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The Light - 8/16/2008 8:35:21 AM   
SimplyMichael


Posts: 7229
Joined: 1/7/2007
Status: offline 		I entered bdsm because when I found it it seemed to be who I was.  I was part metro sexual, part knuckle dragging rejectionist.  I hated anything new age because of all the idiots who espoused the words so loudly while doing the exact opposite.  I hated flogging because of all the wankers who were nothing but service tops despite calling themselves masters.  I hated and rejected pretty much everything but me because I was one kick ass motherfucker.  I talked women into meeting me with their legs open, their mouths gagged and their eyes blindfolded.  I was a fucking GOD.
 
But then I met a woman who put up with a bit less of my shit but gave me far more than any of the others.  She opened my eyes to a lot of things, she was new age without the BS baggage, she was open to new things, and I began to see things in a new light.  I started to change but not enough.  Our inner demons, mine in particular, destroyed what was in many ways a very wonderful relationship.
 
Other relationships, more growth.  I realized my anger and rejection wasn’t about how stupid “they” were but more about my own fears and insecurities.  I finally matured enough I could go to therapy without a chip on my shoulder and actually shut up and listen and even more importantly I had learned to look honesty at myself and not fear what I might find.
 
That therapy didn’t emasculate me, emotionally or physically, it liberated me.  I still confront people but I also look at why.  A few weeks back I was angry at BSB, angry on the boards, but I didn’t see it, not really.  I got in a confrontation with a couple of bikers who cut me off and we went round and round a bit and I realized “gee, I think I AM angry”…still not sure exactly what it was, perhaps a combination but the point is that rather than just “be”…I realize I am complex and that issues in one place in my life affect others and watching for that doesn’t make me a pussy, it makes me a man.  Now I don’t define man as some Marlboro character, nor do I see it as some “turn the other cheek” Buddhist.  I define a man who knows who and what he is, is willing to acknowledge his weaknesses, embrace his strengths, and perhaps most importantly understand and accept that others have strengths and weaknesses and may not yet be where I am or may very well be far ahead of me.  That to me is a man.
 
I am that man not because of my darkness but because of the light I have allowed into my life.  It is because of that light that I have the most amazing woman in my life.  My darkside is still there, still important to me but I couldn’t enjoy it as fully as I do without the light I have striven to shine into my life and will continue to seek.
 
To do that I have to allow light in and at times that is painful.  As BSB and I work through things I have found all sorts of insecurities and issues of mine that have either lain hidden or that I was unable to work through.  Many of those issues inform my play, why I like this or dislike that.  Often when I find out the “why” behind a kink, it makes it hotter because I understand it more deeply than before.  That introspective “light” allows me to explore myself and grow.  It requires me to be vulnerable, both to myself and to my partner.  It doesn’t make my darkness less dark, it just strips away the bullshit and instead I see myself and my partner with a clarity that allows the light and the dark to coexist.  Wow, all of that writing to describe ying/yang…3,000 plus year old concept…I guess I am not as dark nor as light as I like to think.
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RE: The Light - 8/16/2008 9:25:56 AM   
kiwisub12


Posts: 4742
Joined: 1/11/2006
Status: offline 		We are all dark/light, and to truly know ourselves we need to know the dark and the light. Our dark sides aren't inherently bad- they are what i think make us interesting and complex as human beings. If it wasn't for the dark of our characters, how could the light shine?
My own therapy has given my life a complexity that i had no idea was there. I was terrified of the dark angry person that was behind my public facade, but once she started to come out into the open, the anger was explained and to a great extent, resolved.  Understanding of our darkest selves makes the dark lighter, and brings peace to the self.

Now when i have issues, i can look at them and usually tell from whence they came. It makes my emotions seem much less random, and i don't have to react to previous triggers. As a (fairly) grown up person, i can choose not to make an ass of myself over something that really doesn't pertain to the situation on hand.  for intance - i have always had an issue with authority. I feared authority figures, thinking they cause nothing but trouble and pain. and i never questioned that reaction, even though i saw that others didn't have this issue. I also hated to be given orders, Someone ordering me to do something made me want to do the opposite or nothing at all.  It took therapy for me to realise that although i perceived my childhood as great, i had little in the way of personal freedom - my parents dictated everything and there was no recourse on the dictates. No wonder i perceived authority figures as threats - i had never learned that i could negotiate terms.  Now, i am more comfortable with said authority figures -  i don't perceived them as threats, but as people there to get a job done, and open to suggestions.

