Memphis paper posts concealed carry permits on line (Full Version)

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outlier -> Memphis paper posts concealed carry permits on line (3/2/2009 2:56:55 PM)


The Memphis Commercial Appeal has posted a list
of everyone in the state who has a concealed carry permit
for a firearm.

http://www.tennessean.com/article/20090302/NEWS0201/903020336


http://www.commercialappeal.com/news/2009/feb/15/inside-the-newsroom-case-for-gun-permit-listings/




Vendaval -> RE: Memphis paper posts concealed carry permits on line (3/2/2009 3:13:22 PM)

Hello outlier,
 
Your first link states that Tenn. makes the concealed carry permits available to the public.  This seems to be an issue of the newspaper taking that information to the next level by pulishing it.  And it is of course very controverisal.  Hopefully some posters from Memphis specifically or Tennessee in general with have some insiders information on this issue.



Evility -> RE: Memphis paper posts concealed carry permits on line (3/2/2009 3:22:33 PM)

I have no problem with this. This information is public or at least it is in Tennessee where this occurred. I do agree that it gives burglars who like to steal and deal in guns a heads up but again the information is public and anyone can obtain it if they ask for it. It was thoughtful of the Commercial Appeal to make it only a mouse click away.

If a newspaper here in Georgia wanted to do the same, fine. I have a concealed carry permit. Let them post my name if they like. I'd be proud to be known as a law abiding citizen who exercises his constitutional rights. I'll even send them my targets from my last trip to the firing range. If one person saw my name and thought "maybe I'll go fuck with somebody else" I'm all for it.



kittinSol -> RE: Memphis paper posts concealed carry permits on line (3/2/2009 3:49:04 PM)

It's a good thing. 



MarsBonfire -> RE: Memphis paper posts concealed carry permits on line (3/2/2009 4:43:16 PM)

Welcome to the 21st century... where "privacy" is a myth.

BTW, wouldn't having other people know you're packin' actually make you a MORE formidable opponent? I mean, isn't that the whole point?



Coldwarrior57 -> RE: Memphis paper posts concealed carry permits on line (3/2/2009 4:48:25 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: MarsBonfire

Welcome to the 21st century... where "privacy" is a myth.

BTW, wouldn't having other people know you're packin' actually make you a MORE formidable opponent? I mean, isn't that the whole point?
Also makes your home a target for a break in.
They need to know your going out of town, and they have a good probability of getting weapons at that house!
Good going there newspapers , always willing to help out the criminal element .



slaveboyforyou -> RE: Memphis paper posts concealed carry permits on line (3/2/2009 5:02:14 PM)

Well I read the whole story.  They didn't post addresses or birthdates, so it's not a big deal.  Public records are public records.  It's not a new thing.  People have been able to walk into county clerk's offices for decades and find out all sorts of things about other people. 

Also, most burglaries are crimes of opportunity, it's someone passing by your home and noticing the garage door open.  Professional burglars are few and far between.  I seriously doubt there will be criminals perusing this link and planning robberies to obtain guns.  If you want a gun, they're are a lot easier ways of obtaining them. 



outlier -> RE: Memphis paper posts concealed carry permits on line (3/2/2009 5:26:34 PM)

Thanks for your thoughts so far.

I posted the story and the reply from the paper
to represent the arguments. I did not link to the
outraged sites because I did not think typing NRA
into Google was that hard.

Here are some more thoughts:

1. Only 19 states make this information public.
Is it a good thing or a bad one that they do.?

2. How in the world was it possible for 9 felons in 1 county
to get a concealed carry permit? Shelby County should be
embarrassed at least, and maybe liable.

3. What if you or make deposits for some small business once
or twice a week and you do not have a concealed carry permit.
Did you just go to the top of the "easy to rob" list?

Isn't it the point of having "CONCEALED" permits so people
don't know?

Outlier



Coldwarrior57 -> RE: Memphis paper posts concealed carry permits on line (3/2/2009 5:52:29 PM)

I carry when I need to!
I live by the axiom I would rather be tried by 12 then carried by 6.



rulemylife -> RE: Memphis paper posts concealed carry permits on line (3/2/2009 6:29:46 PM)

I'm not a big fan of concealed carry laws but the Cleveland Plain Dealer did the same thing when Ohio passed its law.

I thought it was a below the belt tactic then and still do.



Termyn8or -> RE: Memphis paper posts concealed carry permits on line (3/2/2009 10:03:52 PM)

fr

Actually not ever having sold a firearm in my life, but have had three stolen/lost I will have to reserve judgement on this. It might be nice for thieves to be able to get a map and thus avoid coming here, but then I can't be home 24/7, so I really can't say if this is good or bad.

