Las Vegas Republican Debate: Oct 18, 2011

Las Vegas Republican Debate: Oct 18, 2011 (Full Version)

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FirmhandKY -> Las Vegas Republican Debate: Oct 18, 2011 (10/18/2011 8:32:49 PM)
Serious discussion preferred. There is already a joke thread here. My take on the acceptable candidates, or ones that I could get behind and vote/work for: Cain Gingrich Romney Paul All the rest? Not so much. Perry I would specifically not vote for, nor support. I'd probably vote for a third party candidate before I voted for him, or Obama. Cain: Good humor, did a fair to good defense of his 9-9-9 plan, but he's going to have to ramp up it's explanation and have some good "sound bites" to discribe it and sell it. If he thought the Republicans were bad, he ain't seen nothing like what the Dems will do to him and it during a general election. I do think the news that Norquist says that it's "acceptable" under the terms of the "no new taxes" pledge will have an impact. I just like this guy. He's real, he keeps a smile on his face. He seems human and admits mistakes. I could see myself having a beer or two with him, and enjoying the evening. But he really needs to amp up his campaign, get more professional in his organization, et al. And soon. Gingrich: Newt is still the smartest guy in the room. He has also worked hard to overcome the "attack dog" persona that was attached to him back in the '90s. He's had some time out of office and been involved in several think tanks, and written several books of heft. Of course, as far as I know, he has never explained or approached an explanation about his "wife" problem, but hey .... isn't that kinda like his personal business (you know, like getting blowjobs from interns)? Romney: Biggest problem is ... I'm not sure if he is a realistic conservative or a very very good RINO. But, he is electable, and almost unflappable (Perry got him a little riled tonight), is thoughtful, quick on his feet, has an economic plan of sorts and has a good mixed and successful civil and political background. Paul: Much of what Ron Paul says makes good sense. And, from a libertarian background, I even understand most of his "crazy talk". But the two strikes against him are: 1. He is crotchety. His kindergarten report card probably said "Does not play well with others", and 2. The massive changes he would want to make are a revolution all in themselves (or, if not exactly a "revolution", certainly a hard return to original American ideals). I'm afraid that he would waste a lot of capital and time fighting for things that would help, but be marginal in the sense that they would not change the basis of the current political and economic environment. Don Quixote, welcome to the White House. Other Candidates: I wouldn't support any of the other candidates, for various reasons, but will make a few comments about some of them. Bachmann: Her voice drives me nuts. Plus, she gives life to the female stereotype of "She just won't shut the fuck up.". Santorum: Well meaning. Not talking the issues, and too lost in his family values issues. They are important, but do not resonate right now. See Ron Paul. Perry: What a fucking ass. Get your shit together. Arrogance and entitlement. "I'll have an economic plan next week.". I heard that during the last debate? What the fuck is going on with this guy, anyway? His performance and actions (or lack thereof) doesn't track with what I'd heard of him before. I think that was all that were there tonight. Firm

slvemike4u -> RE: Las Vegas Republican Debate: Oct 18, 2011 (10/18/2011 8:51:10 PM)
Not sure you would want...or value my opinion( I don't mean that in a negative way...it is just that...well let's face facts I couldn't vote for any of these guys even if you held a gun to my head)but that aside....your estimation of the debate tonight and the relative strengths and weaknesses of the respective candidates is rather spot on....save for the fact that you think any of them have a snowballs chance.

FirmhandKY -> RE: Las Vegas Republican Debate: Oct 18, 2011 (10/18/2011 9:10:05 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: slvemike4u Not sure you would want...or value my opinion( I don't mean that in a negative way...it is just that...well let's face facts I couldn't vote for any of these guys even if you held a gun to my head)but that aside....your estimation of the debate tonight and the relative strengths and weaknesses of the respective candidates is rather spot on....save for the fact that you think any of them have a snowballs chance. Your opinion is always welcome, mike. I'm not so sure that they can't get elected. But that's part of the fun of the process, isn't it? [;)] Firm

Kirata -> RE: Las Vegas Republican Debate: Oct 18, 2011 (10/18/2011 9:17:07 PM)
Not that he has a chance, but what do you think of Gary Johnson? K.

