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Dominants Dropping the Reigns - 10/6/2008 6:23:30 AM   
MsAuthoritarian


Posts: 51
Joined: 9/14/2008
Status: offline 		D/s and M/s relationships are certainly not immune to problems. With all the challenges of daily life; i.e. work, children, responsibilities, etc.; having an overall healthy relationship is challenging for anyone. It takes work by all parties involved to make the relationship withstand the test of time much less flourish.

Over the years I have heard of many situations where the dominant “dropped the reigns” within the relationship (so to speak). At the beginning of the relationship they would lay out the structure of the relationship, expectations, rules and regulations, discipline, etc. but over time they slowly but surely stop enforcing anything they have mandated, stopped paying attention, stop commutating, etc. Slowly but surely the relationship moves from being based in either D/s or M/s to vanilla with the sub or slave being left to think, “This is not what I signed up for”.
 
When the dominant is dropping the ball on their roles and responsibilities within the relationship:
 
1. How can a sub or slave effectively communicate the issues they see without being disrespectful?
2. What does the sub or slave do if the dominant does nothing to change the situation after being informed of what is being witness and the impact it is having?
3. Has any ever experienced this situation? If so, please tell us your story and how it was dealt with?
 
MsAuthoritarian

< Message edited by MsAuthoritarian -- 10/6/2008 6:24:25 AM >
Profile   Post #: 1
RE: Dominants Dropping the Reigns - 10/6/2008 6:36:50 AM   
Rover


Posts: 2634
Joined: 6/28/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MsAuthoritarian

1. How can a sub or slave effectively communicate the issues they see without being disrespectful?

 
What constitutes respectful communication is defined by each Dominant in their own relationship.  So simply do so in the manner in which they've been instructed.  If they haven't been instructed in such a manner, ask that it be provided.
 
quote:
2. What does the sub or slave do if the dominant does nothing to change the situation after being informed of what is being witness and the impact it is having?

 
That depends upon the nature of the relationship.  In many relationships, it would be acceptable to ask what the Dominant has decided to do about the problem.  But the bottom line is that any submissive/slave either accepts the decision and carries on, even if they're not happy about it, or dissolves the relationship if the problem rises to that level.
 
quote:
3. Has any ever experienced this situation? If so, please tell us your story and how it was dealt with?
 

 
I believe that everyone encounters problems from time to time.  I make a daily "sharing time" to talk openly and honestly about any issue(s).  If it's too difficult to speak to me about it, writing a journal entry can be very effective (it's a "third party" so to speak). 
 
But the bottom line remains the same... it's my decision to make and if she doesn't like it, her only two options are to accept it or move on.  I may or may not be sympathetic to her plight, depending upon the issue... but I can't do anything to change the choices.
 
The decision making process in power exchange relationships will not always yield a desireable result for all parties.
 
John
 

< Message edited by Rover -- 10/6/2008 6:45:24 AM >

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RE: Dominants Dropping the Reigns - 10/6/2008 6:43:30 AM   
LadyPact


Posts: 32566
Status: offline 		Fair enough.

Here's the best I can do for you.  It is one time I "dropped the reigns."  Roles were affected a bit.  Yet, we became more human.

In the past six months, I have been told twice, incorrectly, that I have an illness.  Just a few weeks back, I went for a second biopsy.  I admit it.  I was afraid.  I had no control.  No authority.  No dictation about how this would play out.  Rather than the Dominat who stands her ground..... I laid naked and expsoed.  I was no more or less than anyone who would be in the same position.

Yet, I was Dominant still.  I heard My boy's voice to remind Me that the woman I am is always his Dominant.  Even when My body fails Me or My courage escapes Me.  It is My times that I feel I am My weakness, he shows Me that he believes in My greatest strength.

Have other s-types thought of it this way?



_____________________________

The crowned Diva of Destruction. ~ ExT

Beach Ball Sized Lady Nuts. ~ TWD

Happily dating a new submissive. It's official. I've named him engie.