And no wonder i am a submissive/slave. If i buy into my therapists suggestion that we sexualise what we fear, then i was a perfect set up to be either a sub or a dom. my dark allows my light to enjoy my submission , and love my Sir, without worrying that i am sick or perverted or need to change.

Thank you for raising this issue , Michael, it helped clarify some things in my head.

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RE: The Light - 8/16/2008 9:44:48 AM   
Maxwell67


Posts: 435
Joined: 6/29/2008
Status: offline 		First off, congrats on being one of those who are mature enough that when a problem arises in your relationship you work through it.  I think that must be a quality that is becoming more rare and it is one that needs to be encouraged. 

Isn't is amazing the kind of understanding you get from examining the dual nature of things?  Without the dark (no not the.dark, I mean the absence of light), there would be no understanding of light.  Without evil, no understanding of good.  Without misery how could we know and appreciate joy?  I think there is something in D/s (another duality) and BDSM that lets us explore the nature and relationship of these dualities in ways others cannot (though I am sure that vanilla folk have their own ways.. I don't remember what they are anymore, hehe).

One of the things I love most about WIITWD is the emphasis on trust and honesty in the relationship.  It forces us to do a lot of very hard self-examination and to root out those lies we tell ourselves.  I am sure that every relationship could benefit from the same, but for us it becomes a necessity.  Other forums I have participated in are far more indulgent about allowing thier membership to founder along with whatever little lies help get them through the day (hell, I have read posts where people encourge it, even) but not here.  This community is a great resource for reminding us not to fall for our own bullshit. 

Thanks for the honest self-examination Michael.  I see bits of myself here and there in your post, and similarities to other situations I have been in.  I will be able to recognize those in the future and deal with faster having read this.  I will remember your words next time I am finding anger is rising to the surface often in my own life, and I will know to re-examine the situation and look inside myself for a deeper cause.

< Message edited by Maxwell67 -- 8/16/2008 9:47:49 AM >

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RE: The Light - 8/16/2008 9:45:23 AM   
mistoferin


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quote:

ORIGINAL: SimplyMichael
I define a man who knows who and what he is, is willing to acknowledge his weaknesses, embrace his strengths, and perhaps most importantly understand and accept that others have strengths and weaknesses and may not yet be where I am or may very well be far ahead of me.  That to me is a man.


I'd have to say that would apply very well to being a woman as well. Michael, this thread won't get the same amount of attention as one that is completely insane like "I'm a tramp caused I kissed a guy who wasn't my boyfriend"....and that is so unfortunate. It will filter down the board and likely won't reach 27 pages. Maybe that is because when people see someone who can reach such a brutally honest level of self introspection it has an effect of making you look inward and doing a little of your own self introspection...and sometimes that's a painful thing. That's really too bad because it's threads like yours that should be read. All too often we see the bragging threads....not so often that we see one's where the OP is saying "I'm me....and "me" is not perfect...I'm even fallible...but I'm working on it."

< Message edited by mistoferin -- 8/16/2008 9:56:39 AM >

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RE: The Light - 8/16/2008 9:48:30 AM   
KnightofMists


Posts: 7149
Joined: 7/29/2005
Status: offline 		WHY...WHy...Why...why!!!?????

There are so many whys to ask.  Sometimes I think we can chase our tails in trying to answer the whys of it.  Not that I don't think it is not important to understand the whys... But I think it is more important that we seeking the answer to the right questions.  Sometimes the answers are not uplifting or a catalyst for change.  In large part it is because we are answering the wrong questions.

So... what are the right questions to answer?  


Editted to add the following


Besides asking the right quesitions that will uplift us and/or are a catalyst for positive change.....  We must also have the strength of character to look into not only into the light but the dark as well.  It is not an easy thing to truly look into that mirror.  As Erin suggests in a previous post... so many find "doing a little of your own self introspection...and sometimes that's a painful thing"  Yes when we look into the dark it can and will be painful.  It takes strength of character to take those steps and even more to share the truth with others and this beyond most things is why I both admire and respect Michael.

