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The way seniors are treated sickens me sometimes... - 8/14/2009 12:27:16 AM   
Rhodes85


Posts: 445
Joined: 11/15/2008
From: Nova Scotia, Canada
Status: offline 		Well I had a very interesting week dealing with my step-grandfathers problems. First I just want to say the way he has been treated by his doctor absolutely sickens me, and you'll see why in a second.

First I took him in to an eye clinic to get a replacement pair of reading glasses. So, he goes in to talk to the woman that runs the place and tells her he is there to pick up the reading glasses he ordered in, and she insists on giving him a vision test. This is despite the fact that he specifically told her he had just had minor surgery on one of his eyes and it was still a bit blurry. She ignores this and makes him take the test before she will give him the glasses. The result? He fails the test and she comes out of the room and tells me that he 'has terrible vision in one eye. i'm sorry but I have to revoke his license' The guy has been driving for 70 years and hasn't had an accident. Yet without even consulting him she just fills out some paperwork to get his license revoked. Real nice way to treat a senior isn't it?

But its what happened yesterday that really REALLY sickens me.

Two years ago he ended up slipping on a carpet and falling on his knee. At the time his doctor assumed the injury he got from doing so was just a damaged artificial knee, that now needed to be surgically replaced. So they put him on the waiting list. a year later he finds out that his doctor 'forgot' to put the paperwork through to get him on the waiting list. In reality his own receptionist admitted that he 'doesn't like wasting medical resources on elderly patients' and so intentionally 'forgot' to pass the paperwork through. So, he finds this out, forces the doctor to put him on the waiting list and do the paperwork and after a year of waiting he goes in for surgery (and I might point out hes 87 at the time and walking on this damaged knee joint for 2 years) So, he finally gets in for surgery. I take him to Halifax to get it done and while i'm waiting for him to come out of recovery the surgeon comes up to me with the strangest look i've ever seen on a doctors face. You know what the 'damaged knee joint' turned out to be? the fall had severed his femur bone from his knee joint - literally. There was nothing connecting his lower leg to the rest of his body except muscle and skin. the two sections of bone had been rubbing against eachother for two years...and he was walking on that. The joint itself wasn't even damaged. It was of course repaired and hes fine now. But what sickens me is that after all the x-rays of the knee he had how the hell could his doctor have missed such an obvious injury? I mean I saw the x-rays myself. A six year old would see the break clearly. I'm starting to think the doctor was hoping he would die before getting any kind of treatment. I have to admit I am absolutely shocked and outraged by the way he was treated by his own doctor. To say nothing of the fact hes a veteran and got that knee injury from combat in Italy. So its a real nice way to treat our aging veterans don't you think? I just don't understand it.

So, am I being unreasonable by reporting this doctor to the medical licensing board? Because I consider this beyond malpractice.
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RE: The way seniors are treated sickens me sometimes... - 8/14/2009 12:54:25 AM   
PyrotheClown


Posts: 1950
Joined: 5/18/2009
Status: offline 		here, this will cheer you up
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8xW_-bSxTyI


























...um......well, maybe not

(in reply to Rhodes85)
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RE: The way seniors are treated sickens me sometimes... - 8/14/2009 6:19:31 AM   
purepleasure


Posts: 6941
Joined: 4/9/2004
From: Lehigh Valley, PA
Status: offline 		find a new doctor.  preferably one that specializes in geriatric care.

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RE: The way seniors are treated sickens me sometimes... - 8/14/2009 6:33:42 AM   
OrionTheWolf


Posts: 7803
Joined: 10/11/2006
Status: offline 		~FR~

1) File a complaint with your State Med Board
2) File a complaint with Medicare
3) Find a new Doctor for him

We take care of my elderly parents. My Mom has COPD, on oxygen 24/7 as well as diabtetic. 3 years ago when she was in the hospital they wanted me to sign a DNR, so if she went into arrest they would not do anything. I told them no. I was asked four more times by the Doctor over the next week. I finally got ill, and asked for the Hospital Admin to come down immedicately. With the admin, the charge nurse, and the doctor present I told them all in no uncertain terms I would not sign a DNR. I told them if a code was called I better see everyone doing everything they could to save her, and that I did not want to be asked again. My Mom made it out and has been in only one other time for a few days. Since taking over her health care directly though, she has not been in the hospital in 2 years and is in better health than she has been in a long time.

Yes seniors are often not treated the best, and I worry how much worse it may get in the future.