FirmhandKY -> RE: Las Vegas Republican Debate: Oct 18, 2011 (10/18/2011 9:29:35 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Kirata Not that he has a chance, but what do you think of Gary Johnson? Truthfully, K, I have no real opinion. I purposefully didn't look at your link, and I've only seen him on two debates (I think). He seemed "ok", but didn't strike any fire with me. Firm

tazzygirl -> RE: Las Vegas Republican Debate: Oct 18, 2011 (10/18/2011 9:37:21 PM)
Cain... I agree. However, his 999 plan wont wash in the general election. Sims? Yeah, thats gonna go over well. Newt... Intelligent, yes. But the "wife" situation may still play against him in the general. As you said, he never explained. And its my belief it never would have been the major issue it became if he hadnt gone after the "intern" incident with his family values rhetoric that he clearly was not following himself. Romney... Agreed. Time will tell. Paul.... Once I looked up the stats of where he had his OBGYN practice... well... I dont take well to people who utilize the tactics he did when dicussing how he would not take medicaid, that he would not take any payment at all. About 8.1% of families and 10.2% of the population were below the poverty line, including 12.6% of those under age 18 and 8.7% of those age 65 or over. Later in life, Congresssman Paul snatched up the practice of the only ob/gyn doctor in Brazoria County on the day the previous residing doctor was retiring, and reportedly delivered 40-50 babies a month. His practice refused big carriers like Medicare and Medicaid payments, and Paul instead worked pro bono, arranged discounted or with custom payment plans for patients in need. Sounds good huh. But thats my own personal take. The rest of the field? Couldnt agree more.

lovmuffin -> RE: Las Vegas Republican Debate: Oct 18, 2011 (10/18/2011 11:10:35 PM)
My main concern with Cain is that IMHO Godfathers pizza sucks. I haven't had any in a long time but I remember many of their stores closing. I didn't even know they were still on the map until Cain started getting play in the media. I was also curious about the accusation a poster made (on one of your threads or in response to you I think) and linked to a Mother Jones article about his tenure on Aquila's board of directors. I haven't heard anything about that other than here though. Romney: My concerns with him are that he's a republican governor from a state that elected Ted Kennedy over and over again. He's changed his position on too many issues including and especially gun control trying to come off as more conservative. And then there is his MA health plan. I'm just not buyin it. Paul: I love to listen to him and I'm in general agreement but he's stuck in the 70's. If this was back then I could would go along with a hands off stay out of others affairs policy but that ship has sailed. I mean when he spouts off "whats wrong with Iran having nuclear weapons" It's just way out there like almost in tin foil hat land. Gingrich is the one I like. I was impressed with him after the take over of the House in Clintons first term. I listened to a speech he gave as speaker to house republicans on C-Span telling them to hold it together. He was excellent and I've paid particular attention to him ever since. I think he should have run the last time around and was disappointed that he didn't and that he was so wishy-washy about it especially after all the play that he got on FAUX Nuuuuuuuuuuze[;)] at the time. I wonder how bad he really wants it but clearly he is, the most qualified. My main concerns with Gingrich is that looney commercial with Pelosi and giving lip service to man made global warming. I just hope he doesn't get elected and start trying to do or say squishy stupid shit like so many republicans do trying to get liberals to like them more cause it just never happens. You also mentioned the thing with his ex wife and alluded to Clinton. I would add to that, FDR and JFK. I would support the other candidates in the general election though as apposed to a third party and certainly as apposed to Obama. I mean it's that proverbial lessor of 2 evils I think, and I mean way lessor. As for all those mean awful things you say about the stiff guy with a stick up his ass "I don't think you have a heart". [8D]

lovmuffin -> RE: Las Vegas Republican Debate: Oct 18, 2011 (10/18/2011 11:27:38 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: slvemike4u .......save for the fact that you think any of them have a snowballs chance. At the risk of using this line once again, and I won't be quite as descriptive, and considering the nature of this site and that I may have given the wrong impression the last time, I'll clearly spell it out, if you really think Obama has a snowballs chance you better grab your ankles, cause this time you're gunna get spanked.[8D]

