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RE: Self-discipline and Self -control - 2/14/2009 8:10:30 PM   
feydeplume


Posts: 935
Joined: 12/24/2008
Status: offline 		HUGS!!!! you are braver than you think and sexier than you will ever know. But i bet he knows that too.

_____________________________

Wait! Are those my pants?
If it has testicle or tires, it's gonna give you the fidgets.
Pretend I said something witty and laugh.

(in reply to oceanwynds)
Profile   Post #: 21
RE: Self-discipline and Self -control - 2/14/2009 8:13:56 PM   
oceanwynds


Posts: 1044
Joined: 8/24/2006
Status: offline 		chuckles..he's made mention about my looks many times in the positive, except i have no butt..lol

Thanks again

(in reply to feydeplume)
Profile   Post #: 22
RE: Self-discipline and Self -control - 2/14/2009 10:09:00 PM   
chainedgirl


Posts: 142
Joined: 2/5/2005
Status: offline 		i remember being here a few years ago and also recently.  This struggle will be ongoing through out your submmissive life.  Its perfectly natural as you start to go deeper with submission.  Kind of like an initiatory stage, so congratulations on getting here!

Up til now, you have been exploring what's involved with BDSM, what its like to be submissive, what sort of submissive you are best at being and what it all feels like.  You've been learning protocols, positions, rules.  None of it easy when we are in it seriously.  Somewhere along the way, a deep part of you has woken up and said 'yes' to this, this is indeed what you are/want.  You've come to recognise it and now the real work begins.

How independent and head strong are you in life, in general?  I know I am very head strong and can be quite stubborn when I want to be. That's what's made going deeper harder for me, because I realise what I need most is TPE, but at the same time I'm scared of giving up my 'right' to choose if I work, where I work, what I can do with my own money.  If I can indulge in my hobbies and even when I can indulge in them.  This can be as basic as a fear of giving up the 'right' to choose what you wear, whether you can sit on furniture or the floor when company comes round or even if you can talk to people at a party! 

I know I felt like I was losing my identity.  Who am I?  What am I?  What I eventually realised is I am Master's slave.  I am his property. What I am is a relfection of Him.  I haven't lost my identity, I am still michelle.  I'm just michelle collared to Master is all.  You will work out what the fears are as you go.  For right now, its important to acknowledge they are there.  They are valid feelings.  There's a book called 'Feel the fear and do it anyway' or something like that.  My advice would be to first work out is this what you want?  You can always say no later on.  You aren't signing yourself up for life, so is this what you want at this stage in your life?  If the answer is yes, then go to your Dom, telling him you are shit scared (he will fully understand this) and then take a deep breath and take one step forward at a time.

(in reply to oceanwynds)
Profile   Post #: 23
RE: Self-discipline and Self -control - 2/14/2009 10:31:52 PM   
housemouseinoz


Posts: 83
Joined: 2/3/2009
Status: offline 		oceanwynds :-) great post.......i was in that headspace last week. i was really bothered about my feelings, i was scared i was going to loose me, so many different emotions to deal with. Your question could not have come at a better time for me.

chainedgirl
Thankyou......what a perfect reply. my Dom has been ever so patient with me whilst i make my way through the maze of emotions i experience. i always feel so guilty though, i'm supposed to be making his life easier not more difficult. sometimes i feel like a yoyo or that i run hot and cold, as an end result i wish to serve him and serve him well. It is so nice to read other subs posts and see that many have been where i am. Thank you for sharing your own experiences :-)

(in reply to chainedgirl)
Profile   Post #: 24
RE: Self-discipline and Self -control - 2/15/2009 2:51:51 AM   
InTonguesslave


Posts: 342
Joined: 2/6/2009
Status: offline 		this is such a great question OW ( i want to add an L, ill resist..)

im where you are right now.  not because im afraid of losing myself, though that was a fear i had years ago.  that doesnt happen, or it hasnt happened to me - but a change in you will come about that might seem like youre altering.  normally we change gradually as we grow through life but its concentrated change in these dynamics and that can be scary.

