Interested Dom vs. her protector/mentor

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MindOvrMatter -> Interested Dom vs. her protector/mentor (8/25/2009 5:21:29 AM)
I am a Dom with a few years experience, but not so much in the public scene and relating to certain protocols. Myself and a sub who is looking to find a Dom for a LTR, have been corresponding and I was made aware immediately that she had a Dom assuming the role of protector and mentor, with a primary objective of helping her screen potential Doms for her. Initially this was no big deal and I understood and accepted the situation, as her and I got to know each other over the course of several weeks. It came to light (early on) that he had also become her Dom during the course of this process, filling other roles that she was obviously needing with respect to tasks, punishment, etc. Due to circumstances of their age differences, locale and other issues , I was assured by both that this was temporary and there was no possibility of it being a longterm thing between them. Once she found a Dom to explore a serious D/s relationship with, his role would remain as friend and mentor. I am having several misgivings about this arrangement that I'd like feedback on. First, he dictates "all" the rules of engagement between her and any prospective Dom, including myself. Phone time, 1st and 2nd meetings, etc. The only correspondence that she can have with me that is open is email and yahoo chat...no texting, no camming, no calling, no meeting unless he approves...and so on. We just met for the first time with a rule of 1:45 hr limit, strictly vanilla and not even a permission for a kiss at the end of the meet. After several weeks of talking and trying to get the go ahead for a meeting, this mentor began thoroughly checking me out a day prior to our meet. His method was to search out subs in a certain radius of my, and contact those who had me on their friends list...blindly I might add. Many of those subs contacted me and were taken aback by this approach in a stranger asking about me without me letting them know this might be coming. He also blindly contacted many on my Fetlife friendslist, without asking me prior. I found this to be very disrespectful to me as a fellow Dom. How does this approach line up with certain protocol for obtaining references, etc? I have nothing to hide, but his actions did create some unnecessary drama that wasn't necessary. I have been very patient throughout this process because I like this girl and have grown very fond of her, whereas many Doms have exited the scene immediately upon hearing of their arrangement. The biggest struggle that I am facing today is that there seems to be no 'end game' or plan (except maybe in his head) as to how/when he would step down as her Dom to allow another to have full freedom of communication and meeting with her. She can not answer this question, as they have not talked about it. Needless to say, after now having met her and my becoming increasingly interested in her as a person and potential sub, my patience is dwindling quickly and my frustrations are rising. Not a good thing. Lastly, her Dom/protector/mentor will not engage me for some unknown reason. He sent me an email early on to introduce himself and enlighten me to the arrangement, rules, etc. He was very adament about letting me know that "he has complete power and control over her" in all areas aside from kids, family and vanilla friends. I returned that email and have since sent him two others, with no response whatsoever. Am I being tested, or made to be a fool? With such little information, it's impossible for myself or anyone else to predict the motives that might exist here. I'm simply curious how common this sort of arrangement might be and how it's typically handled? Thank you... Brett

LillyoftheVally -> RE: Interested Dom vs. her protector/mentor (8/25/2009 5:27:20 AM)
Personally this seems a little fishy to me. I understand that you like her, but I think maybe there comes a time where you have to draw the line, his 'power' over her is preventing you from developing any form of dynamic yourself. You need to outline this, if for her it is nothing more than a temporary relationship until she finds someone you need to say, ok so you found me, what is it to be?

Apocalypso -> RE: Interested Dom vs. her protector/mentor (8/25/2009 5:35:26 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MindOvrMatter He was very adament about letting me know that "he has complete power and control over her" in all areas aside from kids, family and vanilla friends. Ask yourself this. Are you seriously happy to get into a relationship (if it happens) where your dominance has been given 'permission' by somebody else? If you're going to pursue this at all, make it clear that you're not prepared to deal with him anymore and let her choose whether to go forward with that being the case. If she refuses, drop her. Seriously.

