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RE: Librarian kicked out of McCain 'town hall" - 9/14/2008 10:11:18 PM

FirmhandKY

Posts: 8948
Joined: 9/21/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: pahunkboy

hello- Firm,

true, I see your point on the PR angle.

....tho I dont know how one can be assessed a fine for this....
it doesnt say much about the outcome

anyone can post stuff on youtube.

the part tho on the new climate that has been around 2000 til now tho is a very different one then when Bill Clinton rather enjoyed the detractors.

then factor in the methods used at the conventions, such as 'free speach zones"...

today one must be QUIET! thats the way the rulers want it. ask no questions.. make no noise. be a quiet little citizen.

sorta like the mantra over terrorists..either you are with them or against them... notwithstanding that the way the US treats other people it will use on its own people.

how can anyone like the new climate? I dont.

so this lady refused to be a schill -a prop for the campaign. maybe if no one showed up they would wish for a disenter. the way it is going- no one will want to show up.

arent YOU more then a prop??

pahunk,

Believe or not, I agree with you to a large extent. I think "free speech zones" are anathema to the spirit of America.

I also think that the crud and bull that some "peaceful protesters" pull is anathema to the spirit of America as well.

How do we balance the two?

Dunno. It's a difficult issue that no one will ever be at peace with.

I blame the problem more on the total lack of societal condemnation (at least in the press and in the "intelligentsia" of the left) of the bad manners of many of the "protesters" (nihilist and socialists, generally) than I do on the government.

But I'm well aware that when the shoe is on the other foot, I'll scream loud and long too.

This particular incident, however, I do not believe merits much of a mention in the battle between free speech and restrictions on free speech.

Firm

_____________________________

Some people are just idiots.

(in reply to pahunkboy)

Post #: 21

RE: Librarian kicked out of McCain 'town hall" - 9/14/2008 10:16:47 PM

popeye1250

Posts: 18104
Joined: 1/27/2006
From: New Hampshire
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: MzMia

quote:

ORIGINAL: pahunkboy

61 year old lady is a big threat... yikes.

it is troubling to me.

Doesn't McCain go along with Bush 90% of the time?
Why are those that elected Bush twice, now wanting to distance
themselves from the President THEY elected?
odd

McCain DOES ============ Bush!

Right on to this library for voicing her opinion, shame on the McCain camp for attempting
to silence her!

What if someone tried to get into an Obama event with a sign that read; "OBAMA DOES KENNEDY".
Do you think the secret service would let them in?

_____________________________

"But Your Honor, this is not a Jury of my Peers, these people are all decent, honest, law-abiding citizens!"

(in reply to MzMia)

Post #: 22

RE: Librarian kicked out of McCain 'town hall" - 9/15/2008 12:07:50 AM

Thadius

Posts: 5091
Joined: 10/11/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250

quote:

ORIGINAL: MzMia

quote:

ORIGINAL: pahunkboy

61 year old lady is a big threat... yikes.

it is troubling to me.

Doesn't McCain go along with Bush 90% of the time?
Why are those that elected Bush twice, now wanting to distance
themselves from the President THEY elected?
odd

McCain DOES ============ Bush!

Right on to this library for voicing her opinion, shame on the McCain camp for attempting
to silence her!

What if someone tried to get into an Obama event with a sign that read; "OBAMA DOES KENNEDY".
Do you think the secret service would let them in?

To answer your question, do a search for what was allowed as far as signs or other banners at the Berlin speech and into Invesco field. Unless it was the clothes on your back, not much else was allowed. All signage was confiscated.

_____________________________

When the character of a man is not clear to you, look at his friends." ~ Japanese Proverb

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Post #: 23

RE: Librarian kicked out of McCain 'town hall" - 9/15/2008 1:39:31 AM

NeedToUseYou

Posts: 2297
Joined: 12/24/2005
From: None of your business
Status: offline

I think its pretty pathetic all around that the secret service is doing PR work for any candidate. I mean they didn't want her there because of a sign, a sign is no threat to life, and guess what, if one was going to try to off McCain, they almost certainly would try to blend in not stand out. Also, why do the cops care what the sign says as long as it's not filled with foul language, they have no right to remove someone from a public space like that, any law that disallows truly peaceful displays of discontent on public property is an extreme perversion of intent. IMO. It's irrelevant to me whether she meant the sign to be a slam on Bush or not. whatever. It's not hate speech,age bias,biased against the handicapped, or any of the usual suspects that the government feels needs to be controlled, it is a equation with to long variable names, denoting equality.

