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RNC/White House Secret Email System Backfires... - 4/9/2007 8:28:22 AM   
farglebargle


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http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/world/la-na-laptops9apr09,0,4563806.story?coll=la-home-headlines

quote:


GOP-issued laptops now a White House headache
Democrats say a private e-mail system was used in violation of federal rules.
By Tom Hamburger, Times Staff Writer
April 9, 2007

WASHINGTON — When Karl Rove and his top deputies arrived at the White House in 2001, the Republican National Committee provided them with laptop computers and other communication devices to be used alongside their government-issued equipment.


_____________________________

It's not every generation that gets to watch a civilization fall. Looks like we're in for a hell of a show.

ברוך אתה, אדוני אלוקינו, ריבון העולמים, מי יוצר צמחים ריחניים
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RE: RNC/White House Secret Email System Backfires... - 4/9/2007 9:06:47 AM   
pahunkboy


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From: Central Pennsylvania
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secret emaits. chatlogs.  well-it is very easy to see the contexxxt out of whack

(in reply to farglebargle)
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RE: RNC/White House Secret Email System Backfires... - 4/9/2007 9:13:46 AM   
puella


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Seems like a fair enough request to me.... they have had unfettered access into the personal emails, phone records and mail of US Citizens for a long time now.. turn about and all that.

_____________________________

We must move forward, not backward, upward, not forward, and always twirling, twirling, twirling towards freedom...... The Simpsons

War is God's way of teaching Americans geography." ...Ambrose Bierce

"Don't you oppress me!"....Stan/Loretta

(in reply to farglebargle)
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RE: RNC/White House Secret Email System Backfires... - 4/9/2007 11:11:17 AM   
Sanity


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From: Nampa, Idaho USA
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You've been hunting those wascawwy wabbits for a SO long now, Elmer. Do you think you're really going to get them this time...

All comedy aside, these perpetual politically motivated witch-hunt "investigations" & prosecutions are pure BS

Doesn't Congress have any real work to do

(in reply to farglebargle)
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RE: RNC/White House Secret Email System Backfires... - 4/9/2007 11:57:44 AM   
farglebargle


Posts: 10715
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From: Albany, NY
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quote:


All comedy aside, these perpetual politically motivated witch-hunt "investigations" & prosecutions are pure BS


It's sad to see so little respect for the Law. The White House computer network and affiliated websites, e-mail accounts, backups and archives are the property of the United States, as required by the Presidential Records Act.

(1) The term “documentary material” means all books, correspondence, memorandums, documents, papers, pamphlets, works of art, models, pictures, photographs, plats, maps, films, and motion pictures, including, but not limited to, audio, audiovisual, or other electronic or mechanical recordations.
(2) The term “Presidential records” means documentary materials, or any reasonably seg­regable portion thereof, created or received by the President, his immediate staff, or a unit or individual of the Executive Office of the President whose function is to advise and assist the President, in the course of conducting activities which relate to or have an effect upon the carrying out of the constitutional, statutory, or other official or ceremonial duties of the President. Such term—
(A) includes any documentary materials relating to the political activities of the President or members of his staff, but only if such activities relate to or have a direct effect upon the carrying out of constitutional, statutory, or other official or ceremonial duties of the President; but
(B) does not include any documentary materials that are
(i) official records of an agency (as defined in section 552 (e) [1] of title 5, United States Code);
(ii) personal records;
(iii) stocks of publications and stationery; or
(iv) extra copies of documents produced only for convenience of reference, when such copies are clearly so identified.
(3) The term “personal records” means all documentary  materials,  or  any  reasonably segregable portion therof,[2] of a purely private or nonpublic character which do not relate to or have an effect upon the carrying out of the constitutional, statutory, or other official or ceremonial duties of the President. Such term includes—
(A) diaries, journals, or other personal notes serving as the functional equivalent of a diary or journal which are not prepared or utilized for, or circulated or communicated in the course of, transacting Government business;
(B) materials relating to private political associations, and having no relation to or direct effect upon the carrying out of constitutional, statutory, or other official or ceremonial duties of the President; and
(C) materials relating exclusively to the President’s own election to the office of the Presidency; and materials directly relating to the election of a particular individual or individuals to Federal, State, or local office, which have no relation to or direct effect upon the carrying out of constitutional, statutory, or other official or ceremonial duties of the President.
(4) The term “Archivist” means the Archivist of the United States.
(5) The term “former President”, when used with respect to Presidential records, means the former President during whose term or terms of office such Presidential rec­ords were created.