i have no self discipline, its dreadful how unself disciplined i am.  i do have self control and that if anything is what holds me back.  when that happens i have to trust that Sir will pace the push he gives me to get me through my hesitations.

if i feel uncomfortable about something i sit back a bit and look at it, reflect on it, work out why it frightens me, talk it through,, but talking it through is sometimes hard when what im feeling is in a fog and confused.  sometimes i have to wait for it to bubble up to the surface, maybe a day or two later.  i really am someone who has to sleep on something sometimes to work out how i feel.  that creates a delayed reaction that i can usually sort out myself, but not always.

i have to admit that i am really sticky about holding on to who i am - and who i am doesnt always find it easy to swallow the submission i need to have in my life.  its not so much an internal struggle as a series of blips that hit me in the chest - i just deal with them as they come along and i usually find a way around or over them.  if i cant i ask for help with it


(when i was lally i was corrupted, now im all sweet and innocent again)

< Message edited by InTonguesslave -- 2/15/2009 2:53:31 AM >

(in reply to oceanwynds)
Profile   Post #: 25
RE: Self-discipline and Self -control - 2/15/2009 2:55:38 AM   
SailingBum


Posts: 3225
Joined: 12/10/2007
From: Sailin the stormy sea
Status: offline 		How bout a shock collar so when you have these urges ya can  zapp yourself?  That should teach you self control.

BadOne

_____________________________

The beatings will continue until morale improves.

According to SwithNSpanky
We are all so very lucky to have you with us to impart your great wisdom.

(in reply to oceanwynds)
Profile   Post #: 26
RE: Self-discipline and Self -control - 2/15/2009 3:47:50 AM   
chainedgirl


Posts: 142
Joined: 2/5/2005
Status: offline 		Thank you housemouse. I recently put Master through 2 years of it lol (We've only been together for 4). It was right at the time he wanted to offer me a formal, full collar. I was going through a self-doubt sage at that time and didn't know if I wanted to, or could, commit on such a deep level. However, I knew I wanted to be his submissive and live partner. I have always been fully comfortable with the idea of him playing with others, so that wasn't so much an issue. His patience and love helped me through that bad time and it was 2 years, so its not a fly-by-night thing by any means. I'm happy to say that life changes came along and helped me remember this is who I am and what I want and he is the only one I ever want to do it with.

(in reply to SailingBum)
Profile   Post #: 27
RE: Self-discipline and Self -control - 2/15/2009 5:08:30 AM   
sparkyRBF


Posts: 157
Joined: 2/23/2007
Status: offline 		some beautiful and fantastic advice on this thread. 

I think you probably have more self control and discipline than you think you do.   I saw in another post you had written about how you are aware of being a reflection on your Sir.  That in it's self shows self control and discipline. 

I agree most with InTonguesslave with recognizing the fear or the issue and take the emotion out of it.  Reflect on it, think logically about it. 

Unicorn and fairytale wishes to you.

Sincerely


_____________________________

sparkyRBF
Happily owned slave
of
RedBotttomFarms

(in reply to oceanwynds)
Profile   Post #: 28
RE: Self-discipline and Self -control - 2/15/2009 5:45:41 AM   
CatdeMedici


Posts: 2257
Joined: 10/20/2008
Status: offline 		I have read this post many times and walked away to try to frame My response, I hope this makes sense--and I know, I'm a D so what would I know--( teasin ya ocean..)
 
I think where you are is what I call the "skin in the game" phase, really defining that level of trust, really determining if this is a fantasy or something that is what you are all about.  In the beginning, I find its easy for submissives to submit--as long as it meets or matches what, as you stated ," the fantasy is"--"its easy to submit as long at its something i have chosen to submit". But that list usually runs its course early on and  reality sets in, real life gets entwined--bills need paid, house needs cared for, and the easy fun list gives way to the "wait a minute, He/She is controlling everything" or
 " He/She expects submission in all areas".
 