T



rulemylife -> RE: Memphis paper posts concealed carry permits on line (3/2/2009 10:07:25 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Termyn8or

fr

Actually not ever having sold a firearm in my life, but have had three stolen/lost I will have to reserve judgement on this. It might be nice for thieves to be able to get a map and thus avoid coming here, but then I can't be home 24/7, so I really can't say if this is good or bad.

T


Well, you live here too so you must remember all the arguments about it, pro and con.



Termyn8or -> RE: Memphis paper posts concealed carry permits on line (3/2/2009 10:35:34 PM)

Kinda what I'm sayin rulem, is it "Don't mess with that dude he's packing" or "Hey, he went to work, let's go heist his irons". ?

T



Vendaval -> RE: Memphis paper posts concealed carry permits on line (3/3/2009 1:27:44 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: outlier

Here are some more thoughts:

1. Only 19 states make this information public.     [sm=seesaw.gif]
Is it a good thing or a bad one that they do.?

I can see the positives of identifying people in the area you should avoid.  But for the criminal element that same information could attract robbers to your home when no one is present.


2. How in the world was it possible for 9 felons in 1 county
to get a concealed carry permit? Shelby County should be
embarrassed at least, and maybe liable.

Bribery and forgery come to mind.


3. What if you or make deposits for some small business once
or twice a week and you do not have a concealed carry permit.
Did you just go to the top of the "easy to rob" list?

That does not necessarily mean you do not have some other soft of weapon on your person.  You could have mace, knives, tazer, etc hidden under clothes.

Isn't it the point of having "CONCEALED" permits so people
don't know?

That is my understanding of the permits.


Outlier



Asherdelampyr -> RE: Memphis paper posts concealed carry permits on line (3/3/2009 1:49:02 AM)

Seriously, if someone wants a gun that badly there are much much easier ways to get one
it would have been worse if they posted the names of all the people who owned a top of the line gaming computer, or a large plasma-screen tv... in most cases those will sell better
Other than that, there isnt really a contreversy. As stated above, the info published was already public, they didnt dig it up in some seedy back alley somewhere, the state government has the info available to anyone.

As far as the felons, I think that was more a laziness from the people doing their jobs than any criminal intent. it has been my experience that people willing to commit felonies arent worried if they are legally permitted to carry a gun to commit those felonies or not. Or to put it more simply, when you are looking at a possible first degree murder charge, carrying without a permit is nothing.



truckinslave -> RE: Memphis paper posts concealed carry permits on line (3/3/2009 1:04:17 PM)

I wish I thought there was a chance in hell they would spend some ink printing criminals. This week they could do child molesters, next week muggers.....
Nah, the ACLU would twist that into an invasion of privacy.



truckinslave -> RE: Memphis paper posts concealed carry permits on line (3/3/2009 1:09:26 PM)

"If you want a gun, they're are a lot easier ways of obtaining them".

Well, there are indeed easier ways for law-abiding citizens with jobs. The preferred gun for a criminal, though, is a stolen one, and for obvious reasons. 



LaTigresse -> RE: Memphis paper posts concealed carry permits on line (3/3/2009 1:13:01 PM)

I certainly have no problem with it becoming public knowledge.

As for anyone stealing them.........I believe that is what safes are for. If you have guns laying all about your house, then you deserve to have them stolen.



rulemylife -> RE: Memphis paper posts concealed carry permits on line (3/3/2009 1:27:16 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Asherdelampyr

Seriously, if someone wants a gun that badly there are much much easier ways to get one
it would have been worse if they posted the names of all the people who owned a top of the line gaming computer, or a large plasma-screen tv... in most cases those will sell better
Other than that, there isnt really a contreversy. As stated above, the info published was already public, they didnt dig it up in some seedy back alley somewhere, the state government has the info available to anyone.


No they didn't dig it up in a back alley, but most people would not bother to look it up or even know where to find it.

This was an attack by the newspapers on people who took advantage of a legal ruling that the papers' editorial staff disagreed with.

Like I said before, I don't support concealed carry, but what these newspapers did was a blatant attempt at coercion.





Asherdelampyr -> RE: Memphis paper posts concealed carry permits on line (3/3/2009 2:19:15 PM)

"The preferred gun for a criminal, though, is a stolen one, and for obvious reasons."

Almost right, the preferred gun for a criminal will e any one that cant be easily traced back to him... sometimes that may be stolen from some random guys apartment, usually that means bought from a less than reputable dealer, since they dont keep receipts or ask for your real name half the time... Honestly in this country it is easier to purchase a gun if you are a criminal than if you are a "law-abiding citizen" and there isnt a waiting period.

The idea that this is going to make those people bigger targets for robbery is ludicrious to me... I mean, the sort of person that would take the time to find out where you live, track your habits to find out when you arent home and then break in would have had no problem finding this info on-line before the newspaper in question listed it... The bigger issue is whether or not this may hurt people applying for employment, or trying to purchase a home or car because someone doesnt want to sell to/hire them if they know that they are packing.




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