Questions that I know many people will be piss off about

Questions that I know many people will be piss off about (Full Version)

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Shylahgirl -> Questions that I know many people will be piss off about (3/8/2007 9:13:28 AM)
I love my lifestyle. I am a 24/7 submissive and very proud of it. I have served Master for a year and four months. I love to play and have fun. I am young but very experienced for my age. I feel, and this is my personal opinion, that BDSM and in particular D/s is very spiritual for those involved. BDSM is about finding the joy in life and living life. (Once again my opinion) <--- Why do I feel that I have to state that? After talking to several people and messaging back and forth with a few in some posts I have done, I've gotten the impression that a lot of people take the lifestyle and themselves way to seriously. Why is that? Such as that obvious opinion of some of, “That’s not my opinion or experience, so it can be right. I must do all I can to change this persons opinion so that they understand the ‘true’ way to do it” Why? I have not had as many experiences as some and I have had more experiences then others. But I wonder why when someone states what they believe about the lifestyle the way they live it there always has to be someone to point out what is wrong about what they said or how they said it, example: “If you’re a ‘real slave/sub’ you wouldn’t talk about this’” What is a “real slave/submissive” and what is a real “Master/Mistress”? What is the one thing that any “true slave/submissive” has that makes them a”true” what ever? What is a “true Master/Mistress” what makes them a “true” whatever? Why is it that some people in the lifestyle can’t seem to let others shear there personal opinions or thoughts/feelings with out coming back with how what they are stating is wrong? Why must there be this attitude that one way of learning or training is superior to the other? When I see these things it makes me sad that we have to be so sepret and yet still we clam the label of a community, when we can’t even let other members of the community shear what they believe with out at least one person making a personal attack? I know I will get shit for this. But once again I will state these are my personal thoughts and observations. I may be wrong, I may be right, but I hope I’m wrong. Shylah

moki1984 -> RE: Questions that I know many people will be piss off about (3/8/2007 9:17:14 AM)
I do not understand why you question yourself so much. Whatyou say is true....just because someone does not share your experiences of views does not make them right or you right. No matter if we are sub or dom we are humans who will make our own conclusions and emotions about life. Much of life is perspective and that is solely upon you to decide how you view anything and everything. If you enjoy who you are and how you are, then more power to you. Life your life how you see fit and dont let others telling you "oh your not a good sub...or thats not right" affect you. I know one dom who hates it when a woman calls him sir or master etc...he wants them to call him by his name and feel open to be themself although submitting to him...yes many many doms would hate that and say it was undeserved and disrespectful....again, everything is perspective. Just do what makes your lil heart smile, if you follow your heart and masters training you will be fine and others opinions need not touch you. Only your master's opinion should

LuckyAlbatross -> RE: Questions that I know many people will be piss off about (3/8/2007 9:21:51 AM)
I don't understand people who assume they will get flamed for something and then publicly announce it. I don't understand people who think that saying "It's just my opinion" means they should somehow be less responsible for their pronouncements. BDSMers are just like everyone else- we have all the same crap, same communication problems, same insecurities, same illusions. People get into bdsm because they feel a connection to it- for whatever reason. But we often feel a need to make what we do "more special" than anything else. And the most common way to make something feel "more special" is to make something else "less special." Which is why you often hear people put down vanilla sex. Especially when someone is new, this "new thing" takes over their lives and becomes THE BIG DEAL. It's hard to see beyond the illusions and be relaxed at that point in time. It's hard to see how a couple can be the most serious M/s couple in the world, and yet be laughing at a football party with friends like anyone else. They haven't reconciled their feelings/ideas with reality yet. Again, we're just like everyone else. To expect bdsm to operate any differently is unfounded.

thetammyjo -> RE: Questions that I know many people will be piss off about (3/8/2007 9:27:26 AM)
Not sure I'm understanding what you are saying, Shylahgirl. If someone says "in my experience" or "in my opinion" or "in my household" or does something to indicate that they are not making a universal claim that should apply to everyone, I don't have a problem with that. I have a big problem with people promoting "one true way"s (the s is outside for a reason) or universals without taking the few seconds to make it clear that this is only for them and theirs. Why? First I find it rude regardless of whom it may be rude to specifically. Given this website is potentially available worldwide it seems that politeness might be a big plus especially if you want to share or learn and not merely preach. The second reason is related to the first. Communicating in writing is difficult -- no voice and no body language and we often can't ask questions to clarify before we get a gut-level reaction. Anything I can do to help me clarify what I say by including "in my experience" or "in my opinion" may help me communicate. I'm not perfect in this. Should more people try to control their gut-level reactions? Maybe but that might be helped if folks just took those extra seconds to add in personalized phrases. Of course some folks aren't interested in learning sharing, only in preaching and promoting their version of the the "one true way". Those tend to really start up flamewars every where, not just here in my experience. wink

