... it probably would change my opinion on a relationship if i was expected to top AND dominate someone. i don't have any real-tiem experience with it, though, so i can't say anything for sure. i don't get bored of my role because to me, like others have said, it's not a role. it's just how i am. though i guess you could say that being a "sister" is a role, being a "mother" is a role -- all facets of one whole. but i don't get bored of being myself. i like sadistic men who want me to serve them and want to whack on me. =p it's not about me getting attention, or being a lazy lay (i'm definitely not =p), it's about a complementary existence with someone who wants what i am/have to offer.

Ninebelowzero -> RE: Reversing your "role" when playing... (11/1/2011 4:23:08 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Ninebelowzero That would put the biggest grin on that dudes face for a long time. I doubt he would freak at all. quote: ORIGINAL: Lockit quote: ORIGINAL: LadyHibiscus I am a dominant ALL the time, no matter what. Back in the day, I bottomed very heavily, and always switching with the same people. It amused us. I was in it for the physical challenge, and the search for endorphins...at least I got some exceptionally cool marks out of it, lord knows those endorphins are elusive little suckers... There are some masochistic things that I still enjoy in the right circumstances, and EXACTLY the way I want it. I have really startled partners in the past when I got up and said NO you're doing it wrong! Damn... I forgot about that aspect of things. [:D] Wake up Lockit! I may need to marry and go to a cooled man-cave and get all nurtured up cause I'm sick and forgettin stuff. Shall I book a flight for two? hehe Freak that dude out!

Wolf2Bear -> RE: Reversing your "role" when playing... (11/1/2011 4:23:09 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Clickofheels In my opinion, Switches are people who can't make up their minds as to what they are. And I am not here as an available "benefit" of this website for them to experiment with! <laughs> Do I REALLY look like a test tube? ??? I think not! I know who I am....and I want a D/s partner who does as well. And I honestly don't feel it is either too much nor too outlandish to expect. Respectfully, Clickofheels With all due respect, as one of these switches, the point I feel you are missing is many of us who do switch, don't do so at our whim. I think what you miss is that when I and many others when we approach someone who is fully dominant, we are approaching them as a submissive; in most cases. maybe your own experiences with switches have been les than satisfactory yet many of us have a good grasp to what specific elements are needed to move from dominant to submission and back again. Every single time I have been in service to another...it has always been I am the sub and they are the dominant. Thus all the protocols and the dynamics between us follow that path which we both agreed upon. The thing is, we switched know how to make our minds up, we know what we want and we know what we need. This also applies to one who is in a relationship with another like I am. My cub is also a switch and he knows how to take the subtle clues and acts accordingly and viceversa.

Daddysredhead -> RE: Reversing your "role" when playing... (11/1/2011 5:43:12 PM)
I am also a switch and it isn't because I don't know how to make up my mind or anything. I used to wonder how people could switch, it puzzled me. And then, it happened that I became one of "them." I was encouraged by my former Dom, to top a few ladies that we played with. I didn't like it at first, but it became more natural the more I did it. As Hibbie said, I am really quite sadistic, and since I have maso tendencies myself, I can dish out similar to what I can take or adjust it if necessary. In my relationship with Geoff, we are able to ebb and flow with one another. I don't know if one would call it "inter-switching," but we can read each other's body language and go with it accordingly. I like pain, Geoff does not. Geoff's submissive side is geared more to service. Therefore, he is able to "top" me physically and give me that glazed-over feeling that comes from an endorphin rush, and serve me while he is doing it. I can top him in the boudoir, as he can me, which flips both of our switches. I know that I am seen as more of the Dominant partner in our relationship, but it really is kind of fluid, in that, when I need to ratchet things down, he is willing to let me just "go there." I think it's interesting that more women see their Dominant men as "icky" or less respectable if they want to get thumped on a bit, but the submissively geared men do not tend to have those feelings about their Dominant women. Women seem to be allowed to be "soft and cared for" when need be, while still maintaining a sense of control over their submissive partners, while the men are expected to be "in charge and ready to go" all the time, and if they want to let their bodies have any endorphin-saturation from bottoming, somehow they become pussies.