MasterSlaveLA -> RE: Las Vegas Republican Debate: Oct 18, 2011 (10/18/2011 11:29:59 PM)
Three words ---> TOO MUCH BICKERING ! ! ! I enjoyed the last CNN debate, but Anderson Cooper allowed far too much bickering to take place -- that's not what the American people want to hear... stick to the issues. The above aside, to me, the candidates who stood out the most were: Romney (Presidential/Informed), Gingrich (Presidential/Informed), Cain (Bold/Controlled), and possibly Santorum (Passionate/Good Ideas).

farglebargle -> RE: Las Vegas Republican Debate: Oct 18, 2011 (10/19/2011 5:02:47 AM)
After Romney reminded everyone that Newt "Individual Mandate" Gingrich is the one RESPONSIBLE for the idea of the individual mandate ( Which WILL be upheld at the supreme court, or they're going to have to legalize marijuana to be consistent with the Interstate Commerce Clause... ) Gingrich is toast...

DomYngBlk -> RE: Las Vegas Republican Debate: Oct 18, 2011 (10/19/2011 5:32:33 AM)
Just from the Politics of it. If Romney thinks he is going to win he better start mending fences with the Gov. of Texas. Can tell they hate each other. Romney has to have the Governor's machine in Texas to win.

DarkSteven -> RE: Las Vegas Republican Debate: Oct 18, 2011 (10/19/2011 6:04:39 AM)
Firm, I agree with most of your assessments. But a couple of addenda: 1. Gingrich. You say he's the smartest guy in the room. But that's only if he's speaking or writing. When he's being himself, he's randy, unprincipled, and undisciplined. A huge case of "do what I say, and ignore what I do". Plus his wife is a spoiled princess and will start directing his campaign if it gets to be too much a part of his life. 2. Santorum. You consider him an actual person. I don't. I think of him as a Reagan wannabe, who thinks if he looks good and has great hair, and spends his emphasis on social issues with a conservative slant, he'll win. Lemme try explaining that another way: he's a dumbshit with no ideas of his own and is so passive he's devoted his life to being an echo of another, rather than himself. He's also dumb enough not to realize that he's used the same schtick for decades and it got him swept out of office before and he's never gained any traction since with it.

Owner59 -> RE: Las Vegas Republican Debate: Oct 18, 2011 (10/19/2011 6:24:37 AM)
Newt? Doesnt know he lost yet.In debt big time,.....again. Mitt? Pretty much thinks he has it if he hangs on.Prolly right about that. The flavor of the week? More show than substance.His 999 thing`s getting 86ed.The biggoty stuff will get him some votes,maybe.But then it`s back to Mitt,again....... Paul? Who`s Ron Paul?[:D] The only real republican there. Michele? Go`n where Perry,Newty and Cain are going......down. Perry? I have fond memories of the cons here, talking him up like he was a superstar,the next Ronnie Reagan,the Texas miracle.....Those were heady days.....a few weeks ago.....lol The other Rick? Oh god wouldn`t that be a blessing(for dems) if he won?Good reminder of why most people don`t like the GOP, tho.And why some do.Does he know he has a google problem?[:D] "To much bickering?" ROTFLMAO! 1st good laugh of the day.