So, since the e-mails sent "Out of band" were related to the operations of the DOJ, ( at least in THIS demonstrable case ) then there is yet again a clear violation of the oath the "Faithfully Execute The Laws".



< Message edited by farglebargle -- 4/9/2007 12:03:15 PM >


_____________________________

It's not every generation that gets to watch a civilization fall. Looks like we're in for a hell of a show.

ברוך אתה, אדוני אלוקינו, ריבון העולמים, מי יוצר צמחים ריחניים

(in reply to Sanity)
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RE: RNC/White House Secret Email System Backfires... - 4/9/2007 12:14:44 PM   
Sanity


Posts: 22039
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From: Nampa, Idaho USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: farglebargle

quote:


All comedy aside, these perpetual politically motivated witch-hunt "investigations" & prosecutions are pure BS


It's sad to see so little respect for the Law. The White House computer network and affiliated websites, e-mail accounts, backups and archives are the property of the United States, as required by the Presidential Records Act.

(1) The term “documentary material” means all books, correspondence, memorandums, documents, papers, pamphlets, works of art, models, pictures, photographs, plats, maps, films, and motion pictures, including, but not limited to, audio, audiovisual, or other electronic or mechanical recordations.
(2) The term “Presidential records” means documentary materials, or any reasonably seg­regable portion thereof, created or received by the President, his immediate staff, or a unit or individual of the Executive Office of the President whose function is to advise and assist the President, in the course of conducting activities which relate to or have an effect upon the carrying out of the constitutional, statutory, or other official or ceremonial duties of the President. Such term—
(A) includes any documentary materials relating to the political activities of the President or members of his staff, but only if such activities relate to or have a direct effect upon the carrying out of constitutional, statutory, or other official or ceremonial duties of the President; but
(B) does not include any documentary materials that are
(i) official records of an agency (as defined in section 552 (e) [1] of title 5, United States Code);
(ii) personal records;
(iii) stocks of publications and stationery; or
(iv) extra copies of documents produced only for convenience of reference, when such copies are clearly so identified.
(3) The term “personal records” means all documentary  materials,  or  any  reasonably segregable portion therof,[2] of a purely private or nonpublic character which do not relate to or have an effect upon the carrying out of the constitutional, statutory, or other official or ceremonial duties of the President. Such term includes—
(A) diaries, journals, or other personal notes serving as the functional equivalent of a diary or journal which are not prepared or utilized for, or circulated or communicated in the course of, transacting Government business;
(B) materials relating to private political associations, and having no relation to or direct effect upon the carrying out of constitutional, statutory, or other official or ceremonial duties of the President; and
(C) materials relating exclusively to the President’s own election to the office of the Presidency; and materials directly relating to the election of a particular individual or individuals to Federal, State, or local office, which have no relation to or direct effect upon the carrying out of constitutional, statutory, or other official or ceremonial duties of the President.
(4) The term “Archivist” means the Archivist of the United States.
(5) The term “former President”, when used with respect to Presidential records, means the former President during whose term or terms of office such Presidential rec­ords were created.

So, since the e-mails sent "Out of band" were related to the operations of the DOJ, ( at least in THIS demonstrable case ) then there is yet again a clear violation of the oath the "Faithfully Execute The Laws".




Could you imagine George Washington or Abraham Lincoln trying to operate under these conditions? Congress demands written records of every single conversation ever made so they can endlessly investigate you for partisan gain... Why in the name of DOG would anyone run for President these days.

< Message edited by Sanity -- 4/9/2007 12:16:14 PM >

(in reply to farglebargle)
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RE: RNC/White House Secret Email System Backfires... - 4/9/2007 12:22:35 PM   
farglebargle


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From: Albany, NY
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"Could you imagine George Washington or Abraham Lincoln trying to operate under these conditions? Congress demands written records of every single conversation ever made so they can endlessly investigate you for partisan gain... Why in the name of DOG would anyone run for President these days."

I imagine, well in Washington's case, that the Federal Government wasn't involved in so many unconstitutional tasks.

Lincoln just appointed his own fake Congress to rubberstamp whatever decrees he sent down. It's been pretty much downhill from there.

If you have a problem with the Presidential Records Act, then take it up with the Legislature. Bush didn't get any options when he swore to G-d to he would "faithfully execute the office of President of the United States; and will, to the best of my ability, preserve, protect and defend, the Constitution of the United States."

He gets to enforce and obey The Law as dictated to him by The People via their reps in Congress. Period.

If he doesn't like the RESPONSIBILITY that goes along with the job, he can resign.


