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RE: Invisible Dominance and submission - 2/9/2009 10:02:32 AM

LadyHibiscus

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From: Island Of Misfit Toys
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We see a lot of threads on how to tell someone's orientation, too, like we should have different coloured marks on our foreheads or something. A relationship happens between the people involved. If those people are in tune to one another, it looks easy on the outside. Why shouldn't it?

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Post #: 21

RE: Invisible Dominance and submission - 2/9/2009 10:42:17 AM

sintyl

Posts: 11
Joined: 1/28/2009
Status: offline

I'd have to say that we're fairly invisible to most people too. Most people just see it as a successful relationship; they don't see all the work we've put into it to make it as far as we have. I take it as a compliment.

(in reply to Vendaval)

Post #: 22

RE: Invisible Dominance and submission - 2/9/2009 10:45:31 AM

Morniel

Posts: 60
Joined: 11/9/2007
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My all-time favourite, said to him in front of me... "She's your slave? Wow, she's so self-confident, no one would ever guess."

At the time it was all I could do not to burst out laughing, which would have been a tad rude, but to me, that's always been the absolute epitome of people who don't really understand a M/s or D/s marriage.

As someone else said, are we supposed to have "Hetero slave female" and "Bi Dominant Male" tattooed on our foreheads or something?

Soltic exerts dominance every day, simply by being who he is, and (it seems) I show submission every day, in spite of my self confidence.

I think that those who mentioned the "bedroom aspects" being what people think a BDSM relationship of any kind is about, are spot on. He's not currently beating you? You're not collared and leashed? (I am actually, but my "collar" is a bracelet") You're not kneeling naked (at my age?! kneeling?!) at his feet? Then he can't be a twue dom and you sure aren't a twue slave!

The whole thing's still a giggle.

(edited because lack of coffee caused a "post reply" before I was done babbling)

< Message edited by Morniel -- 2/9/2009 10:55:58 AM >

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Post #: 23

RE: Invisible Dominance and submission - 2/9/2009 11:00:08 AM

VampiresLair

Posts: 1307
Joined: 9/3/2008
Status: offline

Fox and I are not exactly invisible. It isnt so much the D/s as it is simply how our relationship works out. Fox is a very subservient type, and enjoys getting me things when we are out, so his serving me is open. Even vanillas cna see it, though they see it as being a doting boyfriend rather than a slave.

What we do hear often is that I am not dominant enough because I do not demand he do everything all the time. They dont see how the power exchange could function when I still do housework and the like. I dont see why liking a clean house and having more free time means I am not being dominant. It means I make the decision to do the work when I can, rather than put his school in jeapordy. I think its sad when people pigeonhole their relationships, and are so wrapped up in how things look that they cant see how they function.

DV

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Separately we are DiurnalVampire and DVsFox

10/18 Wedding date. 1 year and still blissfully happy

10/13/10 3 year anniversary of his becoming my Fox

Talk impolitely to me, baby - Thanks sunshinemiss

(in reply to Morniel)

Post #: 24

RE: Invisible Dominance and submission - 2/9/2009 2:29:58 PM

CreativeDominant

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Joined: 3/11/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: mistoferin

quote:

ORIGINAL: CreativeDominant
Sure they do...witness the thread from 2 - 4 weeks ago started by Knight about how some seem to need that overt expression of dominance. Views were expressed ranging from "you need to keep reminding me of why I submitted to you in the first place by showing your dominance" to "there has to be that overt display for me to feel like he is something more than any other domineering man" to "I get bored easily when things settle into a routine".

CD, I don't think that I caught the thread that you are referring to, I've been rather busy here lately. I have to say that I think that if a Dominant has to "show" their dominance though, it would be to garner submission that is obviously not there, at least not in that instance or there would be no need for the "show". As for things settling into a routine....funny, I would think that would be the goal. Maybe I'm viewing the word differently but to me "routine" would equate to "flow".

Apparently not, mist...the idea of settling into a routine. That was the complaint and at a certain point, I get what is being said. I am sure there are those that settle into a routine and, just as what happens in many non-D/s relationships, what is occurring in terms of D/s comes not from thought or reflection but rather from repetition. While everything we do in life is repetitious once we reach a certain stage, repetition rather than guidance/control OR obedience/yielding of a conscious sort should NOT be the guiding factor. On the other hand, the idea that I should have to remind you each and every day why you chose to submit to me...through some act, whether it be overt or not...seems to me to be, in addition to what I noted above, an invitation to the dominant/submissive to fail.

