Russian Gay Pride March to Go Ahead Despite Ban

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dcnovice -> Russian Gay Pride March to Go Ahead Despite Ban (5/26/2007 2:58:03 PM)
Russia's homosexual community plans to push ahead with a gay pride march in the capital on Sunday despite opposition from city authorities and far-right extremists, an organiser said Saturday. ... Gay pride organiser Nikolai Alexeyev told journalists on Saturday that marchers would deliver a letter to Moscow Mayor Yury Luzhkov asking that the demonstration and others like it be authorised. The mayor had earlier called gay pride "the work of Satan." The march has been banned by city authorities and clashes are feared with extreme-rightists similar to those that occurred in May last year. ... At last year's parade, also held in defiance of a ban, more than 100 people were arrested and dozens of gay rights campaigners were attacked by skinheads shouting "Moscow is not Sodom." SOURCE: http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20070526/lf_afp/russiagaysdemo_070526212404 Memorial Day weekend seems a fitting time to remind myself not to take my rights (nor those who fought for them) for granted. I salute the courage of my Russian brothers and sisters.

cyberdude611 -> RE: Russian Gay Pride March to Go Ahead Despite Ban (5/26/2007 4:19:46 PM)
Someone is going to get shot.

dcnovice -> RE: Russian Gay Pride March to Go Ahead Despite Ban (5/26/2007 4:23:54 PM)
Sad to say, that's probably a possibility.

minnetar -> RE: Russian Gay Pride March to Go Ahead Despite Ban (5/26/2007 9:06:37 PM)
thanks for that info - can you believe how far the country has changed even with the opposition that they allow it? minnetar

SirKenin -> RE: Russian Gay Pride March to Go Ahead Despite Ban (5/26/2007 10:30:06 PM)
Now this bugs me. I am all for gay rights and gay parades. I thoroughly enjoy the one in Toronto... BUT.. Nobody has ANY right to force their lifestyle on others and break the Law in the process. There is more than one way to skin a cat and this is the wrong way to go about it. It does not further their cause. It puts them at a further disadvantage.. And yes.. Someone is going to get shot and all of a sudden the gays will be screaming, shaking their fists and looking about in bewilderment, declaring themselves the martyrs. Your first responsibility is to the Law. If you do not agree with the Law you fight to change it. You do not take every opportunity to break it. . Because yes, you will go to jail, you will get your head kicked in, you will get shot.. And you will have noone to blame but yourself. Sounds cold and callous, but that is just the way it is.

dcnovice -> RE: Russian Gay Pride March to Go Ahead Despite Ban (5/26/2007 10:59:29 PM)
I see your point, SirKenin, and I don't take law-breaking lightly. I think it's hard to work within the law, though, when you're up against a mayor who sees you as satanic. This may be one of those times, like the Boston Tea Party or Civil Rights marches, when one has to resort to civil disobedience.

minnetar -> RE: Russian Gay Pride March to Go Ahead Despite Ban (5/26/2007 11:34:48 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: dcnovice I see your point, SirKenin, and I don't take law-breaking lightly. I think it's hard to work within the law, though, when you're up against a mayor who sees you as satanic. This may be one of those times, like the Boston Tea Party or Civil Rights marches, when one has to resort to civil disobedience. There is alot of phobia and hate based on sexual orientation. It is based on tolerance. Hell we don't see it here on this site. minnetar

dcnovice -> RE: Russian Gay Pride March to Go Ahead Despite Ban (5/26/2007 11:36:28 PM)
quote: There is alot of phobia and hate based on sexual orientation. Too true, alas.

SirKenin -> RE: Russian Gay Pride March to Go Ahead Despite Ban (5/26/2007 11:51:50 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: dcnovice I see your point, SirKenin, and I don't take law-breaking lightly. I think it's hard to work within the law, though, when you're up against a mayor who sees you as satanic. This may be one of those times, like the Boston Tea Party or Civil Rights marches, when one has to resort to civil disobedience. Hmmm. No, there are always higher powers. I am very good at exploiting those avenues... As many people are. When you do not get what you want at one level, you escalate to the next until you do get what you want. Every boss has a boss. [;)] And this is precisely what I think the gays in Russia should do. I definitely do not think they should take it sitting down, but at the same time I should think they should utilize due process. They will be much farther ahead in the end.

NeedToUseYou -> RE: Russian Gay Pride March to Go Ahead Despite Ban (5/27/2007 12:11:00 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: SirKenin Now this bugs me. I am all for gay rights and gay parades. I thoroughly enjoy the one in Toronto... BUT.. Nobody has ANY right to force their lifestyle on others and break the Law in the process. There is more than one way to skin a cat and this is the wrong way to go about it. It does not further their cause. It puts them at a further disadvantage.. And yes.. Someone is going to get shot and all of a sudden the gays will be screaming, shaking their fists and looking about in bewilderment, declaring themselves the martyrs. Your first responsibility is to the Law. If you do not agree with the Law you fight to change it. You do not take every opportunity to break it. . Because yes, you will go to jail, you will get your head kicked in, you will get shot.. And you will have noone to blame but yourself. Sounds cold and callous, but that is just the way it is. I couldn't disagree more. A good part of the civil rights movement was based on "breaking" unjust laws. Something about sitting at the front of the bus, water fountains and such. The prerequisite seems to be non-violent law breaking of unjust laws. I'm sure you are right though in that it may boil over, but I doubt the civil rights movement would have been successful without reaching the boiling point a few times. When someone dies for doing a routine act, it does tend to make people evaluate their position. Either way, I'm sure the gay russian people are aware of the risk they are taking, and view it as an acceptable price to pay to potentially invoke a change.

