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Needs vs Wants - 1/5/2008 3:28:19 PM

gwendolyn

Posts: 188
Joined: 7/19/2005
Status: offline

     I'm not really sure where to begin. I wasn't even sure if I wanted to post it, but here I am. I could just really use some advice. A bit of background is in order, I guess.

    We have been together for a little over a year. By 'together', I mean living together. When I first moved in, things worked in the way that we had discussed prior to sharing a roof. It was what I would call a typical 24/7 D/s dynamic. I have no idea how to describe the dynamic of our relationship now. That's the reason for so much confusion. We had an aurgument this afternoon that is as much my fault as it is his. I woke up without enough time to go to work. Was several hours late, in fact. Since I started this job, we've shared an alarm clock. He sets it to get up in the morning and, before he leaves, sets it again so that I get up for my job. Two days ago he started using his own, but still set mine before he left. I apparently made a grievous error in assuming that he would set mine again, as has been the case for nearly two months now. When I called to ask him why he had not done it this morning, he brushed both me and the situation off. He seemed angry with me. I lost it and said some very harsh things, things I both did and didn't mean.
     My dilemma is this: I called him a bit later and left a message telling him that I was very confused as to where we stood in our relationship. One day he tells me I'm a grown woman, but the next he'll become angry if I used the debit card without permission. His reply was that our dynamic was one of a '50's style household. Part of it is my own fault for not seeing the signs that he obviously didn't want the D/s dynamic. I just don't know what to do anymore. I feel like my needs aren't being met anymore. Over the months, I've tried to show him and tell him that I needed those elements in my life. He seems to be avoiding it, though. I'm just wondering if anyone has any advice as to how to handle things from here. Is the D/s aspect something I need, or just a want? I both want the answer and am afraid of it at the same time.

_____________________________

Tell me what did you like about me?
And don't say my strength and daring.
'cause now I think I'm at your mercy;
And it's my first time for this kind of thing.

Post #: 1

RE: Needs vs Wants - 1/5/2008 3:47:27 PM

RedMagic1

Posts: 6470
Joined: 5/10/2007
Status: offline

I don't think it's time to get all philosophical yet. It might be as simple as him saying, "Damn. She's supposed to be serving *me*, but instead I have to set her alarm clock, make all the financial decisions, and basically be the parent all the time even though I'm totally exhausted because of this new project at work. I'm really the one serving her, and she's got it all cushy."

I don't know, so I'm just iffin' here. But ---- *you* don't know either, and that's the point of address. Find out. If you can't talk with each other without exploding, go to couples therapy and learn how to communicate better. Don't worry about the therapist being weirded out by D/s -- they've already heard some stoooo-reeeees, I promise you.

And, news flash: anyone, sub or dom, who doesn't assume personal responsibility, becomes annoying.

(in reply to gwendolyn)

Post #: 2

RE: Needs vs Wants - 1/5/2008 3:49:49 PM

Prinsexx

Posts: 4584
Joined: 8/27/2007
Status: offline

There are so many issues in yout OP.
First off the relationship is very new. I don't know though how long you knew each other for before you were under the same roof.
Finances seem to be interwoven as part of the dynamic and whilst you are earning it does seem contrary that you need to ask before using the credit card. Do you each have access to it?
I am not sure that his answer that it is a fifties style household was really the right one. If it's Gor, or Master/slave collared, or fifties it surely must be one that is communicated and accepted between you and not just prescriptive.
I know I have no desire whatsoever to be part of a fifties type anything as I am old enough to have known it the first time round and there is nothing about it that holds any romance, creativity or attraction whatsoever as a woman of 2008.
Also; alarm clocks for goodness sake? please there are issues and there are issues and please do not think I am making slight of what is a raw misunderstanding between you...but alarm clocks?
In my real first time round fifties household as a child the mother of the house got up first, lit the fire, and cooked the breakfast (whilst drunk from the night before and War traumarred) and then woke us all up, before going out to work. Her only reward was that he handed her his wage packet.
Roles were distinct and she knew to keep her mouth shut or rather she never thought to open it against him. Rows would erupt where she would hit him physically with the coal poker but then that really was a fighting time because of the fixed nature of their roles. No-one thought anything about the bruises most women got (so my mother's reactions were rather unusual.)
Maybe in his fifties type imagination he wants a show down.
(IMPO How I dislike anything retro.......but I think this might be the tip of an iceburg that needs some warmth to melt it.....)