This is not to say Michael or any of us are perfect.  But I do admire those that have a desire to improve upon themselves for both the benefit of themselves and the people that are close to them.  But having the desire to do so doesn't translate into "real" change.  As they say talk is cheap.  This is the next stage that comes from a difficult journey of introspection (Awareness and Acceptance)....  which is Actualization.   This again reflects strength of character... the follow through if you will.  By taking concrete and constructive steps that show change in a positive direction we are validating our Acceptance of our flaws but we are not accepting that they need be that way.  We show growth and change by taking the steps we need to do to effect the change and growth we desire.

So... after we have learned the whys of the right questions... We then venture into the world of Whats and Hows... What I am going to do?.. How am I going to do it?

< Message edited by KnightofMists -- 8/16/2008 10:12:18 AM >

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RE: The Light - 8/16/2008 9:53:58 AM   
NeedingMore220


Posts: 615
Joined: 6/5/2008
Status: offline 		It must be great to be at a point where you can understand some of the kinks you have.  I'm still at the point of acceptance and embracing them .. but understanding?  Not so much.  Perhaps in time.  Perhaps not.  I just know what I need, want and desire.  And I'm definitely not at the point of figuring that out - I'd be forcing something that's not ready to come out yet. 

A question, though.  How does BSB help you work things out?  I'm assuming listening on both sides is a huge part of that, and sharing her experiences also may clarify some things.  Perhaps it's also that you've been able to let down walls with her based on your mutual trust and love?

quote:

So... what are the right questions to answer? 


Starting with this one would make the process a whole hell of a lot easier. 


< Message edited by NeedingMore220 -- 8/16/2008 9:55:42 AM >

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RE: The Light - 8/16/2008 9:57:55 AM   
lizcgirl


Posts: 287
Joined: 4/13/2008
Status: offline 		The hardest thing to look at in an honest light is yourself. Wether it's your appearance, your mannerisms, even your likes and dislikes, it's difficult to really appericate yourself without either being too self involved or too critical of yourself. The way we behave and percieve ourselves is colored alot by the people in our lives and sometimes it's almost impossible to get past them to see who you really are. It's hard, it's challenging, but once you know yourself for who you REALLY are and not who you thought you should be, a most amazing freedom comes to you. I wish every one took as much time to know themselves and to acknowledge both their "good" and "bad" qualities, it would make for much more interesting people.

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RE: The Light - 8/16/2008 10:07:09 AM   
RCdc


Posts: 8674
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quote:

ORIGINAL: SimplyMichael
I am that man not because of my darkness but because of the light I have allowed into my life.  It is because of that light that I have the most amazing woman in my life.  My darkside is still there, still important to me but I couldn’t enjoy it as fully as I do without the light I have striven to shine into my life and will continue to seek.
 


I am a woman not because of darkness or light I allow into my life, but because of both of them.  For me, I found it pointless and negative to ignore one or the other and instead embrace both and love them both equally.  It's because of both aspects that I am who I am today and who I am with -The most wonderful and awe-inspiring man who also loves me because he is accepting of both the light and the dark parts not only of me, but also himself.  You can't have one without the other, else the other would not exist.
 
Without shadows that the light and dark form together, everything would be pretty 2D and flat.
 
the.dark.

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RE: The Light - 8/16/2008 10:08:28 AM   
RCdc


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Maxwell67
Isn't is amazing the kind of understanding you get from examining the dual nature of things?  Without the dark (no not the.dark, I mean the absence of light), there would be no understanding of light. 




the.dark. 

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RE: The Light - 8/16/2008 10:15:14 AM   
zumala


Posts: 1121
Joined: 6/16/2005
Status: offline 		Wow...

I have found this to be a very interesting thread, short as it is yet.  I struggle with a lot of self-loathing and I'm not even sure why I'm like that.  I'm not even sure that I'd figure it out if I sat down and pondered it for a long time.

BUT, the point of the thread, at least to me, is that it is important to sit back and honestly examine oneself.  That may be the first step to self-improvement and thus self-understanding.  And that's important to anyone.

So thanks for the topic, SimplyMichael.


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RE: The Light - 8/16/2008 10:36:39 AM   
Sunnyfey


Posts: 1436
Joined: 9/21/2007
From: OK
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quote:

ORIGINAL: SimplyMichael

  I talked women into meeting me with their legs open, their mouths gagged and their eyes blindfolded.  I was a fucking GOD.
 