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RE: The way seniors are treated sickens me sometimes... - 8/14/2009 6:46:56 AM   
thishereboi


Posts: 14463
Joined: 6/19/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: OrionTheWolf

~FR~

1) File a complaint with your State Med Board
2) File a complaint with Medicare
3) Find a new Doctor for him

We take care of my elderly parents. My Mom has COPD, on oxygen 24/7 as well as diabtetic. 3 years ago when she was in the hospital they wanted me to sign a DNR, so if she went into arrest they would not do anything. I told them no. I was asked four more times by the Doctor over the next week. I finally got ill, and asked for the Hospital Admin to come down immedicately. With the admin, the charge nurse, and the doctor present I told them all in no uncertain terms I would not sign a DNR. I told them if a code was called I better see everyone doing everything they could to save her, and that I did not want to be asked again. My Mom made it out and has been in only one other time for a few days. Since taking over her health care directly though, she has not been in the hospital in 2 years and is in better health than she has been in a long time.

Yes seniors are often not treated the best, and I worry how much worse it may get in the future.


I understand that when you hear someone bitching about the health care a family member is getting, that the natural conclusion is....he must be talking about the US. But I checked his profile and he is in Canada. Not sure where he can go for help, but I hope he gets it. That someone would be made to go through that kind of bs sickens me also.

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RE: The way seniors are treated sickens me sometimes... - 8/14/2009 8:29:48 AM   
ThatDamnedPanda


Posts: 6060
Joined: 1/26/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Rhodes85
So, am I being unreasonable by reporting this doctor to the medical licensing board? Because I consider this beyond malpractice.


If it were me, I'd feel I had a moral obligation to report it. How many other elderly patients is he doing this to, or will he do it to in the future, if he's allowed to continue?

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In the forest of the night
What immortal hand or eye
Made you all black and white and roly-poly like that?


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RE: The way seniors are treated sickens me sometimes... - 8/14/2009 8:50:40 AM   
DomImus


Posts: 2004
Joined: 3/17/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Rhodes85
I take him to Halifax


This is not encouraging.

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RE: The way seniors are treated sickens me sometimes... - 8/14/2009 9:01:36 AM   
Termyn8or


Posts: 18681
Joined: 11/12/2005
Status: offline 		There are two things I do not understand here.

Why would the doc hold up the paperwork, won't he get paid for the operation ?

And why would they ask you to sign the DNR instead of him ? Is he incompetent in some way ?

Not so long ago people were bitching about doctors making people hang on too long rather than letting them die, and performing unnecessary operations, and of course over medicating. This seems to be the exact opposite.

One thing's for sure, no matter what else you do, find another doctor. Not finding a broken leg on an Xray is pretty incompetent. Perhaps this doctor is so incompetent he wouldn't be able to perfom the surgery. It's the only thing that makes any sense to me at this time. I could almost understand this behavior if the patient is already terminal, but nobody said anything of the sort here. My boss's Father in his eighties just had a knee replaced, even my boss asked him why, is it that bad ? But as far as i know he didn't get any of this guff from his doctor. Even his son didn't give him guff, it was more in the context of 'what are you going to run a marathon and go dancing every night ?'.But then I don't know how bad it was, knee pain can be excruciating, I know that from personal experience. There is also a finite limit on just how much painkiller one can possibly take. I also know that for certain bone problems, painkillers are largely innefective. So I am not saying that they shouldn't have done it, it's just that it is something I would take into consideration, his age and overall prognosis. However like I said I didn't hear (read) anything of the sort, like he already has cancer or something like that.

I am having trouble understanding why they would treat him this way. Unless they're just plain stupid.

T

(in reply to Rhodes85)
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RE: The way seniors are treated sickens me sometimes... - 8/14/2009 9:11:30 AM   
VirginPotty


Posts: 11624
Joined: 7/16/2008
From: Virginville
Status: offline 		OP, definitely report this Dr. He's a DANGER to those living out their Golden Years.
Term, I've seen DNR's that were such a joke that staff in Nursing Homes were trying to pass off as legitimate it scares me.  Patients in full arrest and the staff trying to shove off photocopied DNR's to stop CPR, DNR's not signed by a Dr.............they just don't want to be bothered.  We have 6 nursing homes in our 1st due and there are only 2 that I believe are doing what's in the best interest of the resident/patient. Damn shame.


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RE: The way seniors are treated sickens me sometimes... - 8/14/2009 9:56:27 AM   
Termyn8or


Posts: 18681
Joined: 11/12/2005
Status: offline 		Potty, even that I have trouble with. Don't they keep getting paid as long as the patient lives, and does that not stop when the patient dies ?

People usually have a motive for the things they do. I don't see a money motive here though. What a nursing home charges per month can be astronomical, but the dead do not pay. Can someone be that much of a pain in the ass ? (waiting for Rhi to ring in with that answer). It seems like they are shooting themselves in the foot monetarily. It just doesn't make sense.