It's all sickening really, this country eeks closer and closer to shitdom every year.

(in reply to pahunkboy)

Post #: 24

RE: Librarian kicked out of McCain 'town hall" - 9/15/2008 1:46:35 AM

meatcleaver

Posts: 9030
Joined: 3/13/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: FirmhandKY

3. Since the Secret Service asked her to leave, I suspect that there is more information than is apparent in this propaganda piece.

Oh I doubt it. Have you ever entered the USA and dealt with American security? They do everything by the book as though the book is infallible which means a fucking lot of pissed off tourists, threats of arrest because frustrated tourists call the security arseholes under their breath which is noticed now and again (by observant security men) while anyone who wants to enter the US illegally would go to Mexico. The thing is, if you were a potential risk you will know the exact procedure that you will face and since many countries back the terrorists, its not that difficult to get all the false info and documents someone would need. So I for one believe, American security exists to treat innocent people like criminals.

< Message edited by meatcleaver -- 9/15/2008 1:49:52 AM >

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Post #: 25

RE: Librarian kicked out of McCain 'town hall" - 9/15/2008 3:22:17 AM

Hippiekinkster

Posts: 5512
Joined: 11/20/2007
From: Liechtenstein
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: meatcleaver

quote:

ORIGINAL: FirmhandKY

3. Since the Secret Service asked her to leave, I suspect that there is more information than is apparent in this propaganda piece.

Oh I doubt it. Have you ever entered the USA and dealt with American security? They do everything by the book as though the book is infallible which means a fucking lot of pissed off tourists, threats of arrest because frustrated tourists call the security arseholes under their breath which is noticed now and again (by observant security men) while anyone who wants to enter the US illegally would go to Mexico. The thing is, if you were a potential risk you will know the exact procedure that you will face and since many countries back the terrorists, its not that difficult to get all the false info and documents someone would need. So I for one believe, American security exists to treat innocent people like criminals.

You're pretty much on the mark. I've gone through US Customs over 50 times, and there have been times when I have felt embarrased for foreigners entering the US. I personally was pulled out of line and taken off to a search room in Vancouver because I told the truth, and admitted that I was carrying carrots I bought in Canada. This is no bullshit. Carrots. These cocksuckers put on gloves and put all my carry-on luggage on a table and went through it. Carrots. Yea! Homeland Security. Stupid miserable fucks.

I went up to Upstate NY a couple years ago, just west of Rochester, where I have some kin. My niece and I went over to Ontario, to the Niagara wine country. OMG, such fine Icewines and late harvests. Really like that area. Crossing back to the US, we went from clear skies to a really dismal dark stormy weather front. I remarked that we were re-entering Mordor, and that is exactly what it felt like. Anyone who has been outside the US for any length of time, and then comes back, has that feeling. I have crossed into the Eastern Bloc and it didn't feel anything like entering the monolithic US. Anyone who hasn't done such, and still babbles about the US being so free yada yada doesn't have fuck-all to say to me. I went wherever the fuck I wanted to when I crossed over. Nobody following me. Nobody spying on me. Yeah, so much for Communism. I had to see it for myself, and it wasn't anything like my so-called "Government" told me it would be like.

I have been behind the so-called "Iron Curtain" and damn near everything Americans think they know is wrong. Tough shit; that's the way it is.

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Post #: 26

RE: Librarian kicked out of McCain 'town hall" - 9/15/2008 4:45:19 AM

MzMia

Posts: 5333
Joined: 7/30/2004
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Firm? That "little old lady" did not need to SELL me anything!
I did not ever vote for BUSH, I do not like BUSH or his "policies".
McCain has agreed with and is proud of his "record" of supporting
Bush and his policies.

Mz.Mia has figured out on her own that,
McCain DOES equal Bush!

