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D/s with PTSD - 11/25/2008 1:12:12 AM   
DogGoneBad


Posts: 40
Joined: 11/25/2008
Status: offline 		I'm interested in what works best for a submissive with PTSD and other dissociative disorders.  I'm interested in knowing what things to avoid as well.  I'm seeking general information, advice and input.  I'm not looking for advice on avoiding or ending relationships.  Any helpful information deeply appreciated.

< Message edited by DogGoneBad -- 11/25/2008 1:18:42 AM >
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RE: D/s with PTSD - 11/25/2008 1:20:47 AM   
variation30


Posts: 1190
Joined: 12/1/2007
From: Alabama
Status: offline 		learn as much about their circumstance as you can. learn how to deal with flashbacks. learn how to avoid triggers. if they want therapy, find a cognitive behavior therapist who knows his stuff. if they are very comfortable, you can slowly (and I do mean very, very, very slowly) try to desensitize them to their triggers.

mostly, be understanding and supportive. communicate with them and let them know their episodes aren't bother and they have no reason to be embarrassed or ashamed.

it is, to say the least, a very difficult situation. I would hesitate jumping into a relationship like this.

< Message edited by variation30 -- 11/25/2008 1:21:30 AM >

_____________________________

all the good ones are collared or lesbians.

or old.

(in reply to DogGoneBad)
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RE: D/s with PTSD - 11/25/2008 1:47:34 AM   
MAMandSlave


Posts: 110
Joined: 8/15/2008
Status: offline 		I highly advise finding a therapist who is experienced in trauma therapy as part of thier treatment process. Not all therapists are trained in it. If the PTSD was caused by a sexual trauma, it might be important for the sub to deal with the triggers, develop coping mechanisms, learn to identify when they are in a dissociative state and warn thier dom, and the dom may need to learn to bring them out of this state, prior to beginning play.
Each individual has baggage they bring with them, some physical, some emotional, some with mental health issues. Communication and planning allow for strong relationships.

(in reply to variation30)
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RE: D/s with PTSD - 11/25/2008 2:15:06 AM   
zakkan


Posts: 606
Joined: 4/15/2008
Status: offline 		Slightly off topic here

When I first heard of cognitive behavior therapy, I instantly realised it was a perfect acronym for C.B.T.  In fact, the lecturer kept saying CBT to refer to the treatment. I couldn't stop laughing. And the person sitting beside me thought I was crazy.

When a hot female lecturer starts saying stuff like "CBT is most effective in treating such and such disorder..."


_____________________________

Silence! I keel you!

(in reply to MAMandSlave)
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RE: D/s with PTSD - 11/25/2008 2:17:31 AM   
variation30


Posts: 1190
Joined: 12/1/2007
From: Alabama
Status: offline 		I no longer tell people here that the only thing I take seriously is CBT, as I have enough blue names in my mailbox as it is.

_____________________________

all the good ones are collared or lesbians.

or old.

(in reply to zakkan)
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RE: D/s with PTSD - 11/25/2008 4:54:38 AM   
RealSub58


Posts: 1073
Status: offline 		There are dozens of archived forums on this very topic...search them?

(in reply to variation30)
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RE: D/s with PTSD - 11/25/2008 5:17:00 AM   
Rover


Posts: 2634
Joined: 6/28/2004
Status: offline 		BDSM is not therapy.  I believe PTSD and a professional therapist would be a much better fit.  It may be difficult to take that first step, and if that's the case find someone who can help you make it.  Seriously, reach out to a friend.
 
John

_____________________________

"Man's mind stretched to a new idea never goes back to its original dimensions."

Sri da Avabhas

(in reply to variation30)
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RE: D/s with PTSD - 11/25/2008 5:42:58 AM   
kiyari


Posts: 631
Status: offline 		DGB: Welcome to CM/CC

As for PTSD: I am not aware that there is any curative 'treatment' for that condition, sadly.

How is it, that you are aware of (or suspect) PTSD in your (prospective) sub?

Are they aware of it, themselves?

Be considerate of panic attacks, and suspend any 'play' if such presents, is my only (pure layperson's) suggestion.

_____________________________

Black Water Dragon

(in reply to DogGoneBad)
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RE: D/s with PTSD - 11/25/2008 6:08:21 AM   
OrionTheWolf


Posts: 7803
Joined: 10/11/2006
Status: offline 		This is some very good advice here. My slave has PTSD, because of a previous owner. Between the therapist working with her, keeping us both informed, and me working with her on triggers, it has become less than it was and the episodes have become more infrequent. The condition can never truly be cured but it can be managed so that it does not impact life very much.


quote:

ORIGINAL: variation30

learn as much about their circumstance as you can. learn how to deal with flashbacks. learn how to avoid triggers. if they want therapy, find a cognitive behavior therapist who knows his stuff. if they are very comfortable, you can slowly (and I do mean very, very, very slowly) try to desensitize them to their triggers.

mostly, be understanding and supportive. communicate with them and let them know their episodes aren't bother and they have no reason to be embarrassed or ashamed.

it is, to say the least, a very difficult situation. I would hesitate jumping into a relationship like this.