Kana -> RE: Reversing your "role" when playing... (11/2/2011 6:34:12 AM)
We don't have "roles" so we have nothing to switch out of. We are simply who we are. She's submissive by nature, avoids conflict, a problem solver, background seeking quasi wallflower. I'm a take charge, type A driver with a loud mouth who takes control of situations automatically. Thus, it would be antithetical to who and what we are to even consider it, heck, it would be defying our basic natures.

oneluckysub -> RE: Reversing your "role" when playing... (11/2/2011 7:33:30 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Kana We don't have "roles" so we have nothing to switch out of. We are simply who we are. She's submissive by nature, avoids conflict, a problem solver, background seeking quasi wallflower. I'm a take charge, type A driver with a loud mouth who takes control of situations automatically. Thus, it would be antithetical to who and what we are to even consider it, heck, it would be defying our basic natures. My question was not about changing your role in your day to day life or switching during play time, it was more about as a Dom do you enjoy being Topped by your sub from time to time. Have you as a Dom, from time to time, been bound, gagged and/or flogged by your sub and did you enjoy it? Did she, as a sub, enjoy doing it to/with you or did she find it more of a challenge that either of you thought?

LillyBoPeep -> RE: Reversing your "role" when playing... (11/2/2011 7:41:46 AM)
if he uses topping as an extension/expression of domination, they go hand in hand, and switching might not be enjoyable... Kana's posts often talk about "taking what he wants" from his girl, which, to me, sounds like the activity is all a part of an all-encompassing domination, not an activity that can be separated from it. i MIGHT be able to flog someone (but i'm terrible at it and wouldn't want to hit them very hard anyway), but binding and gagging? that's probably the line for me. i've tried to flog people, and just stood there cringing and going "oh geez i'm sorry" -- i think a switchy Dominant deserves someone who's better at it/more enthusiastic than i am. who knows if that would ever change down the line -- sometimes your chemistry with a person allows you to do things you thought you never would/could.

Kana -> RE: Reversing your "role" when playing... (11/2/2011 8:29:56 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LillyBoPeep Kana's posts often talk about "taking what he wants" from his girl, which, to me, sounds like the activity is all a part of an all-encompassing domination, not an activity that can be separated from it. Yep. I operate within a 24/7 TPE where she has no limits/privileges except those I allow. She's an owned piece of fuck meat. It's that simple. quote: ORIGINAL: oneluckysub quote: ORIGINAL: Kana We don't have "roles" so we have nothing to switch out of. We are simply who we are. She's submissive by nature, avoids conflict, a problem solver, background seeking quasi wallflower. I'm a take charge, type A driver with a loud mouth who takes control of situations automatically. Thus, it would be antithetical to who and what we are to even consider it, heck, it would be defying our basic natures. My question was not about changing your role in your day to day life or switching during play time, it was more about as a Dom do you enjoy being Topped by your sub from time to time. Have you as a Dom, from time to time, been bound, gagged and/or flogged by your sub and did you enjoy it? Did she, as a sub, enjoy doing it to/with you or did she find it more of a challenge that either of you thought? I did answer your question. Switching would be, in essence, being untrue to who and what we are, not as slave/sub/bottom/Master/Dom/Top, it would be against who we are as people, both personality wise and the way we interact with the world and each other. Matter of fact, I think it would damage our relationship because it would cause cracks in the foundation. So no. It's not something either of us would enjoy or try.

oneluckysub -> RE: Reversing your "role" when playing... (11/2/2011 9:24:07 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LillyBoPeep i don't really know what i'd think. i think a lot of people conflate topping with domination and bottoming with submission, and so, if they felt that they had to dominate their Ms/Ds, then they'd feel conflicted and it might challenge their relationship. if they could separate topping and domination, it might change the way they see it, but as is, it's a perfectly reasonable frame of mind. ... so how do you define topping? is it connected with/an extension or an expression of domination, or just an activity? Very thought provoking question you pose Lilly. I have thought that topping would be an expression of dominance but some of the responses here have made me think that maybe it is just an activity that is part of my relationships. I see my Dom (when I am with one) as the decision maker, authority figure that others will divert to when we are together. I am more of the care giver, non aggressive, laid back, get things done in the background sort of person. When I am not in private settings with my Dom, I am think of myself as an equal partner with my Dom (but one who thinks of and puts her Dom before anyone else). I have a career and a personal life outside of my relationship and in issues outside of the relationship, I make those decisions on my own. In household decisions in the relationship, I have an equal voice in those decisions. Sexually, my vanilla relationships have been 50/50 in who does what and how. When doing BDSM activities, I am more of receiver than the active doer. Not to say that I just lay there but when bound and hooded, there is not much more I can do! [;)] And no, not being the Lazy Lay either. (Thanks for that Lockit - it made me chuckle). So yes, I think I see Topping as an activity which is why I think I could Top my Dom if I was asked to do so. I would be doing it at his request and by his direction but with my own twists and turns. Since its just an activity, I dont think it could change how I see him as a Dom. quote: ORIGINAL: Kana I did answer your question. Switching would be, in essence, being untrue to who and what we are, not as slave/sub/bottom/Master/Dom/Top, it would be against who we are as people, both personality wise and the way we interact with the world and each other. Matter of fact, I think it would damage our relationship because it would cause cracks in the foundation. So no. It's not something either of us would enjoy or try. You may have answered the question before but I did not read it as an answer so I apologize if I implied that you did not and I appreciate this response as clarification. This helps me understand how a sub could think differently or lose respect for the Dom. It makes sense to me for those in a TPE relationship. I am not in one and have never been. And I dont want to be in one. At least not a 24/7 TPE situation. In my mind I was thinking that I could not Top my Dom because how could I take control of a situation that I am not supposed to have control over. But now that I have seen that maybe its just an activity that we do, I cant lose respect if he wants me to do it to him instead. It would be like disrespecting him because I had to drive the car us around town instead of him driving me. I am completely serious when I say thank you to all of you for your responses. I think I have a better understanding of what my ex was saying and why I was confused about it.