< Message edited by Prinsexx -- 1/5/2008 3:53:55 PM >

(in reply to gwendolyn)

Post #: 3

RE: Needs vs Wants - 1/5/2008 3:50:13 PM

SirJohnMandevill

Posts: 546
Joined: 11/10/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: gwendolyn

     I'm not really sure where to begin. I wasn't even sure if I wanted to post it, but here I am. I could just really use some advice. A bit of background is in order, I guess.

    We have been together for a little over a year. By 'together', I mean living together. When I first moved in, things worked in the way that we had discussed prior to sharing a roof. It was what I would call a typical 24/7 D/s dynamic. I have no idea how to describe the dynamic of our relationship now. That's the reason for so much confusion. We had an aurgument this afternoon that is as much my fault as it is his. I woke up without enough time to go to work. Was several hours late, in fact. Since I started this job, we've shared an alarm clock. He sets it to get up in the morning and, before he leaves, sets it again so that I get up for my job. Two days ago he started using his own, but still set mine before he left. I apparently made a grievous error in assuming that he would set mine again, as has been the case for nearly two months now. When I called to ask him why he had not done it this morning, he brushed both me and the situation off. He seemed angry with me. I lost it and said some very harsh things, things I both did and didn't mean.
     My dilemma is this: I called him a bit later and left a message telling him that I was very confused as to where we stood in our relationship. One day he tells me I'm a grown woman, but the next he'll become angry if I used the debit card without permission. His reply was that our dynamic was one of a '50's style household. Part of it is my own fault for not seeing the signs that he obviously didn't want the D/s dynamic. I just don't know what to do anymore. I feel like my needs aren't being met anymore. Over the months, I've tried to show him and tell him that I needed those elements in my life. He seems to be avoiding it, though. I'm just wondering if anyone has any advice as to how to handle things from here. Is the D/s aspect something I need, or just a want? I both want the answer and am afraid of it at the same time.

Only you know the truth of the want/need aspect. Most of the female subs I've talked with have expressed it as a need.

That said, things elvolve in any relationship, D/s or vanilla. If you really want the relationship, don't stop communicating until you either get the answer you want...or realize you never will.

Just my .02 zlotys.

Les (Purveyor of Fine, Handcrafted Kink)

_____________________________

Iam an eroticist
I am a fully eroticized being
No more neuroses
I found my strip naked soul soup
With the deviant ingredient
---The B-52s

(in reply to gwendolyn)

Post #: 4

RE: Needs vs Wants - 1/5/2008 4:05:13 PM

RCdc

Posts: 8674
Status: offline

Firstly, get it out of your head that there is a 'typical Ds relationship'. There isn't - well apart from one person dominates and another submits - but that's the act not the relationship.

Some of this is hard to comment on because there is so little information to assist. What was the relationship like before? How is it now? (Other than changed).

I would suggest that your dynamic is in no way 50's - not in the strictest sense, by the mere fact that you are working for one and that you have clear with him on when you spend, although it does depend on what you are spending on. What elements is it that you need that aren't being met? If you cannot write that here or say to yourself in your head what these needs are after reading that question, then to me - you aren;t communicating them clearly to him. Unless you can sit down and communicate clearly he cannot work with you. I know I may sound harsh, but your post isn't particularly clear and if you cannot communicate to us what the problem is, then that makes me assume he isn;t being properly informed. There does seem to be much assumption from your side (the clock for example).
I would suggest you communicate and that seems to be a problem. Maybe from both sides.

the.dark.

_____________________________

RC&dc

love isnt gazing into each others eyes - it's looking forward in the same direction

(in reply to gwendolyn)

Post #: 5

RE: Needs vs Wants - 1/5/2008 4:07:00 PM

IrishMist

Posts: 7480
Joined: 11/17/2005
Status: offline

I am going to have to ask...when you say D/s...are you meaning the 'dynamic'? or are you talking about 'play'...as in BDSM?

_____________________________

If I said something to offend you, please tell me what it was so that I can say it again later.

