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promiscuity tolerance training... - 10/18/2007 1:40:46 PM

seangrey

Posts: 31
Joined: 8/29/2007
Status: offline

I am in my very first serious M/s relationship. I was clear up front that I was not monogamous and didn't feel that I could be. She chose to submit anyway. We tried to negotiate certain compromises... IE I won't allow another sub to swallow my cum. etc etc etc. but nothing worked and the more negotiation the farther we get from the M/s purity that we were both originally drawn to. I basically decided that if she wants to remain my slave it must be with no conditions. She has agreed, but I want to know if anyone has any training ideas or emotional strategies that can keep her healthy through this adjustment. I am particulary interested to hear from a sub or slave that has been through this. I am all ears. Yes, I have considered releasing her, but our connection is too strong.

Post #: 1

RE: promiscuity tolerance training... - 10/18/2007 1:47:15 PM

Estring

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Joined: 1/1/2004
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I seriously doubt you can train her to accept your being with other women. She may learn to accept it, or she may never accept it. You will find out soon enough.

_____________________________

Boycott Whales!

(in reply to seangrey)

Post #: 2

RE: promiscuity tolerance training... - 10/18/2007 1:50:59 PM

lisacat

Posts: 4
Joined: 10/12/2007
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Having been in the past a sub/slave in a 24/7 r/t situation it took alot of discipline to make me understand that if Master was happy then i would be happy. It is very important to give approval for that concept, and strict disapproval for any jealousy, acting out, etc. Also, in practice, your slave will see that Master will continue to care for her despite being with others. In fact, she will see that it is to her benefit to have a happy Master.

(in reply to seangrey)

Post #: 3

RE: promiscuity tolerance training... - 10/18/2007 1:51:43 PM

DarkDaddyZ

Posts: 805
Joined: 4/7/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: seangrey

I am in my very first serious M/s relationship. I was clear up front that I was not monogamous and didn't feel that I could be. She chose to submit anyway. We tried to negotiate certain compromises... IE I won't allow another sub to swallow my cum. etc etc etc. but nothing worked and the more negotiation the farther we get from the M/s purity that we were both originally drawn to. I basically decided that if she wants to remain my slave it must be with no conditions. She has agreed, but I want to know if anyone has any training ideas or emotional strategies that can keep her healthy through this adjustment. I am particulary interested to hear from a sub or slave that has been through this. I am all ears. Yes, I have considered releasing her, but our connection is too strong.

Sounds like you two really didn't agree to anything.

I'd recommend posting this in the poly lifestyle board and good luck!

_____________________________

"Flirting is part of the job description." DJ Jesus (Lucy Daughter Of The Devil)

Vanilla Official Music Page http://www.myspace.com/djzulu

(in reply to seangrey)

Post #: 4

RE: promiscuity tolerance training... - 10/18/2007 2:03:23 PM

ownedgirlie

Posts: 9184
Joined: 2/5/2006
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I went through something very similar, only there was no negotiating on his part. I entered into slavery with him knowing full well he would have other girls if he wished. Yet to my own surprise, it still bothered me greatly, for some time.

Yes, a girl can indeed be trained to accept all things from her Master, including his desire for others. My Master constantly told me the only one who can affect my slavery to him is me. No one else has the ability to destroy what we are creating, especially an outside person. Yet I also knew he would do what he wanted and with whom, and he would either choose to share it with me or not. Because I responded poorly at first, he chose to simply shelter me from the knowledge in most cases, and it was inappropriate for me to even ask about it (my questions were really just to sate an unhealthy curiosity or to torture myself, neither having anything to do with my actual slavery and service to him).

Once I came to understand my place with him, and feel absolutely secure in it and in what my submission means to both of us, I realized that is really the only important thing to focus on, and anyone or anything or anyway he chooses to spend his time with has no bearing on my slavery to him. In short, I love when he is happy and fulfilled, and if he is such with additional slaves, then I am at peace with that.

Once I realized these things, I began being brought into his fold of knowledge. He enjoys sharing such things with me, and I am thrilled to be in a place where I can actually add to the ways I can serve him, by understanding his world a little better, absent of my baggage being in the way. Some of the slaves he has had, I have been involved with, and some not. Typically now if I am not, it is because the other slave has not come to terms with my presence yet. Many agree to a poly Master but still find much difficulty with it. It takes a great Master with great patience to be able to train a slave through her own issues about this. And in my case, it took a couple of years.