GraciousLady -> RE: Interested Dom vs. her protector/mentor (8/25/2009 5:45:53 AM)
She already has a Dom. You have been told this man will continue to be her friend and mentor no matter what your relationship is with her. You will never be her Dom as long as this other man has control of her. He is, and will remain, her Dom and he will be yours as well because he will be calling the shots. He is essentially topping you from the bottom here.

LillyoftheVally -> RE: Interested Dom vs. her protector/mentor (8/25/2009 5:47:14 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: GraciousLady He is essentially topping you from the bottom here. Well not really, him and the OP do not have an established relationship, he is dominating him but not from the bottom

daintydimples -> RE: Interested Dom vs. her protector/mentor (8/25/2009 5:54:40 AM)
It seems more like she's topping him from the bottom, but she's using this "protector" dom to do it. The OP doesn't really know how much control this protector has, he's had one communication with him. In any case, I agree, this girl has a dom, and it's not the OP. Lot's of game playing going on here, I'd bow out.

mnottertail -> RE: Interested Dom vs. her protector/mentor (8/25/2009 5:56:45 AM)
Kick that stupid bitch to the curb. Having a broker is one thing, but if she ain't got it on her own by now.............. As your protector and mentor, I obviously know what is best for you. So, like if you all are 'deemed' worthy to get a little slap and tickle.......let's say, some 5 or 6 years down the road, does she call him and ask if he would allow her to suck your dick? Will you have to get on the phone and explain your nutsack to him? Just so he can be sure? Or is that the point where you have to give her money to give to him for his service? Outta here, clown. This will not EVER have (not even one in a gazillion) a chance of turning out well. Ron

DarkSteven -> RE: Interested Dom vs. her protector/mentor (8/25/2009 6:03:02 AM)
I have been in the protector role a time or two. I will screen out the initial contacts, discuss things with the submissive up to and after the first meeting, and after that withdraw. What he's doing is ridiculous. Dude, he's got her ear and I'd be very surprised if he's not talking you down to this sub every chance he gets. He's hoping for a relationship with her and you're an obstacle to him. Go nuclear. Contact her and tell her that he's been extremely rude in contacting your friends without your permission, in not replying to your emails, and in not having any kind of timetable. Tell her that you have complied with all of his demands and that you suspect that his sole goal is to get you out of the picture and get her to yourself. Tell her that you want to continue seeing her, but on YOUR terms, not his. If you want, check out all of his friends on cm and fet just like he did with you. Contact their local friends as well, and they will all say that he's a wanker. Bring that to the conversation if you wish. There's going to be a confrontation anyway. The sooner the better.

DomImus -> RE: Interested Dom vs. her protector/mentor (8/25/2009 6:04:56 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MindOvrMatter many Doms have exited the scene immediately upon hearing of their arrangement. You stuck with it and found out why they did not. It sounds to me like you are being had and that these two enjoy jerking around with people in this manner. If she was really looking for someone she'd have gotten the message after the other doms bolted. Never, ever woo another dominant in order to reach a submissive.

MsFlutter -> RE: Interested Dom vs. her protector/mentor (8/25/2009 6:09:33 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: DomImus quote: ORIGINAL: MindOvrMatter many Doms have exited the scene immediately upon hearing of their arrangement. You stuck with it and found out why they did not. It sounds to me like you are being had and that these two enjoy jerking around with people in this manner. If she was really looking for someone she'd have gotten the message after the other doms bolted. Never, ever woo another dominant in order to reach a submissive. What he said

Missokyst -> RE: Interested Dom vs. her protector/mentor (8/25/2009 6:18:14 AM)
Who is the sub again?