Please do not send me email here. Unless I know you, I will delete the email unread

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RE: Dominants Dropping the Reigns - 10/6/2008 6:55:45 AM   
Dnomyar


Posts: 7933
Joined: 6/27/2005
Status: offline 		I'm going to plagiarize John's answer. What he said.  

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RE: Dominants Dropping the Reigns - 10/6/2008 7:05:42 AM   
leadership527


Posts: 5026
Joined: 6/2/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MsAuthoritarian
3. Has any ever experienced this situation? If so, please tell us your story and how it was dealt with?


Sure, I didn't drop them because I'd gotten sloppy or complacent (ask me again in 3 or 4 years.. that'll be more likely then).  I dropped them because I was seriously considering whether I wanted the Master role when faced with the first time with the need to seriously discipline my wife. 

In the end, this is why I like my marriage and dislike your question.  Implied in your question is that the two people who ought to be in a partnership are combatting each other.  We don't have that.  My wife and I are partners.  What happened when I dropped the leash is that she came to me, knelt in front of me and asked what was wrong.  I told her and said, "I just don't know if I can do this."  Her response was simple and eloquent.  She snapped the leash onto her collar, took the other end and placed it in hand and said, "Sure you can Master.  See, it's easy.  Here, let me help." 

That would be what it looks like when two people have open lines of communication and shared goals.  Your questions look liked a  failed relationship has already happened... long ago.

_____________________________

~Jeff

I didn't so much "enslave" Carol as I did "enlove" her. - Me
I want a joyous, loving, respectful relationship where the male is in charge and deserves to be. - DavanKael

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RE: Dominants Dropping the Reigns - 10/6/2008 7:23:50 AM   
MsAuthoritarian


Posts: 51
Joined: 9/14/2008
Status: offline 		To those that have responded. Thank you for your input.
 
Rover,
It is great to see you :) (You call me Tigress in real life). Where is the Second Banana, is he around as well? <snickers> If so, it will feel like old times <laughing>
 

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RE: Dominants Dropping the Reigns - 10/6/2008 7:34:04 AM   
Mercnbeth


Posts: 11766
Status: offline
quote:

When the dominant is dropping the ball on their roles and responsibilities within the relationship:
  1. How can a sub or slave effectively communicate the issues they see without being disrespectful? 
  2. What does the sub or slave do if the dominant does nothing to change the situation after being informed of what is being witness and the impact it is having? 
  3. Has any ever experienced this situation? If so, please tell us your story and how it was dealt with?

When an "issue", crisis, or even a speed bump comes up it is an opportunity. It is a benchmark providing a good indication whether you have a viable partnership or a convenient friendship. It's my opinion that you never know your partner until you have one and see how he/she reacts.

  1. Communication never ends. Initiating communications is never disrespectful. Lecturing, blaming, yelling, berating; these are not methods of communication; they are methods of 'venting'. Sometimes its necessary, but it should come with a disclaimer. Get it behind you and then start communicating to discuss the specifics and determine a agreed solution.
  2. If nothing changes or nothing is agreed; unfortunately sometimes that "solution" is dissolving the relationship. It shouldn't be problem. It shouldn't even cause bitterness. You've talked it out, the situation can't be resolved to both partners satisfaction, things change. The result of change may have evolved one or both parties to a point where they are no longer compatible partners.
  3. We haven't experienced anything like this - yet. You can prepare, try to avoid, plan the best you can; and yet you can't consider every eventuality life presents. Unsuccessful relationships can be found scattered all over the place. They provide a great source of CSI style analysis and perfect 20/20 hindsight of what when wrong. Successful relationships can only be labeled as such on a common tombstone shared by both parties.

There should never be a time when the dominant "drops the reigns". Take off some of the tension, or loosening them - sure. As long as that communication thing we all know critical has established the cause and need that, for now, the reigns will not be so tight, it shouldn't cause a problem.

(in reply to MsAuthoritarian)
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RE: Dominants Dropping the Reigns - 10/6/2008 7:34:04 AM   
Rover


Posts: 2634
Joined: 6/28/2004
Status: offline 		Hey, Tigress.  :)  It's getting tough to keep track of you.  *LOL*
 
The second banana is alive and well (as you know), but hasn't been lurking in these parts since I wandered back a week ago or so.  But you are welcome to invite him, and remind him of his second banana status.  :)
 
John

_____________________________

"Man's mind stretched to a new idea never goes back to its original dimensions."