LillyBoPeep -> RE: Reversing your "role" when playing... (11/2/2011 9:40:56 AM)
hooray for discussion threads with different perspectives! these are the kinds of discussion threads i enjoy. ^_^ quote: ORIGINAL: oneluckysub Very thought provoking question you pose Lilly. I have thought that topping would be an expression of dominance but some of the responses here have made me think that maybe it is just an activity that is part of my relationships. I see my Dom (when I am with one) as the decision maker, authority figure that others will divert to when we are together. I am more of the care giver, non aggressive, laid back, get things done in the background sort of person. i generally consider topping to be an extension of domination; i guess i'm more the type of s-person who does seek out more "all-encompassing, force-that-can-not-be-denied" sort of domination. maybe it's stereotypical, but i don't really want fluidity. and that, to me, isn't about not allowing a dude to be soft; if he doesn't want to be a hardass, but instead wants me to cuddle with him or console him when he's upset, that would definitely never change my opinion of him. i prefer men who are comfortable expressing every facet of who they are as human beings. if you can't feel like you can open up and cry in front of me when your mother dies, then maybe i'm doing something wrong. =p to me, i'm there to make his life better and easier. (that was referencing another post, not necessarily yours, oneluckysub -- just a thought i was having.) quote: ORIGINAL: oneluckysub When I am not in private settings with my Dom, I am think of myself as an equal partner with my Dom (but one who thinks of and puts her Dom before anyone else). I have a career and a personal life outside of my relationship and in issues outside of the relationship, I make those decisions on my own. In household decisions in the relationship, I have an equal voice in those decisions. i don't necessarily think of myself as equal in the relationship. i have equal intrinsic worth -- like if i have a heart attack, the ambulance should come just as fast as if he has a heart attack. =p the relationship can't exist without either party, so in that sense, we have equal value to the relationship. but i also think that being unequal and having a 24/7 relationship doesn't mean that you don't have a voice. like my previous Dude thought i had good opinions and liked to listen to them. he'd have me research stuff and then tell him what i thought about it. he liked someone to bounce ideas off of -- it didn't change the fact that he was the Leader, and he wasn't so interested in controlling my life, like picking out classes and such -- but we had very similar goals for the future, so we were both working together towards that one future. i guess, for us, we were each other's lives. we were sailing together and he was the Captain. quote: ORIGINAL: oneluckysub Sexually, my vanilla relationships have been 50/50 in who does what and how. When doing BDSM activities, I am more of receiver than the active doer. Not to say that I just lay there but when bound and hooded, there is not much more I can do! [;)] And no, not being the Lazy Lay either. (Thanks for that Lockit - it made me chuckle). this is a good point to make. =p when you're tied up and restrained, there's not a whole lot you can do, and for a lot of Male Doms -- that's the entire point! it's not about you as a sub/bottom being lazy, it's about them tying you down because they don't want you squirming around while they do horrible things to you. haha =p

