So we'd like some advice (Full Version)

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Plethora22 -> So we'd like some advice (4/19/2007 6:45:38 AM)

My Mistress and I have recently made a transition from a more vanilla relationship to a more D/s style one.  This wasn't a sudden drastic thing, but we recently eliminated a number of "vanilla" practices in our relationship... just as an example until a few months ago we shared our household chores more or less equally, now I am responsible for all of them and am punished when they are not completed in a timely manner.

The problem is, I work a full time job and am also in college pursuing my Master's degree.  Most of the time, I am able to get the chores done in a timely manner and everyone is happy... some of the time, I am seriously not able.  She and I have discussed the situation some, and the ultimate problem here isn't that she doesn't understand my lack of time or anything like that, but that she really has no way of figuring out when I am positively tapped from school and work, and when I am just being lazy (which is known to happen from time to time). 

We have decided that, as appealing as it sometimes sounds to me, it would be a bad move to just assume I am always being lazy and punishing me accordingly, because that would most likely result in my prioritizing chores ahead of schoolwork, which is nothing either of us wants to happen.  However, though it hasn't happened yet, I can see myself slacking off hardcore and just blaming it on a lack of time.

Thus we just thought we would throw the topic out there, and see if anyone has experience with this sort of situation, and if there is any kind of a practical solution that anyone can come up with. 

-Charlie



mp072004 -> RE: So we'd like some advice (4/19/2007 6:57:15 AM)

Do you keep a schedule or diary? If not, I would advise you to start planning your days more explicitly. You likely have some idea of when you'll have particularly busy times in school and work, yes? There might be a week when you have an exam or a paper, or when a work project is drawing to a close. You can then communicate that instead of ten hours daily on school and work, you'll need to spend twelve hours this week. This would insulate against laziness, and fabricated overworking, but it might also have the bonus effect that you'll find that you have extra time and will be able to fulfill more of your obligations than you had expected. You might also note the variation between planned duration of an activity and actual duration of an activity--for example, if you planned that your coursework would take two hours, and it only took an hour and a half, then note that, plan to take only an hour and a half for similar future assignments, and use the remaining half hour productively.

Also, on the worry that the threat of punishment might cause you to neglect school and work for chores, couldn't you be punished for poor performance in school and work, too?

Monica



gypsygrl -> RE: So we'd like some advice (4/19/2007 7:04:23 AM)

I have to decide this question for myself all the time, though it hasn't been an issue in any relationship I've been in.  Basically, I question whether or not I'm rationalizing not cleaning the bathroom, or really am just am too busy with other important things.  At the end of the day, sometimes I feel bad for not having gotten more stuff done and cant always remember what I've done. 

When this goes on too long, I start logging my activities.  I just keep track of everything I do, and that way I have a good judge of how I'm spending my time so I can decide if I'm being lazy.  It makes things a little more objective.



LuckyAlbatross -> RE: So we'd like some advice (4/19/2007 7:13:27 AM)

I usually ask permission for an extension ahead of time.  It shows I'm aware of my duties, aware of my time management, and aware of the authority dynamic.  If I can present a reasonable set of circumstances showing why I want to delay doing house chores to get ready for a class, it's up to them to decide.  If they decide doing chores is more important, then they have told me that they don't mind if I get a lower grade in the class. 

Now I know more of where their priorities are, and they made an informed choice.



toservez -> RE: So we'd like some advice (4/19/2007 7:34:53 AM)

Chores assigned and expected to be done in a certain time frame need to be realistically feasible for success and this also goes to when to punish or not.

I think it is good that both of you are discussing the situation and are moving from the just punish no matter the reason because in my opinion something like that could cause damage in the long run.

Communication is critical, try talking to each other ahead of time so instead of blanket orders they can be more customized to fit your schedule/energy level for that day. For example if tomorrow is clean the house and you have to work a full day and have a big test or paper due the next day both of you can be on the same page and let the cleaning go for a day or two.

If you are prone to make excuses to get out of things, then you need to work on not doing that with her. In order for her to punish you properly some consistency from your actions would be very helpful. She does need to learn you and not just be black and white because of your full load, but both of you need to work on it.



SimplyMichael -> RE: So we'd like some advice (4/19/2007 7:52:22 AM)

What LA said!

This is communication 101. You need to empower your dominant with the information she needs in order to make effective, practical, and nurturing decisions for you.  Give her that and she will succeed.  Sounds like you two have something really good, best of luck with it.

