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lazarus1983 -> RE: Lift Detroit In Prayer! (9/15/2008 5:39:16 AM)
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quote:
ORIGINAL: tsatske
quote:
Let's say you are homeless, or starving. Would you rather people express concern for your situation, or would you rather people try to help you out of your situation? Would you rather someone come along and say to you in your cardboard box, "I feel bad for you," or would you rather someone come along and give you some food?
My answer was, simply, that religous groups, those who gather and pray, do the lions share of the 'real work' of charity in this country. The vast majority of blankets, food, and water bottles are handed out by religious orginazations.
And, then, those who are offended by religion find things to complain about. The nuns in varoius large cities - I would bet Detroit has one - who have a foot washing ministry. They wash the feet of homeless people, and, whatever spirtiual and Biblical connetation they may put behind it, in reality, it improves the health of men who are on their feet all day. And, then they hand out shoes and socks. And, usually, they do it at a soup kitchen or day ministry, so the men also get fed, or get a warm place to sit, some coffee and a shower.
But, of course, there are 'bigger needs'. They could be spending their time on something better than feet, if they weren't so hung up on the special meaning that this act has for them. Say people who are so un-hung up that they are doing nothing.
Your complaint is very simular liberal complaints about prolife groups. I understand if, as a prochoice person, you find the prolife stance wrong and even offensive. I am not disagreeing with that. But, a common comment is that prolifer's care about unborn children, once their born, they no longer worry. But prolife charities hand out huge amounts of diapers and formula, baby clothes and baby furniture, and keep lists of people offering free baby sitting so that mothers can return to work.
What you need to understand is that things come in certain bundles in life - like chinese resteraunt meals. One of column A, two of Column B, that kind of thing.
For those with a religous bent, prayer, and gathering with others of their religious tradition, fuels them to do good works. And, me, I don't care why the good works get done. Do you really think some homeless guy, being handed a blanket on a cold night, is going 'Wait - did you pray over this first? Cause if you are one of those praying people, I don't want this blanket.'
So, our real disagreement - well, beyond that fact that I fundementally disagree with you that you have any right to be offended by people who practice their American rights in a way you find useless - useless is just not the same as harmful, I'm afraid - but, aside from that, our fundemtal disagreement is, I am aware that religous orginazations do most of the work that you are bemoaning not getting done, but not actually doing yourself.
You seem to be saying, hey, if that is what it takes, a bunch of religous nuts praying, i'd rather the homeless go without the damn blankets. You don't relize that is what you are saying, because you are avoiding that relazation by imagining, in spite of glaring statistics to the contrary, the these religious freaks do nothing but pray.
I have to admit, when it comes down to the real work - soup kitchens and blankets - I am sometimes offended. I am a liberal Christain and I don't believe in prostylazation. I would rather they just give them a blanket, and not insist on praying together, for instance - and often they do insist on something, a prayer together, or a church service, whatever. But, again, the homeless dude is probably more than happy to get the blanket, even if he has to put up with the prayer. When there is more 'competition' - some group handing out blankets on the next corner, without requiring the prayer, maybe he will go there. In the mean time, i suspect he is just gonna take the blanket, prayer and all.
Again, you try to cast me in an anti-religious light, while avoiding a simple answer to my question.
Am I sitting here bemoaning the religious organizations that do stuff? Am I pointing fingers at the christian children's fund? Point out in my posts where I have said that. Go ahead. My only target has been the "Lift Detroit with prayer" people. Not their right to gather and pray, not those religious groups that actually do stuff, but them.
My viewpoint is doing vs. thinking about doing.
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