quote:

ORIGINAL: Thadius

For me discipline is never play.  I use discipline to re-enforce the proper behavior, wether it be researching the particulars of a subject (researching the concepts of time for tardiness), or to use the same example of tardiness for every 5 minutes I wait (without a valid reason) she will spend 10 minutes doing something something that makes her reflect on the time it cost both of us (hence the doubling).  These are just a couple of really basic examples, but as I said discipline should be a tool to enforce the expected behavior and even make the person reflect on the reason for being disciplined.

I don't have an alphabet after my name yet....

Thadius

quote:

ORIGINAL: Prinsexx

quote:

ORIGINAL: Thadius

For me discipline is never play.  I use discipline to re-enforce the proper behavior, wether it be researching the particulars of a subject (researching the concepts of time for tardiness), or to use the same example of tardiness for every 5 minutes I wait (without a valid reason) she will spend 10 minutes doing something something that makes her reflect on the time it cost both of us (hence the doubling).  These are just a couple of really basic examples, but as I said discipline should be a tool to enforce the expected behavior and even make the person reflect on the reason for being disciplined.

I don't have an alphabet after my name yet....

Thadius

Then, if i might ask, who disciplines you? It's not a sarcastic question or a derogatory question in the slightest. I am interested in knowing where do you get your sense of discipline from: from yourself? from the concept of a Higher Self?

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lumus
It's bloody well impossible to self-discipline when writing [...........]

quote:


Like any good sub, I let the boss find out the hard way that what they were asking for was not what they were going to get.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lumus

a while ago, one of my bosses tried to tell me how to do my job.  As you might suspect, they had no clue what they were talking about, 

Eventually they insisted I start doing one aspect of my job a particular way, even though I had explained how this would be a bad thing

I smiled, shrugged, said, "Ho-kay.".  Several weeks later it was clear things were going exactly as I'd warned they would,

quote:

ORIGINAL: Prinsexx
For the D types: to what uses do you contruct your disipline: to change, motivate or shape your submissive?
In general is all discipline constructive or also 'play'?

quote:

ORIGINAL:  Prinsexx
Then, if i might ask, who disciplines you? It's not a sarcastic question or a derogatory question in the slightest. I am interested in knowing where do you get your sense of discipline from: from yourself? from the concept of a Higher Self?

quote:

ORIGINAL: LuckyAlbatross

Ultimately all discipline is self discipline.

Can it become unproductive?  Speaking as a control freak perfectionist with moderate OCD- absolutely.  I've worked hard and used my discipline to help me NOT be so disciplined and not care so much about certain things over time so I can lead a much more fulfilling and pleasureable life.

For me discipline is simply controlled behavior and thought processes.  I use it in ways so that we become more effective and fulfilled in who we are and what we want to be.

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ORIGINAL: leadership527

quote:

ORIGINAL:  Prinsexx
Then, if i might ask, who disciplines you? It's not a sarcastic question or a derogatory question in the slightest. I am interested in knowing where do you get your sense of discipline from: from yourself? from the concept of a Higher Self?

Interesting question and one the answer is one that I frequently marvel at.  At least for us, I discipline myself, but it is based upon her discipline.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Prinsexx


For the D types: to what uses do you contruct your disipline: to change, motivate or shape your submissive?

In general is all discipline constructive or also 'play'?

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ORIGINAL: DiurnalVampire

quote:

ORIGINAL: Prinsexx


For the D types: to what uses do you contruct your disipline: to change, motivate or shape your submissive?

In general is all discipline constructive or also 'play'?

{.....}
I taught Angel a bit about being more self confident. The discipline with him came from encouragement to say what needed said, even if it got a bit of rebuke.

None of our discipline is play. Thats kept very spearate.

DV

quote:

ORIGINAL: AMaster

Discipline is not play.  To grow and learn a sub must be rewarded when appropriate, and punished when correction is needed.  To be a good teacher, a DOM  must learn what the sub enjoys, and what she fears. 

quote:

ORIGINAL: DMFParadox

If we're going to go the route that all discipline is self-discipline, then it can also be argued that no discipline relies completely upon oneself; it's all relative, and therefore externally dictated. (This is not entirely true, but not entirely false either.)
Yes i have a problem with the construct that all dusipline is self-discipline logic. i simply have a problem with the 'all anything; issues being entirely related to self.

If we really wrangle we can remove almost all meaning from the word, until Humpty Dumpty cried tears of pride, to witness such mastery of language.
i'm not trying to be clever with words here in answering you really i;m not.

I don't like the word discipline, or the concept.  It is used to describe too many unrelated things, to force a pattern onto things that have different characters entirely.
i didn't open the thread because i personally use or like the word discipline either. It was really to open up the concept. i also see it used very frequently. It's rather like a 'so many years in the lifestyle' approach or even the word lifestyle itself. There are so many profiles that say: a harsh disciplinarian, or 'this Dominant will discipline you and train you....etc. Don't ask me how many profiles....haven't time to count.

But, sadly, the concept is so deeply ingrained into our collective psyche that trying to explain a different way of seeing things meets with great resistance.
When as a slave i am being flogged, whipped, chided and so forth, i actually don't consider it discipline. Some of it is i suppose punishment, perhaps that's a better word, but since i too have dhaped 50 years of my life pretty much as a free woman, i have had the same exposure to parental, peer, educational and spiritual disciplines from the outside world probably as any other person.

I believe that all thoughts and actions spring from emotion; that all thoughts, even the most basic like the ones that translate pixels to assemble a mental image, or abstract, that use symbolic systems to represent concepts that mere words cannot convey... all thoughts are emotions.  Complex tapestries of 'want', and 'not want'.
i replied in an earlier post that some of the ways i 'feel' feel like i am being self-disciplined; but at other times i am reacting at the other extreme in a fight or flight manner. The tripartite human brain has the capacity for thinking/cognitive logic and it has a primal brain when the trauma, the overload pain, the being trapped gets in. But i poersonally have that whole mid-brain, and an experience of an emotional bridge upon which i stand most of the time. i get stuck in old emotions and flashback to old horrors but the middle path, steering between the extremes of emotions is where i strive to be. My point is however to agree with you that it is all emotional, a complex and beautiful human chemistry. Emotion: a much derided area.....but why?

One can be considered a 'disciplined' writer if they write much and carefully; but what if it is simply fear that motivates them?  Then again, what if it is love for the art?  Or love for the topic, instead?  Three very different situations with different outcomes, but we would still label that person disciplined because of temporary, transitory behavior.  This I find fault with; but then, what else can we call it?  A difficult question, so far, for me to answer.

i was trained professionally many  years ago by a medical doctor who had become a hypnotherapist by choice and by training. At one point i had phoned him to ask for some supervisory advice. He simple said; all human problems are reducible to two basic emotions; either fear or love. i applied it to the issue i was phoning him about and yes; the model worked.
Where does this fit in with constructive discipline? Well it doesn't. It leaves the very idea of constructive discipline (constructed duscipline) far behind. It puts questions concerning the bdsm dynamic back into the arena of emotional intelligence.



_____________________________

Owner of asterion

Metawhore.... the sound of a metaphore when gagged
Free woman
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To my stalker:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LN2lP_7J7GI&feature=fvwrel

(in reply to DMFParadox)

quote:

ORIGINAL: DMFParadox

The question was, what do I use to motivate my submissive?  Right now, it's not a question, but the same thing applies to most social interactions.  Hope and habit.  Those are the two big words.  Fear, but fear doesn't inspire patterns that could be construed as discipline very well; one must replace it with hope at the earliest opportunity.