Riddle me this Firm?
Why do all of you BUSH supporters, not want BUSH linked with McCain?
Don't you want more of the same?
Aren't you proud of President Bush and happy that John McCain will give
us more of the same thing?

< Message edited by MzMia -- 9/15/2008 4:49:59 AM >

_____________________________

Namaste'
To Each His/Her Own
"DENIAL ain't just a river in Egypt." Mark Twain

What's your favorite fetish?
"My partner's whisper"--bloomswell

(in reply to FirmhandKY)

Post #: 27

RE: Librarian kicked out of McCain 'town hall" - 9/15/2008 5:31:12 AM

Sanity

Posts: 22039
Joined: 6/14/2006
From: Nampa, Idaho USA
Status: offline

Yes, that little old lady was trying to sell you something.

Do you really think it's a mere coincidence that there was a camera on her from start to finish?

I suppose you think it's also a coincidence that there is a prominent URL at the end of her short propaganda film...

_____________________________

Inside Every Liberal Is A Totalitarian Screaming To Get Out

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Post #: 28

RE: Librarian kicked out of McCain 'town hall" - 9/15/2008 6:08:37 AM

pahunkboy

Posts: 33061
Joined: 2/26/2006
From: Central Pennsylvania
Status: offline

Some good comments here.

In the OP, I mentioned skipping seeing Bill Clinton here... because I did not want to bother with security. I had heard somehting like 2 hours in advance and unclear if a bathroom break is allowed..no leaving or coming late. That is the start if the many rules.
/////
cool a good song on the radio yay

(in reply to Sanity)

Post #: 29

RE: Librarian kicked out of McCain 'town hall" - 9/15/2008 6:43:28 AM

bipolarber

Posts: 2792
Joined: 9/25/2004
Status: offline

Well, the woman, at 61, was 12 years McCain's junior. So, it's not inconceivable that she could have used her spry youth against McCain in a face to face confrontation. Of course, McCain now has to be taken to task for hassleing a much younger woman..

(in reply to FirmhandKY)

Post #: 30

RE: Librarian kicked out of McCain 'town hall" - 9/15/2008 7:20:00 AM

FirmhandKY

Posts: 8948
Joined: 9/21/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: MzMia

Firm? That "little old lady" did not need to SELL me anything!
I did not ever vote for BUSH, I do not like BUSH or his "policies".
McCain has agreed with and is proud of his "record" of supporting
Bush and his policies.

Mz.Mia has figured out on her own that,
McCain DOES equal Bush!

Riddle me this Firm?
Why do all of you BUSH supporters, not want BUSH linked with McCain?
Don't you want more of the same?
Aren't you proud of President Bush and happy that John McCain will give
us more of the same thing?

I guess you didn't bother to read my earlier "number's game" post, did you?

Admit it Mz, you are either a pure partisan, and nothing said will sway your vote, or you have drunk the Kool Aide.

I don't particularly like McCain, and before Palin was very likely going to vote for Obama.

With Palin, he's got my vote, and I'm not particularly a notable "feminist".

But I'm not deceived, nor do I try to deceive others by repeating the "party line". I may say the same things that others are saying, and are the "party line", but only if I've arrived at the conclusion independently.

Obama isn't evil, and the world wouldn't end if he was elected. Neither would it if McCain is elected. I think Obama is (mostly) sincere in his beliefs (as much as any politician normally is). I think McCain is sincere in his beliefs (as much as any politician normally is).

Your "McCain voted with Bush 90% of the time" means about as much as "Obama voted 95% of the time with the Washington power establishment".

I guess our goal is to see who we can best besmirch, huh?

I'll say it again, this piece is pure stagecraft and likely excellent (black) propaganda.. Your "McCain voted with Bush" is part of the propaganda campaign albeit on the "white propaganda" side of the house.

That's not you in the video is it?

Firm

< Message edited by FirmhandKY -- 9/15/2008 7:21:24 AM >

_____________________________

Some people are just idiots.

(in reply to MzMia)

Post #: 31

RE: Librarian kicked out of McCain 'town hall" - 9/15/2008 8:09:40 PM

MzMia

Posts: 5333
Joined: 7/30/2004
Status: offline

lol, Firm.
That's not me in the video!
I am 99, and that is a young chick, she is only 61!