 For many, its not easy to fully trust someone with your well being, to move off the CM list of fun things to the reality list of not so funs and not so easys.  Many bolt at the point you are at--not what they signed up for--yet you are at the point where the depth of the relationship is beginning to set in, the weaving of trust, commitment, devotion on BOTH sides, the deepening of the bond, and from your perspective, the turning over of your will to His. It may be an easy journey, it may be a hard one, I've seen them go both ways, but to look deeply at it, to question, to frame to analyze and define IMHO is a mark of strength, wisdom and growth. The play clothes have fallen away, it is time to define what submission for you really means--only you can do that, no one can say yeah or nah as you and Sir build your relationship. But in the end it has to feel good for you, you both have to inspire each other to be the most that you can be FOR and TO each other.
 
I wish you well, and admire this next level of your journey.

_____________________________

I am the Cat, holder of the whip and chair.

"Let's see-whips, dips, chains, chips, yep sounds like a party to Me!"

(in reply to oceanwynds)
Profile   Post #: 29
RE: Self-discipline and Self -control - 2/15/2009 6:24:52 AM   
gypsygrl


Posts: 1471
Joined: 10/8/2005
From: new york state
Status: offline 		A couple weeks ago, I had a couple of hiccups with the whole giving up control thing.  I was having a hard time just doing the basic stuff and feeling neglected which was making me feel resentful.  At the same time, I knew that Sir's behavior hadn't changed and he was in no way neglecting me.  We talked some about what I was feeling but it wasn't helping.  I was still feeling unsettled. 

Later on, as we were falling asleep, it dawned on me that I was wrestling with conflicts carried over from my childhood.  I was a quiet, compliant kid, and my parents mostly ignored me because both my siblings were much more demanding of their attention.  I grew up in a state of low level neglect precisely because I did what I was told, rarely got into trouble, and didn't need attention so much that I would act out to get it.  Basically, I was emotionally self-sufficient.  So, I've always been a good girl, and can't seem to be anything else, but that has often meant being neglected and taken for granted.

The case of the hiccups I had a couple weeks ago was a re-surfacing of all the complex emotions associated with stuff that happened as a child and the fear that I would be neglected if I continued to submit.  This fear is a paradoxical one: if I continue to obey, and do everything I'm supposed to...if I continue to make Sir happy, would I be forgotten, ignored, neglected?  At the time I was hiccuping, I couldn't answer this question with any certainty.  Experience has taught me that the sqeaky wheel gets the grease and I don't seem to have it within me to squeak much (but I also dont need much grease, so it probably evens out in the end).  At the same time, so long as I was hiccupping, I wouldn't have an answer because my case of the hiccups was interfereing with my submission thus preventing me from finding out what will happen if we take this further.  (I hope I'm being clear here.)  At this point I don't have an answer because the answer can only come in time.  But, the inner work of self reflection helped me to sort out my fears and get a very concrete handle on what was going on and why alot of which has nothing to do with Sir.  Additionally, it made me realize that I had moved beyond wondering whether or not I could trust Sir and struggling with all those issues that revolve around basic trust and was now struggling with internal issues. 

In any case, I'm with those who have said to "ride out your feelings."  Feelings are usually a symptom that we have some thinking/ self reflection to do.  I'm a very disciplined person (in most areas) and have a lot of self-control.  But, I do not apply that discipline/ self control to my feelings.  Well, I used to, but I don't any more.  Therapy helped me with that. lol

I do use discipline and self control when it comes to translating feeling into action.  I don't act on my feelings without taking time to reflect, analyze and think about things.  I allow myself to feel the feelings but I don't allow myself to be governed by those feelings.  I try not to speak from emotion (I'm not always successful) and rarely act from it. 

I think its really important to allow yourself to feel the full range of whatever it is your feeling.  Just let it all wash over you, the good, the bad, the ugly.  And then, try to figure out what it means.

quote:

The fear of giving control up has risen now  


Its good to keep things in perspective.  Its my guess that people like us who actively and consciously seek to give up control to an earthly power are in the minority and there's probably a reason for this.  Its not easy.  Its scary.  Its hard.  It calls up a lot of demons, some of which have probably been lurking within us since our formative years. So, every time you feel the twinge of doubt, embrace it.  Pat yourself on the back and take it as a good thing, as a sign that you're moving in the right direction.  Of course, pay attention to the doubt too, because its probably telling you something you need to know.

quote:

Sir cant always tend to my needs and he needs a strong sub who can take care of herself.   


