RE: Fetish trends

RE: Fetish trends (Full Version)

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LATEXBABY64 -> RE: Fetish trends (3/3/2009 6:49:41 PM)
the thing about staples That might be asking for more trouble granted it falls into percing but i see future health problems

variation30 -> RE: Fetish trends (3/3/2009 6:57:59 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: DavanKael A fetish is a psychological diagnosis. Davan hm...I always thought you were supposed to diagnose diseases, not a proclivity to engage in certain activities. silly me.

DavanKael -> RE: Fetish trends (3/3/2009 7:35:59 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: variation30 quote: ORIGINAL: DavanKael A fetish is a psychological diagnosis. Davan hm...I always thought you were supposed to diagnose diseases, not a proclivity to engage in certain activities. silly me. Look, I didn't write the book or coin the term but I abhorr incorrect usage of terminology. Given previous posts of yours that I've read, I would think you would understand that variation30; you're often quite unyielding. Strictly speaking and defining from my own head here rather than quoting from the DSM, a fetish is a fixation on a particular object or practice that is required for one to be able to perform sexually. The popularization of the term has nothing to do with what it actually means. It turnes a requisite presence for function into a socially giggle-worthy preference. Davan

variation30 -> RE: Fetish trends (3/3/2009 8:00:19 PM)
I tend to shy away from the dsm as a tool to give a realistic gauge of human behavior. but let's take a gander at the dsm-iv. "Paraphilias are defined by DSM-IV-TR as sexual disorders characterized by "recurrent, intense sexually arousing fantasies, sexual urges or behaviors generally involving (1) nonhuman objects, (2) the suffering or humiliation of oneself or one's partner, or (3) children or other nonconsenting persons that occur over a period of 6 months" and "cause clinically significant distress or impairment in social, occupational, or other important areas of functioning". The question is who will decide whether or not an individual is 'under distress'. It should be the individual, But that's another topic altogether. I just think it's safer to not refer to behaviors as disorders.

DavanKael -> RE: Fetish trends (3/3/2009 8:14:39 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: variation30 I tend to shy away from the dsm as a tool to give a realistic gauge of human behavior. but let's take a gander at the dsm-iv. "Paraphilias are defined by DSM-IV-TR as sexual disorders characterized by "recurrent, intense sexually arousing fantasies, sexual urges or behaviors generally involving (1) nonhuman objects, (2) the suffering or humiliation of oneself or one's partner, or (3) children or other nonconsenting persons that occur over a period of 6 months" and "cause clinically significant distress or impairment in social, occupational, or other important areas of functioning". The question is who will decide whether or not an individual is 'under distress'. It should be the individual, But that's another topic altogether. I just think it's safer to not refer to behaviors as disorders. Ummmmm, the person's subjective reports of distress are a part of the making of such a diagnosis. Not all of us who use those diagnoses professionally wield them like we're G/god(s); they're identifying tools and a place from which to start. You need an adept practitioner as well as a participative client to fully engage the therapeutic process. The client and their desire for change is most important, imo. And, as a rule of thumb, I diagnose as little as possible because people tend to over-identify with labels and regard them as more than the tools that they are. "...it's safer not to refer to behaviors as disorders"?! What shall we call them...fluffy bunny slippers?! I know you enjoy arguing for the sport of it (As do I on occasion) but you fail to address the statement that is the core of all of this: pop culture and this thread use the term fetish erronsously. Davan

ELUSIVE1 -> RE: Fetish trends (3/4/2009 9:45:47 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LATEXBABY64 the thing about staples That might be asking for more trouble granted it falls into percing but i see future health problems Latex Baby, I have had it done on my legs, chest, back...there is a tool the pulls out the staples so that they do not rip the skin...I have had no health issues over the ones I have done so far...

sirsholly -> RE: Fetish trends (3/4/2009 10:00:41 AM)
quote: I just think it's safer to not refer to behaviors as disorders. The DSM is published by the American Psychiatric Assoc. Perhaps you need to address your complaint to them