needlesandpins -> RE: Reversing your "role" when playing... (11/2/2011 9:50:31 AM)
fr for myself in my present situation i would describe myself as a switch if i have to lable myself. however, previously i would have said domme only outwardly as i didn't trust my ex, or anyone else, enough to give over my submissive side. the submissive side stayed very much a fantacy that i thought would always be that way. then i met my pressent play partner and everything changed. it's all been a matter of trust and a gradual push on/from each other. we have found that we can feel both sub or dom within any moment of our play, or one can start the lead and the other take over at some point. this weekend just gone for instance; i set off in the D role but ended up very much in the s role. the dynamic changed at some point, but i couldn't tell you when. all i know is that i had a great time and got exactly what i wanted throughout all the play, i think we both did. as being able to give myself over to his use is so new to me i guess i'm wanting to be in that space more than D to an extent. i think that's ok with him though as he get's to let his darker side run free too. as always with these things it's each to their own, what suits one won't suit everyone. i don't think i'd like to have to be just one persuasion anymore as i've become greedy with it and want it all, but i am very much awear that it's person dependent on what i can give. needles

slaveluci -> RE: Reversing your "role" when playing... (11/2/2011 10:15:51 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: oneluckysub Do you (as a Dom or sub) get "bored" in your role and want/need/long to have things switched up occasionally? As others have mentioned, we don't really see how we interact with each other as "roles" so much as just how we're wired. It's natural for me to submit. It's natural for Him to be dominant. That's just how the chips fall, so to speak. As far as switching, neither of us have any desire to do so with each other. I'm afraid that, for whatever reasons, I just don't find it appealing in any way to dominate or "top" Him - or any male for that matter. That may not be a pc answer but it's an honest one. I don't think it would make Hiim "icky" or a "pussy" if He desired that. As a matter of fact, it might be hot to see a dominant female serve Him in that way. It's just not my cup of tea and I certainly wouldn't want to top/hurt/dominate Him in any fashion. I would if He commanded it but I think it would be detrimental to our relationship. I guess I would compare being forced to be dominant/a top to a straight person being forced to be with a person of the same sex or to a homosexual being forced to be with a member of the opposite sex, etc. I COULD and WOULD do it, but it wouldn't appeal to me or excite me at all. In the past, I would have said I didn't have any desire to top anyone, but that has changed over time. I can easily see myself dominating another female. As a matter of fact, that has come to be one of my favorite fantasies if that's not TMI[;)] luci

SailingBum -> RE: Reversing your "role" when playing... (11/2/2011 11:01:56 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: oneluckysub quote: ORIGINAL: Kana We don't have "roles" so we have nothing to switch out of. We are simply who we are. She's submissive by nature, avoids conflict, a problem solver, background seeking quasi wallflower. I'm a take charge, type A driver with a loud mouth who takes control of situations automatically. Thus, it would be antithetical to who and what we are to even consider it, heck, it would be defying our basic natures. My question was not about changing your role in your day to day life or switching during play time, it was more about as a Dom do you enjoy being Topped by your sub from time to time. Have you as a Dom, from time to time, been bound, gagged and/or flogged by your sub and did you enjoy it? Did she, as a sub, enjoy doing it to/with you or did she find it more of a challenge that either of you thought? Kana reply was quite clear to me he is the alpha dog and she is the bitch. She does as she is told. Which is precisely how it works in my world as well. Now if I told her to tie me up and whip me do I consider that "switching"? In a word, no as she is doing exactly what I told her to do. BadOne

LadyHibiscus -> RE: Reversing your "role" when playing... (11/2/2011 11:38:47 AM)
Oh dear Gary, I agreed with Sailor again... Obviously Iam one who separates activty from orientation. I am a rope bottom--being tied is utterly relaxing, and the closest thing to an endorphin reaction I've ever had. Heaven connot help the person who thinks that they can do anything TO me while I am tied. Rigging does not equal domination. If I am telling someone, take this crop and hit my clit until I come, well guess what, I am being served! If someone decided to just do that without invitation? Let's say it wouldn't happen again.

SailingBum -> RE: Reversing your "role" when playing... (11/2/2011 12:28:27 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: SailingBum quote: ORIGINAL: oneluckysub quote: ORIGINAL: Kana We don't have "roles" so we have nothing to switch out of. We are simply who we are. She's submissive by nature, avoids conflict, a problem solver, background seeking quasi wallflower. I'm a take charge, type A driver with a loud mouth who takes control of situations automatically. Thus, it would be antithetical to who and what we are to even consider it, heck, it would be defying our basic natures. My question was not about changing your role in your day to day life or switching during play time, it was more about as a Dom do you enjoy being Topped by your sub from time to time. Have you as a Dom, from time to time, been bound, gagged and/or flogged by your sub and did you enjoy it? Did she, as a sub, enjoy doing it to/with you or did she find it more of a challenge that either of you thought? Kana reply was quite clear to me he is the alpha dog and she is the bitch. She does as she is told. Which is precisely how it works in my world as well. Now if I told her to tie me up and whip me do I consider that "switching"? In a word, no as she is doing exactly what I told her to do. BadOne I forgot to add whether the girl doing what I tell her to do wants to, enjoys it or dislikes doing it is no concern of mine. She is doing it cuz I told her to. nuff said BadOne