Acer49 -> RE: Interested Dom vs. her protector/mentor (8/25/2009 6:34:26 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MindOvrMatter I am a Dom with a few years experience, but not so much in the public scene and relating to certain protocols. Myself and a sub who is looking to find a Dom for a LTR, have been corresponding and I was made aware immediately that she had a Dom assuming the role of protector and mentor, with a primary objective of helping her screen potential Doms for her. Initially this was no big deal and I understood and accepted the situation, as her and I got to know each other over the course of several weeks. It came to light (early on) that he had also become her Dom during the course of this process, filling other roles that she was obviously needing with respect to tasks, punishment, etc. Due to circumstances of their age differences, locale and other issues , I was assured by both that this was temporary and there was no possibility of it being a longterm thing between them. Once she found a Dom to explore a serious D/s relationship with, his role would remain as friend and mentor. I am having several misgivings about this arrangement that I'd like feedback on. First, he dictates "all" the rules of engagement between her and any prospective Dom, including myself. Phone time, 1st and 2nd meetings, etc. The only correspondence that she can have with me that is open is email and yahoo chat...no texting, no camming, no calling, no meeting unless he approves...and so on. We just met for the first time with a rule of 1:45 hr limit, strictly vanilla and not even a permission for a kiss at the end of the meet. After several weeks of talking and trying to get the go ahead for a meeting, this mentor began thoroughly checking me out a day prior to our meet. His method was to search out subs in a certain radius of my, and contact those who had me on their friends list...blindly I might add. Many of those subs contacted me and were taken aback by this approach in a stranger asking about me without me letting them know this might be coming. He also blindly contacted many on my Fetlife friendslist, without asking me prior. I found this to be very disrespectful to me as a fellow Dom. How does this approach line up with certain protocol for obtaining references, etc? I have nothing to hide, but his actions did create some unnecessary drama that wasn't necessary. I have been very patient throughout this process because I like this girl and have grown very fond of her, whereas many Doms have exited the scene immediately upon hearing of their arrangement. The biggest struggle that I am facing today is that there seems to be no 'end game' or plan (except maybe in his head) as to how/when he would step down as her Dom to allow another to have full freedom of communication and meeting with her. She can not answer this question, as they have not talked about it. Needless to say, after now having met her and my becoming increasingly interested in her as a person and potential sub, my patience is dwindling quickly and my frustrations are rising. Not a good thing. Lastly, her Dom/protector/mentor will not engage me for some unknown reason. He sent me an email early on to introduce himself and enlighten me to the arrangement, rules, etc. He was very adament about letting me know that "he has complete power and control over her" in all areas aside from kids, family and vanilla friends. I returned that email and have since sent him two others, with no response whatsoever. Am I being tested, or made to be a fool? With such little information, it's impossible for myself or anyone else to predict the motives that might exist here. I'm simply curious how common this sort of arrangement might be and how it's typically handled? Thank you... Brett I would say it is time that the "Dom" meet with you, if he will not I would surmise the he is nothing more than a illusion created by the submissive

beargonewild -> RE: Interested Dom vs. her protector/mentor (8/25/2009 6:53:48 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MindOvrMatter Am I being tested, or made to be a fool? With such little information, it's impossible for myself or anyone else to predict the motives that might exist here. I'm simply curious how common this sort of arrangement might be and how it's typically handled? Thank you... Brett Here's how I see this, up until now you have been polite and followed the rules of protocol and such. This other person seems to be always dangling the "carrot" in from of you by only saying you are allowed to do this and not this this or this. If you honestly believe this girl is worth continuially perusing then take more active role in guiding this relationship to how you want and not how an unseen mentor wants. If it happens this "mentor" is a fabrication by the girl......well we know that a line has been crossed and trust becomes an issue.

