quote:

ORIGINAL: slaveboyforyou

I'd be more impressed if he could do it the way Babe Ruth did; fat, out of shape, and with a hangover.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Alumbrado

quote:

Truth is steroids don't do anything unless you have pushed yourself to your limit - only then do they begin to assist.

No, steroids make possible  unattainable hypertrophy with crappy form, mediocre workouts, and scant attention to rest and nutrition cycles.. which is why they are so popular. They are a big short cut. They also allow coaches to win with players who might otherwise be sidelined too long from injuries.

If you had to already be a champion to get a microscopic benefit, they wouldn't be in currency with every gym rat who thinks squats are too hard, and strict form is for losers.

quote:

ORIGINAL: slaveboyforyou

I'd be more impressed if he could do it the way Babe Ruth did; fat, out of shape, and with a hangover.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Alumbrado

I wasn't arguing that Bonds would never have broken the record without chemical help..his talent is obvious.  It may have taken longer. 

But I did want to offer a counterview to the notion that only those who already give a superb effort borne of immense talent will see any benefit from steroids.  

quote:

ORIGINAL: SwitchMaleChgo
Let me clarify. I do not think steroids should be legal for teenagers or for women (unless a sepcific medical condition merits it). But as for developed men - all studies suggest their use to be benifitial however we are denied these substances because of a war-on-drugs type mentality that jumps on hype instead of looking at the evidence. Watch this video. If it doesn't change you mind or at least make you consider rethinking the whole issue then I will respect your opinion but retain my own. Too each their own as they say.

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-2754168929523377644&q=steroid&total=2888&start=0&num=10&so=0&type=search&plindex=9

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

quote:

ORIGINAL: SwitchMaleChgo
Let me clarify. I do not think steroids should be legal for teenagers or for women (unless a sepcific medical condition merits it). But as for developed men - all studies suggest their use to be benifitial however we are denied these substances because of a war-on-drugs type mentality that jumps on hype instead of looking at the evidence. Watch this video. If it doesn't change you mind or at least make you consider rethinking the whole issue then I will respect your opinion but retain my own. Too each their own as they say.

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-2754168929523377644&q=steroid&total=2888&start=0&num=10&so=0&type=search&plindex=9

What studies? The ones that prove anabolic steroids can cause fatal liver damage? Or perhaps its the ones that prove anabolic steroids can cause sterility and development of female secondary sexual characteristics? Or maybe you mean the ones that show that anabolic steroids are associated with a variety of self and other endangering psychological changes?

Or maybe you'd rather go with the anecdotal evidence? Maybe interviews with Lyle Alzado and Chris Benoit will be helpful? Then again maybe not. Although if you hurry you can interview "Superstar" Billy Graham on his admitted anabolic steroid use but I would wait very long if I was you.

As to Gumbel's little "news" report it would be more interesting and relevant if I didn't actually know how to use pubmed. A quick search of:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/sites/entrez
shows 5400+ articles on anabolic steroids and mixed in with the studies on how to detect it are plenty of articles on the damage it causes. I count 6 on the first page of 20 results.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Alumbrado

There was a pharmacist on the skeptic's forum who provided links to similar material... and no doubt that hysteria co-exists with denial on the subject.  


Now as to 'healthy adult males', that would include my son when he was 18, and his coaches realized that as a natural talent, he was a career booster for them...on steroids, he would have been their meal ticket. Good thing we had had a long time to teach him to think for himself, and sift through the hype from both sides.

quote:

ORIGINAL: SwitchMaleChgo

right. Steroids won the record. It had nothing to do with natural talent or hard training. Listen - if you have no talent and take steroids it doesn't give you talent. If you take steroids and sit on your ass they do not build muscle. Truth is steroids don't do anything unless you have pushed yourself to your limit - only then do they begin to assist. He still had the work to do. He still had to train and push himself to his absolute limit. Steroids or not. He deserves the honor. Every sport in history has had their cheats and I'm sure Aaron isn't immune. If every bat Aaron ever used has been X-ray'd to see if it was corked then maybe I'm wrong. But I'm guessing a corked bat or two made it in his record and just no one knows about it. Give Bonds his due. Steroids should be legal anyway.