I am also not a pure partisan, I am a moderate!

Firm, you considered voting for Obama?

How many shots of whiskey had you consumed?

You still never explained why so many BUSH lovers and supporters,
don't enjoy McCain being linked to Bush?
McCain= Bush

< Message edited by MzMia -- 9/15/2008 8:10:36 PM >

_____________________________

Namaste'
To Each His/Her Own
"DENIAL ain't just a river in Egypt." Mark Twain

What's your favorite fetish?
"My partner's whisper"--bloomswell

(in reply to FirmhandKY)

Post #: 32

RE: Librarian kicked out of McCain 'town hall" - 9/15/2008 8:51:34 PM

FirmhandKY

Posts: 8948
Joined: 9/21/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: MzMia

lol, Firm.
That's not me in the video!
I am 99, and that is a young chick, she is only 61!

... and a mighty spry 99, I'd bet!

quote:

ORIGINAL: MzMia

I am also not a pure partisan, I am a moderate!

Hey ... my definition of "pure partisan" is pretty much what everyone's around here is ... if you don't agree with me, that makes you a "pure partisan" for the other side.

(neat how that works, huh?)

quote:

ORIGINAL: MzMia

Firm, you considered voting for Obama?
How many shots of whiskey had you consumed?

Actually, it was one of my more intellectual moments. I even discussed it with Thadius in a thread.

Prior to Palin, the more pertinent question was how many shots of Makers would it have taken for me to vote for McCain?

quote:

ORIGINAL: MzMia

You still never explained why so many BUSH lovers and supporters,
don't enjoy McCain being linked to Bush?
McCain= Bush

Being dis-ingenious again, are we Mz?

Of course you know well the answer. Bush isn't very popular, and if McCain is tied to him as "Bush III", then it would reduce the likelihood of some people voting for him.

Which is exactly the reason that you, the "librarian" and the Big O all want to do it.

What?

You were thinking I wouldn't say it?

Firm

_____________________________

Some people are just idiots.

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Post #: 33

RE: Librarian kicked out of McCain 'town hall" - 9/15/2008 8:57:21 PM

MzMia

Posts: 5333
Joined: 7/30/2004
Status: offline

Cute response Firm.
It boils down to, truth hurts!

If McCain wins, and he also is not "popular", I guess
the next Republican candidate will have to distance himself from McCain.

_____________________________

Namaste'
To Each His/Her Own
"DENIAL ain't just a river in Egypt." Mark Twain

What's your favorite fetish?
"My partner's whisper"--bloomswell

(in reply to FirmhandKY)

Post #: 34

RE: Librarian kicked out of McCain 'town hall" - 9/15/2008 9:10:22 PM

FirmhandKY

Posts: 8948
Joined: 9/21/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: MzMia

Cute response Firm.
It boils down to, truth hurts!

If McCain wins, and he also is not "popular", I guess
the next Republican candidate will have to distance himself from McCain.

So I take it that you now agree with me that the "librarian" knew well these facts, and therefore was both dishonest and disingenuous with her comments in the video?

Firm

_____________________________

Some people are just idiots.

(in reply to MzMia)

Post #: 35

RE: Librarian kicked out of McCain 'town hall" - 9/15/2008 9:32:03 PM

cloudboy

Posts: 7306
Joined: 12/14/2005
Status: offline

Yes, but as she asked, why was it offesive to carry a sign that read "McCain =s Bush."

That's the funny thing.

(in reply to FirmhandKY)

Post #: 36

RE: Librarian kicked out of McCain 'town hall" - 9/15/2008 10:00:50 PM

Marc2b

Posts: 6660
Joined: 8/7/2006
Status: offline

quote:

I went up to Upstate NY a couple years ago, just west of Rochester, where I have some kin. My niece and I went over to Ontario, to the Niagara wine country. OMG, such fine Icewines and late harvests. Really like that area. Crossing back to the US, we went from clear skies to a really dismal dark stormy weather front. I remarked that we were re-entering Mordor, and that is exactly what it felt like. Anyone who has been outside the US for any length of time, and then comes back, has that feeling.

My regional pride has been wounded here, so...