MasterFireMaam -> RE: Questions that I know many people will be piss off about (3/8/2007 9:35:09 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Shylahgirl Why is it that some people in the lifestyle can’t seem to let others shear there personal opinions or thoughts/feelings with out coming back with how what they are stating is wrong? This is simply human nature, most of the time. When we understand in our own heads that the world works in X way, it's really hard to grasp that the world could work in Y way. For example, in my belief system, I'm taught that the ancestors/guides/totem etc. enjoy and gain from hearing our words. Thus, I'm being trained to "speak" what I want in order to create it. However, I just was able to grasp that, for a friend of mine, this is simply not the case. For him, it's much more that the rule of magik that speaking some intentions robs the intention of energy. I totally didn't get that...until it was explained to me by my March totem in a shamanic way. The concept simply had to be translated in my head. I still don't get it and feel that it's not the way things work...but it's HIS way and HIS choice to make it work that way for him. From his perspective, this is his Universe...and his Universe works that way. Mine doesn't. Some of us react to other peoples’ Universes in such a way as to declare that our Universal Laws MUST be the ONLY way to do things, simply because these are truths to us. We either forget or don't understand that one person's truth doesn't necessarily apply to another...and we become belligerent about it. It sucks, but whining about WHY it happens doesn't improve the situation. Have compassion for people who need to do this. We're all guilty of it from time to time. Master Fire

toservez -> RE: Questions that I know many people will be piss off about (3/8/2007 9:47:07 AM)
I think anyone who writes in gross generalizations tends to get flamed a little bit. No one likes to get judged and your posts (OP) seem to have an element of that and it feels like the pot calling the kettle black. Do people take themselves too seriously, for the most part of course, but this life is no different then the regular world. Look around you, there are people get emotionally involved deciding what fast food place to get lunch from at your workplace, people getting upset over a sports game, see how someone reacts when another tells them they are wrong about something or a boss showing them up and a ton of other things. Too seriously and having a high opinion of ourselves is just human nature. People are on these message boards for various reasons but certainly one of the reasons is they have a passion for this life that they are seeking out like minded people to talk about things and share this passion. Does a poor writing skill, not well thought out ideas and agenda motivations affect how people come off on this board and message boards in general, of course, that is the nature of cyber, you cannot fully know what the tone of the message might be or the context of the person writing. What might come off as too serious might be a nice humble person just writing too quickly or in a bad mood. You will get flamed not by what you are trying to convey but from how you convey it. You first seem to make gross negative generalizations of people and tell people your way, then move on to your topic. By doing so you have judged others inferior to yourself no many how many disclaimers subsequently follow. To be honest your words in this thread are quite hypocritical and that will get some negative comments.

Dnomyar -> RE: Questions that I know many people will be piss off about (3/8/2007 9:56:51 AM)
Truth is just someones opinion to begin with. There is no such thing as truth. It is a made up word used to try to make someones opinion valid.

KatyLied -> RE: Questions that I know many people will be piss off about (3/8/2007 9:58:52 AM)
quote: Why is it that some people in the lifestyle can’t seem to let others shear there personal opinions or thoughts/feelings with out coming back with how what they are stating is wrong? Some opinions were made to be sheared. And some people make it easy when they use words like spiritual and true.

