Dems worst nightmare (Full Version)

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cyberdude611 -> Dems worst nightmare (3/16/2008 2:21:24 PM)

While John McCain visits with American troops and Iraqi leaders in Baghdad... and the GOP begins to campaign for November, the Democrats remain locked in a bitterly contested primary battle that is getting more and more ugly.

With Hillary holding a lead in Pennsylvania, neither Obama nor Hillary will have enough pledged delegates to win the nomination before the convention in late August.
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/03/16/us/politics/16delegates.html?ex=1206244800&en=96c114472a3805a9&ei=5065&partner=MYWAY

To complicate the scenarios....Hillary campaign donors and fundraisers are becoming more angry at the process. A Miami businessman said last week he will demand his $28,000 donation to Democrats be refunded if the DNC refuses to seat Florida and Michigan's delegates. The man told the New York Times, "If they refuse to count my vote, then they arn't going to get my money."
Many other donors have also threatened to pull their money out of the DNC.
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/03/15/us/politics/15donate.html?ei=5065&en=68bdcd72f717cb5f&ex=1206158400&partner=MYWAY&pagewanted=print

Now the Democratic primary is becoming increasingly more about racism. Not only was Geraldine Ferraro forced to resign because of comments made of Obama's skin color....but Obama has had to answer tough questions concerning his preacher Jeremiah Wright who has made countless anti-semetic, anti-American, and racist remarks over the past 20 years.
http://apnews.myway.com/article/20080315/D8VE0OL80.html

Recent polls also show John McCain is either tied or beating either Obama or Hillary in head-to-head match-ups....
John McCain also is beating Obama AND Clinton in Pennsylvania (by 2 pts), Ohio (by 1 pt), and Florida (by 9 pts). If McCain runs the table on those 3 states....the election is over. It will be very difficult for the Democrats to pull off a victory in the electoral vote.
http://www.realclearpolitics.com/



Owner59 -> RE: Dems worst nightmare (3/16/2008 3:39:58 PM)

You worry about your guy.lol

Ain`t no one gonna vote for Bush-dark.

~McCain,same Bush policy,same Bush taste~




KenDckey -> RE: Dems worst nightmare (3/16/2008 3:48:08 PM)

Face it Owner    the DNC is its own worst enemy



Level -> RE: Dems worst nightmare (3/16/2008 3:49:10 PM)

Nancy Pelosi weighed in today..... and pissed Hillary off.
 
She stated she did NOT see a Clinton/Obama nor Obama/Clinton ticket, and that the superdelegates should respect whoever is leading come convention time.



Owner59 -> RE: Dems worst nightmare (3/16/2008 3:52:55 PM)

He`s already stated he wouldn`t take a VP possision.

We`ll see...

A side of that ,the only poll that matters is next Nov.2.

Neo-cons don`t have a chance.



cyberdude611 -> RE: Dems worst nightmare (3/16/2008 4:30:33 PM)

I could care less who wins because I think the screwed either way...

But the polls are very interesting....
When they do a poll saying if they want a Democrat or a Republican in the White House... 49% say they want a Democrat and only 34% say a Republican.
However, when they ask if they will vote for John McCain or Obama.... the poll is tied.

The polls seem to indicate that the people dont want a Republican in the White House.....unless it's John McCain. If the Democrats go into this election thinking they have it in the bag....they are going to look like the New England Patriots come November 2nd. They run the table but lose the big dance. Dont underestimate McCain....he has that ability to woo the independents.



popeye1250 -> RE: Dems worst nightmare (3/16/2008 4:36:15 PM)

This would be a good time for an Independant candidate to emerge.



cyberdude611 -> RE: Dems worst nightmare (3/16/2008 5:27:21 PM)

Dems have a history of doing this type of thing. They implode. Gore did it in October 2000 with his crappy debates and Kerry did it in August of 2004 with his Vietnam junk. And now the party again looks like a mess with racism.

Remember the November election is based on electoral votes. Not the popular vote. So when we talk about November...we need to start looking at electoral votes and swing states. Right now, I think the Dems will probably run up the popular vote. But the electoral vote looks very, very close and we will probably be in for a long night on November 2nd. McCain is leading in most of the crucial swing states.

You can play with the numbers at this site...It's pretty cool....
http://www.270towin.com/



Moloch -> RE: Dems worst nightmare (3/16/2008 5:34:06 PM)

McCain is endorsed by Bush.  Plus McStain has a horrbile track record with 2nd amendment issues.



cyberdude611 -> RE: Dems worst nightmare (3/16/2008 5:36:00 PM)

Like I said, I dont like any of these guys running. I'm simply pointing out who has the better chance of winning.



Smith117 -> RE: Dems worst nightmare (3/16/2008 6:08:30 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Moloch

McCain is endorsed by Bush.  Plus McStain has a horrbile track record with 2nd amendment issues.


McStain? That's the best you can come up with? Just like those who say "shrub" in refence to Bush....no maturity whatsoever. You don't like the guy so you resort to schoolyard name calling, and with something as lame as "McStain." Sheeesh.

Classic. Classic and typical.



celticlord2112 -> RE: Dems worst nightmare (3/16/2008 6:19:13 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Moloch

McCain is endorsed by Bush.  Plus McStain has a horrbile track record with 2nd amendment issues.