(in reply to mistoferin)

Post #: 25

RE: Invisible Dominance and submission - 2/9/2009 4:56:51 PM

slaveluci

Posts: 4294
Joined: 3/2/2007
From: Little Rock, AR
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: mistoferin
So many people are into the sexual aspect or the show aspect. Don't get me wrong, those are important components too. But the reality is that there are 23 other hours in the day...lol. Someone said to me that if things are being done "because" of the show, then they are meaningless and hollow. I think that is very true and I believe that so many people are looking for or are so hung up on the "show" that it causes them to never actually know what the "meat" tastes like.

Absolutely! Master and I have talked about this very thing at length. We don't do "show." We don't play in public, he doesn't lead me around the streets half-naked in leash and collar at gatherings, etc. We know what our dynamic is and we live it always. If others notice, fine. If they don't, that's fine too. But people DO notice.

They don't see whips, chains and cuffs but they see me serving Him, deferring to Him, respecting Him and a myriad of other things. He works with several girls and women and they all know His wife "takes care of Him." They see His delicious, carefully packed lunches, they hear and see how we interact. It's no mystery that He is king of His castle in every way. I don't need to strut down to His workplace scantily-clad and crawl up to Him and call Him "Master" to get that point across. Perhaps this would be "boring" to many. It's simply how it works for us. And it's working very well

......................luci

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To choose a good book, look in an inquisitor’s prohibited list. ~John Aikin

(in reply to mistoferin)

Post #: 26

RE: Invisible Dominance and submission - 2/9/2009 4:58:02 PM

elleRT

Posts: 28
Joined: 1/30/2005
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To me it has to do with willingness and commitement. I think the stronger dom/sub relationship is the one that is calm and quiet and not necessary visable to others. I have seen a lot of couple that put on a stage for others to see, thus believing they are acting dominant/submissive then anyone else. That is a game nothing more.

The bottom line is both should be in it for the right reasons. A dom should be a teacher, a lover, a counselor, a leader, patient, forgiving, and yes a punisher when is warranted. A sub should be submissive, to use all her abilities to make him happy, to use initiative to serve him well, to think of her dom as her world, as she will be the world of her dom. They both should be in it because they can not be without it. Not to show up and say" hey look at me, I am a male dom, punching his chest like a gorilla" The sub should be in it because that is what her heart dictactes her to do, it should make her happy serving, not do it because she fears the whip or reprements. Once both have found a match, no one needs to see proof, as it rests with eachother ;) No need to show it in the world

just my opinion :)

(in reply to mistoferin)

Post #: 27

RE: Invisible Dominance and submission - 2/9/2009 7:01:38 PM

kallisto

Posts: 1185
Status: offline

Someone else used the word "fluid". I think when you're in a relationship that works like a well-oiled machine, you are in tune and in synch with each other. I also think that too many people relate a D/s relationship with the physical acts of BDSM. If they don't see your Dom leading you around by a leash or carrying a whip, then you're not in a D/s relationship. Many times the most subtle relationships are really the most obvious.

(in reply to elleRT)

Post #: 28

RE: Invisible Dominance and submission - 2/9/2009 7:22:52 PM

Sexycelticlady

Posts: 112
Joined: 7/20/2008
Status: offline

I agree with much of what has already been said, about D/s not necessarily on show, just like any relationship, if it works it works, external factors such a showing other people the dynamic is unnecessary. I do know of some couples, very active in the clubs etc who have some of the strongest D/s relationships I have come across. It depends entirely on the individuals involved and what they enjoy doing together. The key is that it is for themselves, not others.

(in reply to kallisto)

Post #: 29

RE: Invisible Dominance and submission - 2/9/2009 8:08:26 PM

MidMichCowboy

Posts: 665
Joined: 3/23/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: mistoferin

So many people are into the sexual aspect or the show aspect. Don't get me wrong, those are important components too. But the reality is that there are 23 other hours in the day...lol. Someone said to me that if things are being done "because" of the show, then they are meaningless and hollow. I think that is very true and I believe that so many people are looking for or are so hung up on the "show" that it causes them to never actually know what the "meat" tastes like.

Erin, my lovely friend, you have stated it as plain as day. Those who think it's all about the "show" don't get it.
It's so much more. You don't need the public to see what is between two people (although friends can envy what they see between two good friends who deserve each other).

I look forward to seeing you both soon.

_____________________________

I want to capture your mind, your spirit, your soul, your body, your devotion and your love. Then, will I give you my heart.