A lot of people told me it could not be done. A lot of people told me what a big bad brute he was, and a lot of people tried to get me to question myself along the way. Some girls attempted to thwart my efforts by attempting games of jealousy, but he and I both stayed the course, and I was determined to get over myself and accept all things from him without issue. This has been acheived, and the bond we now share is greater than it has ever been, for many reasons actually, not just this one.

Like you, both of us were so drawn to what we were creating together, it was worth going through what we did to get to where we now are. I do wish you the best, and if your girl would like to talk to someone about this who has been through it, she is welcome to message me on the other side.

(in reply to seangrey)

Post #: 5

RE: promiscuity tolerance training... - 10/18/2007 2:04:24 PM

seangrey

Posts: 31
Joined: 8/29/2007
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Thank you for your response. This is just exactly what I am trying to do. Time will tell if it works or not.

(in reply to lisacat)

Post #: 6

RE: promiscuity tolerance training... - 10/18/2007 2:17:54 PM

seangrey

Posts: 31
Joined: 8/29/2007
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This is an outstanding hopeful response. thank you so much for your time and insight.

(in reply to ownedgirlie)

Post #: 7

RE: promiscuity tolerance training... - 10/18/2007 2:27:18 PM

toservez

Posts: 1733
Joined: 9/7/2006
From: All over now in Minnesota
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Estring

I seriously doubt you can train her to accept your being with other women. She may learn to accept it, or she may never accept it. You will find out soon enough.

I have to agree with this. No training or philosophical M/s discussions will really matter. The fact is some people are just monogamous and some are not. Some people cannot have another have sex outside their relationship and others do not care.

All you can do is see if it is natural to her and she just cannot do what you need or she can learn/overcome and deal/embrace the life you are wanting.

In the end, especially for this subject, we are who we are and all the verbal agreeing in the world means little. As you have found out theoretical to real time is always a big step. Not about right or wrong, broken promises or a lack of effort. Reality is just different and for many until they truly expereince it they truly will not know what they are capable of.

_____________________________

I am sorry I do not fit Webster's defintion of a slave but thankfully my Master is not Webster.

"Anything that contradicts experience and logic should be abandoned." - H.H. The 14th Dalai Lama

(in reply to Estring)

Post #: 8

RE: promiscuity tolerance training... - 10/18/2007 3:15:39 PM

ownedgirlie

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Joined: 2/5/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: seangrey

This is an outstanding hopeful response. thank you so much for your time and insight.

You are very welcome. I wrote it out because I suspected you would mostly receive the same kind of feedback I once did...which for me was quite incorrect. It did not come easily, but then few things so valuable in life ever do.

(in reply to seangrey)

Post #: 9

RE: promiscuity tolerance training... - 10/18/2007 3:24:40 PM

seangrey

Posts: 31
Joined: 8/29/2007
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I hope that you are wrong, but I just don't know yet. I will learn by doing I suppose. thanks for your response. I read your replies when I see your avatar, and always find your responses enlightening.

(in reply to toservez)

Post #: 10

RE: promiscuity tolerance training... - 10/18/2007 3:35:11 PM

Aswad

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Joined: 4/4/2007
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A stock phrase in experimental medicine: "Start low, go slow."
It is usually good advice in these kinds of things as well.

What you will want to do, is start off with very light contact, and slowly advance, along with supportive measures; ownedgirlie has some good ideas in her post. The idea is to desensitize the negative response by providing positive reinforcement (support etc.) at the same time as you slowly expand her comfort zone. Reading up on treatment of phobias may be a good place to start, with the technique that is usually the most effective being Cognitive Behavioural Therapy. You don't need the whole thing to do a thing like this, but I still think "Behaviour Therapy and Beyond" is a book that would be good for most M-types to own a copy of.

I'll not be following the thread, though, so if you have questions for me about that, you'll have to PM them.

Just my 2 cents.

Health,
al-Aswad.

_____________________________

"If God saw what any of us did that night, he didn't seem to mind.
From then on I knew: God doesn't make the world this way.
We do." -- Rorschack, Watchmen.