Is this you talking or him?  Has he said this?  Or, are you projecting your self-doubt onto him?

_____________________________

“To be happy is to be able to become aware of oneself without fright.” ~Walter Benjamin


(in reply to oceanwynds)
Profile   Post #: 30
RE: Self-discipline and Self -control - 2/15/2009 6:40:20 AM   
feydeplume


Posts: 935
Joined: 12/24/2008
Status: offline
quote:

quote:

Sir cant always tend to my needs and he needs a strong sub who can take care of herself.

Is this you talking or him? Has he said this? Or, are you projecting your self-doubt onto him?


That is probably one of the best questions any of us have asked thus far. I wonder if that assumption is where some of the internal strife is coming from. Taking the sentence apart and looking at each bit is sort of amazing; the word always is used (absolutism) and the assumption that submitting will mane you too weak to be his sub or to take care of yourself. ouch.

There is a common saying among slave's: our first duty is to see that Master/Ma'am's property is well cared for so s/he doesn't have to worry about it. It is said in many forms, but the gist is always the same. The first duty of a slave is to be strong enough to be a slave, not a burden.


_____________________________

Wait! Are those my pants?
If it has testicle or tires, it's gonna give you the fidgets.
Pretend I said something witty and laugh.

(in reply to gypsygrl)
Profile   Post #: 31
RE: Self-discipline and Self -control - 2/15/2009 7:20:51 AM   
oceanwynds


Posts: 1044
Joined: 8/24/2006
Status: offline 		Thanks everyone for responding. I been experiencing computer problems so for now will try to answer your questions in one post. I do plan to come back and answer each individually when I can.

I use to think that I was in control and could handle anything that came my way. At one time, I remember when my husband set me down and told me, " You, came along way. I know you will do fine, when I am gone". He meant it and I believed it. That though was not the case when he died. I totally lost it and did not know how to move forward. I always had him to lean on about my ideas, and how to do things. Taken that away, i barely existed. This came to a shock for me.

Sir enters my life a year after. He is helping me to be self reliant and able to find my center again. He wants me to learn how to cope on my own when I am going through problems. Yes he is/was aware of these problems but made me go within to rescue myself. This was mainly because of what resulted when i lost my husband. He wants to make sure I can function in this world. My fears in trusting in him deals a lot with what if's. What if he disappears out of my life.

I will write more when i can.

blessings

(in reply to feydeplume)
Profile   Post #: 32
RE: Self-discipline and Self -control - 2/15/2009 7:47:57 AM   
chainedgirl


Posts: 142
Joined: 2/5/2005
Status: offline 		Ocean,

I think you've answered your own question. From this last post, what I'm sensing is your Sir is a very intuitive, knowledgeable and caring Dom. He is responding to what *you* need at this time. Helping you get your balance back. The last part "What if he disappears out of my life" is the real issue here. Its not you submitting more deeply, its not about you giving up control, its your fear you will be abandoned again. Your husband died and it certainly wasn't his choice, but how we react doesn't always have anything to do with the facts of the situation. Its entirely possible you've subconsciously felt abandoned by your husband and your choice of words about you Sir (he disappears) points to this.

Only you can answer this one. What if you were to submit and then he was gone for some reason? Would that invalidate your submission?

Have you discussed this issue with your Sir? We can't plan for everything, but his confirmation he has no plans to walk from you any time soon, will hopefully, go some way to appeasing you.

(in reply to oceanwynds)
Profile   Post #: 33
RE: Self-discipline and Self -control - 2/15/2009 8:17:18 AM   
oceanwynds


Posts: 1044
Joined: 8/24/2006
Status: offline 		InTongueslave

OWL would have been appropriate for many reasons that I wont go into.