Shylahgirl -> RE: Questions that I know many people will be piss off about (3/8/2007 10:03:16 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: moki1984 I do not understand why you question yourself so much. Whatyou say is true....just because someone does not share your experiences of views does not make them right or you right. No matter if we are sub or dom we are humans who will make our own conclusions and emotions about life. Much of life is perspective and that is solely upon you to decide how you view anything and everything. If you enjoy who you are and how you are, then more power to you. Life your life how you see fit and dont let others telling you "oh your not a good sub...or thats not right" affect you. I know one dom who hates it when a woman calls him sir or master etc...he wants them to call him by his name and feel open to be themself although submitting to him...yes many many doms would hate that and say it was undeserved and disrespectful....again, everything is perspective. Just do what makes your lil heart smile, if you follow your heart and masters training you will be fine and others opinions need not touch you. Only your master's opinion should I wasn't meaning to say that what other said effected me on a personal level. I mearly wanted to state a question as to why, people in the BDSM comunity as a whole, do these things. Why they go through their lives telling others how to be and never noticeing that they are not perfict beings ether When someone online or someone I don't know tells me that I, personally, am wrong I understand that that is their opinion as they see the world. I just wanted to know why there is the conferentation and seperation in the comunity as a whole over these things and why some feel the need to personally atack another to make themsevles feel superior in some way. This is all out of me just wanting to know and wanting to learn about the world and other people. Hopefully that makes sense. Shylah

litleone8620 -> RE: Questions that I know many people will be piss off about (3/8/2007 10:03:32 AM)
No matter where you go, within, or outside the lifestyle, you're going to find those who try to shove their opinions down you throat. That is inevitable. Is it worse in the lifestyle? Who knows. You just have to kind of deal with it and move on. There is no such thing as a 'true sub/slave/dom'. Only what's true for you as a person. And usually the people who question the true-ness of an individual's choice are new, or have been here a while, but have to find the 'perfect' slave/submissive. I agree with what LA said. You want what you do to be special, or more special than what another is doing. And by doing that you diminish the importance of what that person is doing. And just like you're entitled to your opinions, so is everybody else here. Don't you think it's a bit ironic that you can post your opinions, and maybe not think you're going to get flamed for it, but not ok for other people to let go with their opinions?

slaveluci -> RE: Questions that I know many people will be piss off about (3/8/2007 10:13:54 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Shylahgirl But I wonder why when someone states what they believe about the lifestyle the way they live it there always has to be someone to point out what is wrong about what they said or how they said it, example: “If you’re a ‘real slave/sub’ you wouldn’t talk about this’” What is a “real slave/submissive” and what is a real “Master/Mistress”? What is the one thing that any “true slave/submissive” has that makes them a”true” what ever? What is a “true Master/Mistress” what makes them a “true” whatever? Why is it that some people in the lifestyle can’t seem to let others shear there personal opinions or thoughts/feelings with out coming back with how what they are stating is wrong? Why must there be this attitude that one way of learning or training is superior to the other? When I see these things it makes me sad that we have to be so sepret and yet still we clam the label of a community, when we can’t even let other members of the community shear what they believe with out at least one person making a personal attack? Shylah i've wondered about this as well, Shylah. Back when i first began becoming familiar with sites such as this, i have to say i was pretty amazed at how some people (NOT ALL) seemed to set themselves up as THE experts on what BDSM is and exactly HOW we all should live/act in this "lifestyle." i always found it sad and ironic that the "vanilla" world is so judgemental of BDSM'ers so they form their own groups/communities and then promptly proceed to judge each other even more harshly. One thing that really offended me was this concept of "old timers" thinking they hold all the keys to knowledge and that "newbies" (a word i hate, by the way) can't possibly know anything significant. There seemed to be this concept of quantity vs. quality, i.e. - "I've been doing this 20 years. There's no way you could possibly know more than me." i was intimidated by this at first until Master reassured me. He has over 10 years experience and says He's met many subs with years' experience that can't even begin to know what i know naturally. He compares it to something like a person playing guitar for 20 years versus a born prodigy. Which is better? Do all those years of practice necessarily mean you are better than someone "born" with a natural ability. i've never understood the need to judge or put down another's relationship or way of doing things. If you are truly fulfilled in what you do in your own relationship, why the urge to tear others' arrangements apart to analyze, judge, and condemn? So, it took a little time for me to come to the point that i am at now where, when i read or hear someone doing this, it just makes me wonder if their own life is all they make it out to be. What is "real," or "true," or "right," is indeed up to each of us in our own relationships and, IMHO, the quickest way to mess up ANY relationship (vanilla or BDSM) is to start caring what anyone else thinks about it or to try to make it suit their expectations............slave luci

szobras -> RE: Questions that I know many people will be piss off about (3/8/2007 10:15:11 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Shylahgirl Why is it that some people in the lifestyle can’t seem to let others shear there personal opinions or thoughts/feelings with out coming back with how what they are stating is wrong? IMO ,I do not find this limited to only to this lifestyle. This expression is found everywhere. At times some "react' to what they see, hear, ...,at times, they "respond". There is a difference. As MasterFire has pointed out, to accept that another has a viewpoint and perception that they believe does not cause our own to be unvalidated.