.



Michael as always your posts are so thought out and throughly opinionated, and I adore you for it......

though this bit had me spitting coffee all over my laptop o.0


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RE: The Light - 8/16/2008 10:47:32 AM   
chamberqueen


Posts: 1597
Joined: 10/25/2007
From: Kalamazoo, MI
Status: offline 		I feel like I must be very backwards because I understood the why first.  I am meticulous and look for deeper meaning in everything, and have at time had my feelings hurt because something that was said or done with only surface meaning I took to heart.  I also understand the why behind that - I was brought up with statements such as, "That was good, but how could you have done it better?"  I still carry that with me - that no matter how well I do at any type of task - be it chairing and international committee to cleaning a toilet, that there must have been some way that I could have done it better.

I got into the lifestyle because of the trust and communication.  I wanted to make a real difference in the lives of those that I touched, either as Domme or slave, and to know that my efforts were appreciated.  I wanted both of our lives to be better because I reached out and touched the other person.  The only time I left left asking myself why is when I have a totally unexpected emotional reaction; some hidden chord struck for better or worse.  The lifestyle has allowed me to feel like a complete person instead of the "business" me, the "wild lusting animal me", and the "good friend" me.  I no longer feel shame for emotions generally considered negative - instead of suppressing them (causing myself harm that way) I can now deal with them and go on.  It sounds like you might be going through this same step - integrating yourself.  Bravo!


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RE: The Light - 8/16/2008 11:08:36 AM   
celticlord2112


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quote:

I guess I am not as dark nor as light as I like to think.

No one ever is.

Everyone is a work in progress--and that's usually what makes relationships so much fun (Six Flags will never have a ride with half the thrills and chills of a real romance).


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RE: The Light - 8/16/2008 11:22:05 AM   
NuevaVida


Posts: 6707
Joined: 8/5/2008
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quote:

ORIGINAL: mistoferin
Maybe that is because when people see someone who can reach such a brutally honest level of self introspection it has an effect of making you look inward and doing a little of your own self introspection...and sometimes that's a painful thing.


Introspection can be painful, yes, but it can also be enlightening and liberating.  I am doing so much of that myself these days.  It certainly is not as easy as floating along in life, carefree and happy to not learn oneself.

I'm currently in a position of re-evaluating a lot of things about myself - what went wrong, what went right, what I want for myself, what I like about myself, what I don't like.  We are a blend of dark and light, but do we have a balance of the two?  When we start finding our answers we are all the better for it, and have even more to offer others.

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RE: The Light - 8/16/2008 11:57:27 AM   
Lockit


Posts: 11292
Joined: 5/7/2007
Status: offline 		Great thread! 

I found that it was easier to see and accept my darker side or faults, than to hide from them.  I love the truth and when I hear it, I laugh.  I can laugh at the strangest of things and times and until people know me, they don't know that I most likely heard a truth and it might even have taken me off gaurd a bit.  Hearing it and maybe not seeing it until that moment... is joyful for me.  I love seeing something that is truely a fault and do not resent someone who might tell me I have one and will see the truth in it and be thankful.

Thank you SimplyMichael, for another great post and thread!  It has brought out some wonderful posters with great post!

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RE: The Light - 8/16/2008 12:17:10 PM   
LaTigresse


Posts: 26123
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Status: offline 		Michael, how really disgustingly, light and icky, would I be if I said reading your post made me want to give you one of my (real life) infamous hugs? Disgusting as hell I am sure.

The reality is that I often see so much of myself in your posts. Much of your life issues I think you have dealt with very differently, but the underlying issues have seemed to have been very similar. You've just done "male" coping while I took a more typically "female" coping path.

The results, however, have been much the same. A desire to figure out "the whys" and constantly push ourselves to learn and grow. To be a better human being, partner, dominant, etc. I love reading when you post like this, I admire you for it. Even if I don't always agree with you, I respect and admire your honesty. You are not afraid to put yourself out there.

I've decided that we never really stop, at least I hope we don't.

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Just because you are well educated, articulate, and can use big, fancy words, properly........does not mean you are right!