(in reply to seangrey)

Post #: 11

RE: promiscuity tolerance training... - 10/18/2007 3:39:17 PM

gypsygrl

Posts: 1471
Joined: 10/8/2005
From: new york state
Status: offline

I think you're spot on in thinking of this as a training issue. If ya take a bunch of newbie bottoms and hit them with everything you've got their first time out into the SM arena it'd be no surprise if a good number developed negative views about SM and turned away from it. Just because someone considers themselves a masochist, or agrees to SM play, doesn't mean they can take a heavy beating on their first go round. Alot will have to build up to heavy play.

I think the same can be said of "non-monogmy." No doubt, there are some who are hardwired for monogamy and will never be anything other than monogamous. But, I'm sure there's plenty others who are monogamous by default, and just need to slowly learn new ways of relating, step by step.

I don't think the sort of negotiating you described in your op would work for me. I hate the idea of setting limits on Master's activities even if its for my comfort. He's poly and I'm learning. At the beginning, because I was having negative reactions, I decided to install some filters on my perceptions (this is similar to what ownedgirlie was saying about her Master sheltering her) and just blocked everything having to do with him being with someone else. He would slide things into our conversations, and I would usually ignore them or just repond with formal politeness. He continued to do it, and I'm finding I'm more comfortable with the idea such that I don't even feel a negative reaction when he talks of others though I'm unable to express positive interest at this point. Althought, I've found that recently, when I see a woman I'm attracted to, I want to share that and find out what he thinks of her. (Yes, I ooogle. I feel like a dirty old man sometimes.) I do better when he talks about me being with others because its not as threatening but even then, I find such talk can kick up my separation/abandonment anxiety and it makes me worry that he's looking to be rid of me.

I think the biggest thing in my increasing comfort is that he continues to make time to meet my needs and think about me even though he's had some really good excuses not to lately. (when I say really good excuses, I mean the sort of BIG LIFE EVENTS that would take up alot of anybody's time) I feel like I'm pretty high on his priority list and I'm less worried about being replaced. Early on, when we first met, this was a real issue and I was pretty close to bailing because I couldn't stand the anxiety.

I don't know how long you've been with your slave, but I would definitely wait until your relationship is established before you really push this issue on someone who's always been monogamous.

_____________________________

“To be happy is to be able to become aware of oneself without fright.” ~Walter Benjamin

(in reply to seangrey)

Post #: 12

RE: promiscuity tolerance training... - 10/18/2007 3:41:19 PM

xoxi

Posts: 1066
Status: offline

The one thing that will make or break this is whether she is willing to work toward accepting it. If she genuinely wants to be tolerant of your promiscuity, then yes it is a matter of training. But if she (even subconsciously) is dead set against it, and truly wants to be your one and only, no amount of training will work at all.

(in reply to gypsygrl)

Post #: 13

RE: promiscuity tolerance training... - 10/18/2007 3:43:43 PM

MrDiscipline44

Posts: 1776
Joined: 1/5/2005
Status: offline

Look, Sean, she knows what she's getting herself into, right. You both talked this through. She either deals with it or moves on. There is no way to "train" her to be alright with it. She just either will be or she won't be. But I will tell you one thing, insecurity is a motherfucker. The longer she feels insecure about you bangin away on Darla (humps lamppost), the worst her mind will fill with things that aren't true. She needs to be able to come upto you and say what it is that she is feeling insecure about so you can do something about it. Communication, man. Thats the only way to go.

_____________________________

If you love somebody, you have to be willing to break them.

Those who can, do. Those who can't, teach.

Have you slapped your slave today?

(in reply to seangrey)

Post #: 14

RE: promiscuity tolerance training... - 10/18/2007 3:44:06 PM

toservez

Posts: 1733
Joined: 9/7/2006
From: All over now in Minnesota
Status: offline

I should point out or recommend things. I was just taken back probably by the word training.

I have never been in a monogamous relationship but that does not mean what ever goes no problem. I am also though not poly in terms of ongoing relationships with multiple people unless it is purely sex.

At first with all my owners it was very important that after you do something do not hide it or brag about it. Talk about honestly with her, I do not mean spill the details but hiding it means what else are you hiding and gushing means am I not as good. Not fair but reality. Put in some extra effort before and after on her. This reassuring of her place with you is simply everything to me. Once the relationship is on good ground I do not need this but still like it! Of course the obvious one is also never neglect her needs in this area as well.

I have never had a problem with sharing my man physically with someone. That does not mean that I do not worry about him sharing his heart with another which is a no no. That may or may not be what you are wanting but these issues are both separate but also intertwine. If you are not suppose to share a heart just be careful to show her this is not happening as well.