Self control or lack of  has become an issue lately with me. This is attached to my emotions, and stepping back I see I am creating fears that aren't even present. I have done some things, like emailing to make sure he reads, so I know he's around, that are really stupid on my part. Sir knows why I do this. He only answers when he chooses. I am trying to stop this action. I am even embarrass to mention that I do this, since it seems so high schoolish to me. At first I made excuses because I use to be in a long term live in situation, marriage, so i am having trouble breaking the pattern. But i know now that it was out of my insecurities. I own it and am working with it. Trying to match my actions with my words now.

Thank you for your post and help.
owl:)

(in reply to InTonguesslave)
Profile   Post #: 34
RE: Self-discipline and Self -control - 2/15/2009 8:18:27 AM   
oceanwynds


Posts: 1044
Joined: 8/24/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: SailingBum

How bout a shock collar so when you have these urges ya can  zapp yourself?  That should teach you self control.

BadOne


That is a great suggestion.
Thank You
oceanwynds

(in reply to SailingBum)
Profile   Post #: 35
RE: Self-discipline and Self -control - 2/15/2009 8:19:36 AM   
oceanwynds


Posts: 1044
Joined: 8/24/2006
Status: offline 		Thank you sparky
Unicorn and fairy wishes to you as well.
oceanwynds

(in reply to sparkyRBF)
Profile   Post #: 36
RE: Self-discipline and Self -control - 2/15/2009 8:22:24 AM   
oceanwynds


Posts: 1044
Joined: 8/24/2006
Status: offline 		Thank you CatdeMedici
What your wrote spoke a lot of truth to me. Somedays, I will hear myself say to me, this isn't a game you need to own your talk.

Thank you for the advice and explanation on this new level of a journey for me.

Blessings,
oceanwynds

(in reply to CatdeMedici)
Profile   Post #: 37
RE: Self-discipline and Self -control - 2/15/2009 8:26:50 AM   
feydeplume


Posts: 935
Joined: 12/24/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: SailingBum

How bout a shock collar so when you have these urges ya can  zapp yourself?  That should teach you self control.

BadOne


Think it would help with me posting silly things on CM? Every time i get the urge to post something serious *zap* hmm wait I LIKE that zap feeling... I'd just become a postwh... never mind *zap*


_____________________________

Wait! Are those my pants?
If it has testicle or tires, it's gonna give you the fidgets.
Pretend I said something witty and laugh.

(in reply to SailingBum)
Profile   Post #: 38
RE: Self-discipline and Self -control - 2/15/2009 8:27:04 AM   
oceanwynds


Posts: 1044
Joined: 8/24/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: chainedgirl

Ocean,

I think you've answered your own question. From this last post, what I'm sensing is your Sir is a very intuitive, knowledgeable and caring Dom. He is responding to what *you* need at this time. Helping you get your balance back. The last part "What if he disappears out of my life" is the real issue here. Its not you submitting more deeply, its not about you giving up control, its your fear you will be abandoned again. Your husband died and it certainly wasn't his choice, but how we react doesn't always have anything to do with the facts of the situation. Its entirely possible you've subconsciously felt abandoned by your husband and your choice of words about you Sir (he disappears) points to this.

Only you can answer this one. What if you were to submit and then he was gone for some reason? Would that invalidate your submission?

Have you discussed this issue with your Sir? We can't plan for everything, but his confirmation he has no plans to walk from you any time soon, will hopefully, go some way to appeasing you.


Thank you and especially for this question. I will ponder it.

Sir knows what is going on with me.  Submitting more deeply is still where I am focus at, since to release control of areas that are needed is doing that. I am willing to go into this new layer of submission, with all the fears and face them. Nothing is guaranteed in life, but i cant let this fear control me over Sir.

blessings
oceanwynds

(in reply to chainedgirl)
Profile   Post #: 39
RE: Self-discipline and Self -control - 2/15/2009 10:15:48 AM   
oceanwynds


Posts: 1044
Joined: 8/24/2006
Status: offline 		housemouse,
Thank you for your reply. It might sound selfish, but it is nice to know I am not paddling this boat all alone. It is also good for me to realize submissives go through this many times.

blessings
oceanwynds

(in reply to housemouseinoz)
Profile   Post #: 40
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