DesFIP -> RE: Reversing your "role" when playing... (11/2/2011 5:52:01 PM)
There's a difference between topping and dominating. If he ordered me to hit his back with a light flogger, and once he felt warmed up, he ordered me to switch to a heavier one, he would still be in charge because he would still be telling me what to do. However, it isn't something I could easily do. I'd be apologizing constantly for hurting him and cringing with every hit. If he really needed someone to top him, I'd rather he went to a pro top for this. That way he would get what he wanted and I wouldn't have to get involved. And it's taken years for me to feel okay about him theoretically doing this. I couldn't have agreed to that in the beginning.

Winterapple -> RE: Reversing your "role" when playing... (11/3/2011 4:25:48 AM)
Would you fuck your Dom up the ass if he told you to? My answer to that notorious, hypothetical question has always been "Yeah, if he wanted me to and told me to." It wouldn't make him less dominant, he'd be in charge and I'd be doing what he told me to do. The pleasure and satisfaction I would get would be from pleasing him and doing as I was told. But, I admit I wouldn't it to be a constant thing. I've heard some submissive women say they could never do anything aggressive to their Dom. No scratching, no biting, no tussles of any kind ever. Personally, I like a little hiss and claw now and then and do better with a man who does to.

LillyBoPeep -> RE: Reversing your "role" when playing... (11/3/2011 5:51:59 AM)
to me, i've always kind of run with the idea that there are no inherently dominant or submissive actions. it also seems, at least to me, that sexual play may or may not count. =p it also seems to me that maybe i do conflate some things with submission -- but i guess that depends on how topping is viewed/defined. i think of topping as "this is my idea, this is what i want to do, i'm calling all the shots, and you're going to go along with it," which is an aspect of domination to me. that's not something i want to do. VaguelyCurious so graciously added the term "middling" to my vocabulary, which is like participating but under the command of someone else. some dominants like anal stimulation, and sex doesn't always seem like a domination thing to me, unless the Dominant makes it that way. i can wrestle with and resist a dominant and scratch and bite but still not feel like that's an actual challenge to his dominance. i actually like resistance play with people who i have no hope of beating. haha =p but i guess since i like sadistic men who like to push a little, i've come to see the expression of sadism and their willingness to "take" from me as an extension of their dominance. so that's just the way i think of topping. could i expand my view of topping?

MariaB -> RE: Reversing your "role" when playing... (11/3/2011 6:20:11 AM)
I don't ever willingly submit but that husband of mine sometimes forces it upon me. In other words he takes me and that can be ruthless and cruel but at the same time hot! Could I willingly bottom to him? No, I tried but just wanted to kill him and yet when I watch him dominate other women I can't help but think, 'he is one hell of a dominant guy!' Can I dominate him? yes sure I can but its sexual dominance and not, 'you will call me Ma'am, now go wash the dishes' kind of dominance. Its just wild kinky stuff and I'm happy to keep it that way. I think the majority of switches enjoy playing in the 'here and now'. They can lose themselves within a scene but its temporary, they don't need that consistency that most 'dominants only' and 'submissive only' need. Saying that, most dominants or submissives are only dominant or submissive in very specific situations. Their everyday life can involve a whole range of roles. Others can only relate and function within the power game. They reckon that out of every 10 people, one or more has experimented with sadomasochism. Some use it as a bit of light sexual entertainment. For some it offers a release of sexual and emotional energy that some people cannot get from traditional sex. I believe that for all of these people, the satisfaction gained from these experiences is something far more than sex. Its about energy, self identity, manipulating the mind, escapism and even cleansing. Not everyone involves themselves in complex rules, rituals, roles and dynamics. They don't need to create a framework around their experience that envelops their existence, others do need this and for them their life revolves around a power exchange dynamic. This doesn't make Masters/slaves, Dominants/submissives slightly bonkers, it just makes them different. It also doesn't make switches confused or indecisive, it just makes their needs different to others.

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