(in reply to mistoferin)

Post #: 30

RE: Invisible Dominance and submission - 2/9/2009 9:30:07 PM

chiaThePet

Posts: 2694
Joined: 2/4/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Vendaval

quote:

ORIGINAL: chiaThePet
You mean not everyone is wearing the Manolo Blahnik Submissive Sneaker Stilettos with Rainbow Pom Poms?

OMFG!

I can't believe this old video has surfaced!

It was late.

Too much tequila.

They were filming 'Pets Gone Wild'.

Aileen wouldn't pull down her panties until I did.

chia* (the pet)

_____________________________

Love is a many splendid sting.

You can stick me in the corner, but I'll probably just end up coloring on the walls.

(in reply to Vendaval)

Post #: 31

RE: Invisible Dominance and submission - 2/9/2009 10:19:36 PM

DavanKael

Posts: 3072
Joined: 10/6/2007
Status: offline

Hmmm, the relationship I was in after my separation had a strong D/s component and people who were not 'in the know' just assumed we were a happily married long-term couple despite the fact that the relationship in its entirety lasted less than a year and we were not married, to each other, at least. I think they sensed the synergy and affinity that was there; it was not difficult to see. I was gratified by that being so evident. I am also sure that that squicked the other person's spouse as that synergy, for them, was not there, particularly in a D/s sense. Folks who were privy to D/s dynamics made the assumption that we (He and I) had a well-established collared relationship (Unless they knew specific details of timeframe and such) and compliments were plentiful on level of service, attentiveness, etc. to each party.
When you see people working well together, it is a wonderful thing to behold; it is an exquisite dance no matter the details.
I think that all relationships involve power dynamics, whether people accentuate them to the point of calling them D/s or not, and seeing attentiveness and ease of relating is going to be something that impresses and attracts others. Seeing people who have a genuine regard and affection for and flow with one another is difficult not to notice; it is a thing of beauty.
Davan

_____________________________

May you live as long as you wish & love as long as you live
-Robert A Heinlein

It's about the person & the bond,not the bondage
-Me

Waiting is

170NZ (Aka:Sex God Du Jour) pts

Jesus,I've ALWAYS been a deviant
-Leadership527,Jeff

(in reply to sailorfrank)

Post #: 32

RE: Invisible Dominance and submission - 2/10/2009 3:48:54 AM

DesFIP

Posts: 25191
Joined: 11/25/2007
From: Apple County NY
Status: offline

I agree. I think that unless someone is always walking eyes downcast, three feet behind the D type, always saying "Yes Master/Mistress" that they don't believe it's going on. For a lot of people it is more about the outward stuff, the formal protocol then it is about the emotions.

I can say "Yes Master" while thinking "you stupid twit" and that isn't submission in my book. Being genuinely happy to be with him, and glad to do things for him, and happy to let him take the reins is, at least for me.

_____________________________

Slave to laundry

Cynical and proud of it!

(in reply to sailorfrank)

Post #: 33

RE: Invisible Dominance and submission - 2/10/2009 4:18:59 AM

mistoferin

Posts: 8284
Joined: 10/27/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: DesFIP
I can say "Yes Master" while thinking "you stupid twit" and that isn't submission in my book.

I have to disagree here because I think that that IS submission. There are lots of times that I don't agree with him, and yes, even times I think that what he wants is stupid or that he's being a jerk....but submission to me is submitting to his will even when I do think it's stupid. If our views and wants were always in accord, I wouldn't be submitting to much.

_____________________________

Peace and light,
~erin~

There are no victims here...only volunteers.

When you make a habit of playing on the tracks, you thereby forfeit the right to bitch when you get hit by a train.

"I did it! I admit it and I'm gonna do it again!"

(in reply to DesFIP)

Post #: 34

RE: Invisible Dominance and submission - 2/10/2009 4:19:32 AM

Aileen1968

Posts: 6062
Joined: 12/12/2007
From: I miss Shore, New Jersey
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: chiaThePet

Aileen wouldn't pull down her panties until I did.

chia* (the pet)

You got that right!

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Post #: 35

RE: Invisible Dominance and submission - 2/10/2009 7:43:14 AM

CreativeDominant

Posts: 11032
Joined: 3/11/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: mistoferin

quote:

ORIGINAL: DesFIP
I can say "Yes Master" while thinking "you stupid twit" and that isn't submission in my book.

I have to disagree here because I think that that IS submission. There are lots of times that I don't agree with him, and yes, even times I think that what he wants is stupid or that he's being a jerk....but submission to me is submitting to his will even when I do think it's stupid. If our views and wants were always in accord, I wouldn't be submitting to much.