Lucylastic -> RE: Las Vegas Republican Debate: Oct 18, 2011 (10/19/2011 6:35:45 AM)
newt reminds me of someone..pompous windbag. Romney is the best of the bunch and that is saying something. Bachman is channeling Palin and doesnt know that Libya IS IN AFRICA. Let alone her "issues " with starting wars, then uses Iran to gnash her teeth at and promise you another round of Iranian/US Supremacy bullshit. Paul had the best comments last night

FirmhandKY -> RE: Las Vegas Republican Debate: Oct 18, 2011 (10/19/2011 6:36:58 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: DarkSteven Firm, I agree with most of your assessments. But a couple of addenda: 1. Gingrich. You say he's the smartest guy in the room. But that's only if he's speaking or writing. When he's being himself, he's randy, unprincipled, and undisciplined. A huge case of "do what I say, and ignore what I do". Plus his wife is a spoiled princess and will start directing his campaign if it gets to be too much a part of his life. Well, some of our most respected Presidents had the same general issues, I think. Isn't it always the Dem's that are pointing out that the political persona is different from the private persona, though? quote: ORIGINAL: DarkSteven 2. Santorum. You consider him an actual person. I don't. I think of him as a Reagan wannabe, who thinks if he looks good and has great hair, and spends his emphasis on social issues with a conservative slant, he'll win. Lemme try explaining that another way: he's a dumbshit with no ideas of his own and is so passive he's devoted his life to being an echo of another, rather than himself. He's also dumb enough not to realize that he's used the same schtick for decades and it got him swept out of office before and he's never gained any traction since with it. I've always had a "good impression" of Santorum before. I've seen him interviewed when he was in office, and found him genuine ... but since I was never in a position to vote for him, didn't look at him in that way. shrugs He just comes off too self-absorbed in his own issues right now. Firm

Owner59 -> RE: Las Vegas Republican Debate: Oct 18, 2011 (10/19/2011 6:55:55 AM)
Best line of the night..... "maximizing bickering is probably not the road to the WH". Bicker bicker bicker........[:D]

Lucylastic -> RE: Las Vegas Republican Debate: Oct 18, 2011 (10/19/2011 7:25:49 AM)
from theheadmaster of the bickering school, Bicker McBickerson.

farglebargle -> RE: Las Vegas Republican Debate: Oct 18, 2011 (10/19/2011 7:26:43 AM)
When the fuck did US politics devolve into Dancing With The Stars?

philosophy -> RE: Las Vegas Republican Debate: Oct 18, 2011 (10/19/2011 8:28:31 AM)
FR I couldn't watch the debate, but I've read as many reports as I can find. My problem with Herman Cain is that he flip flops more than a fish on a trawlers deck. This business with the electric fence. Putting aside whether or not it is a good idea, in the space of 3 days he went from suggesting it, to explicitally labelling a joke, to explicitally labelling it not a joke. He needs to find a principled position and then stand on it. right now it looks like he's just saying whatever he thinks the person he's talking to wants him to.

DomYngBlk -> RE: Las Vegas Republican Debate: Oct 18, 2011 (10/19/2011 8:36:40 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: FirmhandKY quote: ORIGINAL: DarkSteven Firm, I agree with most of your assessments. But a couple of addenda: 1. Gingrich. You say he's the smartest guy in the room. But that's only if he's speaking or writing. When he's being himself, he's randy, unprincipled, and undisciplined. A huge case of "do what I say, and ignore what I do". Plus his wife is a spoiled princess and will start directing his campaign if it gets to be too much a part of his life. Well, some of our most respected Presidents had the same general issues, I think. Isn't it always the Dem's that are pointing out that the political persona is different from the private persona, though? quote: ORIGINAL: DarkSteven 2. Santorum. You consider him an actual person. I don't. I think of him as a Reagan wannabe, who thinks if he looks good and has great hair, and spends his emphasis on social issues with a conservative slant, he'll win. Lemme try explaining that another way: he's a dumbshit with no ideas of his own and is so passive he's devoted his life to being an echo of another, rather than himself. He's also dumb enough not to realize that he's used the same schtick for decades and it got him swept out of office before and he's never gained any traction since with it. I've always had a "good impression" of Santorum before. I've seen him interviewed when he was in office, and found him genuine ... but since I was never in a position to vote for him, didn't look at him in that way. shrugs He just comes off too self-absorbed in his own issues right now. Firm Getting a bj is a WHOLE lot different then laying divorce papers on your sick wife in the hospital. Thats a level of nastiness that you just can't talk your way around. But, I'd love to see him as your nominee!!!!!

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