(in reply to gwendolyn)

Post #: 6

RE: Needs vs Wants - 1/5/2008 4:16:58 PM

gwendolyn

Posts: 188
Joined: 7/19/2005
Status: offline

darcy, I don't think it's harsh at all. I can see why you'd come to the conclusion that I wasn't informing him of my needs. I appreciate your honesty.
I've explained how I feel over and over again, but it's never more than a temporary partial fix before he loses interest in anything remotely D/s, excepting the control aspect. And I can't convince him in any way that, being a masochist, sometimes I need that painful release. I feel like he expects blind obedience without any contribution on his part to my needs as his submissive. When we first began the relationship, there seemed to be well defined roles and responsibilities. One conversation that sticks out in my mind just prior to moving in was one in which he made the comment that he could see I wanted his control, and that he wanted to give that to me. That carried over into our daily lives for the first few months. He used to enjoy me sitting at his side on the floor while we watched TV. Now, after no more than a few minutes he'll tell me "That's enough". There used to be a physical aspect to the dynamic. The toys we collected in the first few months of living together have been gathering dust in the top of the closet, and have been for about six months now. He used to want to try new things in that way. Now he doesn't even want anything to do with the 'old' things, so to speak. I can't remember a more vanilla sex life that the present one.

_____________________________

Tell me what did you like about me?
And don't say my strength and daring.
'cause now I think I'm at your mercy;
And it's my first time for this kind of thing.

(in reply to RCdc)

Post #: 7

RE: Needs vs Wants - 1/5/2008 4:18:47 PM

gwendolyn

Posts: 188
Joined: 7/19/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: IrishMist

I am going to have to ask...when you say D/s...are you meaning the 'dynamic'? or are you talking about 'play'...as in BDSM?

Both.

_____________________________

Tell me what did you like about me?
And don't say my strength and daring.
'cause now I think I'm at your mercy;
And it's my first time for this kind of thing.

(in reply to IrishMist)

Post #: 8

RE: Needs vs Wants - 1/5/2008 4:24:20 PM

batshalom

Posts: 1990
Joined: 9/17/2007
Status: offline

It sounds like it's time to sit down and hash it out in outline form. Find out why he changed, tell him you like X, see if he wants Y, and compromise if you can. If there is no compromise to be had, and if neither of you can live the way the other wishes to live, then it's time to make decisions. (P.S. The alarm clock example is a fairly black and white power struggle thing.)

(in reply to gwendolyn)

Post #: 9

RE: Needs vs Wants - 1/5/2008 4:32:38 PM

RCdc

Posts: 8674
Status: offline

From the extra info you have given, my suggestion is that you do have the Ds aspect of the relationship(although slightly confusing and wishy washy for you) but that you also are masochistic? That you enjoy intense play as well and that is what is missing? Not every Ds relationship has BDSM play, but this was something you started with and which was arranged.
If I am wrong, just tell me.

With the clock incident, I would say that it was your responsibility not to assume he would do it continuously unless that had been directly pre-arranged. It's a bit of a power struggle kinda thing. That said, I wouldn't say you are to blame or should find fault with yourself, because it does seem he is being inconsistant with you and that doesn't aid you in serving.

Is it a need or want? It could be both IMO. It obvious you want to serve him, but it's a needbecause you do need to have direct discipline and guidence to serve a dominant. My impression by what you have written is that he may like the whole idea of being in a Ds arrangement, but that he doesn't have the follow through and he definately doesn't seem to desire the play aspect or understand you need/want for physical use. I suggest you ask to speak 'outside the relationship' as it were - and lay your cards on the table and see how he responds. Arrange time together and talk. I know that sounds pretty standard, but its the only way you can get your needs and wants across if you talk to him. His response will determine your actions.

the.dark.

_____________________________

RC&dc

love isnt gazing into each others eyes - it's looking forward in the same direction

(in reply to gwendolyn)

Post #: 10

RE: Needs vs Wants - 1/5/2008 5:18:19 PM

LuckyAlbatross

Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline

This sounds like a serious compatibility issue (which is essentially how well needs/wants match up) mixed with some communication issues and a change of personality.

I'd say you're overdue for a series of deep heart to heart discussions- why has he changed what he likes? What do you both want in this relationship? What specific things make you feel more and less secure in the other? What behaviors do you want to keep and what do you want to change? Where do you see things 5 years from now?

_____________________________

Find stable partners, not a stable of partners.

"Sometimes my whore logic gets all fuzzy"- Californication

(in reply to RCdc)

Post #: 11

RE: Needs vs Wants - 1/5/2008 7:17:46 PM

DesFIP

Posts: 25191
Joined: 11/25/2007
From: Apple County NY
Status: offline

I think six months is way too soon to turn over your finances to him. Six months after The Man moved up here, we were just getting the dynamic back. Literally all that time was spent acclimating to living with each other. Arranging furniture so he was more comfortable, hanging pictures, hell just him becoming a regular at the diner he stopped at to get his coffee. Little things that added together equal a life.

And just because he wants a 50's household doesn't mean he gets it without prior discussion, especially if you don't have your needs met like that.