As Aswad and gypsygl point out, do not immediately dive into the deep end but go slow. If she can learn to enjoy/accept it then it is not going to be probably an on/off switch but a gradual warm up as her fears diminish if it is not hardwired.

_____________________________

I am sorry I do not fit Webster's defintion of a slave but thankfully my Master is not Webster.

"Anything that contradicts experience and logic should be abandoned." - H.H. The 14th Dalai Lama

(in reply to seangrey)

Post #: 15

RE: promiscuity tolerance training... - 10/18/2007 5:55:05 PM

pseudopsychotic

Posts: 145
Joined: 8/27/2007
Status: offline

I'd have to make sure he wasnt turning into a door mat for STDs.
But that's just me.

_____________________________

Got a problem with me Solve it.
Think I'm trippin? Tie my shoe
Can't face me? Turn around

(in reply to toservez)

Post #: 16

RE: promiscuity tolerance training... - 10/18/2007 9:44:46 PM

LuckyAlbatross

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Joined: 10/25/2005
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Is the problem that you are not monogamous, that you want HER to be not monogamous, that you want to have casual affairs, something else or all of the above?

Those are all very different problems to have and can all be solved in several ways. However, most of what everyone else said applies- she is an adult and needs to be responsible for her choices and consequences, however you are also an adult and it would be wrong to accept someone's choice when you know they aren't really capable of making an understanding choice, and in my world, a choice in which they would betray who they are.

A lot of people can learn to accept a lot of things in times. But first you have to figure out exactly what is it that needs to be accepted.

_____________________________

Find stable partners, not a stable of partners.

"Sometimes my whore logic gets all fuzzy"- Californication

(in reply to pseudopsychotic)

Post #: 17

RE: promiscuity tolerance training... - 10/19/2007 6:54:25 AM

BeingChewsie

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Joined: 10/27/2005
Status: offline

Quick reply:

I have been here. You can change this over time. I echo Ownedgirlies response. Sounds very much like what I went through. The don't ask, don't tell period, but we talked about what was making me feel insecure..for me it all came down to a fear of being replaced. Over time (years) we sorted through that.

_____________________________

"In fact, it is my contention that most women are accepting of way less than optimal circumstance constantly, and are lucky to be 'snagged' by the right man, if ever. But it is more by happy accident than by their design. "
~Ron and Hup

(in reply to LuckyAlbatross)

Post #: 18

RE: promiscuity tolerance training... - 10/19/2007 7:21:45 AM

CreativeDominant

Posts: 11032
Joined: 3/11/2006
Status: offline

Interesting post.

I've stated that my first submissive was married and came from a swinging background so I knew I was sharing her. One of the first rules I laid down...and she agreed to...was that the swinging stopped. At first, sharing her with her husband was enough to handle. As I grew more comfortable with the situation that I had willingly walked into, I found that I wanted to take up with other partners for more casual relationships while having her as my main submissive. When I approached her with the idea and asked for help in time issues and explaining what would be involved to these other partners, she helped me by giving me the benefits of her experiences in swinging. You may be wondering if she wanted or was allowed to be with others...no, she was not and did not want to be. She had wanted to move away from the swinging lifestyle and was content to have her husband and me as her only partners.

Oddly enough, this relationship did not lead me to a yearning to be involved in a poly lifestyle. My next two relationships were monogamous, by my choice. Having had the benefit of being involved with someone that was O.K. with my having partners, I got the experience...enjoyed it...but don't necessarily need it. Might want it again someday, might not. I think the important thing though is communication about wants and needs so that you understand up front what you are getting into. As has been pointed out, your slave agreed to this and yet now seems to be playing somewhat of a passive-aggressive card. You can be patient and understanding and supportive...as ownedgirlie's Master was...and try to work it through with her or you may have to step back and take a serious look at things and ask yourself "Is she ever going to change her perception, no matter WHAT I do?". If the answer is no, then either you will have to change or the relationship will have to.

(in reply to seangrey)

Post #: 19

RE: promiscuity tolerance training... - 10/19/2007 9:26:33 AM

seangrey

Posts: 31
Joined: 8/29/2007
Status: offline

I am not monogamous. I don't mind if she is, in fact, I like the idea, although I think that she should at least have some outside play experiences at least. I want to have casual affairs, but I don't want to limit those to cheap sex.

(in reply to LuckyAlbatross)

Post #: 20

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