variation30 -> RE: Fetish trends (3/4/2009 10:18:45 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: DavanKael Ummmmm, the person's subjective reports of distress are a part of the making of such a diagnosis. Not all of us who use those diagnoses professionally wield them like we're G/god(s); they're identifying tools and a place from which to start. You need an adept practitioner as well as a participative client to fully engage the therapeutic process. The client and their desire for change is most important, imo. And, as a rule of thumb, I diagnose as little as possible because people tend to over-identify with labels and regard them as more than the tools that they are. "...it's safer not to refer to behaviors as disorders"?! What shall we call them...fluffy bunny slippers?! I know you enjoy arguing for the sport of it (As do I on occasion) but you fail to address the statement that is the core of all of this: pop culture and this thread use the term fetish erronsously. Davan Many times the person's reports of distress are a part of making such diagnoses. Other times the psychiatrist ignores a client and claims their actions are self-destructive (as if an individual does not have a right to do whatever they please with their body) or so socially dissonant (I shouldn't have to illustrate the dangers of basing medical diagnoses upon the whimsical state of what is socially acceptable...but it leads to things like hysteria, drapetomania, or homosexuality being considered mental "illnesses") and thrusts a 'treatment' upon someone against their will. And yes, I would prefer these behaviors to be called fluffy bunny slippers much more than I would prefer them to be called disorders, diseases, or illnesses...granted, they are none of these things, but at least fluffy bunny slippers is a lot less likely to result in the popularization of ice pick lobotomies as a way to deal with unruly children, the pre-emptive institutionalization of individuals who have committed no wrongdoings, or court-ordered psychosurgery. In the end, I'm a lot more accepting of the pop-culture definition for fetish than I am the pop-culture definition for diagnosis. quote: The DSM is published by the American Psychiatric Assoc. Perhaps you need to address your complaint to them Szasz does a better job at doing that than I ever could. But this thread is not about what we are discussing so I'm dropping it. If you wish to discuss the matter further, send me a private message or start a thread in the offtopic forum.

DavanKael -> RE: Fetish trends (3/4/2009 10:31:52 AM)
Ah, variation30, so you're choosing to use a term erroneously because you like it better. I see. And, where shall we deliver that castle and pony along with the fluffy bunny slippers? Btw, what size do you wear and what color would you like? I would defy you to actually see some people with truly debilitating and life-/relationship-disrupting/destroying fetishes and down-play them in the manner that you are seeking to do. They are serious issues and, indeed, illnesses. Part of my point in offering correction of terminology here is that we so often hear that people into bdsm don't want to be pathologized yet grabbing on to a term like "fetish" which is a diagnosable illness, doesn't do anything positive to help that 'cause'. Certainly, there are things that have greater popularity. Right now, I notice that a lot of 'vanilla' people seem to be trying out light bdsm and strap-on play. These are not fetishes. They're activities that people enjoy, usually without any debilitation to their lives or relationships, possibly even providing enhancements. Feel free to mail me if you'd like to discuss further, Davan <<edited 'cause I said fuzzy instead of fluffy>>

variation30 -> RE: Fetish trends (3/4/2009 10:50:58 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: DavanKael Ah, variation30, so you're choosing to use a term erroneously because you like it better. I see. And, where shall we deliver that castle and pony along with the fluffy bunny slippers? Btw, what size do you wear and what color would you like? I would defy you to actually see some people with truly debilitating and life-/relationship-disrupting/destroying fetishes and down-play them in the manner that you are seeking to do. They are serious issues and, indeed, illnesses. Part of my point in offering correction of terminology here is that we so often hear that people into bdsm don't want to be pathologized yet grabbing on to a term like "fetish" which is a diagnosable illness, doesn't do anything positive to help that 'cause'. Certainly, there are things that have greater popularity. Right now, I notice that a lot of 'vanilla' people seem to be trying out light bdsm and strap-on play. These are not fetishes. They're activities that people enjoy, usually without any debilitation to their lives or relationships, possibly even providing enhancements. Feel free to mail me if you'd like to discuss further, Davan <<edited 'cause I said fuzzy instead of fluffy>> I volunteer at the local va and at bryce hospital here in Tuscaloosa. I've seen enough. Unless there is a lesion in the brain, it's not an illness. I prefer the definition of disease put forth by Virchow in his "Die Cellularpathologie", not the definition put forth by the rich tradition of pseudo-scientists that dates back to the days of Kraepelin, Bleuler, and Freud. There are plenty of 'mental illnesses' and/or conditions caused by damage to the brain like Parkinson's, Alzheimer's, Huntington's, alien hand syndrome, having a packing rod blown through your brian like 'Tan', and so and so on (I'd have to dig out my physiological psych notebook to keep adding to this list, not my abnormal psych notebook). There are also plenty of behaviors that can destroy an individual's life as effectively as a disease. They are serious and should be addressed seriously. Pigeonholing these behaviors as 'illnesses' is not adressing these problems seriously. Grabbing on to a term like 'fetish' is not more detrimental than grabbing on to a term like 'sadist' or 'masochist' of 'voyeur'...all of which are listed as paraphilias in the dsm-iv.