nissa -> RE: Questions that I know many people will be piss off about (3/8/2007 10:17:31 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LuckyAlbatross I don't understand people who assume they will get flamed for something and then publicly announce it. I don't understand people who think that saying "It's just my opinion" means they should somehow be less responsible for their pronouncements. BDSMers are just like everyone else- we have all the same crap, same communication problems, same insecurities, same illusions. People get into bdsm because they feel a connection to it- for whatever reason. But we often feel a need to make what we do "more special" than anything else. And the most common way to make something feel "more special" is to make something else "less special." Which is why you often hear people put down vanilla sex. Especially when someone is new, this "new thing" takes over their lives and becomes THE BIG DEAL. It's hard to see beyond the illusions and be relaxed at that point in time. It's hard to see how a couple can be the most serious M/s couple in the world, and yet be laughing at a football party with friends like anyone else. They haven't reconciled their feelings/ideas with reality yet. Again, we're just like everyone else. To expect bdsm to operate any differently is unfounded. you hit it dead on

Shylahgirl -> RE: Questions that I know many people will be piss off about (3/8/2007 10:17:48 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LuckyAlbatross I don't understand people who assume they will get flamed for something and then publicly announce it. I don't understand people who think that saying "It's just my opinion" means they should somehow be less responsible for their pronouncements. I feel that I need to state that it it my opinion because people don't seem to understand that I don't want to generalise unless I state it. The first post that I worte online I was verbely beaten for "generalizing" I didn't know how I was generalizing. I didn't get my questions answered, just critisized. Shylah

litleone8620 -> RE: Questions that I know many people will be piss off about (3/8/2007 10:26:51 AM)
quote: One thing that really offended me was this concept of "old timers" thinking they hold all the keys to knowledge and that "newbies" (a word i hate, by the way) can't possibly know anything significant. There seemed to be this concept of quantity vs. quality, i.e. - "I've been doing this 20 years. There's no way you could possibly know more than me." i was intimidated by this at first until Master reassured me. He has over 10 years experience and says He's met many subs with years' experience that can't even begin to know what i know naturally. He compares it to something like a person playing guitar for 20 years versus a born prodigy. Which is better? Do all those years of practice necessarily mean you are better than someone "born" with a natural ability. In my opinion, there is nothing better than real life experience, especially when it comes to the lifestyle. There is only so much you can learn from books and websites. Now, i'm not saying age equals experience. I'm saying that a newbie is a newbie because they're new, not because they don't know X, Y, and Z. And book learning can only get you so far. And at the end of your statement, you're questioning nature vs. nurture. It may be in your nature to be a guitarist (using your example), but if it isn't cultivated (by real experience) then where is it going to go?

sublizzie -> RE: Questions that I know many people will be piss off about (3/8/2007 10:31:40 AM)
Shylah, If you know your questions are going to piss people off, why ask them?

hammernhoney -> RE: Questions that I know many people will be piss off about (3/8/2007 10:34:19 AM)
'true sub/slave/dom'..this burns me also,the word 'real" also gets me steamed,,for what is real for one can be a fantasy for another,bounty

litleone8620 -> RE: Questions that I know many people will be piss off about (3/8/2007 10:37:16 AM)
For some reason, the phrase 'true sub/slave/dom' has been floating around the forums a lot lately. I'm curious as to know why.

Shylahgirl -> RE: Questions that I know many people will be piss off about (3/8/2007 10:39:54 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: sublizzie Shylah, If you know your questions are going to piss people off, why ask them? Because I want to know the answers and maybe in the mess of vertual yelling and screaming I might get a little something. I feel that my own personal thoughts on a subject can only take me so far, I like to see what others think and possably modify my opinion in the process with new info that I may not have thought of on my own. The only way to learn is to ask, no matter the conciquesce. Shylah

domiguy -> RE: Questions that I know many people will be piss off about (3/8/2007 10:40:49 AM)
The problem with your argument is contained within the word "community"...Maybe you have the beginnings of one in your group...But out here, man this is about as of diverse of a group that you will ever find...So anytime someone starts out thread by inferring that there is a "community" they are doomed to flaming and failure.

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