porcelaine -> RE: Interested Dom vs. her protector/mentor (8/25/2009 7:02:34 AM)
as others have indicated there are some glaring red flags in this scenario. i believe the advice you've been given thus far is pretty forthright, but since i have a mentor i'll speak from that perspective instead. our arrangement began four years ago and still remains. she serves as an advisor, confidant, and is also a good friend of mine. while i may discuss various things with her relating to people i've met or have taken interest in, she has no control over my decisions or actions. i'm an adult and it is expected that i will do what i feel is best for me. i will admit that has been in contradiction to what she would have chosen for me, but its more important that i remain true to myself. plus there are profound lessons in the mistakes. on occasion she will share her opinion, on other instances she serves as a guide and i discover the truth on my own. the last part is always the ideal, otherwise i'm merely doing as told. in regard to screening applicants or checking references, again, the responsibility of making adult decisions is mine. there have been instances when i've shown her a profile on collarme, but the response usually is followed by what i can only deem as yuck. because she is much older, far more experienced, and has no vested interest in the person, what might appear nice to me is usually a glaring wtf in her eyes. yet and still the choice is mine, and i'll admit she's been spot on every time. however, our relationship is strictly platonic. we have never and will never engage in any capacity as owner and slave. it would completely upset the balance of our relationship if her interests in me fell outside of the dynamic we've created. the intentional bias would make it virtually impossible for anyone to step in. nor is she inflexible to the degree where she believes no one is good enough either. the jury is still out on whether i've met one that she feels has come close. for what its worth i don't believe i have. as for tasks and such, i receive none. i'm extremely disciplined, a true type 'a' personality and profoundly driven. she acknowledges it is unnecessary because i have no deficiencies in these areas. if anything i'm much too hard on myself. over time the relationship has changed and grown exponentially. we've reached a point where i readily accept my slavery and can openly acknowledge how far i've come. the exchange is founded on the principles of self-betterment, as opposed to codependent reliance. the real question you must honestly ask yourself is what she's getting out of it. i am acutely aware of why my mentor remains and if your friend is truthful she'll be able to verbalize the same. the influence you've witnessed he has in her decision making and access are responsibilities she's handed to him. i have never given my mentor that element of control. perhaps if i did i'd have my happy ending. one never knows. best of luck to you and yours. porcelaine

mnottertail -> RE: Interested Dom vs. her protector/mentor (8/25/2009 7:08:00 AM)
gawd, you say that so prettily, and it is sage advice indeed.

BOUNTYHUNTER -> RE: Interested Dom vs. her protector/mentor (8/25/2009 7:09:20 AM)
Thats the problem with this whole deal of collar of protection or being mentored,Most Doms are clingy and want to hold on to what they have.In this case it makes it hard for another interested Dom to even get to know the girl..My rules is when I mentor I don't fuck and I never use the collar of protection,I think thats bullshit along with a training collar..Bounty

angelikaJ -> RE: Interested Dom vs. her protector/mentor (8/25/2009 7:24:03 AM)
IF the girl is new, I am guessing that she has no idea that she had any say in how their relationship was structured. He told her how dangerous it is out there and told her she needed a "mentor" to stay safe. Probably told her all the worst case scenarios. And then he told her that this is the way people are mentored. If she is new, she had no reason not to believe him. (If she isn't new, she likely has no need for a mentor) Has she told you why she feels she needs protection?