Edited to add:  Doing what either of you are attempting to do is harder than it sounds.  Give yourselves permission to screw up.  Punishment isn't as productive as reward and unless quite creative takes up additional time.  Finishing on time results in play/pleasure/fun.  Not finishing requires finishing...not fun.  But again, don't think this is easy, this is a hard thing to get right and one only gains the experience to do it by doing it badly first!



crouchingtigress -> RE: So we'd like some advice (4/19/2007 8:37:06 AM)

 
being lazy is self indulgent behavior that stems from the feeling that you deserve to take a break, you have earned it, ect.
also the body needs to un wind...the ocean ebbs and flows, the moon waxes and wanes everything in life breathes in and out...you do yourself a dis-service to label your behavior as lazy because there is a negative connotation associated with that word that reinforces low self esteem and yet all you are doing is trying to decompress....tv, video games, reading a book, sleeping what have you...all a way to put you mind on "zone"


you feel you have earned the right to chill...and guess what? you are 100 percent right!

but being "lazy" is the passive (maybe a tad aggressive) way to honor yourself and and be indulgent....but its never enough because you never feel totally rested and you never feel totally vindicated...because there is this guilt that you are stealing the rest or the zone out activity instead of having earned it

my thoughts are, plan to indulge yourself and plan it well....if you like hiking then plan a hike every week for 2 hours..if you like gaming plan that too....this way you know there is reward coming.....you know that you are honoring yourself and all the hard work you do...and by taking care of yourself you are also fortifying and honoring your relationship as well.

and i would not just do it once a week, i would plan on it every day, something indulgent something wonderful...and make sure you are gettiing enough sleep and good food....and your drive to be lazy will not be as strong.



juliaoceania -> RE: So we'd like some advice (4/19/2007 8:56:25 AM)

Ok.. here it is

40hrs a week for work

depending on your class load lets say about 20 hours a week for classes

that adds up to 60 hours

Lets say you rest at least 6 hours a night

that is over 100 hours.

Lets say 10 hours a week on personal hygene

110 hours

How long is your commute time? Some people spend up to 10 hours a week in their car (some more)

That adds up to 120 hours

Now add up all the hours in a week. There are 168. There are only about 48 hours left. Now I was conservative in my time allowances. If you sleep more, or go to school more or commute more... that 48 hours just disappeared. Do you have friends? How about commitments outside of class academically (I know I had a few). Do you get leisure time? Do you get time with family? Do you get time with your Mistress?

I am just saying that perhaps what you perceive as laziness is just the human equivalent of regrouping and rest... Most people I know need time to do that, but not all. Maybe you could hire someone to pick up the slack if both of you are too busy to do this housework.

In my eyes anyone that works fulltime and goes to school is not lazy.. but that is just my opinion



M1stressM1na -> RE: So we'd like some advice (4/19/2007 9:01:03 AM)

I teach  4 days a week..and goto law school 1 day plus 2 night schools a week plus look after home and kids.

Thank god for pro plus and caffeine!

Oh and its exam time coming up too ARRRGGGHHHHHH



hisannabelle -> RE: So we'd like some advice (4/19/2007 9:08:34 AM)

greetings plethora,

i totally agree with the idea of keeping a schedule or diary. really, this is a matter of personal responsibility, though...i think it's important to be honest with her about your reasons for doing what you're doing, because if you slack off in this area and lie and say it's because of time constraints, then to me that's saying that it's acceptable to lie to your mistress, when it's not, and could cause problems in other areas.

i also would suggest planning time for laziness. i work full time and go to school full time as well, and one of the biggest things i have learned is the importance of planning me time. He encourages that also. i am not responsible for chores at His place mainly because He enjoys doing housework and accepts that i'm insanely busy and stressed a lot of the time - it may be that this situation just doesn't work, and perhaps you should only be responsible for a portion of the chores, or something like that. i would recommend going back and adding in me time and then keeping a schedule for a few weeks, keeping track of when you are able to finish the chores comfortably within your time frame and when you are overwhelmed because of lack of time.

good luck!

annabelle.



thetammyjo -> RE: So we'd like some advice (4/19/2007 9:16:57 AM)

Try scheduling the chores. Daily, Weekly, Biweekly, and Monthly.

Sit down with your mistress and tell her about your day to need requirements of work and college. Factor in those times when you make your schedule. Be realistic here, you have a limited number of hours every day.

You both might discover that as lovely the thought is of you doing all three things (work, school, and all chores) that it is not reasonable or possible. Then you'll need to decide what has priority and how to deal with it.

