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Is This Where It Comes From? - 10/25/2010 11:51:06 AM

LadyPact

Posts: 32566
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With permission, I'm borrowing this quote from DarkSteven:

quote:

(Name removed), I used to belong to alt. IMO, what killed the site was greed. The site owners got greedy and kept trying to find ways to squeeze money out of its members and lost sight of the fact that they needed to provide a good environment for those members, o they would leave. I left when it got harder to meet good people there. Last I heard, alt instituted a policy where, if you did not get laid in three months, your membership would get extended free. So the natural result was a lot of HNGs, and the women left in droves. So the fakes invaded the site - no female competition, and lots of HNGs to fleece.

This made Me wonder a bit. There are a lot of folks who come here to CM who consider it a kinky dating site. (That can be debated, but that's another thread.) A number of folks seem to think that creating a profile here means they will automatically find a dynamic, someone to give them kink/find someone to perform kink on, or whatever it is that brings them to the site in the first place. Those of us who have been on the site for a while know it doesn't work like this, but often, it seems that people new to the site think that it will.

I've always attributed the mentality of "I've decided I'm kinky, so everyone will be gobbling up what I'm offering" to bad porn. Similar to believing the old Penthouse Forum stories to be true. (Example here would be getting a job delivering pizzas because a guy believes two gorgeous co-eds with 'tip' him by offering a threesome.) The thought process seems to be there. It shows even in reading the introduction threads.

My question is do you think the sites have contributed to people thinking they will automatically find what they are looking for just by creating an account? Since many people here have been on Alt at one time or another, do you think there is a cross over of people believing that's the guarantee?

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Happily dating a new submissive. It's official. I've named him engie.

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Post #: 1

RE: Is This Where It Comes From? - 10/25/2010 11:58:00 AM

AquaticSub

Posts: 14867
Joined: 12/27/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyPact

My question is do you think the sites have contributed to people thinking they will automatically find what they are looking for just by creating an account? Since many people here have been on Alt at one time or another, do you think there is a cross over of people believing that's the guarantee?

I think so. But I don't think it's just the kinky sites, I think it's dating sites in general. If you listen to the ads for the 'vanilla' dating sites, they make promises about finding your perfect match and people get that stuck in their heads. They come to a site that is - basically - a kinky version of OkCupid and expect that same thing.

But I do think it's just a contribution. A major one but not the sole factor. I think another part is just people being people. I meet people in person who bitch about how they are single nearly constantly and will go to their friends, expecting some kind of hook up. I don't know if that is a product of "gimme now" or the fact that our society now lacks the matchmaking roles that we used to have or a combination of both.

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(in reply to LadyPact)

Post #: 2

RE: Is This Where It Comes From? - 10/25/2010 12:02:23 PM

Nslavu

Posts: 342
Joined: 2/1/2010
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Marketing, aka capitalist snow-jobs that are offset with 'buyer beware' making them morally and legally acceptable.

I think anyone who believes in any sort of automatic guarantee (even if paid for) in this fecked up capitalist illusion is ... an unaware consumer asking to be deluded and or bilked.

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Post #: 3

RE: Is This Where It Comes From? - 10/25/2010 12:02:28 PM

sexyred1

Posts: 8998
Joined: 8/9/2007
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Yes, I do believe that is one of the culprits.

I also firmly believe that our instant gratification society coupled with our accelerated online technology, makes people believe that they can get what they want at the click of a mouse.

Many people also have misperceptions about those into kink that we are all total sluts and will instantly blow any guy who calls himself a Dom.

They have misheard from their buddies in the bar that chicks who are on kink sites welcome this kind of approach and they they are oh so shocked to find that is not the case.

It is a shame that so many have lost their ability to create meaningful interpersonal communication whether it be in person, on the phone or online.

I find this to be getting worse and worse, even when people are not new to this; it does not matter what age they are either; a 50 year old sometimes act even more immature and impatient than a 20 year old.

And of course, women do this as well with their why can't I find a Dom in two seconds shtick.

No one has any patience any more and if you are looking for something meaningful, you need that in abundance.

Oh yeah, it is also rampant on vanilla sites, totally.