_____________________________

When speaking of slaves people always tend to ignore this definition "One who is abjectly subservient to a specified person or influence."

(in reply to variation30)
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RE: D/s with PTSD - 11/25/2008 6:50:56 AM   
DarkSteven


Posts: 28072
Joined: 5/2/2008
Status: offline 		I have had a little experience, and the only advice I can give is to be prepared to stop a session with no notice and no safeword, and simply comfort the sub while she goes through a flashback. Kinda like the aftercare without the session.


_____________________________

"You women....

The small-breasted ones want larger breasts. The large-breasted ones want smaller ones. The straight-haired ones curl their hair, and the curly-haired ones straighten theirs...

Quit fretting. We men love you."

(in reply to OrionTheWolf)
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RE: D/s with PTSD - 11/25/2008 7:05:48 AM   
thetammyjo


Posts: 6322
Joined: 9/8/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DogGoneBad

I'm interested in what works best for a submissive with PTSD and other dissociative disorders.  I'm interested in knowing what things to avoid as well.  I'm seeking general information, advice and input.  I'm not looking for advice on avoiding or ending relationships.  Any helpful information deeply appreciated.


As someone with PTSD who also owns someone with PTSD I can say that the person with these issues must be in therapy of some time or have been in therapy successfully so they know how to cope and can give you the answers you seek. I'd also suggest going to therapy with them at least once before you commit yourself to the dynamic.

Given up any thought you might have, however tiny that you can "fix" them.

_____________________________

Love, Peace, Hugs, Kisses, Whips & Chains,

TammyJo

Check out my website at http://www.thetammyjo.com Or www.tammyjoeckhart.com

And my LJ where I post fiction in progress if you "friend" me at http://thetammyjo.livejournal.com/

(in reply to DogGoneBad)
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RE: D/s with PTSD - 11/25/2008 9:28:42 AM   
cagliostro


Posts: 128
Joined: 12/29/2007
Status: offline 		PTSD, DID, and DDNOS all work basically the same way.  An event triggers a mental response which relates to events that occurred in the person's past.  The events are varied and can be as minor as a speech inflection while talking.  If the "trigger" occurs the person's mind changes and becomes beyond their control.  Often they aren't aware that this change has taken place.  So in a state like this it is likely they would be unable to use a safe word or gesture.  It then becomes your responsibility to detect, as best you cant, when this happens, because, in effect, this change is that safeword. 

In addition, you will need detailed information about their past, and will have to keep it in mind at all times or you may unwittingly reproduce events that traumatized them.

(in reply to thetammyjo)
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RE: D/s with PTSD - 11/25/2008 9:49:10 AM   
DavanKael


Posts: 3072
Joined: 10/6/2007
Status: offline 		Go with your partner to their counselor (With ptsd and did, they really ought be in counseling), explain your relationship and discuss how to function as safely as possible within what you two wish to do as compared to triggering events, etc. 
This one, particularly with the intejection of the dissociation, screams, imo, for professional intervention. 
  Davan

_____________________________

May you live as long as you wish & love as long as you live
-Robert A Heinlein

It's about the person & the bond,not the bondage
-Me

Waiting is

170NZ (Aka:Sex God Du Jour) pts

Jesus,I've ALWAYS been a deviant
-Leadership527,Jeff

(in reply to cagliostro)
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RE: D/s with PTSD - 11/25/2008 9:51:37 AM   
DavanKael


Posts: 3072
Joined: 10/6/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: zakkan

Slightly off topic here

When I first heard of cognitive behavior therapy, I instantly realised it was a perfect acronym for C.B.T.  In fact, the lecturer kept saying CBT to refer to the treatment. I couldn't stop laughing. And the person sitting beside me thought I was crazy.

When a hot female lecturer starts saying stuff like "CBT is most effective in treating such and such disorder..."



Rofl, I am so glad you mentioned this!  As a clinician, everytime someone says CBT in a professional setting, I have to take a moment to re-adjust my brain as it does NOT go to Cognitive Behavioral Therapy! 
  Davan

_____________________________

May you live as long as you wish & love as long as you live
-Robert A Heinlein

It's about the person & the bond,not the bondage
-Me

Waiting is

170NZ (Aka:Sex God Du Jour) pts

Jesus,I've ALWAYS been a deviant
-Leadership527,Jeff

(in reply to zakkan)
Profile   Post #: 14
RE: D/s with PTSD - 11/25/2008 10:33:43 AM   
GoodFeathers


Posts: 202
Joined: 11/20/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DavanKael

quote:

ORIGINAL: zakkan

Slightly off topic here

When I first heard of cognitive behavior therapy, I instantly realised it was a perfect acronym for C.B.T.  In fact, the lecturer kept saying CBT to refer to the treatment. I couldn't stop laughing. And the person sitting beside me thought I was crazy.