Sri da Avabhas

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RE: Dominants Dropping the Reigns - 10/6/2008 9:05:06 AM   
bound4more


Posts: 128
Joined: 10/3/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MsAuthoritarian

D/s and M/s relationships are certainly not immune to problems. With all the challenges of daily life; i.e. work, children, responsibilities, etc.; having an overall healthy relationship is challenging for anyone. It takes work by all parties involved to make the relationship withstand the test of time much less flourish.

Over the years I have heard of many situations where the dominant “dropped the reigns” within the relationship (so to speak). At the beginning of the relationship they would lay out the structure of the relationship, expectations, rules and regulations, discipline, etc. but over time they slowly but surely stop enforcing anything they have mandated, stopped paying attention, stop commutating, etc. Slowly but surely the relationship moves from being based in either D/s or M/s to vanilla with the sub or slave being left to think, “This is not what I signed up for”.
 
When the dominant is dropping the ball on their roles and responsibilities within the relationship:
 
1. How can a sub or slave effectively communicate the issues they see without being disrespectful?
2. What does the sub or slave do if the dominant does nothing to change the situation after being informed of what is being witness and the impact it is having?
3. Has any ever experienced this situation? If so, please tell us your story and how it was dealt with?
 
MsAuthoritarian


I found myself in this kind of situation with my Dominant. I think most things in life, when new and fresh, are exciting and interesting. But they also can become responsibilities rather than enticements after a time. I found myself with a Dom who wanted a slave but didn't enjoy the degree of attention I needed from him, to grow into that slave. I found myself struggling with something that I couldn't change - namely, who he is and what he wanted to do. We discussed it, argued and fought about it and it took a long time for me to realize that my slavery needed a degree of attentiveness that wasn't pleasureable for him. Since our relationship very much includes love,  I accepted that I had  2 choices - to stay and accept him as he is, or leave and see if I could find a Dominant who enjoyed what I needed in order to be a full time slave. I chose the former. We changed the form of our relationship to be more agreeable to his natural tendancies. We've both been much happier.  For me a condition I feel is fundamental to a D/s relationship is to accept that the Dominant is the one to  decide how it all plays out, not the submissive. Otherwise who's really the dominant?

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RE: Dominants Dropping the Reigns - 10/6/2008 10:12:26 AM   
Missokyst


Posts: 6041
Joined: 9/9/2006
Status: offline 		One of the reasons I no longer seek is because of this prevailing attitude.  If you have to worry about tendering everything so that the dominant does not view it as "disrespect", communication has a way of tapering off.
There is nothing wrong with just opening up a dialog and stating what you feel.  The shortest route between two points is straight across.
Kyst
quote:

ORIGINAL: MsAuthoritarian
1. How can a sub or slave effectively communicate the issues they see without being disrespectful? 
MsAuthoritarian

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RE: Dominants Dropping the Reigns - 10/6/2008 10:16:49 AM   
MissSCD


Posts: 1185
Joined: 3/10/2007
Status: offline 		The key is it has to be a working relationship.  My slave and I are on leave from the lifestyle for personal reasons.  We talked about it Saturday and agree this is the right thing to do for us at this time.
We are still  seeing each other.  I have too much on my plate to be swinging floggers at someone.
He is in the same place.  We actully are laughing for a change, and that is refreshing.
 
Regards,   MissSCD

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RE: Dominants Dropping the Reigns - 10/6/2008 6:56:20 PM   
LuckyAlbatross


Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MsAuthoritarian
1. How can a sub or slave effectively communicate the issues they see without being disrespectful?

Well a gazillion ways they CAN.  I've known masters who are proud of their slaves for shaking them physically and yelling in their face "What's going on?" because that's what they needed to get their head out of their asses.
 