One example might be that she takes on a few less odious tasks again. Doing chores does not make one less dominant or less a master, in fact, it demonstrates that you are not dependent upon your sub or slave adn that you are allowing them to serve you in ways that you choose.

Another example might be to reconsider the job. If you are both serious you might consider not working and just focusing on her and school. That requires a commitment from her then to support you both and from you to not spend money without explicit consent so that finances do not become a problem.

Sadly you might have to consider going to school part-time or reassessing how many classes you are taking a semester. A lot of grad students (and I am one) think they can take a similar number of classes as they did during their undergraduate years. You can but then you might as well kiss relationships and work good bye or find your stress level high and the quality of your academic work low. Remember a grad level class is worth about 2 undergraduates ones in terms of reading load and writing/research load. So if you took 5 classes a semester as an undergraduate, you probably should stick to only 2 or 3 as a grad student.

In other words, both of you will need to make adjustments if you want this to work out well in the long term.



losttreasure -> RE: So we'd like some advice (4/19/2007 10:04:20 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania

Ok.. here it is

40hrs a week for work

depending on your class load lets say about 20 hours a week for classes

that adds up to 60 hours

Lets say you rest at least 6 hours a night

that is over 100 hours.

Lets say 10 hours a week on personal hygene

110 hours

How long is your commute time? Some people spend up to 10 hours a week in their car (some more)

That adds up to 120 hours

Now add up all the hours in a week. There are 168. There are only about 48 hours left. Now I was conservative in my time allowances. If you sleep more, or go to school more or commute more... that 48 hours just disappeared. Do you have friends? How about commitments outside of class academically (I know I had a few). Do you get leisure time? Do you get time with family? Do you get time with your Mistress?

I am just saying that perhaps what you perceive as laziness is just the human equivalent of regrouping and rest... Most people I know need time to do that, but not all. Maybe you could hire someone to pick up the slack if both of you are too busy to do this housework.

In my eyes anyone that works fulltime and goes to school is not lazy.. but that is just my opinion


Good point.  There's another 13 hours or so in there that you've forgotten about, too.  While a full-time job might get paid for 40 hours, most people work nine hours a day with an hour allocated for lunch.  That's another 5 hours.  Which brings up meals... figuring three meals per day (2 during the work week as one would already be consumed during the additional hour at work) and assuming at least a half an hour for each meal, you can add another 8 hours.



MasterFireMaam -> RE: So we'd like some advice (4/19/2007 10:16:16 AM)

She needs to be more aware of your schedule and time commitments. You need to make sure you're being trustworthy. A calendar on the frig might help.

Master Fire



Pixifer -> RE: So we'd like some advice (4/19/2007 3:17:07 PM)

I have tried to pin him to a schedule, but I fear the retail schedule makes for an all to easy out for not keeping up on it. 

As for myself, I am getting frustrated with having my orders not being completed, and trying to walk the fine line between reasonable, and pushover. Of course, there is also the acting up for extra severe punishment question is also tricky to navigate. I don't want my orders ignored or to be viewed as suggestions, but at the same time I also want to remain reasonable. 

There needs to be an owner's manual written up.......(sorry, but this just amused me, and is a accurate description on many levels)


Thank you for your feedback,  there are a few ideas that we will give a try, and of course thank you for the support.

Will keep you posted, in case this helps others,

M



simplyangelic1 -> RE: So we'd like some advice (4/19/2007 3:39:35 PM)

I am the world's worst at wanting to clean house.  I hate the task and have been known to put it off as much as possible.  The problem with this is that by the time I get around to the task it's much larger and take more time than if I had taken 15-20 mins a day to pick up around the house.  Something I have done with success is take a few minutes each day to "straighten up" around the house, put things away when you are done using them and just doing a quick walk through the house just before you go to bed at night.  It helps keep things neat and when you do have the time for more intense cleaning or chore, the job isn't as large as if you had put all those things off.

Maybe you could talk with your Mistress about maybe sharing the task of straightening up at the end of the day or she pick up while you do laundry or dishes, you know the heavier tasks.  That way you are not so overwhelmed some days and chores get done in a timely manner.

I think a chore journal would be a good option if you have the time to spend doing it.  But if you have days when it's hard to do the chores, where do you find the time to write about doing the chore?



Noah -> RE: So we'd like some advice (4/19/2007 5:42:46 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Plethora22
... but that she really has no way of figuring out when I am positively tapped from school and work, and when I am just being lazy (which is known to happen from time to time).  ...