When a hot female lecturer starts saying stuff like "CBT is most effective in treating such and such disorder..."



Rofl, I am so glad you mentioned this!  As a clinician, everytime someone says CBT in a professional setting, I have to take a moment to re-adjust my brain as it does NOT go to Cognitive Behavioral Therapy! 
Davan


I've had similar experiences...like in my psych capstone class last year.  I kept turning lovely shades of red, so my prof kept staring at me and saying things like "CBT is my preferred form of treating a client."

Back on topic, though...
Dependent upon how severe your subbies PTSD is, there is not only a mental safety issue to concern yourself with, but a physical one.  Not just for the sub, either, but for you too.  I've lived with people who have PTSD...when they felt threatened, they wouldn't run...they'd attack.  I'd seek out a therapist, one who would be comfortable having sessions with you there as well (but not all the time!).  Obviously, you care very much, otherwise you wouldn't be asking, so it's a good first step. 


_____________________________

"The more I learn, the more I realize I haven't learned enough."

(in reply to DavanKael)
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RE: D/s with PTSD - 11/25/2008 10:39:34 AM   
mystickoolaid


Posts: 519
Joined: 11/15/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Rover

BDSM is not therapy.  I believe PTSD and a professional therapist would be a much better fit.  It may be difficult to take that first step, and if that's the case find someone who can help you make it.  Seriously, reach out to a friend.
 
John


While it is true that BDSM is not therapy, if you trusted your dominant enough to try to work through these issues together, would that not be therapeutic in its own right?

(in reply to Rover)
Profile   Post #: 16
RE: D/s with PTSD - 11/25/2008 12:46:16 PM   
IvyMorgan


Posts: 729
Joined: 7/5/2007
From: Midlands, UK
Status: offline 		As others have said, therapy is the first step, and then listening very carefully to what it is that your partner wants and is saying.  They are the person who knows them selves and their condition best, they know what triggers them, what should be avoided etc far better than anyone else.

Be aware of it, and potential triggers you were previously unaware of, during play.

Be compassionate.

Don't push the idea of working through triggers, if they want to, they'll tell you, and lead you in what to do.

(in reply to mystickoolaid)
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RE: D/s with PTSD - 11/25/2008 1:30:10 PM   
DavanKael


Posts: 3072
Joined: 10/6/2007
Status: offline 		I'm concerned about the focus on only ptsdinmost of the recommendations on this.  While that is serious, so too is dissociation.  I worked extensively (2 years in-patient) with people with dissociative identity disorder and it's nothing to play with either.  The spectrum of trauma disorders is something within which to tread lightly and to seek professional intervention. 
  Davan

_____________________________

May you live as long as you wish & love as long as you live
-Robert A Heinlein

It's about the person & the bond,not the bondage
-Me

Waiting is

170NZ (Aka:Sex God Du Jour) pts

Jesus,I've ALWAYS been a deviant
-Leadership527,Jeff

(in reply to IvyMorgan)
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RE: D/s with PTSD - 11/25/2008 2:45:52 PM   
moonvine


Posts: 780
Joined: 11/7/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: GoodFeathers


Back on topic, though...
Dependent upon how severe your subbies PTSD is, there is not only a mental safety issue to concern yourself with, but a physical one.  Not just for the sub, either, but for you too.  I've lived with people who have PTSD...when they felt threatened, they wouldn't run...they'd attack.  I'd seek out a therapist, one who would be comfortable having sessions with you there as well (but not all the time!).  Obviously, you care very much, otherwise you wouldn't be asking, so it's a good first step. 



I just sit down and start crying, in a kind of panicked manner.  I'm so glad I don't attack people...that would be bad..

(in reply to GoodFeathers)
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RE: D/s with PTSD - 11/25/2008 2:50:41 PM   
DavanKael


Posts: 3072
Joined: 10/6/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: moonvine

quote:

ORIGINAL: GoodFeathers


Back on topic, though...
Dependent upon how severe your subbies PTSD is, there is not only a mental safety issue to concern yourself with, but a physical one.  Not just for the sub, either, but for you too.  I've lived with people who have PTSD...when they felt threatened, they wouldn't run...they'd attack.  I'd seek out a therapist, one who would be comfortable having sessions with you there as well (but not all the time!).  Obviously, you care very much, otherwise you wouldn't be asking, so it's a good first step. 



I just sit down and start crying, in a kind of panicked manner.  I'm so glad I don't attack people...that would be bad..



Fight or flight is one of those basic psychological premises.  Either can have really negative ramifications. 
The idea of anyone playing with such serious issues without a trusted professional bieng there to help in the case of an emergency worries the Hell out of me; and, I'm a pretty pragmatic sort. 
Tread carefully, 
  Davan

_____________________________

May you live as long as you wish & love as long as you live
-Robert A Heinlein

It's about the person & the bond,not the bondage
-Me

Waiting is

170NZ (Aka:Sex God Du Jour) pts

Jesus,I've ALWAYS been a deviant
-Leadership527,Jeff

(in reply to moonvine)
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