< Message edited by sexyred1 -- 10/25/2010 12:03:25 PM >

(in reply to LadyPact)

Post #: 4

RE: Is This Where It Comes From? - 10/25/2010 12:07:31 PM

LadyRian

Posts: 486
Joined: 9/5/2010
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"I've decided I'm kinky, so everyone will be gobbling up what I'm offering"

Great topic.
My opinion is, yes. It seems like that to me. Also the other "not specifically a dating site" seems to have quite a bit of activity which corresponds to that mentality.

It's good that the information is out there. It's good that people have places to go to learn, and discover.

But as with anything, especially as concerns the internet, Caveat Emptor.

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(in reply to LadyPact)

Post #: 5

RE: Is This Where It Comes From? - 10/25/2010 12:15:04 PM

LadyHibiscus

Posts: 27124
Joined: 8/15/2005
From: Island Of Misfit Toys
Status: offline

I wondered what was up with Alt! I went back and reactivated my account there earlier this year, and killed it in 24 hrs! It was as bad as AFF, where I also lasted a day. EW EW EW propositions without even a PICTURE up.

Remember when everyone was vilifying the young folks? Well I am here to tell you that the YOUNG folks I meet have manners in spades, it's the folks in MY age group who seem to have lost all their social skills. It doesn't help when half the folks are displaying their genitalia but not their faces.

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Post #: 6

RE: Is This Where It Comes From? - 10/25/2010 12:37:19 PM

DarkSteven

Posts: 28072
Joined: 5/2/2008
Status: offline

I think that the alt guarantee is not the cause of the insta-lay mentality as much as it is a result of it.

I have been a member of cm for three or four years. During that entire time, I have regularly gotten unsolicited messages from women in their twenties in other countries, lovely enough to be pornstars, who told me that they want me to be their Master based on my profile. And these messages always equate M/s with kinky sex.

I conclude that the dots' cluelessness predated the alt offer.

< Message edited by DarkSteven -- 10/25/2010 12:48:34 PM >

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RE: Is This Where It Comes From? - 10/25/2010 12:38:37 PM

LaTigresse

Posts: 26123
Joined: 1/15/2006
Status: offline

Using fast reply...

I believe, just based upon what I've seen in my communications, that patience is a quality that is definitely going the way of the dinosaur. The age of the person writing me matters not at all. Laziness runs rampant. And it's alllllllllll about kink, sex, and them. I rarely, if ever, get asked about ANYTHING other than kink and sex, and it is rare for them to ask what interests me. Usually it's a few short emails about what they want and am I interested or not. Sooooo, my general reply is something along the lines of "Not!"

More and more, unless I get an email from someone I actually enjoy writing to as friends, I don't even log into the other side and emails can sit for days before I bother reading them......if I don't recognize the person they are from.

I might have an inactive profile on alt but I seriously don't remember. I used to belong to AFF years ago (actually met and made some really good friends from that place) but it turned such a shithole I doubt my acct there is still usable.

< Message edited by LaTigresse -- 10/25/2010 12:40:35 PM >

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Just because you are well educated, articulate, and can use big, fancy words, properly........does not mean you are right!

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Post #: 8

RE: Is This Where It Comes From? - 10/25/2010 12:48:52 PM

TotalDiscipline

Posts: 225
Joined: 5/5/2010
Status: offline

quote:

My question is do you think the sites have contributed to people thinking they will automatically find what they are looking for just by creating an account? Since many people here have been on Alt at one time or another, do you think there is a cross over of people believing that's the guarantee?

If it would be automatically...they would have had succes on Alt.
I just think people in general like a partner..if one site doesn't work...try the next. Seems normal to me.
Although...personally I find it sad that Cm turns into a "dating site" on the front page.
But...the users decide how a site is used.

(in reply to LaTigresse)

Post #: 9

RE: Is This Where It Comes From? - 10/25/2010 1:01:39 PM

sweetsub1957

Posts: 2201
Joined: 4/28/2009
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyPact
My question is do you think the sites have contributed to people thinking they will automatically find what they are looking for just by creating an account? Since many people here have been on Alt at one time or another, do you think there is a cross over of people believing that's the guarantee?