My personal preference tends to be "Hey, I feel like I'm putting it all out and not getting anything back, what's going on here?"
quote:


2. What does the sub or slave do if the dominant does nothing to change the situation after being informed of what is being witness and the impact it is having?

Accept or leave.  There are various ways of communicating- lots of people think talking = communication, or nagging = communication, or hearing = communication.  This is PROBLEM SOLVING and DYNAMIC BUILDING.  Explaining is only the first step.  The fact that so many fuck up that first step so utterly completely is pretty impressive.
 
Try as many methods as you can, with counseling and threats and everything in between.  Either you find a way to work together and be fulfilled, or you end it.
 
quote:


3. Has any ever experienced this situation? If so, please tell us your story and how it was dealt with?

Ultimately the relationships ended.  
 
The real issue here is that people turn dominance and submission into tons of rituals and actions and looks and EXTERNAL drains of energy.  So when you're down and tired and sick, those external actions can't be reinforced and suddenly you're left without your structure.
 
The people who build their relationships based on an internal dynamic between eachother, one that flows within stress, one that becomes stronger as it is pulled apart, they know that just because they haven't fucked in a week doesn't mean they aren't desireable.
 
We all have our "levels" of fulfillment and compatibility.  You aren't a bad slave just because you know that you will be miserable if you aren't allowed to kneel.  The worlds most communicative and open couple won't necessarily last forever because sometimes people just grow apart.
 
In our relationship, we're pretty good about noting when we're just having down energy times and when we're actually having friction.  Knowing the difference between "I'm too tired to fuck" and "I don't want to fuck" is a good thing.  Recognize that neither necessarily means anything personal or daming is also a good thing.

 
MsAuthoritarian


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RE: Dominants Dropping the Reigns - 10/6/2008 7:02:00 PM   
DesFIP


Posts: 25191
Joined: 11/25/2007
From: Apple County NY
Status: offline 		Thank God I don't have any blockades set up to prevent me from talking to him openly. Respect here is shown by giving him not an image, but my authentic self. Which means if I'm sad or frustrated or resentful or angry I trust him enough to be able to handle that without throwing a tantrum and saying I'm not a twue subbie.

He wants me vulnerable and open, and that's what he gets.

Beyond that, he drops the dominant reins (note spelling) as often as I do the submissive ones. We both deal with family issues, we both deal with stress, but I get sick more than him. If I need more, I tell him. If he needs more, he tells me. We talk a lot and check in on the strength of the relationship a lot.

_____________________________

Slave to laundry

Cynical and proud of it!


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RE: Dominants Dropping the Reigns - 10/6/2008 7:48:02 PM   
leakylee


Posts: 747
Joined: 7/2/2004
Status: offline 		part of this depends on the reason for the drop, on the strength of the relationship and the dynamic. in a situation such as Lady Pact described, or any time of crisis/choas, i kinda figure it is our duty to act part of, or as that support system. partly just the decent and human thing to do, but also out of the love and devotion that we (hoepfully) feel. common sense should allow that yall arent super human. to expect anything else, just sets everyone up for failure.

relying on communication, the established security of instilled expections, and the strength of a healthy relationship will hopefully help both parties through.

for those that don't have that sort of emotional well-spring to fall back on, then the two options already mentioned are pretty much it. each person has to make the choice that is best for them.

smooches
lee

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RE: Dominants Dropping the Reigns - 10/7/2008 1:56:26 AM   
MaamJay


Posts: 2101
Joined: 9/2/2005
Status: offline 		To a large degree, Master and i have dropped the reins at the moment and have done so for a while. Neither of Us have been well, and there are a lot of other stressors riding on the result of a job interview for me before We can work out which of 2 future paths We will be taking. We've talked about it and agreed that there really isn't much more We could demand or expect of Ourselves at the moment. So We've not had a play session in months and even sex has largely been off the agenda due to illness and injuries! Do We miss it? YES! Can We do much about it now? NO! So the best thing We can do is accept it for now with the determination to reintroduce those activities as soon as it is feasible. The keys to the continuation of the relationship are that, even now, He is still Master and i am His girl and We do all the little things We can to maintain that, We still focus on making each other laugh every day and We are equally determined to raise the bar when We can. If either of Us felt the other had no heart for doing so in the future ... that would seriously challenge the relationship, though He is such an awesome person to be with, i'd find it hard to contemplate replacing Him!  

violet[A] (Maam Jay didn't get to say anything for a change!)