daintydimples -> RE: Interested Dom vs. her protector/mentor (8/25/2009 7:28:54 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: porcelaine as others have indicated there are some glaring red flags in this scenario. i believe the advice you've been given thus far is pretty forthright, but since i have a mentor i'll speak from that perspective instead. our arrangement began four years ago and still remains. she serves as an advisor, confidant, and is also a good friend of mine. while i may discuss various things with her relating to people i've met or have taken interest in, she has no control over my decisions or actions. i'm an adult and it is expected that i will do what i feel is best for me. i will admit that has been in contradiction to what she would have chosen for me, but its more important that i remain true to myself. plus there are profound lessons in the mistakes. on occasion she will share her opinion, on other instances she serves as a guide and i discover the truth on my own. the last part is always the ideal, otherwise i'm merely doing as told. in regard to screening applicants or checking references, again, the responsibility of making adult decisions is mine. there have been instances when i've shown her a profile on collarme, but the response usually is followed by what i can only deem as yuck. because she is much older, far more experienced, and has no vested interest in the person, what might appear nice to me is usually a glaring wtf in her eyes. yet and still the choice is mine, and i'll admit she's been spot on every time. however, our relationship is strictly platonic. we have never and will never engage in any capacity as owner and slave. it would completely upset the balance of our relationship if her interests in me fell outside of the dynamic we've created. the intentional bias would make it virtually impossible for anyone to step in. nor is she inflexible to the degree where she believes no one is good enough either. the jury is still out on whether i've met one that she feels has come close. for what its worth i don't believe i have. as for tasks and such, i receive none. i'm extremely disciplined, a true type 'a' personality and profoundly driven. she acknowledges it is unnecessary because i have no deficiencies in these areas. if anything i'm much too hard on myself. over time the relationship has changed and grown exponentially. we've reached a point where i readily accept my slavery and can openly acknowledge how far i've come. the exchange is founded on the principles of self-betterment, as opposed to codependent reliance. the real question you must honestly ask yourself is what she's getting out of it. i am acutely aware of why my mentor remains and if your friend is truthful she'll be able to verbalize the same. the influence you've witnessed he has in her decision making and access are responsibilities she's handed to him. i have never given my mentor that element of control. perhaps if i did i'd have my happy ending. one never knows. best of luck to you and yours. porcelaine Beautifully stated. That your mentor allows you to fail says that she really does have your best interests at heart, I think. I have learned much more from my failures than I have from my successes.

OsideGirl -> RE: Interested Dom vs. her protector/mentor (8/25/2009 7:30:34 AM)
If you blow up at her, it's going to blow up in your face. If you bash him, he will bash you every place he can...whether it's true or not. You'd probably do better to be calm. Tell her that so far you've done what he's asked. That he offended your friends. Then nicely say that you've gone as far as you're willing to go with him running the relationship. This is the point when you should be trying to figure out if you even like each other, but she's too busy playing by his rules for that to happen. If she's not willing to come out from behind his coat tails, you should be prepared to walk. And I mean walk. No more contact as long as he's in the picture. Here's the bottom line: You're wooing a woman who isn't adult enough to make her own decisions about your relationship. To the point where she has a "D" that isn't her "D" making her decisions for her. Is that really want you want in a partner? Edited to add: I don't think there's much of a possibility of coming out of this in a good position. The other guy has a pretty sweet deal. He's got a submissive that follows his orders with no commitment, so he's absolutely free to do whatever he wants and gets to flaunt his dominance over her by dominating other "D"s. I don't think he'd willingly give that up. So, if you try to wrest control from him or prompt her to take some control, it will be "See? I told you he doesn't respect you/doesn't respect me/ wants me out of the way to take advantage of you." If you go along with the game it will be "See? He's not a REAL/TWUE Dom. He can't even show an inkling of trying to dominate you."

CreativeDominant -> RE: Interested Dom vs. her protector/mentor (8/25/2009 7:38:03 AM)
I agree with others on here, OP. I've dealt with this once in my 10 years and I was willing to follow the "protocol" as such for awhile. But it soon became apparent that what I was dealing with was not the submissive's own thoughts but those of her mentor who had such a profound influence on her...while being just her "friend and protector"...that she prefaced most conversations of an in-depth nature with "my mentor says...blah, blah, blah" and finished the statement with "i agree with him". While it is admirable for a person to choose as a mentor someone whose opinion they respect, it is not so admirable when tis not only the mentor's opinion that becomes respected but the mentor's rules which sound suspiciously like an "owner's" rules. While I can admire a situation such as porcelaine's wherein the role of mentor is being played by someone who acts as a mentor should...with advice, guidance and insight but without rules and a recognition of porcelaine as a person whose choice will be HERS to live with, not the mentor's...I cannot admire a situation such as you have described. I was tied up in the one I noted for 4 weeks...it seems short now but at the time, I kicked myself for almost as long for having allowed it in the first place. Live and learn...and what I have learned is that any "mentor" who sets rules up for the submissive's life, who metes out tasks and punishments and/or who "trains" in BDSM and/or sex play is not a mentor, they are acting as dominant.

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