Take back your paycheck, contribute to the rent and bills and save enough to get your own place. You may not ever have to go, but knowing you can allows you to be surer about getting your needs met. Remember, you are only there as long as you consent to be there.

You folks need a lot of honest conversation. But if he won't agree to talk to you, if he refuses to listen to anything that isn't part of your agenda, then this simply won't work. Take back your money.

_____________________________

Slave to laundry

Cynical and proud of it!

(in reply to LuckyAlbatross)

Post #: 12

RE: Needs vs Wants - 1/5/2008 7:34:18 PM

LaMspeach

Posts: 794
Joined: 12/4/2004
From: Philadelphia area, PA
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: gwendolyn
Is the D/s aspect something I need, or just a want? I both want the answer and am afraid of it at the same time.

For me .... The D/s aspect is something I need in my life to feel whole and to be true to myself. With out it I feel very empty and lost. I can survive very well on my own (and have for a long time) but since I have been own I strive for better because I know it is expected of me. I serve him and make his life as easy as I possible can.

I think you just need to figure out what you both want out of the relationship and discuss it openly. If he wants you to make sure certain things are done by yourself but he will handle the financial side of things he need to express that, then you can decide if that is enough for you or if it time to move on.

_____________________________

peach ~ LordandMasters devoted alpha slave
"Only when the year has grown cold does one know that the pine and cypress are the last to wither"

(in reply to gwendolyn)

Post #: 13

RE: Needs vs Wants - 1/5/2008 7:42:16 PM

slavetaboo

Posts: 408
Joined: 11/30/2007
Status: offline

My first thought was that if he has withdrawn from you perhaps there is a reason. The reason may or may not be you. I will even be more specific in that when you are attempting to find out the reason why he may be feeling more withdrawn to keep the conversation about him and not about you. Try keeping the discussion natural and empathetic not investigative or accusatory. I understand submissive needs and how sometimes those needs can build until it's all you can think about. You'll have more success in having your own needs met if his are being met first. Remind him why you adore him and see what happens.

(in reply to DesFIP)

Post #: 14

RE: Needs vs Wants - 1/5/2008 7:54:18 PM

LATEXBABY64

Posts: 2107
Joined: 4/8/2004
Status: offline

you know the simple term of anything in life is just live it. everyone has wants and needs
money a job lol those are needs on this site everyone tries to define everything every aspect of theory driven books I can not stand profs there so one sided in their socail thinking . You got to class and they just teach from their point of view there are few who are cool who will show you every side of a story be it your own or someone elses biography you want something you take you earn it. YOU have a need or disire this always changes so maybe what is your need of the day or want for now

(in reply to slavetaboo)

Post #: 15

RE: Needs vs Wants - 1/5/2008 8:43:52 PM

sweetnurseBBW

Posts: 2464
Joined: 1/26/2006
From: North Carolina
Status: offline

Just sounds like your and his expectations and boundaries have become blurred. It is time to sit down and talk about what he expects and wants and what you want from him. Sometimes when we get busy we forget about these things and need to talk them through and work them out.

Everyones dynamic is different and needs to be discussed prior to living together.

_____________________________

Sir Pain's pain slut

(in reply to gwendolyn)

Post #: 16

RE: Needs vs Wants - 1/6/2008 1:46:28 AM

Driver1961

Posts: 459
Joined: 9/8/2005
Status: offline

He dips His lid;

It seems your problems are not necessarily unique although to some they may percieve they are.... Confusing like isn't it? Dramatic changes in any relationship (friends, nilla, intimate, workplace , they all apply) create confusion unless all parties communicate clearly of their needs/wants and listen/understand the others' needs/wants. (Power plays occur intentionally and unintentionally)

Communication involves listening and (in my belief) actioning understanding.   To further add confusion- what One states as needs/wants are not always correct either.

One cannot always understand the basis of their expectations but will voice their expectations without being 'on the mark' so to speak. Think of self reflection later on what you have perceived as a need (uncompromisable) or a want (compromisable) only to realize later they were the reverse! Excuse me but we are human!

To further complicate this you have the consequences of the change in YOUR RELATIONSHIP by moving in together.   These needs and wants (seperate things remember) can become blurred very quickly and often without One (Dom or sub) being able to clarify why in their mind.   The 24/7 type responsibilities can often impact so greatly compared to before. Communication is the key with acknowledgement that the 'real issue' still requires to be confronted purposely together.

summarizing...- you have entered a more intimate phase of your relationship and the impacts of 'living together' consequences require acknowledgement to avoid the confusion that not only YOU (OP) has but also what your Dom is most probably experiencing also.   I do not believe that a D/s relationship nullifys the 'essentials' that any 'healthy relationship' requires- nilla, friends or otherwise.