I think so. They all, kinky and vanilla, make either obvious or implied promises of finding that someone special, and there are enough people who are outright desperate enough to find someone that they will believe it. That's what keeps the pay sites in money. The only place I've ever found that special Someone is on Collarme. The first kinky site I was on was Alt, but then I found the free sites, CM and Fet, so I joined them and left Alt quite awhile ago. So I must have left before they came up with that "guarantee." But then, the pay sites have to come up with something to make people willing to pay the price, even if it is bullshit. The reasons I stay on the sites are friends, the message boards(CM) and groups(Fet).

~sweetsub~

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"That's not just a chip on her shoulder, that's the whole potato!" ~Lady Angelika~

In lowering yourself to talking behind my back, you're perfectly positioned to kiss my ass.

An it harm none, do what ye wilt.

(in reply to LadyPact)

Post #: 10

RE: Is This Where It Comes From? - 10/25/2010 1:49:18 PM

Twoshoes

Posts: 1218
Joined: 7/27/2010
Status: offline

Even people who are willing to sleep with you quickly want to feel a 'connection'. So communicating well and first impressions are still of utmost importance.

Also, the appeal of 'objectification' is treating an actual person as an object, which implies being able to relate to them first. In my mind, the 'objectification' fetish is not the exact same as a general inability or unwillingness to relate.

Personally, I mostly process human relationships through emotion, so I really like to have a good idea about how different things make someone feel to get the most possible satisfaction out of any human interaction. (Otherwise it's like a salad without the dressing. Still good to eat, but could be so much better.)

Finally, according to OKCupid, I'm meant for women who:
-are aggressive.
-are bi/pansexual.
-love cats.
-have 3 monitors' worth of favourite books/films.
-are willing to foster a delusional belief about my intelligence.
-seek to destroy/save the world (I don't care either way, but I appreciate the passion involved).
-would have sex with their own clone (narcissists-see below

).
-are unbelievably hot.

(ETA: I definately know what I want better than the OKCupid matchmaking algorithms, so I find the caricature amusing.)

quote:

wikipedia
The name "narcissism" was coined by Freud after Narcissus who in Greek myth was a pathologically self-absorbed young man who fell in love with his own reflection in a pool.

Edited for waaaay better wording.

< Message edited by Twoshoes -- 10/25/2010 2:47:20 PM >

(in reply to LadyHibiscus)

Post #: 11

RE: Is This Where It Comes From? - 10/25/2010 2:08:58 PM

DesFIP

Posts: 25191
Joined: 11/25/2007
From: Apple County NY
Status: offline

I dont think so. There have always been guys who think that buying you a burger and a beer in a dive entitles them to some sex in return. I think it's that same mentality just transferred to online.

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Post #: 12

RE: Is This Where It Comes From? - 10/25/2010 2:31:28 PM

littlewonder

Posts: 15659
Status: offline

People come to sites like this because they think that anyone who is on a "sex site" which is what this site is if you look at the advertisements, must be loose, wild and freaky fun and will put out for absolutely anyone.

You can thank movies, porn and this site itself for its advertisements.

(in reply to DesFIP)

Post #: 13

RE: Is This Where It Comes From? - 10/25/2010 3:28:00 PM

DomImus

Posts: 2004
Joined: 3/17/2009
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyPact
I've always attributed the mentality of "I've decided I'm kinky, so everyone will be gobbling up what I'm offering" to bad porn.

It's the "I've decided I'm kinky" part that is the problem. When is the last time you heard someone say "I've decided that I'm heterosexual"? The people who don't get it (both figuratively and literally) are the ones who just stumbled upon this new aspect of their sexuality about an hour after Comcast activated their cable modem.

(in reply to LadyPact)

Post #: 14

RE: Is This Where It Comes From? - 10/25/2010 3:34:04 PM

kiwisub12

Posts: 4742
Joined: 1/11/2006
Status: offline

I didn't think there was any guarantee that i would find someone on this site to "get my freak on". But i did

I did go on AFF to find someone - and did.

and i was fussy. They had to be up to a certain standard. After all, i really didn't want to end up in the sack with someone that i couldn't stand the sight of, or talk intelligently to.

I view the sites as a convienience - all these lovely kinky people grouped together, and some of them looking for what i have to offer. I don't think of these sites as a short cut, but as a way easier way to contact kinky people. If i waited until i met people in my local grocery that liked bdsm - i'd still be waiting - patiently or otherwise. After all, if you want groceries you go to the grocery store, if you want a book you go to the bookstore, if you want bdsm you go to the internet and google bdsm. Simple!

