quote:

ORIGINAL: farglebargle

http://www.charlotte.com/171/story/101091.html

Buried down in the article.

"Sen. John Warner, R-Va., who has criticized Bush's war policy but opposed the Democratic bill as too heavy-handed, singled out one development that has stoked a more cooperative spirit on Capitol Hill: Word that the Iraqi parliament may recess for two months this summer."

WTF are we doing there protecting them, if they're so secure they can take a summer vacation break???

quote:

ORIGINAL: minnetar

lmao alot of other countries have alot more holidays (they call vacation days that) than the Americans. Look at some of the European countries such as Germany.

minnetar

quote:

ORIGINAL: farglebargle

quote:

ORIGINAL: minnetar

lmao alot of other countries have alot more holidays (they call vacation days that) than the Americans. Look at some of the European countries such as Germany.

minnetar

I do not believe you understand my complaint here.

If they do not believe their nation is in an emergency which requires THEIR full commitment, why should WE put people in harms way?

To put it another way. The Marines should surround the Iraqi Parliment, and "guard it" ensuring no-one leaves until they have their shit together.

Why should more of our troops die, and more of our money be wasted so they get 8 weeks off?

This is an insult to the sacrifice of every soldier, that they treat the situation so casually.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Sinergy

Well put, farglebargle. I agree completely.

We should tell them that since they are going on vacation, so are we.

Sinergy

quote:

ORIGINAL: farglebargle

quote:

ORIGINAL: Sinergy

Well put, farglebargle. I agree completely.

We should tell them that since they are going on vacation, so are we.

Sinergy

"Since you're going on vacation, We're going home!"

quote:

ORIGINAL: Sinergy


What is important about their Parlaiment going on vacation and our government doing nothing is that it, more than anything else, proves that the United States is in Iraq for our purposes, and we frankly dont give a rat's keister about the Iraqi government.

Not that I expect most of the pro-war crowd to see the forest for all those stupid green and brown things in the way.

Sinergy

quote:

ORIGINAL: shallowdeep

Legislative recesses are the norm in democracies, and are not by themselves an indication of laziness or lack of "resolve" as Sen. Warner suggests in his quote in the article. Take a look at the record of the US Congress' days in session ( http://thomas.loc.gov/home/ds/index.html ). You'll notice a usual month-long summer recess in August and no meetings for large portions of October-Janurary as well.

Recess is not synonymous with "vacation" when used in this sense. Recesses are intended to provide an opportunity for legislators to spend time in their district with the constituency that elected them, work on draft legislation, and, of course, campaign. Simply because incumbent elected officials aren't actively meeting for sessions in the capital doesn't mean they aren't working. The value of having legislators holed up in session for the entire year listening to long speeches in the capital is questionable. Arguments can certainly be advanced for other approaches being more productive uses of time. If the situation requires it, a scheduled recess does not preclude reconvening the legislature to deal with it.

While the value of a recess is dependent on what is done during it, it can actually play a useful role in a representative democracy of keeping the elected in touch with the districts they represent. Just something to consider...

quote:

ORIGINAL: shallowdeep

Legislative recesses are the norm in democracies, and are not by themselves an indication of laziness or lack of "resolve" as Sen. Warner suggests in his quote in the article. Take a look at the record of the US Congress' days in session: ( http://thomas.loc.gov/home/ds/index.html ). You'll notice a usual month-long summer recess in August and no meetings for large portions of October-Janurary as well.

*Edit: apparently, something in the forum parses out a Library of Congress address... For the intererested, the asterisks in the URL should be replaced with "l o c . g o v" (without the spaces... sorry for the inconvenience).

Recess is not synonymous with "vacation" when used in this sense. Recesses are intended to provide an opportunity for legislators to spend time in their district with the constituency that elected them, work on draft legislation, and, of course, campaign. Simply because incumbent elected officials aren't actively meeting for sessions in the capital doesn't mean they aren't working. The value of having legislators holed up in session for the entire year listening to long speeches in the capital is questionable. Arguments can certainly be advanced for other approaches being more productive uses of time. If the situation requires it, a scheduled recess does not preclude reconvening the legislature to deal with it.

While the value of a recess is dependent on what is done during it, it can actually play a useful role in a representative democracy of keeping the elected in touch with the districts they represent. Just something to consider...

quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne

ok lets see here...  OIL!!!!

quote:

ORIGINAL: MellowSir

Well at least they take after our gov who usually only convene for 4 months out of the year lol, democracy in action?

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ORIGINAL: farglebargle

I think you underestimate the urgency which they must accomplish the task before them, namely: Getting the Shia, Sunni, Kurd, Turk, Arab, and Persians to all put down their IEDs, sit in a big circle, pass around the hemp hookah, and fucking sing kumbaya.

quote:

ORIGINAL: shallowdeep

quote:

ORIGINAL: farglebargle

I think you underestimate the urgency which they must accomplish the task before them, namely: Getting the Shia, Sunni, Kurd, Turk, Arab, and Persians to all put down their IEDs, sit in a big circle, pass around the hemp hookah, and fucking sing kumbaya.

I don't underestimate the urgency. But I do think there is room to question whether sitting in the Green Zone in Baghdad passing legislation all year is the best approach to that task or whether spending some of that time talking with people in their district, seeing some of the problems firsthand, and convincing constituents to buy into the system may be more valuable in achieving the same task. Recesses provide an opportunity to pursue these other activities and are not "time off" but a potentially valuable component of the process to an improved situation. I don't have a strong opinion as to how much recess is appropriate or how it should be distributed, but I do think some can be useful, perhaps even necessary. Is two months all at once optimal? Quite possibly not. What I take some issue with is passing off the decision to take any recess as simple laziness/apathy on the part of the Iraqi legislators. This is not a fair characterization without knowing how they plan to spend that time.

Please note that I'm not saying that the situation in Iraq is by any means the same as in the US or other democracies. The Iraqi legislature has a much more difficult task... some would say impossible. But some of the reasons why other democracies allow for legislative recesses remain equally valid: a chance to observe and connect with their district and, hopefully, use those observations and connections to draft meaningful legislation that reflects reality and to ensure that the legislation meets with some local support if it is passed is quite valuable.

In short, while there are good arguments for US withdrawal I don't think that news that the Iraqi legislature is considering a two month recess ranks among them. You are more than welcome to disagree.

quote:

ORIGINAL: shallowdeep

quote:

ORIGINAL: farglebargle

I think you underestimate the urgency which they must accomplish the task before them, namely: Getting the Shia, Sunni, Kurd, Turk, Arab, and Persians to all put down their IEDs, sit in a big circle, pass around the hemp hookah, and fucking sing kumbaya.

I don't underestimate the urgency. But I do think there is room to question whether sitting in the Green Zone in Baghdad passing legislation all year is the best approach to that task or whether spending some of that time talking with people in their district, seeing some of the problems firsthand,