EmpressOphira -> RE: Fetish trends (3/4/2009 12:10:41 PM)
I've seen that in the UK too. I think it's pretty. :) Haven't seen it here in NYC though, but I only play with boys and my cross-dressers tend to not be that into anything masochistic. quote: ORIGINAL: ELUSIVE1 latexbaby..i was referring to this yes that is me

DelilahDeb -> RE: Fetish trends (3/4/2009 7:40:51 PM)
Trends, fads, the "next big thing", all appeal to the primate social instinct: mimicry is a means of forming relationships that (may) enable the mimic to succeed (survive, reproduce, have higher status). When I was a kid, and the beat (beatniks) generation had not quite faded from the universe, there was lot written about conformity and conforming and non-conformists. And as I pondered my way into proto-puberty, I dawned on me that "being a non-conformist" was every bit as much conforming as was being a conformist. It was simply a different model that I would be following. And once that struck me, I thought, "Screw it; I'll just do (be, say) what I want, and never mind what 'they' say." That insight has served me well for 45 years, and counting. Consequently, I watch the current local fad of fire play sweeping through our community, and cheerfully step back to let those who will hazard their skins. I won't claim that I was burned at the stake in a past life, but I've survived two major steam scalds on the same (magically unscarred) arm, and I have no interest in playing with heat. Lady Delilah Deb

DesFIP -> RE: Fetish trends (3/5/2009 3:54:28 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: variation30 Many times the person's reports of distress are a part of making such diagnoses. Other times the psychiatrist ignores a client and claims their actions are self-destructive (as if an individual does not have a right to do whatever they please with their body) Actually individuals do not have the right to do what they want with their own bodies. Suicide is illegal. And there are carefully worded legal requirements that must be met if a person is to be hospitalized against their own wishes. Beyond that, someone who winds up living on the streets because they can't stop collecting shoes, and don't pay their rent is obviously someone with a problem.

feydeplume -> RE: Fetish trends (3/5/2009 4:07:05 AM)
To the OP: yeah gawds yes there are trends and fads! I have seen (sigh, help me NOT pun my way through this) fads in fashion, classes and demos, decoration in play spaces, types of public play, huge changes in self-identification labels, how much, if any leather is involved, the Rubber movement, 'nilla sex toys now marketed directly to BDSM sub gengre/cultures, and vast changes in fad or fashionable use and interaction on the net. I know it has impacted (sigh) me at least as far as having to interact with those that are going with one fad or style or what have you. So while munches go down in popularity and come in so many flavors that the word munch no longer seems to fit, and meet and beats are all but gone, classes and destination demo dates are now "the" thing, as far as i can tell at least.

OmegaG -> RE: Fetish trends (3/5/2009 5:58:52 AM)
With regard to those that were talking about shaving and tatoos. First, I think that people in the lifestyle (to use a term that I don't think quite fits right) tend to read more into tatts, piercings and shaving. I got all my tatts and piercings way before I stumbled on to Alt.com (my first introduction to all things kinky). I got them, not because they were trendy or because all the cool kids were doing it, but because they mean something to me. I've always been a bit concerned (to put it mildly) about personal hygene, so I've always trimmed my pubic hair to some extent and shaved my entire legs (I'd have shaved my arms too if my hair on my arms wasn't so blonde I am sure). So when a very vanilla boy friend suggested that if both of us were shaved that sex would be more pleasurable (he had difficulty reaching an orgasm so we'd have sex for hours), I tried it and I preferred it so much that I shave when I am not in a relationship. In fact, when I was first getting to know m'Lord, we discussed prefferences as it's that important to me. Come to think of it, during the weeding process one guy didn't make the cut because he talked about natural pubic hair (among other things) that led me to believe we weren't a good fit.