If you were my submissive and I couldn't, in a given instance, figure out the question at issue, I would ask you: "Was it beyond you, given the circumstances; were you lazy; or is there some other explanation?"

Furthermore, if you were my submissive you would reply with all the self-awareness and candor that you could muster.

I wouldn't presume that in every case you were perfectly forthcoming, or even perfectly honest with yourself, because you're human.

But, frankly, I'd expect you to come pretty close right from the start and to strive toward greater self awareness and complete candor as we went along. I'd be gratified by your trust and your effort, and in ways I thought appropriate I'd let you know that.

Actively acknowledging my fallibility as well as yours (props to your boss for explicitly acknowledging her own, by the way), we'd take it from there.




As for your efforts at improvement, here's a scenario you can picture, if you'd like.

You're with her on the evening of a day when laziness very much wanted to rule you but where that would have in truth been shirking rather than warranted rest. You find yourself in a position to say to her, in complete candor and humility--not at all as a boast nor with the least bit of simpering:

"Today was difficult, that insidious kind of difficulty which seems to drain me from inside rather than throw up obstacles. I didn't think I could prevail, but I eventually I found that I could, for you. Thank you."



Best of luck to you both, and do get some rest, stop and smell the roses, etc.




Slavetrainer2007 -> RE: So we'd like some advice (4/19/2007 6:47:41 PM)

I would have to agree with some type of scheduling here. Everyone needs time to relax.

My slave is expected to take care of an infant plus keep the house in order plus do some work. However her job and chores are flexible with me because the baby is not. I dont press  chores or working( which is a flexible job) if the baby is being  a handful. I also , to a degree, let her decide how much off time she needs.

Since things tend to come up , things dont go as planned, etc.  their is a need to be flexible. As a dom, i will still do housework( and i work 40 plus hours a week not including commute) , cook, and take care of the baby as needed. This doesnt make me feel any less like a dom or that she is failing me. Only that we need to work  togather to get  done what is needed to get done so we both get R&R time.



CuriousLord -> RE: So we'd like some advice (4/19/2007 6:58:19 PM)

Schoolwork takes a -lot- of time.  I probably spend less than two hours doing work on a typical week.  I do, however, spend most of the time reviewing the thoughts and apothems in my head, beating them in.
My majors aren't very writing intensive.  I don't require a lot of time typing.  I can do my thinking while doing other things.  If yours are, though, it's easy to see why you'd be short on time.

In the end, this is our pleasure.  I'm all about the future.  I think a good relationship is important for it, as is a good education and career.  To be set for later lfie.  I wouldn't let either suffocate the other.  BDSM takes considerably more time than most relationships.  Sometimes, it needs to go on the back burner.



simplyangelic1 -> RE: So we'd like some advice (4/19/2007 7:01:14 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Slavetrainer2007

I would have to agree with some type of scheduling here. Everyone needs time to relax.

My slave is expected to take care of an infant plus keep the house in order plus do some work. However her job and chores are flexible with me because the baby is not. I dont press  chores or working( which is a flexible job) if the baby is being  a handful. I also , to a degree, let her decide how much off time she needs.

Since things tend to come up , things dont go as planned, etc.  their is a need to be flexible. As a dom, i will still do housework( and i work 40 plus hours a week not including commute) , cook, and take care of the baby as needed. This doesnt make me feel any less like a dom or that she is failing me. Only that we need to work  togather to get  done what is needed to get done so we both get R&R time.


Exactly.  It does take both parties working together to make things work. No matter if it's housework or the relationship in general.



MasterFireMaam -> RE: So we'd like some advice (4/19/2007 7:02:07 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Pixifer

I have tried to pin him to a schedule, but I fear the retail schedule makes for an all to easy out for not keeping up on it. 

As for myself, I am getting frustrated with having my orders not being completed, and trying to walk the fine line between reasonable, and pushover. Of course, there is also the acting up for extra severe punishment question is also tricky to navigate. I don't want my orders ignored or to be viewed as suggestions, but at the same time I also want to remain reasonable. 


In my opinion, he either wants to serve or he doesn't. If he does, and he does well, reward him. If he doesn't, ignore him. Postive reinforcement is, in a lot of ways, more powerful than punishment. If you use positive, then you don't have to worry that he's going to act up to get attention. He'll have to do WELL to get attention.

quote:

There needs to be an owner's manual written up.......(sorry, but this just amused me, and is a accurate description on many levels)



Absolute shameless plug....Write your own. I think this will help. Manual Creation.

Master Fire



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