T

(in reply to VirginPotty)
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RE: The way seniors are treated sickens me sometimes... - 8/14/2009 10:26:05 AM   
VirginPotty


Posts: 11624
Joined: 7/16/2008
From: Virginville
Status: offline 		Term, you'd THINK that would be the case but it's not.  I'll never forget my first call to a NH, it was around 2am and we were dispatched because the patient fell and had a lac on her head. When we arrived there was the patient sitting in a chair at the nurses station nightgown full of blood and hair matted w/blood.  Like I said, 2am. What time did she fall? Around 9pm! Why did they wait to call.............I swear they gave this excuse......."We didn't feel like doing the paperwork"!
 
I'm SO GLAD that I'm an Officer now because when I go to NH's I have NO PROBLEM bitching at the staff ESPECIALLY when there's a slew of them in the pt's room when we arrive & the patient is injured from a fall. After I identify the nurse I kick everyone else OUT. They stand in the hall and watch, I'll close the door in their faces. It pisses me off when we're told noone witnessed the fall so I'll ask what about all the freakin' staff members that were hovering around when we arrived? Where were they when the patient needed them?

A few months ago we had a pt. in resp. distress w/a resp rate of 45 bpm.  What did the staff have him on.........................4 lpm via nasal canula!  WTF????????
(Not a full face mask w/100% O2, merely the tube w/the prongs that go up the nostrils giving out the bare minimum of O2....well, that's not right, the bare minimum is 2 lpm--liters per minute so I GUESS they were helping him)

**Eta, bpm = breaths per minute. Normal resp rate is 15-20***


< Message edited by VirginPotty -- 8/14/2009 10:28:32 AM >

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RE: The way seniors are treated sickens me sometimes... - 8/14/2009 10:44:51 AM   
Termyn8or


Posts: 18681
Joined: 11/12/2005
Status: offline 		Maybe we should all be glad you're an officer now.

Really, if I demonstrated that level of incompetence at work I would be out the door. But then I guess I got a more important job, fixing big TVs (mind numbing devices). [I was being sarcastic there in case anyone didn't know] Do these people get tenure or something ?

T


(in reply to VirginPotty)
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RE: The way seniors are treated sickens me sometimes... - 8/14/2009 12:02:36 PM   
hizgeorgiapeach


Posts: 1672
Status: offline 		Potty, what you've said makes me really Really appreciate the staff at the nursing home where dad spent 2 years even more than I already did.
 
Dad has a DNR that he signed (and his lawyer made certain was absolutely legal and such for this state) 8 years ago.  He has COPD, asthma, and 3 years ago (as of the 2nd of this month) had that massive stroke.  I'm the one, since the stroke, who has had to make certain that any nursing center he goes to gets a copy of that DNR, his AD, his lists of meds, his contact numbers for doctors, insurance, myself, etc - whether it was the original nursing home he was in for 2 years, or the various nursing homes he stays in short term while I'm on Respite time.
 
I suppose I've been fortunate in how things have gone since dad's stroke.  His GP has been his doctor since long before the stroke, and is top notch and specializes in geriatrics.  The staff at all of the various nursing facilities he's been in over the past 3 years have been attentive and on the ball.  The few times he had falls before I moved him home, I got calls within a few minutes of it happening.  When he's been hospitalized for various problems since the stroke, he's recieved exemplary care from both the nursing staff, and whatever doctors were on staff/duty at the hospital.  (Then again - they take one look at me, and figure if they Don't do so, I'll be quick to both report them And to beat the living hell out of them for it, LOL)

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RE: The way seniors are treated sickens me sometimes... - 8/14/2009 12:30:56 PM   
servantforuse


Posts: 6363
Joined: 3/8/2006
Status: offline 		This is what bothers some with Obamas health care bill. They are worried that government employees on some board will be the ones deciding what care senior citizens and others will be able to recieve. It might be out of the hands of doctors and family members altogether...

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RE: The way seniors are treated sickens me sometimes... - 8/14/2009 7:05:40 PM   
Rhodes85


Posts: 445
Joined: 11/15/2008
From: Nova Scotia, Canada
Status: offline 		'Why would the doc hold up the paperwork, won't he get paid for the operation ? '

The doctor in question is just his regular doctor not his surgeon. From what i've heard from asking around, he has a habit of doing this like this to his senior patients because he feels it is a 'waste of medical resources to perform operations on people that don't have many years left, rather than getting younger people operations they need sooner' was the way his receptionist put it (in private of course) Personally I think he has something against seniors. Regardless of the reason hes a danger to the public and its apparently not the first time this has happened to his patients. Though there was no DNR involved. Were you referring to another poster?

DomImus has a pretty good point. Despite what the government likes to claim, Nova Scotia healthcare is of generally poor quality. It takes an average of three years to get a family doctor here and when you do get one they tend to screw you around alot. Hell i've lived here seven years and still can't get one, even for a standard checkup. My aunt even had one that refused to take her because she was a smoker. So she quit, went back to him a month later and he said 'sorry, I don't take anyone who has smoked.' I don't think thats too ethical either. Now that I think of it The healthcare you get here is terrible. I know another guy that got dropped when they were moving him onto the surgical table - ended up coming out of surgery with a large cut across his head. Shows competency doesn't it?  He also later got a post operative ecoli infection from improperly sterilized equipment. go figure.