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RE: Dominants Dropping the Reigns - 10/7/2008 2:06:47 AM   
tweedydaddy


Posts: 673
Joined: 9/1/2008
Status: offline 		Honest communciation is never disrespectful. If a Dom does not want to listen to you and dismisses your views, you need to trade up. If you are scared to talk honestly to them you need to ask yourself what you are doing there.

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Profile   Post #: 16
RE: Dominants Dropping the Reigns - 10/7/2008 7:17:50 AM   
NuevaVida


Posts: 6707
Joined: 8/5/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Mercnbeth

  • We haven't experienced anything like this - yet. You can prepare, try to avoid, plan the best you can; and yet you can't consider every eventuality life presents. Unsuccessful relationships can be found scattered all over the place. They provide a great source of CSI style analysis and perfect 20/20 hindsight of what when wrong. Successful relationships can only be labeled as such on a common tombstone shared by both parties.
    There should never be a time when the dominant "drops the reigns". Take off some of the tension, or loosening them - sure. As long as that communication thing we all know critical has established the cause and need that, for now, the reigns will not be so tight, it shouldn't cause a problem.


    • I loved the honesty and wisdom behind this post.

    Yes, my former Master dropped the reigns, due to a life circumstance he had not planned or prepared for. Yes, it was terribly painful for me. Yes, I communicated it, and I communicated the effect it was having on me.

    The relationship ended. He was unable to pick the reigns back up, and instead instructed me to "deal with it." My attempts to deal rendered me very depressed. Neither of us were happy, and he ended it with little communication on his end.

    If both parties are not equally committed to the success of the relationship, I can not see its success in the long term. While Merc said there should not be bitterness, I confess that's a pill I am having a very difficult time with, currently. Disposing of anger and resentment is a daily chore for me still, but I do know the day will come when those emotions will be processed through and I won't be burdened with them any longer.

    One person alone can not make a relationship work.

    _____________________________

    Live Simply. Love Generously. Care Deeply. Speak Kindly.



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    Profile   Post #: 17
    RE: Dominants Dropping the Reigns - 10/7/2008 7:48:48 AM   
    WhiplashSmile2


    Posts: 526
    Joined: 6/11/2008
    Status: offline     		This is a little hard for me to fully relate to this type of situation.  If anything I tend to want to take more Reign in the course of time and not less.

    However, to respond to your specific questions.
    1. A sub/slave should be able to communicate without being disrepectful at any point in time during the course of the relationship.  If a sub/slave wishes to address the issue of there being a growing lack of D/s in the relationship, sure this might be a sensitive issue, however it's not intended to be disrespectful in any shape or form.   Their Dominant partner should be in tune with the difference between being Disrespectful and something being a bit uncomfortable for them to hear.   If the Dominant sucks at coping with this, it's the Dominants own internal issue and problem.  The sub/slave meant no disrepect at all.   I would say, the Dom would need to get a grip.  If they blow a gasket over it and flip out, they are the one in the wrong.
    2. My personal perspective is such, that the Dom should be responsible to take charge and do something about the situation and take responsibility for their half or end of the relationship.  Any Dom who does not, well really, is simply letting go of the D/s along with any form of relationship with the other person.  In short, this should hold true for any type of relationship D/s or otherwise.  It's not a D/s failure as much as it is a sign of relationship failure.
    3. I have not experienced this before per se, with the exception of when I myself was packing it on a relationship.  I openly expressed, I'm no longer going to continue the relationship on that level.  We are no longer!! Making it clear in regards to expectations of what was going on.

    I have dealt with things in a bit of a couple of crazy twisted kinky vanilla relationships, however the basic concept of communication applies, along with respect, along with somebody needing to take responsibility and action.