(in reply to littlewonder)

Post #: 15

RE: Is This Where It Comes From? - 10/25/2010 4:00:23 PM

eihwaz

Posts: 367
Joined: 10/6/2008
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyPact

This made Me wonder a bit. There are a lot of folks who come here to CM who consider it a kinky dating site... A number of folks seem to think that creating a profile here means they will automatically find a dynamic, someone to give them kink/find someone to perform kink on, or whatever it is that brings them to the site in the first place. Those of us who have been on the site for a while know it doesn't work like this, but often, it seems that people new to the site think that it will.
[...]
My question is do you think the sites have contributed to people thinking they will automatically find what they are looking for just by creating an account? Since many people here have been on Alt at one time or another, do you think there is a cross over of people believing that's the guarantee?

Certain cm features -- such as interests and skills profile sections and search capability -- are similar to those of most dating sites, only with a bdsm/kink flavor. That encourages the notion the cm is primarily a kinky dating site. As AquaticSub noted, dating sites have been marketed as practically guaranteeing a perfect relationship.

(in reply to LadyPact)

Post #: 16

RE: Is This Where It Comes From? - 10/25/2010 4:19:22 PM

leadership527

Posts: 5026
Joined: 6/2/2008
Status: offline

~fastreply~

I'm gonna go with Des and littlewonder on this one. The idiots have always existed and this site is an excellent lure for them

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I want a joyous, loving, respectful relationship where the male is in charge and deserves to be. - DavanKael

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Post #: 17

RE: Is This Where It Comes From? - 10/25/2010 4:37:45 PM

BurntKitty

Posts: 3340
Joined: 9/7/2010
From: Here To Eternity.
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Twoshoes

Finally, according to OKCupid, I'm meant for women who:
-are aggressive. - Born & raised in NY, 'nuff said.
-are bi/pansexual. drat
-love cats. I have 4
-have 3 monitors' worth of favourite books/films. I have lots of favorites.
-are willing to foster a delusional belief about my intelligence. I can do that.
-seek to destroy/save the world (I don't care either way, but I appreciate the passion involved). I know of a zombie compound you can hide out in.
-would have sex with their own clone (narcissists-see below). I would, because although I'm not bi, I am teh hawtness! Cuing Rod Stewart: I'm too sexy for my shoes....
-are unbelievably hot. See above.

Wait. Cancel the last comment. Turns out, although I am unbelievable sexy, the hotness was just a menopausal flash.
But, I still have really sexeh shoes.

OP- I have to agree with your analysis. It's the "I want it now, no waiting, have it my way" mentality.

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Post #: 18

RE: Is This Where It Comes From? - 10/25/2010 4:39:48 PM

sexyred1

Posts: 8998
Joined: 8/9/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: BurntKitty

quote:

ORIGINAL: Twoshoes

Finally, according to OKCupid, I'm meant for women who:
-are aggressive. - Born & raised in NY, 'nuff said.
-are bi/pansexual. drat
-love cats. I have 4
-have 3 monitors' worth of favourite books/films. I have lots of favorites.
-are willing to foster a delusional belief about my intelligence. I can do that.
-seek to destroy/save the world (I don't care either way, but I appreciate the passion involved). I know of a zombie compound you can hide out in.
-would have sex with their own clone (narcissists-see below). I would, because although I'm not bi, I am teh hawtness! Cuing Rod Stewart: I'm too sexy for my shoes....
-are unbelievably hot. See above.

Wait. Cancel the last comment. Turns out, although I am unbelievable sexy, the hotness was just a menopausal flash.
But, I still have really sexeh shoes.

OP- I have to agree with your analysis. It's the "I want it now, no waiting, have it my way" mentality.

Ya gotta love these NY chicks. Snort.

(in reply to BurntKitty)

Post #: 19

RE: Is This Where It Comes From? - 10/25/2010 4:42:59 PM

domiguy

Posts: 12952
Joined: 5/2/2006
Status: offline

First off CM is a kinky dating site, what else do you think it is?

How many people participate on the forums compared to those that set up a profile and begin trying to tap dat ass?

It is what it is.

Just because someone doesn't realize it, doesn't make it so.

(in reply to leadership527)

Post #: 20

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