NIAGARA COUNTY IS NOT MORDOR! IT IS ONE OF THE BEST FUCKING PLACES TO LIVE IN THE ENTIRE WORLD!!!!!!! IF YOU DON’T LIKE NIAGARA COUNTY THEN GO TAKE A SWIM IN THE NIAGARA RIVER! DO YOU HEAR THAT LOUD ROARING SOUND GETTING CLOSER AND CLOSER? IT’S YOUR DOOM, MOTHER FUCKER! BWA HA HA HA HA!!!!!!!

Seriously, so a storm front just happened to come along just as you crossed the border. Well, boo-fucking-hoo. It is hardly Niagara County’s fault now, is it? Ninety percent of our weather comes from Canada – so it’s really their fault! You should have stayed on our side of the border – our wines are far superior (it has something to do with the escarpment). As for crossing the border back into the U.S. I always get the warm fuzzies – because I’m home!

As for the main topic – I would have told that guy in the green get-up to get out and if he asked why I would have replied, "look at your self in the mirror and ask yourself if you would trust the mental stability of the person you see there." As for the lady, she obviously went there with the intent to create a scene.

< Message edited by Marc2b -- 9/15/2008 10:07:48 PM >

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Post #: 37

RE: Librarian kicked out of McCain 'town hall" - 9/15/2008 10:35:16 PM

EvilGenie

Posts: 1323
Joined: 9/10/2007
From: Morocco and Maine occasionally
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Marc2b

quote:

I went up to Upstate NY a couple years ago, just west of Rochester, where I have some kin. My niece and I went over to Ontario, to the Niagara wine country. OMG, such fine Icewines and late harvests. Really like that area. Crossing back to the US, we went from clear skies to a really dismal dark stormy weather front. I remarked that we were re-entering Mordor, and that is exactly what it felt like. Anyone who has been outside the US for any length of time, and then comes back, has that feeling.

My regional pride has been wounded here, so...

NIAGARA COUNTY IS NOT MORDOR! IT IS ONE OF THE BEST FUCKING PLACES TO LIVE IN THE ENTIRE WORLD!!!!!!! IF YOU DON’T LIKE NIAGARA COUNTY THEN GO TAKE A SWIM IN THE NIAGARA RIVER! DO YOU HEAR THAT LOUD ROARING SOUND GETTING CLOSER AND CLOSER? IT’S YOUR DOOM, MOTHER FUCKER! BWA HA HA HA HA!!!!!!!

Seriously, so a storm front just happened to come along just as you crossed the border. Well, boo-fucking-hoo. It is hardly Niagara County’s fault now, is it? Ninety percent of our weather comes from Canada – so it’s really their fault! You should have stayed on our side of the border – our wines are far superior (it has something to do with the escarpment). As for crossing the border back into the U.S. I always get the warm fuzzies – because I’m home!

As for the main topic – I would have told that guy in the green get-up to get out and if he asked why I would have replied, "look at your self in the mirror and ask yourself if you would trust the mental stability of the person you see there." As for the lady, she obviously went there with the intent to create a scene.

What are you 12? I have lived outside of the US since 1999 never to return to live again. I have re-entered what you call ''home'' many many times and it does feel like Modor! Each and every time I return I feel as though I have had a steel rod from above jammed through my head. That rod is American society to me and it feels absolutely stinking horrible! I hate to have to come back here but have no choice what with family deaths, elderly parents and such. I am a wheelchair traveller though am able to walk, I'd never get to gates on time as I cannot feel my feet on the ground. I have been accosted by security as well more than once. The last time being for a legal and declared carton of duty free cigarettes in my lap in a plastic bag.

Never ever in all of the countries that I have been to and/or lived in have I been treated as badly as when I come back into the US with my US passport. Sucks big time. So don't go spouting 6th grade playground language at anyone until you have done what they have a few times.

I am originally from Maine, a westward 3 hour drive into Canada which I used to enjoy driving to for the day. More than once I have had my entire car dumped out coming back into the US. When they found nothing, there I was on the side of the road with everything to put back into my car and not so much as a faretheewell.

Do yourself a favor buddy and grow up or get someone to wash your mouth out with soap. Wistling air out your ass impresses nobody if not based upon experience and then it will only impress the few.