Level -> RE: Russian Gay Pride March to Go Ahead Despite Ban (5/27/2007 8:15:10 AM)
MOSCOW - Russian police detained gay protesters calling for the right to hold a Gay Pride parade in central Moscow on Sunday while nationalists shouting “death to homosexuals” punched and kicked the demonstrators. Riot police detained the protesters as they tried to present a petition asking Moscow Mayor Yuri Luzhkov, who has called gay marches satanic acts, to lift a ban on the parade. http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/18892535

SirKenin -> RE: Russian Gay Pride March to Go Ahead Despite Ban (5/27/2007 8:20:46 AM)
This is certainly a matter for the Russian Courts. And I would also take it to Parliament.

pahunkboy -> RE: Russian Gay Pride March to Go Ahead Despite Ban (5/27/2007 9:25:05 AM)
i guess im glad we won the cold war.... russian culture has a shortage of men between a certain age. the woman shoulder alot of the burden. if they do get a man- often he is a drunk or a slacker. As a human being, that happens to be gay. God Bless America! ps-keep the govt OUT of ppls bedrooms!

selfbnd411 -> RE: Russian Gay Pride March to Go Ahead Despite Ban (5/27/2007 2:41:03 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: SirKenin This is certainly a matter for the Russian Courts. And I would also take it to Parliament. There is no parliament in Russia. There are no courts. Not in the Western sense of these words. Russia is a giant racketeering dictatorship with Putin as the boss. Who was it who said "I looked [Putin] in the eye. I was able to get a sense of his soul?" Oh yea, that was George W. Bush speaking about his friend Putin.

Griswold -> RE: Russian Gay Pride March to Go Ahead Despite Ban (5/27/2007 3:17:13 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: dcnovice Russia's homosexual community plans to push ahead with a gay pride march in the capital on Sunday despite opposition from city authorities and far-right extremists, an organiser said Saturday. ... Gay pride organiser Nikolai Alexeyev told journalists on Saturday that marchers would deliver a letter to Moscow Mayor Yury Luzhkov asking that the demonstration and others like it be authorised. The mayor had earlier called gay pride "the work of Satan." The march has been banned by city authorities and clashes are feared with extreme-rightists similar to those that occurred in May last year. ... At last year's parade, also held in defiance of a ban, more than 100 people were arrested and dozens of gay rights campaigners were attacked by skinheads shouting "Moscow is not Sodom." SOURCE: http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20070526/lf_afp/russiagaysdemo_070526212404 Memorial Day weekend seems a fitting time to remind myself not to take my rights (nor those who fought for them) for granted. I salute the courage of my Russian brothers and sisters. (Those fun loving crazy commies...they'll do anything for press).

Vendaval -> RE: Russian Gay Pride March to Go Ahead Despite Ban (5/27/2007 3:25:32 PM)
This also bears mentioning, click on the link at the bottom to read the full article in Wikipedia. Stonewall Riots "The Stonewall riots were a series of violent conflicts between New York City police officers and groups of gay and transgender people that began on June 28, 1969, and lasted several days. Also called the Stonewall Rebellion or simply Stonewall, the clash was a watershed for the worldwide gay rights movement, as gay and transgender people had never before acted together in such large numbers to forcibly resist police." http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stonewall_riots

pahunkboy -> RE: Russian Gay Pride March to Go Ahead Despite Ban (5/27/2007 3:33:46 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Vendaval This also bears mentioning, click on the link at the bottom to read the full article in Wikipedia. Stonewall Riots "The Stonewall riots were a series of violent conflicts between New York City police officers and groups of gay and transgender people that began on June 28, 1969, and lasted several days. Also called the Stonewall Rebellion or simply Stonewall, the clash was a watershed for the worldwide gay rights movement, as gay and transgender people had never before acted together in such large numbers to forcibly resist police." http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stonewall_riots I declare this post- as pahunkboys informal post of the day award. congrats! :-)

Vendaval -> RE: Russian Gay Pride March to Go Ahead Despite Ban (5/27/2007 3:39:30 PM)
Thank you sweetie! [sm=flowers.gif]

NorthernGent -> RE: Russian Gay Pride March to Go Ahead Despite Ban (5/27/2007 3:45:15 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: dcnovice Russia's homosexual community plans to push ahead with a gay pride march in the capital on Sunday despite opposition from city authorities and far-right extremists, an organiser said Saturday. Good luck to them. Banning people from a peaceful organised gathering isn't right. Straight people are free to go about their business and organise in large groups - football, bands, pubs etc - I don't see any difference to a gay crowd organising a parade. Same thing ain't it? Just a few more pairs of pink undercracks and leather caps :-)

selfbnd411 -> RE: Russian Gay Pride March to Go Ahead Despite Ban (5/27/2007 4:16:16 PM)
I finally remembered the word I was fishing for to describe Russia--kleptocracy [:D]

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