Agreed. Submission isn't always about doing it the way the submissive might like but sometimes doing it...yielding to the dominant's will...even when you don't like it and may even think the dominant is "a stupid twit" for requesting whatever the act is and yet, you yield and do it.

Something that should be noted...dominance isn't always about doing what we want either. There are times when I...and I'd be willing to bet other dominants...feel like "Oh Jesus, can't you do just this ONE thing without guidance tonight?"

(in reply to mistoferin)

Post #: 36

RE: Invisible Dominance and submission - 2/10/2009 8:08:39 AM

allthatjaz

Posts: 2878
Joined: 8/20/2008
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: elleRT

To me it has to do with willingness and commitement. I think the stronger dom/sub relationship is the one that is calm and quiet and not necessary visable to others. I have seen a lot of couple that put on a stage for others to see, thus believing they are acting dominant/submissive then anyone else. That is a game nothing more.

The bottom line is both should be in it for the right reasons. A dom should be a teacher, a lover, a counselor, a leader, patient, forgiving, and yes a punisher when is warranted. A sub should be submissive, to use all her abilities to make him happy, to use initiative to serve him well, to think of her dom as her world, as she will be the world of her dom. They both should be in it because they can not be without it. Not to show up and say" hey look at me, I am a male dom, punching his chest like a gorilla" The sub should be in it because that is what her heart dictactes her to do, it should make her happy serving, not do it because she fears the whip or reprements. Once both have found a match, no one needs to see proof, as it rests with eachother ;) No need to show it in the world

just my opinion :)

I felt I had to say something here

Within our relationship we are teachers, lovers, counsellors, leaders, patient, forgiving and as well as that we are incredibly romantic and absolutely best friends.
That aside we have an underlying D/s thing going on at all times and thats if we are together or apart. This is a silent part of our relationship that no outsiders see. But we also play in clubs and we don't play in clubs to prove who we are or what we have but because we both have that fetish called 'exhibitionism'. This has nothing to do with our D/s concept but more to do with our S/m one. Exhibitionism is just another celebration of who we are and I don't think it should be put down so lightly as 'not being real'

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(in reply to elleRT)

Post #: 37

RE: Invisible Dominance and submission - 2/10/2009 8:11:20 AM

chiaThePet

Posts: 2694
Joined: 2/4/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Aileen1968

quote:

ORIGINAL: chiaThePet

Aileen wouldn't pull down her panties until I did.

chia* (the pet)

You got that right!

Why yes I did.

And it was spectacular.

chia* (the pet)

_____________________________

Love is a many splendid sting.

You can stick me in the corner, but I'll probably just end up coloring on the walls.

(in reply to Aileen1968)

Post #: 38

RE: Invisible Dominance and submission - 2/10/2009 8:17:33 AM

LaTigresse

Posts: 26123
Joined: 1/15/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: CreativeDominant

Something that should be noted...dominance isn't always about doing what we want either. There are times when I...and I'd be willing to bet other dominants...feel like "Oh Jesus, can't you do just this ONE thing without guidance tonight?"

Uhmmm, yeah. Quite often in fact. Especially here at work with my, obviously submissive, graphics guy. But, I grit my teeth and give him the guidance he needs and move on. And then do everything in my power to refrain from chucking my stapler at the back of his head as he walks away.

_____________________________

My twisted, self deprecating, sense of humour, finds alot to laugh about, in your lack of one!

Just because you are well educated, articulate, and can use big, fancy words, properly........does not mean you are right!

(in reply to CreativeDominant)

Post #: 39

RE: Invisible Dominance and submission - 2/10/2009 9:13:09 AM

bound4more

Posts: 128
Joined: 10/3/2008
Status: offline

Thanks for this great post, erin. Yeah - have to admit I've been guilty of this. I had all kinds of imaginings about what D/s is all about, and how a Master is "supposed" to act and how a slave is "supposed" to respond and blah blah blah. The reality is most times we seem like anyone else. We have work, family, hobbies and interests - we have full rich lives - and a part of these lives is S&m and any overt expression of submission. Mostly it's like I've heard others say, I'm aware of what he likes and wants and I'm happy to provide it when possible. I've also learned to ask for overt expressions of his dominance when I feel a need for it. However, as his submissive, I accept whether he chooses to grant my request or not. Now that, perhaps is the difference.

_____________________________

You can tell who someone really is by how they act

(in reply to mistoferin)

Post #: 40

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