_____________________________

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Some things in life are like trying to pick up a turd by the clean end.

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Post #: 38

RE: Librarian kicked out of McCain 'town hall" - 9/15/2008 11:12:28 PM

Marc2b

Posts: 6660
Joined: 8/7/2006
Status: offline

quote:

What are you 12? I have lived outside of the US since 1999 never to return to live again. I have re-entered what you call ''home'' many many times and it does feel like Modor! Each and every time I return I feel as though I have had a steel rod from above jammed through my head. That rod is American society to me and it feels absolutely stinking horrible! I hate to have to come back here but have no choice what with family deaths, elderly parents and such. I am a wheelchair traveller though am able to walk, I'd never get to gates on time as I cannot feel my feet on the ground. I have been accosted by security as well more than once. The last time being for a legal and declared carton of duty free cigarettes in my lap in a plastic bag.

Never ever in all of the countries that I have been to and/or lived in have I been treated as badly as when I come back into the US with my US passport. Sucks big time. So don't go spouting 6th grade playground language at anyone until you have done what they have a few times.

I am originally from Maine, a westward 3 hour drive into Canada which I used to enjoy driving to for the day. More than once I have had my entire car dumped out coming back into the US. When they found nothing, there I was on the side of the road with everything to put back into my car and not so much as a faretheewell.

Do yourself a favor buddy and grow up or get someone to wash your mouth out with soap. Wistling air out your ass impresses nobody if not based upon experience and then it will only impress the few.

Lighten the fuck up, will ya?

But yes, I do love my home and I do love my county. If you don’t, that’s your problem, not mine.

As for experience, odds are I have crossed the border between the United States and Canada a hell of a lot more than you (I’m only twenty to thirty minute drive from the border) and I have never had the kind of troubles I hear others whining about. The Customs officials have always been professional (if not necessarily polite) and the closest I’ve come to being searched was having my trunk looked in once, after which I was thanked for my co-operation.

< Message edited by Marc2b -- 9/15/2008 11:32:34 PM >

_____________________________

Do you know what the most awesome thing about being an Atheist is? You're not required to hate anybody!

(in reply to EvilGenie)

Post #: 39

RE: Librarian kicked out of McCain 'town hall" - 9/16/2008 12:26:51 AM

FirmhandKY

Posts: 8948
Joined: 9/21/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: EvilGenie

I have lived outside of the US since 1999 never to return to live again. I have re-entered what you call ''home'' many many times and it does feel like Modor! Each and every time I return I feel as though I have had a steel rod from above jammed through my head. That rod is American society to me and it feels absolutely stinking horrible!

My, oh my. What an attitude.

quote:

ORIGINAL: EvilGenie

I hate to have to come back here but have no choice what with family deaths, elderly parents and such.

We always have a choice.

quote:

ORIGINAL: EvilGenie

I am a wheelchair traveller though am able to walk, I'd never get to gates on time as I cannot feel my feet on the ground.

... and now we have a clue about why you are so bitter.

quote:

ORIGINAL: EvilGenie

I have been accosted by security as well more than once. The last time being for a legal and declared carton of duty free cigarettes in my lap in a plastic bag.

With an attitude like yours ... I'm not suprised.

quote:

ORIGINAL: EvilGenie

Never ever in all of the countries that I have been to and/or lived in have I been treated as badly as when I come back into the US with my US passport. Sucks big time. So don't go spouting 6th grade playground language at anyone until you have done what they have a few times.

If the bitterness and contempt you display is something you learned after you were 6 ... I'm not sure you benefited any.

quote:

ORIGINAL: EvilGenie

I am originally from Maine, a westward 3 hour drive into Canada which I used to enjoy driving to for the day. More than once I have had my entire car dumped out coming back into the US. When they found nothing, there I was on the side of the road with everything to put back into my car and not so much as a faretheewell.

We tend to get the attitude that we project reflected back at us.

quote:

ORIGINAL: EvilGenie

Do yourself a favor buddy and grow up or get someone to wash your mouth out with soap. Wistling air out your ass impresses nobody if not based upon experience and then it will only impress the few.

Have you considered taking your own advice?

Firm

_____________________________

Some people are just idiots.

(in reply to EvilGenie)

Post #: 40

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