He does indeed....but can you seriously argue he is worse on the 2nd Amendment than Clinton or Obama?

No candidate has to have the "right" position on any issue; he merely needs to have a slightly better one than his opponent.



caitlyn -> RE: Dems worst nightmare (3/16/2008 8:43:39 PM)

While my opinion might be somewhat slanted, being somewhat liberal on most issues ... I really don't buy the notion that the hard fight is going to hurt either Democratic candidate.
 
Each person running for office has flaws. The possible "gain" by having them come out now, is offset by them being, a) old news, down the road, b) flaws the candidate has lots of time to politically work through ... meaning, spin their way out of.
 
There is also the wonderfully political "kiss and make up" coming down the road.



Owner59 -> RE: Dems worst nightmare (3/16/2008 8:55:53 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Smith117

quote:

ORIGINAL: Moloch

McCain is endorsed by Bush.  Plus McStain has a horrbile track record with 2nd amendment issues.


McStain? That's the best you can come up with? Just like those who say "shrub" in refence to Bush....no maturity whatsoever. You don't like the guy so you resort to schoolyard name calling, and with something as lame as "McStain." Sheeesh.

Classic. Classic and typical.



So you`re apologizing for all the "slick willie"name calling?

You`re apologies are accepted.


http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/politics/special/clinton/stories/burton090598.htm

Burton is one of the House's most conservative Republicans and, as chairman of the House committee that has been investigating campaign finance abuses, one of Clinton's most dogged pursuers. In April, he called the president "a scumbag" and said that was why he was "out to get" Clinton.


Burton began his statement acknowledging his out-of-wedlock child by referring to his role in the campaign fund-raising investigation, which he said had brought him "under attack from people inside and outside the Clinton administration. I was prepared for this, and I made a promise to the American people that I would never allow these attacks to deter my efforts to uncover the truth."









FangsNfeet -> RE: Dems worst nightmare (3/16/2008 9:36:32 PM)

Not my problem. I'm not a democrat.  



farglebargle -> RE: Dems worst nightmare (3/17/2008 3:24:33 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: cyberdude611

Like I said, I dont like any of these guys running. I'm simply pointing out who has the better chance of winning.



That presupposes that it's not all fake and staged as entertainment for the befuddled masses...

Which is exactly what it is.



celticlord2112 -> RE: Dems worst nightmare (3/17/2008 3:44:29 AM)

quote:

I really don't buy the notion that the hard fight is going to hurt either Democratic candidate.
By itself, the hard fight doesn't hurt the Democrats.

What does hurt the Democrats is that their nomination contest will come down to the superdelegates, in a fashion that will leave either Clinton or Obama's supporters potentially arguing they were "cheated".

If the two candidates could be brought together on a viable "dream ticket", that would be a successful outcome to this process.  However, if by Day 1 of their convention the question of whom will be the nominee is not settled, THAT turns the convention into a fractious sort of affair reminiscent of 1968.  That would not augur well for the general election.



pahunkboy -> RE: Dems worst nightmare (3/17/2008 6:04:54 AM)

 wanting the campaigne money back.  hmm.  how about every cent of it returned so there is no quid pro quo.

...i better not get a speeding ticket- if i do- i want my money back to the policemans ball!!   glunk



Muttling -> RE: Dems worst nightmare (3/17/2008 10:51:25 AM)

I must say, the DNC is really pissing in the wind right now and they show no signs of letting up in the near future.   The Florida and Michigan fiasco along with the Super Delegates thing is quickly detonating in their faces.   That will get far worse if they don't solve it quickly and I see no real chance of that.

Hillary has the campain skills to really challange McCain, but it doesn't look like she's going to win without some high end party intervention which would royally screw up her chances.

Obama is pretty green when it comes to campaining at this level and it really shows.  He also has quite a bit of dirty laundry for the GOP leap onto.   Obama will get eaten alive by the GOP campain machine and in debates with McCain.


The electorate is really of no consequence at the moment because attitudes can quickly shift between now and the election, but the DNC is imploding while the GOP sits back and carefully sharpens it's sword while watching the fireworks.  I really don't see Obama or Hillary having much of a shot against McCain unless some massive changes occur very quickly.



Muttling -> RE: Dems worst nightmare (3/17/2008 10:56:27 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: celticlord2112

quote:

I really don't buy the notion that the hard fight is going to hurt either Democratic candidate.
By itself, the hard fight doesn't hurt the Democrats.

What does hurt the Democrats is that their nomination contest will come down to the superdelegates, in a fashion that will leave either Clinton or Obama's supporters potentially arguing they were "cheated".

If the two candidates could be brought together on a viable "dream ticket", that would be a successful outcome to this process.  However, if by Day 1 of their convention the question of whom will be the nominee is not settled, THAT turns the convention into a fractious sort of affair reminiscent of 1968.  That would not augur well for the general election.



Another detail to consider is that a candidate who is basically selected by the party's upper echelon will be vunerable to attack by the GOP on the basis of the fact that they weren't selected by the people.    (Or more likely an interest group with no direct GOP ties.)

Rest assured that people on that side of the isle are already laying out their strategy to smoke the Democratic party as a whole if the upper click are the ones to basically nominate a candidate if said candidate is different from the individual who wins the popular vote.


In terms I am sure you will find quite familiar, the DNC has lost sight of their mission objective.



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