variation30 -> RE: Fetish trends (3/5/2009 9:21:42 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: DesFIP Actually individuals do not have the right to do what they want with their own bodies. Suicide is illegal. And there are carefully worded legal requirements that must be met if a person is to be hospitalized against their own wishes. Beyond that, someone who winds up living on the streets because they can't stop collecting shoes, and don't pay their rent is obviously someone with a problem. are you going to argue that what a government says you can do with your body is the ultimate objective truth when it comes to rights? if that were the case than so long as a government said slavery was legal within its borders, you should have no qualms with the act as certain individuals being free is illegal. I don't care what a legislator thinks of suicide, it is not his life and it is not his body, he should shut the fuck up. truth be told, I don't really care how carefully worded a legal requirement to get someone locked up against their will if they've done nothing wrong is...it's unjust. sure, you might think someone engaging in certain acts is someone who 'obviously' has a problem. what about people who would think that tying someone up and pissing on them is someone who 'obviously' has a problem. if you think your subjective and whimsical views on what is and what is not healthy behavior should hold sway over another individual and his or her actions...then what is stopping any person arbitrarily picked out of a crowd from holding his subjective and whimsical views on what is and what is not healthy behavior over you? some people are so hypocritical.

daddysliloneds -> RE: Fetish trends (3/5/2009 11:49:10 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: VanessaChaland I'm not sure if one would call the following a 'fetish' but I am sick of tattoos, tramp stamps, piercings and shaved pussies. I mean there is nothing unique, indivdual, outlandish, shocking or whatever with any of it anymore. Hasn't been for about a decade. Still every day I see someone flaunting a new tat or some sort of "body art" (lol) like its a novel thing. Whats wrong with nice clean skin, unblemished with ink, scars, metal and with a little God given hair? :) on the other end of the scale though, being natural would include not only a hairy pussy, but hairy arm-pits and hairly legs; been there, done that, and while it's nothing new, the shock and ewwwwwww factor didn't get me laid quite as much as i get it now, that's for sure!

valkyrielover1 -> RE: Fetish trends (3/29/2009 5:12:33 PM)
My fetish evolved slightly. I remember first developing my fetish around puberty (10-12 y.o.). I was always a quiet, submissive, effeminate boy and I loved (still do) dominant, muscular women with hairy armpits who were much bigger, stronger and more masculine than myself. Through my life I have remained submissive and effeminate. At 29 y.o. I'm 5'11" and 129lbs with extremely skinny and weak arms and legs. As a kid I always practiced my fetish in secret by drawing pictures of sweaty, hairy muscular women lifting and carrying weak, hairless, skinny men. It was a bit of a gender-role reversal and I liked that. This went on for a while. My sketches became more detailed as I grew older and better at drawing. About 2-3 years ago (I was 25) I started craving a more intense gender-role reversal and started drawing women with strap-ons. Soon this felt mild and the next step led to powerful women with functioning penises, raping men who sometimes had vaginas. Here's one of my earlier images... [IMG]http://img19.imageshack.us/img19/766/71671623.jpg[/IMG] and two of my later ones... [IMG]http://img21.imageshack.us/img21/8281/13995030.jpg[/IMG] [IMG]http://img259.imageshack.us/img259/4352/93227388.jpg[/IMG] In this last one the woman emasculates and kills me and this has been the latest step in the evolution, where the women are all powerful and the man's very life itself is in their woman's hands. Hope this helps...?

DemonKia -> RE: Fetish trends (3/30/2009 1:21:39 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: DavanKael A fetish is a psychological diagnosis. Davan The dictionary says: an inanimate object worshiped for its supposed magical powers or because it is considered to be inhabited by a spirit. • a course of action to which one has an excessive and irrational commitment • a form of sexual desire in which gratification is linked to an abnormal degree to a particular object, item of clothing, part of the body, etc. ORIGIN early 17th cent. (originally denoting an object used by the peoples of West Africa as an amulet or charm): from French fétiche, from Portuguese feitiço ‘charm, sorcery’ (originally an adjective meaning ‘made by art’ ), from Latin factitius (see factitious ) Just cuz I'm a vocabulary bitch . .. . . & because when I use the term 'fetish' it 'feels' way more like the anthropological sense of the term to me than it does the pathologizing psych sense . . . . . . "It's my language & I'll use it how I wanna, use it how I wanna, use it how I wanna . .. .. . " (Sung to the tune of, "It's my party & I'll cry if I wanna" . . . . . ) Best, The Demon, Kia

Imakemensquirm -> RE: Fetish trends (3/30/2009 2:18:17 AM)
A fetish is almost a compulsion for those with them, so they clearly aren't following a trend and many have had those fetishes long before internet and other forms of media we have to day. In most cases they kept this compusion to themselves, so they weren't following anything except their own feelings. There may be some who see a fetish and try it as a part of their enjoyment for kinky play, but it doesn't often become a compulsion for them.

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