In short- Many of us consider 'the fantasy' of our desired BDSM relationship will automatically meet our 'wants' (compromisable) when they are actually 'needs' (uncompromisable).

P>S> it's heartwrenching but is excellent learning upon self and dual reflection. Consider general couples counselling if you both value the relationship. (Another self reflective thought! LOL)

warm regards Driver.

< Message edited by Driver1961 -- 1/6/2008 2:07:32 AM >

_____________________________

Dance as though nobody is watching!

(in reply to sweetnurseBBW)

Post #: 17

RE: Needs vs Wants - 1/6/2008 2:17:01 AM

darkpassenger434

Posts: 138
Joined: 1/1/2008
Status: offline

I have been in similar situations. Not in the the specifics of your desired dynamic, but regarding a situation where the partner doesn't seem to desire what they initially believed or agreed to. All I can tell you is you guys have to talk and figure out what the problem is. And then you will have to make a decision. It is sadly that simple.
-R

_____________________________

"The man who says it cannot be done should not interrupt the man doing it."

(in reply to Driver1961)

Post #: 18

RE: Needs vs Wants - 1/6/2008 6:12:45 AM

Sexynmentalinkc

Posts: 132
Joined: 4/14/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: LuckyAlbatross

This sounds like a serious compatibility issue (which is essentially how well needs/wants match up) mixed with some communication issues and a change of personality.

/seconds-this

However, I wonder if it was his personality to kink from the start. His apparent lack of interest in your dusty toys is telling - as is the clock thing.

In my way of thinking, you 2 'shared'...now he's got his and you've got yours. The symbolism of that act should tell you volumes about where his mind is at currently. The way he's now, seemingly, blowing off his responsibility to the dynamic and your needs (like sending you away from being next to him at the TV) only reinfornces the fact that something has changed.

As others have stated, a very serious open heart-to-heart is definitely in order.

- Mr. S

_____________________________

"I think all right-thinking people in this country are sick and tired of being told that ordinary, decent people are fed up in this country with being sick and tired. ...I'm certainly not. And I'm sick and tired of being told that I am..."

(in reply to LuckyAlbatross)

Post #: 19

RE: Needs vs Wants - 1/6/2008 6:40:50 AM

TreasureKY

Posts: 3032
Joined: 4/10/2007
From: Kentucky
Status: offline

There really isn't enough information to do anything but hazard a guess, but my first thought in reading your story is that it's not primarily needs and wants that are an issue, but expectations.

First, as Celeste (DesFIP) so wisely brought up, it takes some serious time to adjust to a change in a relationship. Learning to live with someone isn't easy, and blending two lives together harmoniously takes work. You talked about what you wanted and needed, but living those expectations might have been more than was bargained for on a 24/7 basis.

Despite any individual claims to the contrary, most people cannot live in a high-protocol, intense D/s structure non-stop. (Note that I use "D/s" to encompass all levels of power-exchange relationships.) Ordinary life interferes and usurps our time and energy. Living an average, vanilla lifestyle is the norm because quite frankly, that is what comes easiest for people... it's what we grew up with, takes the least effort and provides the most comfort. Injecting a D/s dynamic takes extra thought and effort, and sustaining that effort can be draining.

Even though you might see people protesting that their kink is a need for them to be happy, meeting that need still requires effort. It's the same as if I was an avid equestrian... I love horses and riding, and I can't imagine my life without enjoying them... but to own and care for horses requires that I make the effort necessary to afford and maintain them. But the benefits have to justify the cost.

I suspect that if you were to poll the people who live in happy D/s relationships, you'd find that the majority had a period of struggle with their dynamic before they found the level that satisfied their wants and needs and could be easily maintained. It's a balance of expectations.

It's hard enough balancing our own expectations as individuals... building a life with another requires balancing expectations for the relationship, while supporting our own individual expectations and without interfering with our partner's expectations.

What this all boils down to is that you need to take the prevalent advice given above and communicate with your partner. Talk about what each of you wants and needs, but keep in mind the thought of balancing those expectations with what can be realistically obtained at a comfortable level for both of you. Also remember that sometimes dealing with everyday life can suck us dry and we have barely the energy required to meet our own basic needs... and none left over to see to meeting the expectations of others.

(in reply to gwendolyn)

Post #: 20

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