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RE: The Light - 8/16/2008 12:43:00 PM   
stella41b


Posts: 4258
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From: SW London (UK)
Status: offline 		Humans are the most diverse species on the planet. We thrive on diversity and this is what separates us from all other living beings on this planet. We exist on a planet in the universe and perhaps it is instinct which causes us to perceive ourselves as planets in a galaxy of other humans. We seek to control our environment and nature and yet we are controlled by our environment and nature and thus this is what motivates us to learn, discover, explore and seek.

It would appear that our fascination with life and the other humans around us is caused by our own obsession with human genitalia, our own and that of other humans. From a certain perspective, say that of a Martian we would have come to Earth to check out the possibilities of an invasion, we would have marvelled at something so wonderful as a worldwide computer network known as the Internet but on closer examination we would have discovered that it appears to be a worldwide computer system for humans to view the genitalia of other humans. Terrified by the thought of being humped by a human all further plans for an invasion would have been cancelled and this is why perhaps Martians have chosen to live under the surface of the planet out of sight of humans ever since the first NASA and Soviet rockets started landing on their red planet.

But maybe it is this fascination with our genitalia, gender and its effect on other humans isn't just our failing and weakness, but also our virtue and salvation? We are raised from the cradle to anticipate love, care, emotional support and bonding, and we are conditioned to feel and express our emotions as children before we are taught to think and rationalize our feelings and emotions. Puberty adds a new dimension, bringing to a gradual end that period of life which will remain with us to the grave and setting us along a path through adulthood and maturity. We become even more fascinated with our genitalia, and we go out to chase our dreams and find 'love' and invariably we screw up and get it all arse end backwards. Why? Life - that constant struggle to control our environment and circumstances whilst adapting to the changes that our environment and circumstances force on us.

We are diverse, yet we are far from perfect. We know from our earliest memories that there is good and bad, right and wrong, and that not everything is black and white. We know that success starts with an attempt, continues through failure, and I feel we all know somewhere deep inside us that we were never meant to control our environment or circumstances or to fully submit and leave everything to fate and that there should always be some sort of balance between what lies within and what lies outside.

This is what I believe brings the vast majority of us to BDSM, that failure to strike the right balance between what lies within and what lies without. It is a failure through something which is missing, but to find that something we have to discover through our relationships with other people. However to know what is missing we must find a need, an empty space in our lives, we must examine what is there, what has been, and to find the light you must be able to find your way through the dark and eventually the shadows.

Our arrival and first few forays into BDSM tend to return us to our sexuality and .. our genitalia and its effect on those around us and this is because we have arrived in a very dark place full of mystery and intrigue, but yet to find our way through to the light we must closely examine the mystery and intrigue that lies deep within ourselves. As we move closer towards the light we evolve and realise that BDSM isn't just about sex and our genitalia, but about control and mastery, both of ourselves and of our relationships. We look back towards those in the darkness, and see those walking the same path but much further back - the guys who send out dick shots, the women who put sexual and emotional needs above their own welfare and sense of responsibility, the sexualization and fetishization of BDSM as a whole and so on.

And yet our evolution continues, and yet we discover that there is still some distance towards the light, and that striking the right balance in our relationships relies mainly on finding that right balance within ourselves and this relies on mastery of our emotions, feelings and thinking. We look back and what do we see? We see people who are struggling with the issue of mastery of themselves, the ones who get caught out, who are so quick to cry wannabe, fake, who talk in terms of 'real' and who stumble through BDSM and their relationships ever so perceptive of the failings and weaknesses of others and yet so oblivious to their own. But this is some, not all, for others have already discovered the evolutionary approach to their relationships and are learning, and understand that their stepping into the light is merely the threshold, the light goes on, as does the learning, the discovery and development.

Apologies for the rambling, just my thoughts and my take from my own perspective. Some no doubt may have reason to disagree with what is here on the basis of their own experiences but I feel that we all have our own stories to tell and we are all following our own paths towards the same light.

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RE: The Light - 8/16/2008 6:54:23 PM   
Prinsexx


Posts: 4584
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quote:

Now I don’t define man as some Marlboro character, nor do I see it as some “turn the other cheek” Buddhist. I define a man who knows who and what he is, is willing to acknowledge his weaknesses, embrace his strengths, and perhaps most importantly understand and accept that others have strengths and weaknesses and may not yet be where I am or may very well be far ahead of me. That to me is a man.