    In many regards people have this notion that D/s are so far removed from other kinds of relationships when in fact, this is not the case.   Good communication, respect, honesty, responsibility and giving a damn about the relationship all really matter.

    (in reply to MsAuthoritarian)
    Profile   Post #: 18
    RE: Dominants Dropping the Reigns - 10/7/2008 8:05:12 AM   
    leira73


    Posts: 7
    Joined: 6/28/2008
    Status: offline     		My Dominant (also my Husband) dropped the reigns a long time ago. He's starting to pick them up again. Communication was never really a problem for us. I was communicating my needs in various ways...letters, "out loud" conversations, journal entries, web browsing (since he checks up on my computer activities from time to time). What stumped him was how to fit it all in. With a family, work and house responsibilities there never seemed to be time for what he considered the "D/s" portion of our relationship. The struggle has been to help him understand that for me, it's not seperate...it's inclusive of all of those things. It's not seperate or compartmentalized in my head (or my heart).

    A few months ago I finally made it very clear that my needs weren't being met and hadn't been for a good long while. I wasn't worried about being disrespectful. At some point we are all responsible for ourselves and if voicing our needs (for the hundreth time) is disrespectful...well...too bad. I told him that it was ok if he wasn't interested in re-establishing a D/s relationship, that I understood that it was and is, a great source of turmoil for him. But since that was the case...we needed to start talking about how I would fulfill that need and still maintain our marriage. The suggestion to include another Dominant wasn't as far out in left field as it may seem here, we have included others at various times in our past.

    I ended up here on CM not really searching for anyone in particular but to see who/what was out there. We also started attending our local BDSM Group munches and reconnecting with people we hadn't seen or spoken with in years. I won't say there's been a HUGE change...there hasn't. I think it's finally clicked for him just how important this is to me though and that in itself is huge. For now, we're muddling through and trying to find our balance. I can't say it's been dealt with...but we're dealing with it on a continual basis. It's an ever-evolving process, but I think the same could be said for almost all relationships.

    ~leira

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    Profile   Post #: 19
    RE: Dominants Dropping the Reigns - 10/7/2008 8:07:46 AM   
    Mercnbeth


    Posts: 11766
    Status: offline
    quote:

    While Merc said there should not be bitterness, I confess that's a pill I am having a very difficult time with, currently. Disposing of anger and resentment is a daily chore for me still, but I do know the day will come when those emotions will be processed through and I won't be burdened with them any longer.

    Nueva,
    "Should not" is ideal; it rarely happens and never happens immediately or when one person is blind sided. While one partner is living the other partner is acting. Some people are great actors and can maintain a persona for a long period of time; especially when it satisfies them or they are the receiving end of a desired sensation. However regardless of skill, acting takes effort and work. When the effort isn't worth the sensation, or the sensation gets old, the act is over.
    How can you not be 'bitter'? As I said, when the need comes to loosen of reins (Previously written as reigns!  I hate the English language for it's homonyms especially when spell check isn't smart enough to know which version you intended and you see it as you think you wrote it!) it should be seen as an opportunity to determine if the foundation of the relationship is strong. It also helps for both parties to view the integrity of the other. When the relationship falls apart due to one party not willing to commit to the relationship in hard times there is very little that can be done to salvage it. Logically, why be bitter?

    But 'logic' and emotions don't get along well either. I can't say I've followed my own advice when it comes to not being bitter. Maybe time is the cure, or some other life changing event must occur to move on. Just know you have to do so. Drawing from personal experience, bitterness is baggage can't be carried on to a new relationship with an expectation of success. Bitterness builds is a wall of skepticism preventing happiness, trust, and fulfillment. It closes you from finding another.

    What worked for me, was that I focused on evolving the bitterness into indifference. The energy it took to be bitter was better spent when I became indifferent to the person and the situation. I striped away their value, appreciating that it was their 'acting' I was attracted to and I really didn't know them until they disclosed who they really were in tough times when the reins had to be loosened. I didn't like that person. Therefore there was no reason to be bitter about them anymore than I would a stranger.

    < Message edited by Mercnbeth -- 10/7/2008 8:55:51 AM >

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