VirginPotty, I will certainly be reporting him, and finding a new doctor for him. and incidently I forgot to mention his excuse for the xrays (and there were several of them that all clearly showed the damage) was 'its not my fault. you can't sue me!' funny he put it that way when nobody said anything about suing. I have to say after seeing your post I have to agree with Term and georgiapeach, we should all be grateful that theres people like you working in nursing homes. Its very nice to know that there are still people that work in those places that are geniunly good at their job and actually want to help the seniors there. After all, any of us could end up in a nursing home one day. Its good to know someone is still taking their job seriously when it comes to taking care of our relatives that are already in a home. and that stuff about fake DNRs scares the hell out of me and makes me wonder just how common such incidents are in nursing homes and hospitals.

By the way, i'm wondering, does anyone know if its normal to give someone with extremely low bloodpressure and a heart operating at 40% effeciency (following two heart attacks) morphine as well as whatever it is they give you to increase your bloodpressure? I seem to think that looks a little odd considering morphine is contraindicated for patients with low bloodpressure, irregular heartbeat or who are not lucid. I'm asking this because, ironically at the same hospital, this guys wife was given this a few months ago following two massive heart attacks (the second was *after* they gave her the morphine) seems to me you would get a poor interaction between the two that would negate each medications effects.

You know, all these unpleasant situations really make me appreciate even having healthcare, no matter how bad it can be at times. I mean, i'm sitting here talking about how incompetent some doctors are and didn't stop to think about the millions of americans and canadians that don't even have healthcare. I have to admit, being canadian I never gave too much thought to obama's (or past presidents and other politicians) healthcare proposals and reforms. Given that there is free universal healthcare here. Here I am bitching about healthcare when theres so many people on this continent that don't even have affordable medical care to complain about. It really makes you think. 

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RE: The way seniors are treated sickens me sometimes... - 8/14/2009 7:43:31 PM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline 		first... having read your post many times, i see nothing abotu a DNR order. where did that come from?

and, second, you stated he fell and injured his knee... then that he got the injury while in the service... im confused... can you clarify that?

as far as the morphine question, my son is at that rate, 40% for congestive heart failure secondary to chronic sleep apnea, and his last surgery involved morphine. i would say its not unusual as long as he is well monitored, and it seems to be a drug of choice for many surgeons after orthopedic surgery.

< Message edited by tazzygirl -- 8/14/2009 7:46:32 PM >

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RE: The way seniors are treated sickens me sometimes... - 8/14/2009 7:52:39 PM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline 		people speak about abuse... then do nothing... even within the medical field. standing in a room yelling at a nurse wont get you jack besides laughed at when you leave.

if this is happening, report them to the board of nursing.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

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RE: The way seniors are treated sickens me sometimes... - 8/14/2009 9:47:02 PM   
Rhodes85


Posts: 445
Joined: 11/15/2008
From: Nova Scotia, Canada
Status: offline 		'first... having read your post many times, i see nothing abotu a DNR order. where did that come from? '

VirginPotty mentioned one. I wasn't sure if she meant to ask if there was also a DNR in place or not. Thats why I asked.

'and, second, you stated he fell and injured his knee... then that he got the injury while in the service... im confused... can you clarify that? '

Indeed. What I meant to say is the initial injury that resulted in the artificial joint was a result of of a combat injury (German shell hit the ambulance he was driving if you're wondering...he got very lucky), while the injury that got him into surgery this time was him slipping and hitting his knee against a wall. So everyone assumed it was damage to the artificial joint given how he fell. You'd think they would have said otherwise from the xrays. I just mentioned it because I was trying to make a point that even elderly veterans can't get decent healthcare for treating injuries that resulted from their service.

and tazzy, I agree but hes a doctor not a nurse and I fully indend to report him. and thank you for clairification on the morphine question.

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RE: The way seniors are treated sickens me sometimes... - 8/14/2009 11:51:20 PM   
ThatDamnedPanda


Posts: 6060
Joined: 1/26/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: servantforuse

This is what bothers some with Obamas health care bill. They are worried that government employees on some board will be the ones deciding what care senior citizens and others will be able to recieve. It might be out of the hands of doctors and family members altogether...


As many times as that idiotic lie has been shot down, anyone who's still dumb enough to believe it is beyond reasoning with.

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In the forest of the night
What immortal hand or eye
Made you all black and white and roly-poly like that?


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RE: The way seniors are treated sickens me sometimes... - 8/15/2009 6:05:29 AM   
pahunkboy


Posts: 33061
Joined: 2/26/2006
From: Central Pennsylvania
Status: offline 		What does the grandfather think?

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