_____________________________

It's not every generation that gets to watch a civilization fall. Looks like we're in for a hell of a show.

ברוך אתה, אדוני אלוקינו, ריבון העולמים, מי יוצר צמחים ריחניים

(in reply to Sanity)
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RE: RNC/White House Secret Email System Backfires... - 4/9/2007 1:13:54 PM   
Sanity


Posts: 22039
Joined: 6/14/2006
From: Nampa, Idaho USA
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quote:

ORIGINAL: farglebargle

Period.


Try again.

If I don't like it I'll just sit here on my ass and laugh at everyone who wonders why John Kerry and Al Gore are the highest caliber people that can be mustered to try and FAIL to beat George W. Bush


(in reply to farglebargle)
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RE: RNC/White House Secret Email System Backfires... - 4/9/2007 1:17:08 PM   
farglebargle


Posts: 10715
Joined: 6/15/2005
From: Albany, NY
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"Try again. "

Well, who could expect anything more from someone with such contempt for The Constitution and Laws?



_____________________________

It's not every generation that gets to watch a civilization fall. Looks like we're in for a hell of a show.

ברוך אתה, אדוני אלוקינו, ריבון העולמים, מי יוצר צמחים ריחניים

(in reply to Sanity)
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RE: RNC/White House Secret Email System Backfires... - 4/9/2007 1:17:42 PM   
Sanity


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From: Nampa, Idaho USA
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It's gotten so insane. Here's another good example. besides the ones you so helpfully provide, farglebargle. Looks like Obama need to go to jail - he had a forbidden MEETING

http://www.drudgereport.com/flash2.htm

(in reply to farglebargle)
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RE: RNC/White House Secret Email System Backfires... - 4/9/2007 2:14:06 PM   
farglebargle


Posts: 10715
Joined: 6/15/2005
From: Albany, NY
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Even Drudge needed to disclaim that it was perhaps a legit event. And given Drudge's track record, that's a hell of a disclaimer. Is that the best they could come up with to counter this?

Pretty lame.

<pasted content containing numerous email addresses and telephone numbers removed>

Why is the White House's Deputy Political Director using PRIVATE email services to conduct the lawful business of his office? Tsk, Tsk.

Guess Bush was lying also when he promised to return "Honesty and Integrity" to the White House, eh? Just one lie of an uncountable number at this time, sadly.

< Message edited by ModeratorEleven -- 4/9/2007 3:00:07 PM >


_____________________________

It's not every generation that gets to watch a civilization fall. Looks like we're in for a hell of a show.

ברוך אתה, אדוני אלוקינו, ריבון העולמים, מי יוצר צמחים ריחניים

(in reply to Sanity)
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RE: RNC/White House Secret Email System Backfires... - 4/9/2007 2:38:27 PM   
Termyn8or


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If you elect me, EVERY thing I do in my official capacity will be public. Actrually I won't even use email.

When a lobbyist comes to me I will make it public what he wants. I'll have a poll. Everything lobbyists lobby for isn't bad, but they might just want their company to get the contract.

Everyone who contributes to my campaign will also be in the light of day, and any of them who asks for anything had better realize, there are no secrets. You want to see true representation, actually in the form of leadership ?

If I were President Ron Paul would be Vicepresident, and most likely my most trusted advisor. You would see some trouble.

President too powerful because of executive orders ? How about MY executive orders, Any person who violates Citizens' Constitutional rights is subject to the death penalty. Any person who steals the public money shall be imprisoned.

Notice I didn't say for how long. They would be in prison until all the money is paid back with interest.

They know what that means. That means the gravy train is over. Unfortunately there would be alot of unhappy people. Most government workers would be out of a job, there would be no ATF, no DOT, no IRS, no fed. The FBI would again be prohibited fom carrying firearms on the job, but they can in their off time. Bush and Cheney would be executed for high treason.

Lobbyists would lose their position, bigtime. Their activities would be public, and if they try to conceal it, that is treason, whackem. What is left of the FBI would enforce a tax on businesses which would be flat rate.  There would be no personal income tax.

We would gradually wean ourself off this fiat currency. The media would be controlled, but not by who it is controlled by now. The FCC's SWAT team would also be dismantled.

Instead of mandating that regular TV stop being broadcast at a certain date, it would be mandatory to put newscasts and a few other things on regular TV, and every station would have to prove they are operating in the public interest, and dissenting opinions are aired. Right now the government considers 'in the public interest' to mean to help the government.

Even Ron Paul wouldn't go this far. But I would.