I am going to respond to you Michael in the hope that you may see this as my appropriate response to what is i believe a sincere attempt on you part to self-disclose.
I've read it through a number of times and feel (since that is what i mostly do) that it is relatively guarded, not connective disclosure because it feels like it is guarded. That's the only way i can justify the way i feel about what you are trying to say somehow trapped withing the worfs you are using.
Take the section i have outquoted above.
OK: so you know how to define a man. That IS because you define yourself as one. I would certainly expect you to be able to do so. You define yourself neither as Marlborough Man or 'turn the other cheek Buddhist'....(forgive me I thought turn the other cheek was and is a New Testamnet Christian code of ethics but you know i am probably feeling defnesive about the way you describe Buddhists.)
This part of your post is pivotal though in as much as it demonstartes your attempts to posit what you are NOT rather than to express what you actually are. And i feel it's a brave attempt to describe yourself on the missle path....you know neither Marlborough or Buddhist.
But if you are still doing me the justice of reading me thus far....could i just ask you about giving up dualistic thinking a little further? Practice with the idea. dualism as in:
The man woman duality
The me her duality
The  younger less wise you and now the older fixed you.
And indeed the dualism of darkness and light itslef?
Imagine:
Imagine there's no Heaven
It's easy if you try
No hell below us
Above us only sky
Imagine all the people
Living for today

Imagine there's no countries
It isn't hard to do
Nothing to kill or die for
And no religion too
Imagine all the people
Living life in peace ...............

OK and further more no need for self-improvement because when one self-improves one leaves bejind a lesser self and somehow moves to a better self? One automatically in that reality needs create a hierarchy within which one not only judges oneself but others?
And you have judged me Michael...a woman you have not met and do not know. But your judgment of me aside for once please i am merely attempting to describe the middle path, where there isn't male or female, wehere there is dark below and light above, or even republican to the right and democrats to the left. No black and white only subtle gorgeous relentless and inexhaustable ever changing hues?
It's not that duality does not exist for me. It clearly does as it is constantly projected out into the world in terms of body fascist culture, enculturated ubiquity and mass produced idealism.I see it and experience it usually as a series of blocks, brick walls, recursions, flashbacks, yes i experience being taken out of the now all the time. It's like a world that runs on duality foes that all the time.
To me the Light is at the end of the tunnel and i will get to it at the point at which i get to it....my belief is that it will be zero point on the horizon, i will realise the Light at that point when because of the way that my body works others will call death of my body.
I like to call it passing and sometmes call it transition. My belief is that my consciousness will never end simply that the degree of recollection iwill carry forward into my next body will be the result of the way i live in this one.
But you know what?
I think your post is less angry than when you were angry last. And so if some more time spent in dualism feels that it is serving you then who am i to say dualism does not work for you?
I haven't got a different cheek to you which i can turn? Get the point?
Here's to the Light Michael; since there are no sides, because there is no arguement: we are probably on the same side anyway?
PS edited to add the words in verse are written by John Lennon and are not plagarism ..........




< Message edited by Prinsexx -- 8/16/2008 6:58:37 PM >

_____________________________

Owner of asterion

Metawhore.... the sound of a metaphore when gagged
Free woman
Resident thread finisher
To my stalker:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LN2lP_7J7GI&feature=fvwrel

(in reply to SimplyMichael)
Profile   Post #: 18
RE: The Light - 8/16/2008 9:19:42 PM   
Leatherist


Posts: 5149
Joined: 12/11/2007
Status: offline 		day by day.

The past is dead.

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My shop is currently segueing into production mode.

I'm not taking custom orders.

(in reply to Prinsexx)
Profile   Post #: 19
RE: The Light - 8/16/2008 9:23:04 PM   
AcademyForSlaves


Posts: 712
Joined: 2/24/2006
Status: offline 		My personal opinion is that if a person likes submitting and chooses to, and no one gets abused, then it's not wrong.

How do you determine something as being the "darkside" unless your admitting to yourself that it's wrong, bad, or evil?

I would never dominate out of anger. I don't think hate, anger, or resentment should be a part of BDSM. That's when a therapist is needed.

_____________________________

Academy Mistresses
http://www.academyforslaves.com/home.html

(in reply to SimplyMichael)
Profile   Post #: 20
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