RE: China sues CNN Jack Carfarty, 1.3 billion

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RE: China sues CNN Jack Carfarty, 1.3 billion - 4/27/2008 8:45:07 AM

FullCircle

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It's actually quite funny you can imagine the kind of discussion that would have gone on regarding the whale law above

Person1: We must prevent people from shooting game from a moving vehicle because it is dangerous.

Person2: You will never be able to enforce this law Person1, with this law you are making it illegal for us law abiding whale hunters because the boat is constantly moving due to the tide.

Person1: OK Person2 we will stipulate that whale hunting is excluded from the blanket ban on shooting game from a moving vehicle.

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RE: China sues CNN Jack Carfarty, 1.3 billion - 4/27/2008 8:55:52 AM

FullCircle

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quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic
The Bill of Rights is not a city-council parking ordinance, Full. It is a statement of our basic principles of governance. They can be changed, but it's a serious pain in the ass to get it done. Some of us are very fond of the First Amendment just the way it is, thank you.

Yes I doubt anything will ever change. This is probably why some people subscribe to the conspiracy theories that the Government is attacking its own people to get a blank cheque on fundamental law changes.

I doubt in any other part of the western world you’d find so much paranoia within the citizen's minds about the motives of their own Government.

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RE: China sues CNN Jack Carfarty, 1.3 billion - 4/27/2008 9:15:03 AM

TheHeretic

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quote:

ORIGINAL: FullCircle

I doubt in any other part of the western world you’d find so much paranoia within the citizen's minds about the motives of their own Government.

We have a very different paradigm of the citizen/government relationship, Full. If we can't get past the gap between believing that rights are freedoms granted by government vs. rights being powers denied to gov't, this conversation won't go anyplace.

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RE: China sues CNN Jack Carfarty, 1.3 billion - 4/27/2008 9:29:08 AM

FullCircle

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I guess this is a positive liberty vs negative liberty type argument and no, one can never convince the other in swapping those distinct beliefs.

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RE: China sues CNN Jack Carfarty, 1.3 billion - 4/27/2008 9:31:08 AM

TheHeretic

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quote:

ORIGINAL: FullCircle

It's actually quite funny you can imagine the kind of discussion that would have gone on regarding the whale law above

Person1: We must prevent people from shooting game from a moving vehicle because it is dangerous.
Person2: You will never be able to enforce this law Person1, with this law you are making it illegal for us law abiding whale hunters because the boat is constantly moving due to the tide.
Person1: OK Person2 we will stipulate that whale hunting is excluded from the blanket ban on shooting game from a moving vehicle.

Laws don't get made up in a vacuum, Full. Let's take a quick look at your "no bikes in the pool" law from Baldwin Park. Do you think someone just dreamed that up, or was it reactive to a problem? One summer camp I went to as a kid offered a small collection of beat-up bicycles you could ride down a steep trail, and jump into the lake on. Fun and refreshing. Do you suppose people might have been doing something similar in swimming pools? Perhaps bashing their heads on the concrete and filing a lawsuit?

As for the Whale Exclusion, do understand that it is there to preserve the rights of the remaining native tribes. Someone actually thought that one through.

< Message edited by TheHeretic -- 4/27/2008 9:37:45 AM >

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RE: China sues CNN Jack Carfarty, 1.3 billion - 4/27/2008 9:36:00 AM

TheHeretic

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quote:

ORIGINAL: FullCircle

I guess this is a positive liberty vs negative liberty type argument and no, one can never convince the other in swapping those distinct beliefs.

EXACTLY!

And since we could then go on about which of us represented positive liberty (that would be me, of course), I think I'll bid you a great day/evening and get started on the dog run I need to build.

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RE: China sues CNN Jack Carfarty, 1.3 billion - 4/27/2008 9:43:23 AM

FullCircle

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I'm sure laws are made to regulate stupid behaviour but at some point they need to be reviewed to decide if they still apply or are only acting to give people stupid ideas. More people probably rode their bikes into the pool in defiance of that law than the number of people the law prevented from endangering themselves. I would think that interaction would have to be assessed from time to time rather than just accepted as being there for a reason.

On your second point about the whale law it is interesting that by preserving the rights of tribes you are not passing laws that are undiscriminating. If it is dangerous to shoot game from a moving vehicle why is it safe for others just because they have always done it? Surely the law should apply to all in a consistent way and not single any out for special treatment?

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RE: China sues CNN Jack Carfarty, 1.3 billion - 4/27/2008 9:45:39 AM

FullCircle

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quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic
EXACTLY!

And since we could then go on about which of us represented positive liberty (that would be me, of course), I think I'll bid you a great day/evening and get started on the dog run I need to build.

Enjoy the rest of your day.

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RE: China sues CNN Jack Carfarty, 1.3 billion - 4/27/2008 9:52:11 AM

popeye1250

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With Freedom of the Press being one of our most precious freedoms I doubt this "lawsuit" will go anywhere.
More likely some people looking for some "go away money" which they won't get.

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RE: China sues CNN Jack Carfarty, 1.3 billion - 4/27/2008 10:14:00 AM

SteelofUtah

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How can CHINA as a Counry, NOT under our rights and constitution sue ANYTHING In an American Court. Doesn't the Bill of rights require someone who SUES somoene else to be a Citizen under the Law that the Legal system is supposed to protect.

I am curious how another country can SUE us at all? Aren't Legal systems subject to that Nations Law?? So our Nation can siomply ignore tha acusation period.

China has become a nation of Greed JUST LIKE AMERICA (Yes we are admit it) so as far as I am concerned there are two major issues going on here. Either we need to do something or learn another Language because the more we think doing NOTHING is the answer, or the more we Do whjat other people THINK we should the more Freedom we lose.

There was a time people were PROUD to be American now it seems we are ashamed to be american and try to give everything away to others just because we happen to be american. This is Retarded.

I HONESTLY believe we screwed up a LONG time ago and that now it is probably too late to do anything about it. Damned no matter what we do and that is sad.

I do know that I will fight till the end to remind my son what made america great and why it was something WORTH fighting for.

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RE: China sues CNN Jack Carfarty, 1.3 billion - 4/27/2008 3:35:22 PM

TheHeretic

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quote:

ORIGINAL: FullCircle

On your second point about the whale law it is interesting that by preserving the rights of tribes you are not passing laws that are undiscriminating. If it is dangerous to shoot game from a moving vehicle why is it safe for others just because they have always done it? Surely the law should apply to all in a consistent way and not single any out for special treatment?

          The only problem here is with an individual basing their argument on opinion and impression, without any knowledge or understanding of the facts of the situation. First, who besides yourself says the basis for "no hunting from moving vehicles" has anything to do with it being dangerous? Have you ever hunted? Do you have any understanding of what is involved in bringing down game for food? Such legislation would have a lot more to do with responsible hunting than safety. It is much more likely a preventative against the cruelty of wounding animals, which then get away. Same principle of requiring standards be followed in a processing plant for farm raised stock.

        Yes, I definitely favor a single standard in the law. In this case, there are two things to bear in mind. First is the compromise I believe we must exercise in dealing with the remnants of the stone-age tribes on this continent. They get a bit of slack. Second, it wouldn't be criminal prosecution of whale hunters, but lawsuits by Greenpeace and the myriad of urban environmentalists who believe their goal noble enough to achieve by any means. You could certainly have your public consultants clean up the language on that one.







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