I would go to Iraq and find the leaders of all these factions who want to have a civil war. I would split up the country, clean up as much as possible, leave them with a bunch of money and GTFO. Similarly, all bases around the globe would eventually be closed.

Our money would be worthless overseas, so we would have to learn to become again self sufficient. Gone are the cheap bigscreen TVs and SUVs. Gone are the $39 microwave ovens. Gone gone gone, ALOT of things.

The question is, are you ready for a world like that ? A return to sanity ? Can you handle it, are you ready for a life with less luxury ?

Can you fish, hunt, cook ? Are you ready for my EO forbidding states from requiring licenses for just about anything ? That means hunting, fishing, driving, operating a small business and so forth.

Are you ready to really be free ? Because freedom doesn't mean you can just do anything, YOU are responsible for feeding yourself and your children. The government will not step in to stop you nor to help you.

Are you ready for that ?

T

(in reply to Sanity)
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RE: RNC/White House Secret Email System Backfires... - 4/11/2007 9:10:58 PM   
farglebargle


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From: Albany, NY
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The fallout continues:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/04/11/AR2007041102167.html

White House E-Mail Lost in Private Accounts
Messages May Have Included Discussions About Firing of Eight Prosecutors

By Michael Abramowitz and Dan Eggen
Washington Post Staff Writers
Thursday, April 12, 2007; Page A04

The White House acknowledged yesterday that e-mails dealing with official government business may have been lost because they were improperly sent through private accounts intended to be used for political activities. Democrats have been seeking such missives as part of an investigation into the firing of eight U.S. attorneys.

_____________________________

It's not every generation that gets to watch a civilization fall. Looks like we're in for a hell of a show.

ברוך אתה, אדוני אלוקינו, ריבון העולמים, מי יוצר צמחים ריחניים

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RE: RNC/White House Secret Email System Backfires... - 4/11/2007 9:12:38 PM   
minnetar


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this girl finds the whole situation amusing

minnetar

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RE: RNC/White House Secret Email System Backfires... - 4/11/2007 9:15:17 PM   
cyberdude611


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So it is illegal for the President to have a Hotmail or Yahoo account? I know that's not exactly what happened here, but I mean I never thought it was illegal that a president can't have a private email address.

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RE: RNC/White House Secret Email System Backfires... - 4/11/2007 9:17:35 PM   
minnetar


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this girl thinks this was done to circumvent any congressional oversight.

minnetar

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RE: RNC/White House Secret Email System Backfires... - 4/11/2007 9:53:29 PM   
Sinergy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity

Doesn't Congress have any real work to do



They have not done any the last 6 years, I can understand your concern.

Sinergy

_____________________________

"There is a fine line between clever and stupid"
David St. Hubbins "This Is Spinal Tap"

"Every so often you let a word or phrase out and you want to catch it and bring it back. You cant do that, it is gone, gone forever." J. Danforth Quayle


(in reply to Sanity)
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RE: RNC/White House Secret Email System Backfires... - 4/11/2007 9:55:49 PM   
Sinergy


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I seem to recall some issue with Nixon and the Republicans...

Something about recording conversations where illegal activities were discussed...

Sinergy



_____________________________

"There is a fine line between clever and stupid"
David St. Hubbins "This Is Spinal Tap"

"Every so often you let a word or phrase out and you want to catch it and bring it back. You cant do that, it is gone, gone forever." J. Danforth Quayle


(in reply to farglebargle)
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RE: RNC/White House Secret Email System Backfires... - 4/11/2007 10:05:11 PM   
dcnovice


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quote:

So it is illegal for the President to have a Hotmail or Yahoo account? I know that's not exactly what happened here, but I mean I never thought it was illegal that a president can't have a private email address.


Try [email protected].

_____________________________

No matter how cynical you become,
it's never enough to keep up.

JANE WAGNER, THE SEARCH FOR SIGNS OF
INTELLIGENT LIFE IN THE UNIVERSE

(in reply to cyberdude611)
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RE: RNC/White House Secret Email System Backfires... - 4/12/2007 2:32:29 PM   
farglebargle


Posts: 10715
Joined: 6/15/2005
From: Albany, NY
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Just to take a quick survey: Among the IT people around, given rotated backups, RAID, Multiple copies in subfolders, etc. Do emails ever go away?

_____________________________

It's not every generation that gets to watch a civilization fall. Looks like we're in for a hell of a show.

ברוך אתה, אדוני אלוקינו, ריבון העולמים, מי יוצר צמחים ריחניים

(in reply to dcnovice)
Profile   Post #: 20
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